How to Answer Liberals Who Scream “First Amendment Rights” for the Ground Zero Mosque (Vanity)

8/24/10 | self

[CitizenM]

When arguing against those who support building the Islamic mosque in close proximity to where the Twin Towers fell - engulfed in flames and dust from the Jihadist attack - because Liberals feel it is the Constitutional right of Muslims to build it:

Just employ the “KISS” (Keep It Simple Stupid) principle.

Just give them the facts:

- New York City has more than 100 mosques.

- There are over 2,000 mosques in the United States.

- Other NYC property to build the Cordoba mosque has been offered, free of charge to the planners.

- No one is denying them, or opposing the right to Freedom of Religion/religious expression should they build anywhere else in NYC.

Moslems have been free to build mosques and worship without controversy in that city, and most always in locations throughout our country.

The issue of the opposition to the construction of a mosque/cultural center (whatever they are calling it now) in New York cannot, therefore, be clouded by arguing that the Islamists are being denied religious freedom or expression. They have enjoyed that freedom many times over, and may still do so.

The issue lies only with the site they have selected. It is one of location, location, location. That is not a fight with the First Amendment.

And…since, for many years, our government has denied:

The placing of Christian crosses on the roadside to honor a Veteran,

References to The Ten Commandments in or on public buildings,

Prayer in schools and public places,

Nativity scenes on public or government property,

The use of the Bible in the Courtroom,

And so many more restraints against Christian religious displays and expression that it is almost impossible to keep tabs. All because minorities of differing non-Christian, non-Judean religions or those with no religious beliefs might, just possibly, feel oppressed, intimidated, offended, or otherwise upset by anything related to an outward demonstration of Christianity.

So, now, equally applying that Politically Correct (as it is argued) ruling, our government should fully and specifically protect the “feelings” of the MAJORITY of Americans, especially those who suffered personal losses at Ground Zero where innocent people were murdered at the will and desire of hate filled Islamic Jihadists.

Our leaders need to listen to the millions whose sensitivities the government seems to be casting aside. It is still our country. We are offended by the placement of this building in the shadow of Hallowed Ground. We are being oppressed into accepting it There; intimidated by others who insist we are being prejudiced, and upset because the pain of that tragic day is being rekindled and will stab at our hearts and memories every time the Islamic Call to Prayer blasts out from the mosque over the blood-stained ground where Twin Towers once stood and where the lives of innocent people ended in agony.

We want OUR rights guaranteed this time!

Democracy is still alive in the USA; we have not lost it as of yet. And in this country Democracy is supposed to mean the government acquiesces to the rule of the MAJORITY. Democratic rule trumps the right of the minority to face slap us. PERIOD. END OF DISCUSSION.

[CitizenM]

I don't often post a vanity, but I am so tired of this construction project being complicated by the non-issue of Freedom of Religion. It is a smokescreen being employed by Liberals. The result is that this is just what the fanatic Islamic factions want for ammunition to engage more terrorists and step up their war against Americans. If the "Freedom of Religion" argument isn't stopped, and sane minds look at the real objection, then Americans will end up opposing every other mosque building project to come. The Muslims have pretty much enjoyed construction of their places of worship without too much objection. But this slap in our faces will sting forever if they continue with their plans at the Ground Zero site. The imam behind this is just escalating confrontations. Neither side will go without being harmed.

[pnh102]

Also add to this list that Mr. Mosque and his wife are travelling all over the world on our dime to preach the wonders of sharia. I’d like for the liberals to tell us where’s that “wall of separation” between mosque and state?

[waxer1]

Good vanity..except we are not a democracy. I really wish people would quit refering to USA as a democracy we are not.

[HushTX]

I also tend to use the text of the First Amendment in my discussion of this issue.

Congress has passed no laws regarding the “Ground Zero Mosque.” The First Amendment has not been violated.

The First Amendment does not guarantee the right for construction of a building. It only protects the free practice, which logically includes the necessities of said practice. A building is not a necessity in religious practice, so is not protected by the First.

The Constitution is written on a fifth grade reading level. It does not require interpretation. It is clear and concise, unlike legislation passed by Congress today.

Excellent points, though. Just wanted to share my own.

[MrB]

Leftists really need to be confronted with

“You’re a self-styled ‘liberal’ who is trying to use the Freedom of Religion argument in defense of the mosque? That’s laughable. Next you’ll be arguing for private property rights! HA! Let’s go all the way! Let’s hear your adamant defense of 2nd amendment rights!”

