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Southern Jews and the Confederacy
Jewish Press ^ | Jul 28 2010 | Lewis Regenstein

Posted on 08/04/2010 5:34:10 AM PDT by SJackson

Virginia Governor Robert F. McDonnell's recent proclamation of Confederate History Month provoked a firestorm of criticism, with many accusing him and those who commemorate their Southern ancestors' bravery of ignoring or even defending slavery.

But the cruel and evil institution of slavery was not the sole or even primary reason for the South's secession from the Union, nor was it a significant motivating factor for individual Confederate soldiers.

Yet many of us in the South, including those descended from old Jewish families of the Confederacy, still struggle to expose the truth about why Southern soldiers fought, the courage they showed against overwhelming odds, and the sacrifices they made.

The history of the Confederacy is full of long-forgotten tales of Jewish heroes, warriors, and leaders. This is a story little known today, absent from history books and an embarrassment to liberal Jewish historians ashamed of the prominent role played by Jews in supporting, defending and fighting for the Confederacy. It is a government about which they know little except for its association with slavery.

They find the truth about the war incompatible with their idolization of Abraham Lincoln and his administration - an administration in which anti-Jewish sentiment was rampant, at one point even becoming official government policy and resulting in the worst official act of anti-Semitism in the nation's history.

I know firsthand the ignorance one encounters on this subject because a few years ago I wrote for the Atlanta Journal-Constitution a mild mannered op-ed article discussing why so many good and decent Georgians take pride in their Confederate ancestors.

I explained that we revere our ancestors because, against overwhelming odds, they fought on, often hungry, cold, sick and wounded, to protect their homes and families - not the institution of slavery - from an often cruel invader. Put simply, the heavily outnumbered and undersupplied Confederate soldiers felt they were fighting because an invading army from the North was trying, with great success, to burn their homes, destroy their cities, and kill them.

Advertisement In response, the newspaper published two letters to the editor. One said my statements "were reminiscent of neo-Nazi apologists denying the Holocaust." The other accused me of defending slavery and "a treasonous movement" called the Confederacy.

My then-84-year-old mother asked me to "please wait until I die before you write any more articles."

Slavery was an important political issue before and during the Civil War, especially to the large plantation holders in the South and the abolitionists in the North. But while the war is often portrayed as primarily a fight over slavery, much more important were the issues of preservation of the Union for the North and the over-taxation of the South in the form of exorbitant tariffs.

In the case of Virginia, to cite one example, it is quite clear that the state did not secede over slavery; it stayed in the Union after seven Southern states seceded and formed the Confederacy. It was only after President Lincoln called for 75,000 troops from state militias to attack the South that Virginia, refusing to wage war on its "kinfolk," left the Union.

* * * * *

Let me briefly recount why I take pride in my Confederate ancestors and the brave men who fought with them. One hundred and forty-five years ago, on April 9, 1865, Robert E. Lee surrendered his Army of Northern Virginia to Union Commander Ulysses S. Grant, marking the effective end of the South's struggle for independence.

It was a fateful day for the South, and in particular for my great-grandfather and his four elder brothers, all of whom were fighting for the Confederacy.

While Lee was surrendering at Appomattox, my then-16-year-old great-grandfather, Andrew Jackson Moses, rode out on horseback to defend his hometown of Sumter, South Carolina, along with some 157 other teenagers, invalids, old men, and the wounded from the local hospital. Approaching were 2,500 hardened soldiers from Sherman's army who had just burned nearby Columbia, and it was feared they were headed to Sumter to do the same. Sumter's defenders, outnumbered 15-to-1, managed to hold off Sherman's battle-seasoned veterans for over an hour before being overwhelmed by the vastly superior force.

That same afternoon, the eldest Moses brother, Joshua Lazarus Moses, was killed a few hours after Lee had surrendered (the news having not yet reached the front). Josh was commanding an artillery battalion that fired the last shots in defense of Mobile before being overrun by a Union force outnumbering his 13 to 1. In this battle of Fort Blakeley, one of his brothers, Horace, was captured, and another, Perry, was wounded.

