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Stephen Hawking: God was not needed to create the Universe
Daily Telegraph ^ | 02 Sep 2010 | Laura Roberts

Posted on 09/02/2010 6:21:27 AM PDT by tlb

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To: Hegewisch Dupa

LOL!


101 posted on 09/02/2010 6:58:19 AM PDT by TSgt (And the war came.)
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To: tlb

So brilliant and yet so foolish.

Where does he suppose “laws” come from?

Laws represent order, and order comes from design.


102 posted on 09/02/2010 6:58:31 AM PDT by Elpasser
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To: tlb
Hawking said: “Because there is a law such as gravity, the Universe can and will create itself from nothing.

That's a pretty goofy non sequitur, Professor.

103 posted on 09/02/2010 6:59:22 AM PDT by Sloth (Civil disobedience? I'm afraid only the uncivil kind is going to cut it this time.)
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To: tlb
“It is not necessary to invoke God to light the blue touch paper and set the Universe going.”

Uh...

...is it necessary to invoke anything to light it...?

Uh... ...or... ...did it just light itself???

Something must have lit it.

Whatever that Something is...is...well... ...uh God.

Poor Stephen. He's finally gone over the edge.

"A rose by any other name would smell as sweet."

"Oh what a noble mind is here o'erthrown."

104 posted on 09/02/2010 6:59:50 AM PDT by Savage Beast ("True evil has a face you know and a voice you trust." Greg Iles. "True Evil")
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To: tlb
Those who assert that there is no God, have a reason for doing so.
I am so thankful for receiving God's Divine Gift of Faith.
I truly feel sorrowful for those who have not received this gift, or who have received it and then discarded it through the sin of Pride. Say a prayer for Steven. He actually believes his argument holds water.
105 posted on 09/02/2010 7:00:22 AM PDT by J Edgar
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To: snarkbait
"A point of infinite energy is not “nothing”"

Absolutely right. In fact, it is pretty much impossible to define what "nothing" is. As soon as you define it, it becomes '"something". Philosophers and scientists have grappled with this for centuries. I like the definition put forth by Johathan Edwards (the pastor, theologian and philosopher - not the politician.) "Nothing is what rocks dream of".

106 posted on 09/02/2010 7:00:29 AM PDT by circlecity
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To: ShadowAce

I think the repeated emphasis on
“And the evening and the morning were the Xth day”


107 posted on 09/02/2010 7:00:59 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a (de)humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: tlb

Bottom line..ta,ta....,”There Is NO God”. This man is a fool!


108 posted on 09/02/2010 7:01:04 AM PDT by shiva
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To: ShadowAce

I think the repeated emphasis on
“And the evening and the morning were the Xth day”

were intentional, as is everything God has done.


109 posted on 09/02/2010 7:01:27 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a (de)humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: Nabber
"Agreed. Where did gravity come from?"

Where did god come from?

110 posted on 09/02/2010 7:02:13 AM PDT by mlo
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To: tlb

Stephen Hawking.
What a dumbass.


111 posted on 09/02/2010 7:02:18 AM PDT by Verbosus (/* No Comment */)
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To: tlb

It’s very godlike of him to make such a statement.


112 posted on 09/02/2010 7:04:27 AM PDT by samtheman
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To: dfwgator

I agree with you totally.

The Bible may contain some history and some biology and some astronomy. But its not a science or history book.
Its a moral and theological tome concerning God, man, and salvation.

But NEVER, NEVER post that in an Evolution blog here. They will crucify you - literally.


113 posted on 09/02/2010 7:04:41 AM PDT by ZULU (God, guts and guns made America great,)
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To: mlo

That’s the point.

I AM

means eternally existing.

I AM

created the “time” by which you’re attempting to measure Him.


114 posted on 09/02/2010 7:04:50 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a (de)humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: airborne

That is it exactly. Excellent observation.


115 posted on 09/02/2010 7:05:18 AM PDT by cbvanb
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To: Zionist Conspirator

I often ask athiests “do wings on a bird have a purpose?” They invariably answer “yes, to fly”. I then ask the same about legs, eyes, etc. They again answer ‘yes’. I then ask them to look up the definition of ‘purpose’ in any dictionary and I inform them that the first synonymous definition they will see listed is ‘intent’. I then ask them to explain ‘intent’ in the absence of intelligence. This generally ends the debate.


