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Massachusetts for Palin?
The Boston Globe ^ | August 1, 2010 | Jeff Jacoby

Posted on 07/31/2010 8:13:03 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

IT IS Election Night, 2012. The polls have closed. State by state, the votes are being counted, and gradually it becomes clear, to the bottomless horror of some voters and the unbridled delight of others, that Sarah Palin, the Republican presidential nominee, has bested President Barack Obama in the popular vote nationwide.

In Massachusetts, where Obama crushed Palin in a 79 percent landslide — the most lopsidedly anti-Palin vote of any state — “bottomless horror’’ doesn’t begin to describe the political reaction. For in 2010, Massachusetts joined the National Popular Vote compact, making a commitment to cast all of its electoral votes for the presidential candidate receiving the most votes nationally, regardless of the results in Massachusetts. The compact took effect in December 2011, when California became the 15th state to join, thereby uniting enough states to control a majority of the Electoral College. Now Massachusetts, the bluest of the blue states, must award its presidential electors to a candidate Massachusetts voters overwhelmingly opposed.

. . .

Well, that’s one scenario. Maybe it won’t be Sarah Palin, maybe it won’t be 2012, but sooner or later a Republican is going to win the largest number of votes in a presidential election, and that Republican probably isn’t going to carry Massachusetts. What will Bay State liberals and Democrats say when the National Popular Vote compact that so many of them endorsed requires Massachusetts electors to line up behind the Republican? Imagine if Massachusetts had been compelled to give its electoral votes in 1972 not to George McGovern, but to Richard Nixon. Or to the first George Bush in 1988, instead of Michael Dukakis. Or to George W. Bush, not John Kerry, in 2004.(continued)

(Excerpt) Read more at boston.com ...


TOPICS: Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 2012; baker; bush; electoralcollege; massachusetts; novotesbypublic; obama; palin; patrick; popularvote; romney; sarahpalin
Talk about something that would really make me smile. What's that German word for enjoying someone else's misery and anguish?
1 posted on 07/31/2010 8:13:06 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

2 posted on 07/31/2010 8:17:36 PM PDT by onyx (Sarah/Michele 2012)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

‘Schadenfreude’ is the word you’re looking for.


3 posted on 07/31/2010 8:18:10 PM PDT by Newtiebacker
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

schudenfreude (botched spelling no doubt, but you get the gist of the word)


4 posted on 07/31/2010 8:18:34 PM PDT by gas_dr (Trial lawyers AND POLITICIANS are Endangering Every Patient in America)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Ask a democrat.


5 posted on 07/31/2010 8:18:44 PM PDT by TribalPrincess2U (demonicRATS... taxes, pain and slow death. Is this what you want?)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Of course the NPV would never be used to elect a GOP candidate. In the scenario above, ballots would just be printed until enough, no matter how many millions or billions, ballots were needed to assure 0bama’s re-election.


6 posted on 07/31/2010 8:19:27 PM PDT by pnh102 (Regarding liberalism, always attribute to malice what you think can be explained by stupidity. - Me)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
I am looking forward to it. Massachusetts liberals are really stupid enough to let the rest of the country pick their electors for them. And the best part of all is that it will lead to them losing all but one of their Representatives in Congress.

Amendment XIV, Section 2:

But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice-President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.

7 posted on 07/31/2010 8:20:34 PM PDT by Hoodat (.For the weapons of our warfare are mighty in God for pulling down strongholds.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Massachusetts is renowned for passing laws they later greatly regret.


8 posted on 07/31/2010 8:21:54 PM PDT by downtownconservative
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To: pnh102

Also, note that the Legislature of Mass would quickly change the rules... What? Socialists lie? How can anyone say that? After all Obama was all for government funding of elections with restrictions on totals until it was in his favor to do otherwise.


9 posted on 07/31/2010 8:22:10 PM PDT by donmeaker ("Get off my lawn." Clint Eastwood, Green Ford Torino)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I believe this will be another case of unintended consequences. One of the biggest whining points of the dems is that republicans use of the filibuster has made a 60/40 vote necessary on just about all bills. If I am correct the rules on filibustering were imposed by democrats at the behest of one Robert Byrd.


10 posted on 07/31/2010 8:24:14 PM PDT by pnut22
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To: onyx

Does anyone know who the woman is behind Sarah. Talk about two beautiful women!