Josh Moses was one of more than 3,000 Jews who fought for the South and the last Confederate Jew to fall in battle.

* * * * *

More than two-dozen members of the extended Moses family fought in the war, and at least nine gave their lives for what Southerners came to refer to as the Lost Cause. The best known of the Moses family Confederates was Major Raphael Moses, a fifth-generation South Carolinian who in 1849 moved to Columbus, Georgia, where he was a lawyer and planter. Moses, whose three sons also fought for the South, ended up attending the last meeting and carrying out the last order of the Confederate government - delivering the last of the Confederate treasury, $40,000 in gold and silver bullion, to help feed and supply defeated Confederate soldiers in the Augusta hospital or straggling home after the war.

Major Moses named one of his sons Albert Luria because he wanted to preserve the family name of an ancestor who reputedly was the court physician to Spain's Queen Isabella. Luria was called to duty in Columbus, five miles from home, on Saturday, April 20, 1861. After marching from the armory to the depot, Albert writes, "we were met by an immense concourse of citizens - assembled to bid us 'God Speed.' "

Among the crowd were several members of his family whom Albert was surprised to see. Being observant Jews, they would not ride or work their horses on the Sabbath, and so they had walked several miles into town to say farewell.

Luria, Josh Moses's first cousin, was the first Confederate Jew to be killed, mortally wounded at age 19 during the Battle of Seven Pines (Fair Oaks) in Virginia on May 31, 1862. He died after courageously throwing a live Union artillery shell out of his fortification before it exploded, thereby saving the lives of many of his men.

Luria's brother Israel Moses Nunez, a veteran of many battles, was named after his ancestor Dr. Samuel Nunez (sometimes written Nunes), who arrived in Savannah, Georgia, in July 1733, in a boat from England with 42 Portuguese Jews fleeing persecution. Dr. Nunez is credited with saving the newly established mosquito-infested colony from being wiped out by what was thought to be yellow fever but which was probably malaria.

Another leading Jewish figure of the war was the Moses brothers' mother - my great-great-grandmother - Octavia, a legend within the family and in Sumter.

She was from one of the country's most prominent Jewish families, her father being the well-known Jewish author and playwright Isaac Harby, one of the leading Jewish figures in 19th century America. There was a tradition among members of the family that their name came from a courageous Jewish soldier who fought in defense of Jerusalem against the Romans and who took the name of Hereb (sword), or more likely Ish Hereb (swordsman).

Isaac Harby was proud of the role played in the American Revolution by his father-in-law, Samuel Mordecai, "a brave grenadier in the regular American Army, who fought and bled for the liberty he lived to enjoy and to hand down to his children."

Harby was a leading member of the Kahal Kadosh Beth Elo[k]im synagogue, first organized in Charleston in 1749 and thought to be the oldest synagogue in continuous use in the United States. A Jewish Tourist's Guide to the U.S. notes that "So many Charleston Jews enlisted in the service of the Confederacy that from 1862 to 1866, Beth Elo[k]im found it impossible to obtain a quorum of trustees and could hold no regular meetings."

Octavia Harby and her husband, Andrew Jackson Moses, had 17 children (three died in infancy), the five eldest males of whom fought for the South. Octavia was very active on the home front in support of the Confederacy. As she put it,

When the War broke out like every other Southern woman, I immediately began work for the soldiers: I organized a sewing society, to cut and make garments for them. I made it a point to try and meet every train that brought soldiers through our town, and, with others, frequently walked from my home, sometimes at two o'clock in the morning, to take food to our men as they passed through. We always greeted them with the wildest enthusiasm, and no thought of defeat ever entered our minds . Whenever the boys were fortunate enough to get home on short furloughs, they were the guests of the town - everybody feted them and nothing was too much to do in their honor.

When hospitals were established in Sumter, Octavia writes, "Our ladies, of course, took immediate charge, and the soldiers were fed and nursed with all the means of our command, and all the tenderness of Southern women."

She also showed compassion for the Union troops who had been taken prisoner: "When I heard that the Northern prisoners would be brought through our town and that they were nearly in a starving condition, I immediately exerted myself to obtain a large quantity of provisions to give to them."