116 posted on 09/02/2010 7:05:18 AM PDT by Right Brother
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To: Verbosus

Stephen Hawking.
What a dumbass.


That’s pretty funny in its succinct manner.
Kinda reminiscient of Andrew Dice Clay.


117 posted on 09/02/2010 7:05:56 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a (de)humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: mlo
"Where did god come from?"

He is eternal, God was not created. Once can't explain existance with out assuming an eternal as an axiom. Thus, either the universe is eternal and had no beginning (Hoyle's "steady state" theory) or there is an eternal God which created the universe. Science currently points to a universe which had a beginning. If one assumes time is a componant of the universe then logic dictates it must have had a beginning. That leaves only God. Which is eactly what first four words of the Bible tell us.

118 posted on 09/02/2010 7:07:20 AM PDT by circlecity
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To: SMARTY

Yes.

Consciousness creates form. Always the spirit forms the flesh. It is never the other way around.

CA....


119 posted on 09/02/2010 7:09:58 AM PDT by Chances Are (Whew! Seems I've found that silly grin again!)
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To: ShadowAce
Presuming you didn't come up with that in parallel, Terry Pratchett should be given credit:
In the begining there was nothing, and it exploded.
- Terry Pratchett
Some other favorites of mine:
The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it.
Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time.
Always be wary of any helpful item that weighs less than its operating manual.
The truth may be out there, but the lies are inside your head.
He says gods like to see an atheist around. Gives them something to aim at.
And my personal all-time favorite:
Give a man a fire and he's warm for the day. But set fire to him and he's warm for the rest of his life.
- Terry Pratchett
For my money the best author of fantasy humor ever.
120 posted on 09/02/2010 7:10:34 AM PDT by PreciousLiberty (In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they're not.)
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To: tlb

“but it wouldn’t be a personal God that you could meet, and ask questions.”

That doesn’t logically follow.
Requires an assumption of a fact not in evidence.

If there were an infinite God (which I believe there is) wouldn’t He want to reveal Himself? Of what possible purpose would a Creator create something for no reason?


121 posted on 09/02/2010 7:10:37 AM PDT by vanilla swirl (We are the Patrick Henry we have been waiting for!)
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To: tlb

Sounds like Stephen has some gum on his wheel.


122 posted on 09/02/2010 7:12:51 AM PDT by MarineBrat (Better dead than red!)
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To: PreciousLiberty
Actually, I was thinking it was Douglas Adams in the Hitchhiker's series.

But I could be wrong.

123 posted on 09/02/2010 7:14:15 AM PDT by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: dfwgator
The Bible says God created the world in 7 days, I don’t take that literally, after all a day is the time it takes for the Earth to revolve one time, it’s a man-made unit of measure. To God, a “day” may very well have been millions of years

I've thought that for years. My Pastor and I disagree on it - he thinks it's 7 literal days. To me, a God big enough to create something as expansive as the Universe wouldn't measure his time based on how long it takes the Earth to make one revolution.


124 posted on 09/02/2010 7:19:28 AM PDT by reagan_fanatic (YouTube My Space and I'll Google your Yahoo.)
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To: reagan_fanatic
To me, a God big enough to create something as expansive as the Universe wouldn't measure his time based on how long it takes the Earth to make one revolution.

Then you need to read the passage again. When was the sun created? It certainly wasn't before days were mentioned. Perhaps our revolution around the sun was based on a day, rather than the other way around?

I'm certainly not saying this is the case, but it cannot be disproven, either. I just find it interesting that the sun wasn't created until the fourth day.

125 posted on 09/02/2010 7:23:35 AM PDT by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: ShadowAce; reagan_fanatic
Revolution, orbit. I know I mixed them up. Sorry.

My point still stands, though.

126 posted on 09/02/2010 7:24:55 AM PDT by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: tlb

Let’s see now ... Trinity, Hiroshima et. al. demonstrated that matter can be converted to energy; I understand it’s been demonstrated experimentally that energy can be converted to matter.