11 posted on 07/31/2010 8:24:53 PM PDT by hampdenkid
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
It's hard to figure out how Gay State leftists (the Massachusetts legislature is 90% RAT...as is our empty suit Governor) think this will help any RAT nominee.The year 2000 comes to my mind...but algore carried the state easily as it was.

(If only algore had been able to carry his *home* state...BWAHAHAHA!)

12 posted on 07/31/2010 8:29:52 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative (''I don't regret setting bombs,I feel we didn't do enough.'' ->Bill Ayers,Hussein's mentor,9/11/01)
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To: donmeaker
Also, note that the Legislature of Mass would quickly change the rules...

They're also famous for enacting ex post facto laws, like they did with Ted Kennedy's replacement. Of course no one challenges them on that.

13 posted on 07/31/2010 8:34:37 PM PDT by pnh102 (Regarding liberalism, always attribute to malice what you think can be explained by stupidity. - Me)
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To: Gay State Conservative
If only algore had been able to carry his *home* state ...

He did. He won DC handily.

14 posted on 07/31/2010 8:35:44 PM PDT by pnh102 (Regarding liberalism, always attribute to malice what you think can be explained by stupidity. - Me)
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To: Gay State Conservative

“It’s hard to figure out how Gay State leftists think this will help any RAT nominee”

I’ve been having a “discussion” about this on a leftist site in Boston, they don’t have a clue. They think the entire electoral college is being elimanated, not just gerry rigged in a few states.


15 posted on 07/31/2010 8:36:16 PM PDT by Sparky1776
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To: pnh102

That last ex-post facto change got Death Care passed and the budget limit raised trillions. We should all care.


16 posted on 07/31/2010 8:38:03 PM PDT by Nateman (If liberals are not screaming you are doing it wrong!)
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To: Hoodat

That is very interesting...


17 posted on 07/31/2010 8:40:25 PM PDT by Republican Wildcat
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
This is just an example of immature liberals throwing a 10 year long temper tantrum.

And just imagine if Jacoby's scenario played out. They would cry for years again about the stolen election, if their emergency meeting of the legislature failed to overturn the law in typical Massachusetts fashion, like when Kennedy died and the law had to be changed to undo what was done when they were silly enough to think Kerry could get elected president and their was a Republican governor.

Liberals never seem to take a hard look at the possible outcomes when they sign on to an agenda. Look at the Global Warmies. Do they not understand that there is no way ever for their position to be vindicated, but a perfectly plausible and likely way for it to be disproven. If the world isn't warmer in 20 years they are all fools and idiots. If it is warmer (plausible, since it's been warming since the end of the last ice age), but not ending, they and are still fools and idiots. If it's warmer and in great peril (yea, right), they still can't prove why it's warmer (that ice age thing again). So they are destined to bang their heads against a wall for the rest of their lives on the issue, no matter what happens.

18 posted on 07/31/2010 8:42:03 PM PDT by Minn (Here is a realistic picture of the prophet: ----> ([: {()
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

that what happens when you thought the will of the state come 2nd to the will of the majority of Americans. Its the argument that the Left been pushing since 2000 because Bush won the CV votes while Gore won the popular vote


19 posted on 07/31/2010 8:43:00 PM PDT by 4rcane
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

That would be so sweeeet!

However, it cuts both ways.

I don’t fancy messing with the electoral college, anyway.


20 posted on 07/31/2010 8:45:49 PM PDT by dixiechick2000 (Remember November...I can see it from my house!)
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To: 4rcane

The left are short sighted. The CV system is MUCH better than a Popular Vote system. It reduces tyranny of the majority


21 posted on 07/31/2010 8:48:12 PM PDT by 4rcane
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To: Hoodat

I forgot about that clause of the 14th. At least the Radical Republicans are still fighting for us! Any honest court would declare this an unconstitutional run around the specified amendment procedure. Any dishonest court still able to stop short of treason, would have to at least rule such a Compact required formal consent of Congress (Article I, Sect. 10).


22 posted on 07/31/2010 8:48:44 PM PDT by JohnBovenmyer (Tear down that BARACK-ade!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Red states won’t sign up for this. Blue states will. That means the law can ONLY hurt blue states.

Amazing, huh?

That said, this is a HORRIBLE idea - one step closer to being a democracy, one step further from being a republic.