Throughout the South, Jews assumed prominent roles in the Confederate government and armed forces; as Robert Rosen puts it in his authoritative book The Jewish Confederates, they "were used to being treated as equals" (an acceptance they had enjoyed for a century and a half).

The Confederacy's secretary of war and later state was Judah P. Benjamin - the so-called brains of the Confederacy - and the top Confederate commander, General Robert E. Lee, was known for showing great respect to his Jewish soldiers.

Charleston in the early 1800s had more Jews than any other city in North America, and many were respected citizens, office holders, and successful entrepreneurs. The city was commonly referred to as "our Jerusalem," and Myer Moses, my maternal family patriarch, in 1806 called his hometown " this land of milk and honey."

Many Jewish Confederates carried with them to the front the famous soldiers' prayer (which began with the sacred Shema) written by Richmond Rabbi Max Michelbacher, who after secession had issued a widely published benediction comparing Southerners to "the Children of Israel crossing the Red Sea."

* * * * *

In contrast to the South, the North was a hotbed of anti-Jewish bigotry. Much of the political and military leadership of the Union government was composed of men - including such leading figures as generals Ulysses S. Grant, William Tecumseh Sherman and Benjamin ("Beast") Butler - who disliked Jews, openly expressed their feelings, and persecuted Jews when they had the occasion to do so. The prevailing anti-Jewish attitude resulted in the Union army's committing the worst official act of anti-Semitism in American history - about which I wrote in greater detail for The Jewish Press in "Shame of the Yankees - America's Worst Anti-Jewish Action" (front-page essay, Nov. 17, 2006).

On December 17, 1862, Grant issued his soon-to-be infamous "General Order #11," expelling all Jews "as a class" from his conquered territories within 24 hours.

As a result of Grant's expulsion order, Jewish families were forced out of their homes in Paducah, Kentucky and Holly Springs and Oxford, Mississippi, and several were sent to prison.

On January 4, 1863, President Lincoln had Grant's order rescinded, but by then Jewish families in the area had been expelled, humiliated, terrified, jailed, and in some cases stripped of their possessions.

Bertram W. Korn, in his classic work American Jewry and the Civil War, describes the hardships and persecution suffered by Jewish families subject to the expulsion order:

They still tell stories of the expulsion in Paducah of the hurried departure by riverboat up the Ohio to Cincinnati; of a baby almost left behind in the haste and confusion and tossed bodily into the boat; of two dying women permitted to remain behind in neighbors' care. Thirty men and their families were expelled from Paducah, and according to affidavits by some of "the most respectable Union citizens of the city," the deportees "had at no time been engaged in trade within the active lines of General Grant " Two had already served brief enlistments in the Union army.

There are numerous other documented examples of widespread anti-Semitism in the North (recounted in my aforementioned "Shame of the Yankees" article, which can be accessed on The Jewish Press website). But you will find nary a mention of this persecution in history books, only adulatory praise for the Union and Lincoln.

The Union army that killed my family members was hardly the forerunner of the Civil Rights movement. Indeed, the treatment of Jews by Union forces pales in comparison to other atrocities they regularly committed against civilians, including the destruction of agricultural areas and other non-military targets; the routine burning and looting of cities, homes, libraries and courthouses; and, worst of all, the mass murder of Native Americans in the so-called Indian Wars.

This was the Union Army that descended upon the South and that my ancestors fought heroically in defense of their lives, their families, and their nation. It was a Lost Cause but an honorable one, and it should not be forgotten.


TOPICS: Editorial; US: Virginia
KEYWORDS: confederatejews; dixie; dsj; history; jews; proslaveryrinos; southern; southron; thisisnuts; whitesupremacists
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1 posted on 08/04/2010 5:34:11 AM PDT by SJackson
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; Lent; GregB; ..
Middle East and terrorism, occasional political and Jewish issues Ping List. High Volume

If you’d like to be on or off, please FR mail me.

..................

Unfortunately this is often a sensitive subject on FR, but the focus of the article is the author's, and the region's, remembrance. My ancestors may have faced his on the field, but I've no problem with it.