But, if you start with neither, how is either “created”?


127 posted on 09/02/2010 7:27:41 AM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: tlb

Dude vistited the taxidermist some time ago, now just a prop.


128 posted on 09/02/2010 7:28:48 AM PDT by dusttoyou (Let the other side get all wee-wee'd up, Remember come November)
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To: RockyMtnMan

The Bible says through Christ Jesus, God spoke the worlds into existence.


129 posted on 09/02/2010 7:29:00 AM PDT by carton253 (Ask me about The Stainless Banner - a free e-zine dedicated to the armies of the Confederacy.)
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To: ShadowAce

Just as Jesus didn’t leave any ambiguity about who He was, so God didn’t leave any in the Creation days. You have to make a choice - believe man or believe scripture. Due to the order given in Genesis 1, you can’t warp scripture to “fit” man’s understanding or assumptions of creation.

It was a supernatural event, as we’ve determined here by the “ex nihilo” factor. So, yes, the sun, moon, and stars were created later than “light” existed.


130 posted on 09/02/2010 7:29:18 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a (de)humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: shiva

God is Dead. — Nietzsche

Nietzsche is Dead. — God


131 posted on 09/02/2010 7:30:24 AM PDT by samtheman
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To: Boogieman

It seems, Hawking making a declarative statement was that was needed all along. Who knew?


132 posted on 09/02/2010 7:31:11 AM PDT by Texas Songwriter
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To: shiva

God is Dead. — Nietzsche

Nietzsche is Dead. — God

Zed’s dead, baby. Zed’s dead. — Butch


133 posted on 09/02/2010 7:31:32 AM PDT by samtheman
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To: tlb
Sitting there in his wheel chair, unable to move, unable to speak, barely able to communicate with the world outside, alone with his thoughts, he reminds me of that line from Hamlet “I could be bounded in a nutshell and count myself a king of infinite space, were it not that I have bad dreams.” Oh yes, bad dreams: he believes in God, everyone does, he just doesn't know it, or want to admit it.
134 posted on 09/02/2010 7:33:29 AM PDT by PUGACHEV
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To: ozark hilljilly
I totally believe in the Big Bang, but "someone" had to pull the trigger. ; )

I agree. "On the first day God said let there be light"

If one where to contemplate the beginning of the universe. That would be one heck of a big bang!

I checked your personal page. I liked the picture,and I don't need an explanation.

For those who need one read Atlas Shrugged.

135 posted on 09/02/2010 7:39:04 AM PDT by painter (No wonder democrats don't mind taxes.THEY DON'T PAY THEM !)
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To: TSgt
God always existed.

Logical fallacy of special pleading.

Our weak little minds can’t wrap around the concept of forever. We only understand time as having a finite beginning and end.

Science has already played with the idea that time is not absolute. Time going in one direction only as we experience actually creates a problem in physics. In a "something from nothing" universe a timeline is assumed ("from"), but a timeline did not necessarily exist.

We can’t fully comprehend infinity.

Already been done. Our mathemeticians even do math using infinity. The "infinite monkeys crating all the works of Shakespeare" exercise is meant to explain infinity.

136 posted on 09/02/2010 7:45:31 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: ZULU

As my favorite Bible teacher says... the Bible is what God has chosen to reveal about Himself to finite. There are many mysteries left that He chose not to reveal...


137 posted on 09/02/2010 7:47:40 AM PDT by carton253 (Ask me about The Stainless Banner - a free e-zine dedicated to the armies of the Confederacy.)
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To: Boogieman
Okay...so let me think. There was this rock, and the rock was lonely so it wanted to create more rocks to keep it company. The rock thought, hey, I will become a universe. But, first I have to blow myself up. A bit dangerous to me, but I will give it a try. Oh my, I have no fuse, no ignition, how am I going to explode? That's okay, I have a Theory. And, thus the universe was born.

But I still don't get it...who made the rock?

138 posted on 09/02/2010 7:48:55 AM PDT by CitizenM ("Do you miss me yet?" Yes, George, we do.)
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To: tlb; wagglebee

So this is the atheist story of creation then. Keep it out of our schools.