23 posted on 07/31/2010 8:53:22 PM PDT by piytar (Those who never learned that peace and freedom are rare will be taught by reality.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

What would really be amusing would be if,

1. Palin barely won the popular vote running up huge margins in the mountain states

2. It was very very close in the electoral college, but OBama would prevail 280 to 258 in the electoral college.

3. But alas since the 12 MA EVs are going to the popular vote winner, Palin, despite Obama winning the state, she wins the presidency 270 to 268.

Can you imagine the lefts reaction to this scenario?


24 posted on 07/31/2010 9:29:26 PM PDT by JLS (Democrats: People who won't even let you enjoy an unseasonably warm winter day.)
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To: JLS
Can you imagine the lefts reaction to this scenario?

Yes, entirely predictable...8 years of whining about the illegitimate Presidency of Sarah Palin, racism in the South and the disenfranchisement of minorities in the Dem controlled inner cities of New York, Philly, Detroit, LA, Chicago and Atlanta.

25 posted on 07/31/2010 9:41:49 PM PDT by JrsyJack (a healthy dose of buckshot will probably get you the last word in any argument.)
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To: JLS

Except that since there are (or will be) some 15 states in the compact, a 280-258 would end up far more lopsided, since they would all cast their EVs for the popular vote winner.


26 posted on 07/31/2010 9:43:57 PM PDT by Little Pig (Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici.)
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To: Little Pig

Right I thought maybe CO had done the same thing. So you see ultimately 15 state voting for this?

I guess my scenario would still hold if Pa1lin took all but 1, MA, of those 15 states and the EV ended up as I said.


27 posted on 07/31/2010 9:46:26 PM PDT by JLS (Democrats: People who won't even let you enjoy an unseasonably warm winter day.)
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To: hampdenkid

It looks like Michael Jackson.


28 posted on 08/01/2010 3:12:58 AM PDT by Former War Criminal (My senior Senator [who served in Vietnam and Rhode Island] said so.)
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To: hampdenkid

Just an eyeball, but it kinda looks like Bo Derek.


29 posted on 08/01/2010 4:13:19 AM PDT by eCSMaster (He promised hope; he gave us hype. He promised change; he gave us chains!)
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To: JLS
3. But alas since the 12 MA EVs are going to the popular vote winner, Palin, despite Obama winning the state, she wins the presidency 270 to 268.

One (big) problem with your scenario.Unless the RATS succeeded in their effort to scam the census this year (certainly possible) the Gay State is sure to lose at least one Congressional seat for the '12 election and I've even heard some say it will be two.So if it's one...then we'd have an Electoral Vote tie and if it's two,well....

30 posted on 08/01/2010 4:55:51 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (''I don't regret setting bombs,I feel we didn't do enough.'' ->Bill Ayers,Hussein's mentor,9/11/01)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
What's that German word for enjoying someone else's misery and anguish?

My German's not very good, but I think it's palinwinnen.

31 posted on 08/01/2010 5:22:58 AM PDT by BfloGuy (It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker, that we can expect . . .)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
*** What's that German word for enjoying someone else's misery and anguish? ***

That'd be....

Schadenfreude

I put it in Gothic Font as that's how das deutsche Volk (Germans) used to print everything.

32 posted on 08/01/2010 5:23:02 AM PDT by Condor51 (SAT CONG!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Once again, the Kennedy-Kerry-Brown-Romney-Patrick-Bulger
fascists refuse to let a single Massachusetts voter
actually .... vote.

Even the GOP was stolen by Romney and Brown preventing
a primary this year. Massachusetts citizens’ civil rights
have been stolen by carpetbagging outsiders from Chicago
and Utah.

America, wake up. The Commonwealth is the canary.


33 posted on 08/01/2010 5:23:20 AM PDT by Diogenesis (Article IV - Section 4 - The United States shall protect each of them against Invasion)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
'Massachusetts for Palin?'

There's one 'little' problem with this 'compact', its Unconstitutional.
(I know, that's a mere technicality to the commieRATS)

Article I, Section 10, clause 10.3 prohibits 'Compacts Among States'. So the first time its used, hello SCOTUS here we come. Not to mention that other little technicality like the scenario of this article. It disenfranchises voters. And we know how SCOTUS views that.

Annnnnnnd if a Blue State was 'forced' to go the other way because of said compact, there aren't enough TV Cameras in the world to cover all the protests by Rev Al, Jesse, the NAACP -- and all the race riots that would ensue.