The only Jewish military cemetary outside Israel, Richmond, Va.


2 posted on 08/04/2010 5:38:40 AM PDT by SJackson (most merciful thing that a large family does to one of its infant members is to kill it, M Sanger)
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To: SJackson
Revisionist history at it's worst. Article is total nonsense on the facts.

http://www.fas.org/blog/secrecy/2007/10/abraham_lincoln_and_the_jews.html

Abraham Lincoln and the Jews
October 17th, 2007 by Steven Aftergood

In a remarkable episode from the Civil War that is not as widely known as it might be, General Ulysses S. Grant issued Order No. 11 on December 17, 1862 expelling all Jews from those portions of Kentucky, Tennessee, and Mississippi where his forces had taken the field.

Equally remarkable, President Lincoln did not say he would “stand by” his generals or that “we must give the military the tools it needs” to accomplish its mission. Instead, he rescinded the Order.

3 posted on 08/04/2010 5:42:57 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run our of other peoples money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: SJackson
To claim they were not fighting for slavery is to try and rewrite history to fit current PC political dogmas. It is an absurd argument that has no validity in historic facts.

It was not “State Rights” that motivated Davis, Stephens, Ruffin, et al.

It was not “State Rights” that lead a SC Congressmen to beat a Massachusetts Senator to the edge of death on the Senate floor.

It was not “State Rights” that brought Abraham Lincoln back into politics in the 1850

It was not “State Rights” that caused men to butcher each other in “Bleeding Kansas”.

It was not “State Rights” that lead John Brown to raid Harper’s Ferry.

No issue but Slavery lead men to political violence in the antebellum period. Without Slavery all other issues between the North and South could be dealt with in the normal political progress. Only Slavery is the “irreconcilable difference” that makes it impossible to forge a political solution.

To ignore the facts of that period to create a faux history in order to justify current political dogmas is not only utterly stupid from a public relations stand point, it is also intellectually dishonest and serious damages the movements credibility with the voting public.

We on the Right routinely decry the attempt by the Left to rewrite history to justify their current political dogmas. We should not do it either.

That Slavery was fundamental issue that split the North and the South in the Civil War is just plain fact

4 posted on 08/04/2010 5:46:58 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run our of other peoples money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: SJackson

Great article...thanks for posting it...my g-grandfather was in I Company.23rd S.C. infantry and knew the Moses family...one of the Moses men who died has his name inscribed on the Confederate monument in Sumpter,SC...I applaud Lewis Regenstein for writing this article, because I’m sure he will be further attacked by Jews and Gentiles alike...

PS....the only Jewish military cemetary outside Israel is in Richmond and there lie Jewish Confederates.


5 posted on 08/04/2010 5:47:16 AM PDT by STONEWALLS
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To: SJackson
You should at least be aware of the other side of this particular story...

It is not to be doubted, I know with absolute certainty, that the separation of the United States into two federations of equal powers had been decided upon well in advance of the Civil War by the top financial power of Europe. -- OTTO VON BISMARCK, Chancellor, Germany.

For the Southerners to have aligned themselves on the side of the Rothschilds and English mercantilists against Lincoln was entirely similar to somebody aligning with the English in the revolutionary war. You can't really expect a whole lot of mercy or sympathy when you do stuff like that.

6 posted on 08/04/2010 5:48:10 AM PDT by wendy1946
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To: SJackson

Excellent article! I lived in the South most of my adult life (originally from Michigan) - the only thing I didn’t like about living there is the oppressive heat...it made my yankee DNA shut down. I had a visitor from Ghana in the early 1970s who told me that he much preferred the South to the North because you knew where you stood in the South. In the North the bigots were more subtle in their hate and hypocrisy.


7 posted on 08/04/2010 5:53:42 AM PDT by Sioux-san
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To: MNJohnnie
Who made the following statement?:

"Fear is the beginning of wisdom."

  1. Adolf Hitler
  2. Osama Bin Laden
  3. W. T. Sherman
  4. Pol Pot

8 posted on 08/04/2010 5:57:53 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: SJackson

Excellent article. Thank you for posting.