[Tax Government]

I marvel that democrats are stupid enough to support this thing. They are beyond tone deaf; they are running, lemming-like, into the sea.

[Puppage]

Just give them the facts:

Liberals don't deal in facts, they deal only in feeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeelings.

Facts mean nothing.

[PA-RIVER]

I would say yes, we have a right to express our faith. But first, explain why our President covered all expressions of Christian faith and Jesus when he spoke at Notre Dame?

[CitizenM]

Actually, I was very careful not to say we are a Democracy. I know better.

I know we are a Republic with the Democratic rule of governing. So I said, specifically, "Democracy is still alive in the USA," and "And in this country Democracy is supposed to mean the government acquiesces to the rule of the MAJORITY....Democratic rule ..." Please read that section again. I assure you, that is one of my arguments, too, that people keep calling this a "Democracy."

[Pecos]

“The Constitution is written on a fifth grade reading level. It does not require interpretation. It is clear and concise, unlike legislation passed by Congress today.”

The problem is that too many children have graduated from high school without receiving a fifth grade education.

[television is just wrong]

I used to get yelled at in school for trying to remind people we have a REpublican form of government which is a representative govt. Not a mob rule democracy.

[MNnice]

Since when has the Left ever been concerned over anyone’s religious rights? These are the same people who took God out of schools, took Christmas from the public square, and prayers from high school football games.

But let’s not stop at religious rights. When has the Left ever been concerned about the Constitution? Everything they propose is unconstitutional.

[alicewonders]

I’ve had a couple of liberal acquaintances throw that whole freedom of religion thing in my face. They always accuse me of being prejudiced against Islam.

It stops them cold when I say, “You know what I don’t like about Islam? The way they treat women and gays.”

They always look like they swallowed a rotten egg and shut up at that point.

[MortMan]

I prefer to use seven letters and a space.

[CitizenM]

Exactly my point, you got my drift.

Left wingers have been chipping away at the First Amendment rights for over a decade. It is ironic that they want to employ that rule now, in support of the Islamic center at this location.

Liberals are like people caught in a revolving door...they are always "spinning."

The result is, they pretty much end up looking like the dizzy Nancy Pelosi. who can't make sense of anything because she has been revolving around and around so long in her spin-a-new-lie life.

[waxer1]

Point well taken.

[ml/nj]

Just employ the “KISS” (Keep It Simple Stupid) principle.

Islam isn't a religion. It is a military organization. The first amendment cannot apply to a "religion" that believes in imposing laws suppressing other religions.

ML/NJ

[bassmaner]

I prefer to use seven letters and a space.

ROF LMAO {?}

[CitizenM]

I am in agreement with that. Thanks for your comment. But that is an issue for another argument. I tried to keep this post on focus about how the Liberals are trying to turn this opposition into a fight about religion (as most view Islam.) That seems to be the focus of left wingers...because they are so stupidly unaware of and insensitive to the real issue.

[Prince of Space]

Love it! Throw it right back at them. Such hypocrites!

[PATRIOT1876]

*It stops them cold when I say, “You know what I don’t like about Islam? The way they treat women and gays.”

They always look like they swallowed a rotten egg and shut up at that point.*

Good one! They hate it when you use something they might say.

[TexasFreeper2009]

I just say...

So let me get this straight...

It's ok for Muslims to build at ground zero...
But it's not ok for Israel to build in Jerusalem. got it. It all makes sense now... *rolls eyes*

[CitizenM]

Good response, too. We have so many smart FReepers.

[Mr. Silverback]

Nice work.

[CitizenM]

Thanks for sharing your insight. Good points also.

[CitizenM]

Great, alicewonders. Would love to see how they choke on that response!

[CitizenM]

Thanks!!!

[conservativebabe]

Exactly

Just a person can twist a paperclip into the form of cat and call it “art” so can we get caught up in defining what religion is.

In my mind any religion that teaches to suppress the rights of some of followers (women) and endorses the murder of non-believers is not a religion.

Islam is the only “religion” I know of that includes as part of its doctrine the not only endorsement of but requirement to kill “infidels”.

It’s a psychosis, not a religion.

[ConservaTexan]

Ask if they would support and defend the first amendment right of the KKK to erect a building/monument close to the Sixteenth Street Baptist Church in Birmingham, AL.

[Liz]

NOW HERE'S A GREAT IDEA Spain's "Cordoba Mosque" converted to Catholic Cathedral.