Plus thanks to this 'Compact' all the court challenges would throw the election results up for grabs for months.
It'd be Bush v Gore x 108 power.

34 posted on 08/01/2010 5:46:24 AM PDT by Condor51 (SAT CONG!)
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To: Condor51
So the first time its used, hello SCOTUS here we come.

Not so fast. Just how many times did the courts tell us "You have no standing" when people sued for the COLB in the eligibility lawsuits?

They told Alan Keyes, a candidate, the same thing, iirc.

They'll just dummy up again.

35 posted on 08/01/2010 6:48:43 AM PDT by lentulusgracchus
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To: onyx
Yes, "rules" are good. Thanx!!!
36 posted on 08/01/2010 6:50:02 AM PDT by lentulusgracchus
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To: JLS

Under that scenario, 0bama would also lose Illinois (his home state) since Illinois has also signed on to the NPV travesty.


37 posted on 08/01/2010 7:42:15 AM PDT by reg45
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To: JLS

There are already 4 or 5 other states that have passed similar legislation. Ultimately, they need 15 to sign on for the compact to become active, and once it’s active, it doesn’t matter how many of those states are “won” by their candidate; they’ll all be bound to case for the popular vote winner.


38 posted on 08/01/2010 10:06:28 AM PDT by Little Pig (Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici.)
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To: Little Pig

Right and that has nothing to do with my scenario where Palin wins all of those 15 states except MA, wins the popular vote, narrowly loses the EV calculated the old way, but since she gets the MA EVs too wins the presidency. Of course it is unlikely to happen that way, but it could.


39 posted on 08/01/2010 11:29:10 AM PDT by JLS (Democrats: People who won't even let you enjoy an unseasonably warm winter day.)
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To: JLS
"1. Palin barely won the popular vote running up huge margins in the mountain states"

Rarely has it happened that the popular vote winner lost in the electoral college. In 50+ Presidential elections it has happened only twice to the best of my knowledge -- 1876, Hayes v Tilden, and 2000, Bush v Gore.

There are many reasons why the Founders chose the electoral college, and how these manifest. But in its simplest statement, the basic effect today is that for extremely close elections (e.g., Bush v Gore), the tie goes to the candidate with the broader electoral appeal, meaning the rural parts of the country. This is exactly what the Founders wanted -- they didn't want the populous cities to disenfranchise the voters from the less populated agrarian states.

And a very important ancillary impact is that the Dems have no reason to engage in wholesale fraud in the inner city precincts that vote 100% democratic, unless there is a statewide race (e.g., Senate) that is close. Let's not forget that in 2000, there were many precincts in Miami and St Louis which had 102% and 105% turnout.

Should the Presidential election become a direct election, you can bet that ballot-stuffing in the inner city will be rampant in ALL precincts, every four years.

40 posted on 08/01/2010 4:50:56 PM PDT by tom h
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To: tom h

“Rarely has it happened that the popular vote winner lost in the electoral college. In 50+ Presidential elections it has happened only twice to the best of my knowledge — 1876, Hayes v Tilden, and 2000, Bush v Gore.”

Well there is 1960, Kennedy v. Nixon also. Additionally, it is not clear there was a final national count in 2000 to know who won it.


41 posted on 08/01/2010 9:25:48 PM PDT by JLS (Democrats: People who won't even let you enjoy an unseasonably warm winter day.)
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To: JLS

JLS, now I’m a bit of an American history buff and I’m wondering if you really know the details of why JFK did not win a majority of popular votes. Because it’s true but only by a technicality. Do you know that story?

In case you don’t, here’s the facts:

Kennedy’s popular vote total was 0.17%, or 112,000 votes out of 68 million cast. Just about any source will use these figures.

But the truth is that some of Kennedy is routinely “awarded” votes in the state of Alabama that were not intended for him. At the time, voters in Alabama voted for electors, not presidential candidates, and Kennedy’s tally includes the highest vote total for an Alabama elector even though almost half of the electors refused to vote for him when the electoral college convened. So, a more accurate accounting would give Kennedy fewer votes and a majority of popular votes to Nixon.

It’s hard to find detail about this but the NYT has a good summary:

http://www.nytimes.com/2000/11/16/opinion/the-slippery-statistics-of-the-popular-vote.html


42 posted on 08/02/2010 12:30:33 AM PDT by tom h
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