9 posted on 08/04/2010 5:59:19 AM PDT by Blennos
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To: MNJohnnie
Please, let us fight again that terrible war with all its pride and atrocity. As a Southerner I am still aggrieved at the bloody hands of the north. The Tea Party is the closest to proof since that time that the South shall rise again. Perhaps this time we can carry the day and end the tyranny of the Northern (read liberal) aggressors.
10 posted on 08/04/2010 6:00:27 AM PDT by Louis Foxwell (They are the vultures in Dark Crystal screeeching their hatred and fear into the void of their malig)
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To: MNJohnnie

Cloaking cheap labor in the guise of something more noble is nothing new and in fact quite similar to the open borders/amnesty crowd’s rationalizations today.


11 posted on 08/04/2010 6:03:19 AM PDT by rhombus
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To: SJackson

The straight scoop...for those few w/the eyes and ears who can bear the truth...

http://gunnyg.wordpress.com/2010/06/23/%E2%80%9Ci-agree-with-clyde-wilson-that-america-can%E2%80%99t-be-saved-or-returned-to-its-roots-until-the-republican-party-is-destroyed-%E2%80%9D/


12 posted on 08/04/2010 6:03:22 AM PDT by gunnyg (WE ARE BEHIND "ENEMY WITHIN" LINES, SURROUNDED, Our 'Novembers' Are Behind Us...If Ya Can "grok" it!)
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To: wendy1946

Strange. People in 2010 have talked of secession to escape an intrusive federal government but it couldn’t have happened in 1860. Oh, well we weren’t there. I suspect the truth is somewhere in the middle. One more thing. Look at who writes the history books. Should be a no brainer.


13 posted on 08/04/2010 6:04:29 AM PDT by beckysueb (January 20, 2013. When Obama becomes just a skidmark on the panties of American history.)
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To: SJackson

Jewish Confederate BUMP.


14 posted on 08/04/2010 6:05:07 AM PDT by SharpRightTurn (White, black, and red all over--America's affirmative action, metrosexual president.)
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To: Amos the Prophet; MNJohnnie

If we have CW II, what will be the heathen Yankee liberal excuse for invasion, rape and pillage? Slavery is gone, what will it be then? I leave that question for some Yankee scum to answer.....


15 posted on 08/04/2010 6:05:29 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Amos the Prophet
the South shall rise again

And do what? Lose again?

16 posted on 08/04/2010 6:05:55 AM PDT by frithguild (Joe Wilson was wrong when he shouted "You lie!" Obama doesn't just lie - he lies all the time.)
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To: MNJohnnie
Equally remarkable, President Lincoln did not say he would “stand by” his generals or that “we must give the military the tools it needs” to accomplish its mission. Instead, he rescinded the Order.

I guess you didn't read the article:

On January 4, 1863, President Lincoln had Grant's order rescinded, but by then Jewish families in the area had been expelled, humiliated, terrified, jailed, and in some cases stripped of their possessions.
The construction of the words in your comment is extremely disingenuous. "Lincoln did not say ..." Lincoln did not say a lot of things. He didn't say anything about wanting to travel to Siam either.

ML/NJ

17 posted on 08/04/2010 6:07:00 AM PDT by ml/nj
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To: MNJohnnie
That Slavery was fundamental issue that split the North and the South in the Civil War is just plain fact

You sound like the MSM today: "The unpopularity of Obama's policies are racism."
18 posted on 08/04/2010 6:07:36 AM PDT by Tzfat
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To: central_va

Proverbs 9:10


19 posted on 08/04/2010 6:10:29 AM PDT by frithguild (Joe Wilson was wrong when he shouted "You lie!" Obama doesn't just lie - he lies all the time.)
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To: frithguild

Ahhh, no. You see, now we have all the guns. While the north was busy disarming themselves we were busy arming ourselves. And the north is probably outnumbered because they have aborted all their babies. And of course gay men are probably too busy worrying about decorating and fashion to fight a war.


