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You’ve Come A Long Way, Baby: The Second Amendment finally applies to the states. Now the fight...
Reason ^ | October 2010 | Brian Doherty

Posted on 09/13/2010 12:38:53 PM PDT by neverdem

The Second Amendment finally applies to the states. Now the fight over gun rights really begins.

It was the morning of June 26, 2008, and Alan Gura had just won the first case he’d ever argued in front of the Supreme Court. Before taking a media victory lap to celebrate his historic vindication of the Second Amendment in D.C. v. Heller, Gura headed to the Court’s public information office for a moment of privacy. He called an old buddy from law school, the Chicago attorney David Sigale. “File it,” Gura said.

“It” became, almost exactly two years later, Gura’s second victory before the Supreme Court, McDonald v. Chicago. That case—decided, like the first one, by a narrow 5-4 majority—established that the gun rights recognized in the District of Columbia because of Heller must also be respected by states and cities outside the purview of the federal government. The Second Amendment’s protection now applies not just to D.C.’s 600,000 residents but to more than 300 million people across the country.

The magnitude and reach of this earthquake in American law, which has touched off slow-motion aftershocks throughout the 50 states, are still uncertain. But whatever the future holds, Americans’ ability to own guns has, at long last, taken its place among the other individual rights spelled out in the Bill of Rights.

The invalidation of handgun bans throughout the country, accomplished in the space of two years, was sudden and surprising even to those who have spent decades laying the groundwork. Take Alan Gottlieb, founder and president of the Second Amendment Foundation, which began backing Gura’s various gun lawsuits after Heller. Since founding the SAF in 1974, Gottlieb has been hosting academic conferences, supporting legal scholars and historians, and filing carefully targeted lawsuits in defense of gun rights...


(Excerpt) Read more at reason.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Editorial; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: banglist; heller; mcdonald

1 posted on 09/13/2010 12:38:56 PM PDT by neverdem
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To: neverdem

***Now the fight over gun rights really begins. ***

How true! I can read any newspaper in the US, order it through the mail, cross state lines to buy one.

Such should now apply for guns.

But I can’t buy a handgun out of state.
I can’t buy one through the mails.
I can’t own certain handguns or rifles in some areas.
I can’t own more than one in some cities and then the city may dictate what I am allowed to own.

Yes, the fight is now really on.


2 posted on 09/13/2010 12:50:20 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar ( AKA Rodrigo de Bivar)
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To: neverdem

“targeted lawsuits”...

bahaha! I get it...

Now, when will somebody file a lawsuit that forces DoD to allow us to carry weapons (on which we’re trained and which we carry everywhere else) on DoD installations?

Colonel, USAFR


3 posted on 09/13/2010 12:51:15 PM PDT by jagusafr ("We hold these truths to be self-evident...")
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To: jagusafr
Now, when will somebody file a lawsuit that forces DoD to allow us to carry weapons (on which we’re trained and which we carry everywhere else) on DoD installations?

Sounds like you might make a good Plaintiff.

4 posted on 09/13/2010 12:52:39 PM PDT by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar

I live in NJ.. someone please help me!!


5 posted on 09/13/2010 12:58:05 PM PDT by mikelets456
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To: Lurker

what your ideal of trained and some bureaucrat ideal is I am sure will not be the same


6 posted on 09/13/2010 1:19:43 PM PDT by jrd
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To: neverdem
The Second Amendment finally applies to the states.

Well duh, did anyone ever read the 10th Amendment?

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

7 posted on 09/13/2010 1:39:44 PM PDT by Las Vegas Ron (Moderates manipulate, extremest use violence, but the goal is the same.)
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To: harpseal; TexasCowboy; nunya bidness; AAABEST; Travis McGee; Squantos; wku man; SLB; ...
Click the Gadsden flag for pro-gun resources!
8 posted on 09/13/2010 1:41:21 PM PDT by Joe Brower (Sheep have three speeds: "graze", "stampede" and "cower".)
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To: mikelets456

ANJRPC recently filed a lawsuit against the state of NJ seeking repeal of the law that limits the purchase of handguns to no more than one every thirty days. The cavalry is approaching slowly even though the sound rattling sabers and hooves is still faint. After all,we’re still waiting for a favorable verdict from the courts on the Menendez recall issue.


9 posted on 09/13/2010 1:41:28 PM PDT by Postman
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To: Las Vegas Ron
I've always like reading Art 6 paragraph 2 right before reading the 10th.

This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.

I always giggle a little bit in nervous hysteria when reading the "Laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding" bit...

10 posted on 09/13/2010 1:47:35 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Alarm and Muster)
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To: neverdem
The Second Amendment’s protection now applies not just to D.C.’s 600,000 residents but to more than 300 million people across the country.

Right now it's a bit fuzzy as to what that protection really is. I guess it will take many court cases and much time to sort that out.

11 posted on 09/13/2010 1:48:56 PM PDT by umgud (Obama is a failed experiment.)
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To: Dead Corpse
...."Laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding" bit...