There can be no more support for atheism and state than for church and state. The no god god cannot become the “defacto” state religion.


139 posted on 09/02/2010 7:52:14 AM PDT by a fool in paradise (I want IMPROVEMENT, not just CHANGE.)
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To: CitizenM
"But I still don't get it...who made the rock?"

Who made the person who made the rock?

140 posted on 09/02/2010 7:52:22 AM PDT by mlo
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To: Boogieman

When’s the next one happening?


141 posted on 09/02/2010 7:52:41 AM PDT by a fool in paradise (I want IMPROVEMENT, not just CHANGE.)
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To: ShadowAce; JoeProBono
First there was nothing. Then it exploded.

Cleanup is going to be a #%@&!

142 posted on 09/02/2010 7:53:28 AM PDT by a fool in paradise (I want IMPROVEMENT, not just CHANGE.)
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To: painter

“On the first day God said let there be light”
You betcha, >bang!< and there was light.
Of course, once you have a light/heat source then all the other stuff falls into place. But this is from my ig’nert bitter gun clinging, invisible sky god believing point of view.
(oh and Thanks.If you ever need or want to use that pic, go ahead and pinch it, I did that meself.) : )


143 posted on 09/02/2010 7:53:48 AM PDT by ozark hilljilly (Had enough, yet?)
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To: antiRepublicrat

I guess we’ll find out who is correct when we both assume room temperature?

God speed er I mean good luck!


144 posted on 09/02/2010 7:55:19 AM PDT by TSgt (And the war came.)
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To: a fool in paradise

He didn’t present a theory.


145 posted on 09/02/2010 7:55:19 AM PDT by mlo
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To: mlo

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/theory

“a coherent group of general propositions used as principles of explanation for a class of phenomena”

“a proposed explanation whose status is still conjectural, in contrast to well-established propositions that are regarded as reporting matters of actual fact.”


In his latest book, The Grand Design, an extract of which is published in Eureka magazine in The Times, Hawking said: “Because there is a law such as gravity, the Universe can and will create itself from nothing. Spontaneous creation is the reason there is something rather than nothing, why the Universe exists, why we exist.”

“It is not necessary to invoke God to light the blue touch paper and set the Universe going.”


PS I called it the atheist story of creation. It is his story (did not use the word theory).


146 posted on 09/02/2010 8:01:38 AM PDT by a fool in paradise (I want IMPROVEMENT, not just CHANGE.)
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To: Hemingway's Ghost

He’s OK with the concept of “Aliens”. Just not something as radical a concept as “Creator”. Brilliant people don’t know everything, but truly gifted people know that they don’t.


147 posted on 09/02/2010 8:02:03 AM PDT by jdsteel (CONGRESS: Take it again in twenty ten.)
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To: reagan_fanatic

2 Peter 3:8

But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.


148 posted on 09/02/2010 8:02:40 AM PDT by ozark hilljilly (Had enough, yet?)
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To: Vanders9
"So, why is there a law such as gravity? Mr Hawking is a smart man (although not a wise one) and he has succeeded in pushing back the boundaries of "starting points" more than most. But he has not explained everything. There is always a "why"."

That's true, he's only helped push back boundaries. We have yet to reach the root answers. Which is not the same as saying we never will.

But religion only pushes back the boundary too, and it does it based on speculation on unfounded belief.

149 posted on 09/02/2010 8:03:10 AM PDT by mlo
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To: TexasFreeper2009

I’ve read a couple of Hawking’s books. After the first book, my thought was that if you write a bunch of stuff about something that 99 percent of people don’t understand, then those people will think you are smart, even if you’re wrong or your theories can’t be proven. Those people will agree with you so others will think they’re smart too.

Does Hawkings have some good theories? Yes. But, since they can’t be proven (except in theoretic models), they’re just theories. I believe “The Personal God” is a creator, and that the workings of the physical world are organized by Him. That’s why I’m not a scientist, I guess.


150 posted on 09/02/2010 8:03:40 AM PDT by Dexter Morgan (Everyone hides who they are.)
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