20 posted on 08/04/2010 6:11:50 AM PDT by beckysueb (January 20, 2013. When Obama becomes just a skidmark on the panties of American history.)
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To: beckysueb

The agenda of the North was always to destroy the Southern economy and culture. That slavery was part of the equation is undeniable and forever curses the Southern cause. War, however, was not intended to end slavery but to destroy the South.
I wrote the following to commemorate the same dynamic today in the form of the liberal cause of ending the independence of the American people by today’s Northern hypocrites, the Progressives.
They are the vultures of Dark Crystal screeeching their hatred and fear into the void of their malignant lusts knowing their malicious theft and corruption have been exposed and they will die ten thousand tiny quivering excremental deaths for every greedy mouthful they have swallowed.
Go Sarah.


21 posted on 08/04/2010 6:12:46 AM PDT by Louis Foxwell (They are the vultures in Dark Crystal screeeching their hatred and fear into the void ....)
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To: Amos the Prophet

Well said.


22 posted on 08/04/2010 6:13:38 AM PDT by beckysueb (January 20, 2013. When Obama becomes just a skidmark on the panties of American history.)
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To: beckysueb

Ok


23 posted on 08/04/2010 6:14:32 AM PDT by frithguild (Joe Wilson was wrong when he shouted "You lie!" Obama doesn't just lie - he lies all the time.)
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To: SJackson
In the case of Virginia, to cite one example, it is quite clear that the state did not secede over slavery; it stayed in the Union after seven Southern states seceded and formed the Confederacy. It was only after President Lincoln called for 75,000 troops from state militias to attack the South that Virginia, refusing to wage war on its "kinfolk," left the Union. * * * * *

Gen. Jackson - Men of the Valley

24 posted on 08/04/2010 6:22:42 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: MNJohnnie

You shouldn’t comment on things you obviously know nothing about.


25 posted on 08/04/2010 6:23:44 AM PDT by BubbaBasher ("Liberty will not long survive the total extinction of morals" - Sam Adams)
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To: MNJohnnie

It gives the Grays a lot of comfort in pretending that the MAIN reason for those initial states bolting was something nuance and praiseworthy, and not something disgraceful even by 19th century standards.

It was pretty much in black and white that the power elite were terrified that Abe was going to free the people they held in bondage. That’s why they left. The guy wasnt even sworn-in yet!

Now for those other states? Maybe you can make a roundabout case that they left because they didnt wish to see federal force used to compel these states to remain in the union.

But if slavery wasn’t in their top 5 reasons, they make a crappy show of trying to prove it.


26 posted on 08/04/2010 6:41:29 AM PDT by VanDeKoik (Iran doesnt have a 2nd admendment. Ya see how that turned out?)
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To: SJackson

still struggle to expose the truth about why Southern soldiers fought...

Many of ‘em fought because they wanted to, because they enjoyed fighting (and winning). “Honor-based”, slave-holding culture, duels, sir and ma’am for almost everybody. I’ve read direct quotes of General Lee addressing individual sergeants under his command as “Sir”.


27 posted on 08/04/2010 6:41:55 AM PDT by flowerplough (Thomas Sowell: Those who look only at Obama's deeds tend to become Obama's critics.)
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To: SJackson

I applaude the patriotic tone of this article and I appreciate the intimate stories of the Civil War from a new and very interesting family viewpoint with so much detail.

But some of the history related is, in my opinion, mistaken;

and the story of Grant’s order #11 which applied to Jewish traders trying to pass through Grant’s lines and to go South to buy cotton cheaply for large profits,

is indeed mentioned in many history books -— but what I have read before this is completely at odds with what is related above.

Again, very interesting article.


28 posted on 08/04/2010 6:51:09 AM PDT by DontTreadOnMe2009 (So stop treading on me already!)
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To: SJackson

Thank you for this post.


29 posted on 08/04/2010 6:52:43 AM PDT by bayouranger (The 1st victim of islam is the person who practices the lie.)
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To: MNJohnnie
While I hold no sympathy for those who try to paint Abraham Lincoln as a tyrant, I have to say that the Southern Armies with scattered exceptions such as Quantrill's raiders and the Ft. Pillow Massacre, conducted themselves with considerably more dignity than their Northern counterparts.

Further, such difference was mainly a function of their leadership rather than their innate natures.