The Great Mosque of Córdoba, Spain, begun 786, then converted into Córdoba's Roman Catholic cathedral in 1238. The Catholic Cathedral is known locally as La Mezquita —The Mosque.

Aerial view of the Great Mosque of Córdoba, Spain, begun 786, doubled in area in the 10th century to 585 x 410 feet, with 1,200 columns supporting horseshoe arches, patterned with colored marbles and other stones. Although it was converted into Córdoba's Roman Catholic cathedral in 1238, the building is known locally as La Mezquita —The Mosque. LINK AT SITE: see the Great Mosque of Córdoba, showing the Christian alterations.

[Renderofveils]

Islam isn't a religion. It is a military organization. The first amendment cannot apply to a "religion" that believes in imposing laws suppressing other religions.

It's a militant theocracy. Support of shariah in the United States is sedition. Cut and dried.

[ml/nj]

right of the KKK to erect a building/monument

No! A "cultural center" !!

ML/NJ

[ml/nj]

right of the KKK to erect a building/monument

No! A "cultural center" !!

ML/NJ

[Renderofveils]

The Great Mosque of Córdoba, Spain, begun 786, then converted into Córdoba's Roman Catholic cathedral in 1238.

The conversion of the church of St Vincent into the Great Mosque of Cordoba began in 786. It was RECLAIMED by Christianity in 1238.

[Liz]

Will add.

[CitizenM]

Very interesting, thanks for posting this. There is a thread on here about Michelle taking her daughter to visit a mosque while she was in Spain. She could have visited this, also. But, anyway...you might want to post this article as a comment on that thread. I think it would be very appropriate there, and good for others to read.

[Liz]

Already posted this on thread you referenced.

[MortMan]

The phrase I have in mind whymes with “Yuck Foo”

[KeyLargo]

Mosque opposition not based on ‘tyranny of the majority’

August 24, 2010

Opposition to the mosque being proposed to be built near Ground Zero in New York has nothing to do with a “tyranny of the majority” as the Chicago Sun-Times editorial board suggested [”Constitution should settle mosque issue,” Aug. 17]. This issue is driven by common sense — or a lack thereof.

Those who have chosen the location near Ground Zero in New York are very much within their rights to build a mosque anywhere they choose. As Americans, their freedom to practice their religion is guaranteed. However, the equally important right to free speech does not allow people to attend the funerals of fallen soldiers and disrupt them with unique political agendas.

All of our rights come with the understanding that they will be enjoyed with a modicum of common sense. Anyone suggesting that this mosque being proposed so close to a location where 2,750 Americans were murdered in the name of an extreme interpretation of religion is ignoring common sense.

Corey Simonson, Irving Park

[numberonepal]

Building a mosque close to GZ is like building a gun and black trench coat store across the street from Columbine HS.

[CitizenM]

Good comparison. I will use it.

[Labyrinthos]

“And…since, for many years, our government has denied:

The placing of Christian crosses on the roadside to honor a Veteran,

References to The Ten Commandments in or on public buildings,

Prayer in schools and public places,

Nativity scenes on public or government property,

The use of the Bible in the Courtroom”

The obvious distinction is that all above concern public propery, whereas the mosque is on private property. The better arguments have little to do with religious freedom under the 1st Amendment, but rather, Due Process and Equal Protection under the 5th and 14th Amendments, in that the City of New York is exercising a different set of standards for the mosque than the standards it applies to everyone else including other projects of a religious nature.

[SoldierDad]

I have an even bigger problem than with just the building of this mosque within the shadow of the 9/11/01 site. Islam isn’t just a religion. It is predominately political, judicial, and military in it’s scope, with the aim to supplant all other forms of political, judicial, military and religious beliefs everywhere it spreads (and their aim is to spread everywhere across the globe). Those of us who love our country and the principles of liberty and freedom given to us by our forefathers, and defended by our soldiers in uniform, had better wake up and oppose Islam itself - Islam needs to be removed from our shores completely.

[wardaddy]

non-Judean religions

not exactly with all due respect on that point

[wxgesr]

or a chapel next to an abortion clinic

[W. W. SMITH]

Islam is an instrument of enslavement.

[W. W. SMITH]

IIRC the mosque in Cordoba was first a church then a mosque then back to being a church.

[Liz]

Right-—it was St Vincents’ Church initially-—then the mosque then the Cathedral.