Lee's Army spent almost a month in south central Pennsylvania before the fateful approach to Gettysburg from the north and west. The only atrocities recorded against the civilian population was one incident of the southern army near York capturing a group of 40 African American men whom they thought to be runaway slaves (but were mostly free men) and sending them south to slavery. There was another incident of Southern soldiers snatching headgear off the heads of townspeople in exchange for their battered headgear. Lee promptly issued an order that all such exchanges going forward were to be voluntary or paid in cash. While the presence of a large hostile army was obviously intimidation, compare and contrast Lee's Army comparative gentle treatment of the Pennsylvania population to Sherman's treatment of the Georgia population one year later. Sherman's army paid the civilians for nothing, took everything which they deemed useful and wantonly burned and destroyed everything else, including civilian homes with the inhabitants still inside. They went out of their way to slaughter, pillage and destroy everything in their path from Atlanta to the sea, a scale of destruction unmatched since the Thirty Year's War, some two centuries earlier.

30 posted on 08/04/2010 7:06:31 AM PDT by Vigilanteman (Obama: Fake black man. Fake Messiah. Fake American. How many fakes can you fit in one Zer0?)
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To: MNJohnnie

The tall guy from Illinois made it clear during the campaign and in his inaugural address that he had no intent to interfere with slavery where it exists, and that as President he had no legal right to do so. It was likely one of many issues, probably near the top of the list for slaveholders, but it’s revisionism to suggest Abe invaded the South for that purpose, or that slavery was the motivation of the particimants, Southern ancestors tarred as pro slavery, northerners as anti. And it’s the honor and rembrance or thsoe vererans the article is about


31 posted on 08/04/2010 7:08:22 AM PDT by SJackson (most merciful thing that a large family does to one of its infant members is to kill it, M Sanger)
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To: frithguild

the South shall rise again
And do what? Lose again?

Perhaps, but it is a noble cause.


32 posted on 08/04/2010 7:13:17 AM PDT by Louis Foxwell (They are the vultures in Dark Crystal screeeching their hatred and fear into the void ....)
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To: central_va; BubbaBasher; Tzfat; ml/nj; rhombus; Amos the Prophet; VanDeKoik; Vigilanteman; ...
What is particularly tiresome is this attempt, for modern political reasons, to rewrite history to make certain race and ethnic groups eternal victims. Well historic facts don't fit the current PC dogmas.

There were Jewish slave owners, their were Black slave owners. Their were Black soldiers in the Confederate army. Their were Jewish soldiers in the Confederate army. Their were Jewish slave traders, their were Black slave traders. Most of the blacks sold into slavery were war captives taken by other blacks and sold to white slavers. All groups have been oppressed, and oppressor, in history. NO race or ethic groups is pure and innocent.

This constant attempt to rewrite history to validate current political dogmas is childish and really must stop.

33 posted on 08/04/2010 7:25:45 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run our of other peoples money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: MNJohnnie

Not stopping bump.


34 posted on 08/04/2010 7:29:28 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: MNJohnnie

You’re absolutely correct but the temptation to continue the feud appears stronger among some than to stand united against our foes.


35 posted on 08/04/2010 7:30:31 AM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: Amos the Prophet
................. SC Congressmen to beat a Massachusetts Senator to the edge of death on the Senate floor

Ahhhhhh the Good Ole Days.. sighhhh

36 posted on 08/04/2010 7:34:55 AM PDT by Robe (Rome did not create a great empire by talking, they did it by killing all those who opposed them)
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To: MNJohnnie
There were Jewish slave owners, their were Black slave owners. Their were Black soldiers in the Confederate army. Their were Jewish soldiers in the Confederate army. Their were Jewish slave traders, their were Black slave traders. Most of the blacks sold into slavery were war captives taken by other blacks and sold to white slavers. All groups have been oppressed, and oppressor, in history. NO race or ethic groups is pure and innocent.

Exactly. And the most recalcitrant group of slave traders is in northeast Africa-- the Sudan region today and the Kenyan region in the 1880's when British warships had to patrol the coast and later even put the country under colonial administration to end the sorry practice.

How ironic it is that we have a Kenyan in the white house still engaging in a whole new level of slave trading.

37 posted on 08/04/2010 7:35:33 AM PDT by Vigilanteman (Obama: Fake black man. Fake Messiah. Fake American. How many fakes can you fit in one Zer0?)
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To: rockrr
You’re absolutely correct but the temptation to continue the feud appears stronger among some than to stand united against our foes.

Funny, how the way these "crazy" pro-southern civil war threads get invaded are similar to how the south was invaded in 1861. I guess being a anti-Republic status quo bully is genetic.

38 posted on 08/04/2010 7:37:34 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: rockrr

are similar=is similar


39 posted on 08/04/2010 7:39:02 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va

“Invaded”?! Don’t be a moron.


40 posted on 08/04/2010 7:45:11 AM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: rockrr
“Invaded”?! Don’t be a moron.

Can't stay away,can you?

41 posted on 08/04/2010 7:49:17 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: MNJohnnie; SJackson; ml/nj; Alouette; ExTexasRedhead; Eleutheria5; sheik yerbouty; MeanWestTexan; ..
It should be noted that Grant as President apparently made amends for that infamous order and enjoyed good relations with the American Jewish community in general.

Lincoln is to be greatly admired for rescinding that order after being alerted to it by representatives of Jews directly impacted by it.

42 posted on 08/04/2010 7:49:51 AM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: central_va
Can't stay away,can you?

I go where I please and I'm certainly not dissuaded or discouraged by a wretch like you

43 posted on 08/04/2010 7:52:18 AM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: MNJohnnie

What a load of crap. It’s evidence of the guilt that the North still bears for the war crimes inflicted upon the Southern population by the Yankee aggressors that prompts this kind of a response.


44 posted on 08/04/2010 7:54:35 AM PDT by pgkdan (When the same man...holds the sword and the purse, there is an end of liberty: George Mason)
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To: Amos the Prophet

If a state cecedes while restoring the Constitution to how the framers intended it, I will move there.


45 posted on 08/04/2010 7:55:45 AM PDT by frithguild (Joe Wilson was wrong when he shouted "You lie!" Obama doesn't just lie - he lies all the time.)
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To: justiceseeker93
Though my own ancestors were Southern Unionists, I'm glad to see an article that corrects the bizarre notion that the Confederacy was a sort of proto-Nazi Germany.

Unfortunately, history being what it is, it seems one can't defend the South without slamming the Republican party, which is also wrongly accused of anti-Semitism.

PS: There was plenty of anti-Semitism in the North, but Lincoln was not an anti-Semite.

46 posted on 08/04/2010 7:58:09 AM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (Re'eh, 'Anokhi noten lifneykhem hayom berakhah uqelalah.)
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To: rockrr
I go where I please and I'm certainly not dissuaded or discouraged by a wretch like you

I am pointing out your invasion, not protesting it. You are not that important to even care about. Self flattery seems to be a Yankee trait. Legends in your own mind.

47 posted on 08/04/2010 7:58:33 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator; SJackson; MNJohnnie; ml/nj; ExTexasRedhead; Alouette; All
I don't get the idea that the author of the posted piece is accusing Lincoln of being an antisemite.

He accuses Sherman of antisemitism, which is the first I've ever heard of. He does not give any specific facts to show it, however. I can understand someone of his background calling Sherman a lot of names.

48 posted on 08/04/2010 8:07:57 AM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: central_va

“Fear is the beginning of wisdom”

King Solomon, King David and G-d.

“The fear of the L-RD is the beginning of wisdom.”

It’s in Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy, Proverbs, Psalms in various forms about 100 times.


49 posted on 08/04/2010 8:09:43 AM PDT by Jewbacca (The residents of Iroquois territory may not determine whether Jews may live in Jerusalem.)
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To: pgkdan
war crimes inflicted upon the Southern population

Crushing the enemy is not a war crime. Ask the Japanese.

50 posted on 08/04/2010 8:10:58 AM PDT by frithguild (Joe Wilson was wrong when he shouted "You lie!" Obama doesn't just lie - he lies all the time.)
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