Indeed, not to mention the "shall not be infringed" part

12 posted on 09/13/2010 2:01:03 PM PDT by Las Vegas Ron (Moderates manipulate, extremest use violence, but the goal is the same.)
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To: Dead Corpse
--- all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States--

--that one I worry about--

13 posted on 09/13/2010 2:07:42 PM PDT by rellimpank (--don't believe anything the MSM tells you about firearms or explosives--NRA Benefactor)
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To: rellimpank

As long as you are armed you don’t have anything to worry about unless the other guy has more firepower than you do.


14 posted on 09/13/2010 2:11:14 PM PDT by B4Ranch (Conflict is inevitable; Combat is an option. Train for the fight.)
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To: B4Ranch

Uh, don’t forget being ABLE to hit your target.

We turned over rubble with 18 inch guns on the japanese islands, then the real fight began.....

Give me accuracy over caliber ANY day. Of course, don’t take this to the extreme.
Either end is bad. 223 is about as light as anyone should go in rifle, and 9mm in a handgun. But no use talking a lady in carrying a desert eagle in her purse because she will “out firepower” the bad guy....

Heh....quite a thought, little old lady with a Desert Eagle in her purse!


15 posted on 09/13/2010 2:18:11 PM PDT by BereanBrain
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To: rellimpank
"... to the Contrary notwithstanding"... Even Treaties need to comply where they might otherwise conflict.

And if a Judge says otherwise, remind them that they too are "bound thereby"...

16 posted on 09/13/2010 2:26:28 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Alarm and Muster)
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To: wardaddy; Joe Brower; Cannoneer No. 4; Criminal Number 18F; Dan from Michigan; Eaker; Jeff Head; ...
The Reason essay mentions Gura's pending case in Westchester County, NY.

Obama's electoral coalition is crumbling (LA Times is dumping on Hussein Alert)

‘Like a Dog’: The Origins of Barack Obama’s Petulance Excellent VDH

Castro at the Crossroads

‘Secure Communities’ plan threatens immigrants (That's the illegal immigrants.)

Some noteworthy articles about politics, foreign or military affairs, IMHO, FReepmail me if you want on or off my list.

17 posted on 09/13/2010 2:40:43 PM PDT by neverdem (Xin loi minh oi)
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To: neverdem

excellent. a nation without the right to own firearms is a nation without defense from tyranny.


18 posted on 09/13/2010 2:41:14 PM PDT by rightistight
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To: umgud; All
Well, at least 3 states have it right: Vermont, Alaska and Arizona at least understand the plain meaning of "shall not be infringed."

It's about

★ FREEDOM! ★

★ Estimated Value – PRICELESS! ★

19 posted on 09/13/2010 3:05:44 PM PDT by Neil E. Wright (An OATH is FOREVER OathKeeper III We are EVERYWHERE)
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To: 2nd amendment mama; myboyz

Ping!!


20 posted on 09/13/2010 4:08:06 PM PDT by basil (It's time to rid the country of "Gun Free Zones" aka "Killing Fields")
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To: neverdem
Heller isn't a Second Amendment case, though. Ninth Amendment, maybe, but there's no way the Second can be read as providing a right to police permission to keep a handgun in your home (and there only) for self-defense.
21 posted on 09/13/2010 4:12:58 PM PDT by Grut
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To: Grut
Heller isn't a Second Amendment case, though. Ninth Amendment, maybe, but there's no way the Second can be read as providing a right to police permission to keep a handgun in your home (and there only) for self-defense.

Nice try, but no cigar. The prefatory clause in the Second Amendment that mentions the militia, "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State," has been used by gun grabbers for a century or more to claim it is only a collective right. Heller says it is an individual right subject to reasonable regulations. Other cases will be coming including the bearing of arms. You don't pay for rights either. IMHO, all these fees will go the way of the poll tax.

22 posted on 09/13/2010 5:22:57 PM PDT by neverdem (Xin loi minh oi)
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To: rightistight

If ever the US or any state legislature passes laws that forbid ownership of firearms by citizens, that when it is time for us to replace the sitting politicians by force.


23 posted on 09/13/2010 6:51:21 PM PDT by B4Ranch (Conflict is inevitable; Combat is an option. Train for the fight.)
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To: BereanBrain

I know a little old lady with a Colt 1911 in her purse. She probably uses a box of ammo a month shooting at varmints and ground squirrels on her ranch. Her eyesight isn’t quite what it was but I wouldn’t want to go up against her.


24 posted on 09/13/2010 6:59:41 PM PDT by B4Ranch (Conflict is inevitable; Combat is an option. Train for the fight.)
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To: neverdem

Thanks for the ping!


25 posted on 09/13/2010 7:54:33 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: B4Ranch

My mom’s the same way (she packs a .38 snubby, eyesight just starting to go) . She might hit your ear, she might hit your toe, she might gut-shoot you. Makes a good case for yelling: “Hello the house!” at the edge of the yard should one want to go onto her property. And I always call ahead.


26 posted on 09/13/2010 8:07:05 PM PDT by Free in Texas (If islam is so great, why are there "religious police" who's main task is to beat you into a mosque?)
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To: Free in Texas

She is in dire need of some Crimson Trace laser sighted gun grips. Buy her a pair for whatever holiday is coming up next.

http://www.crimson-trace-laser-grips.com/smith.html


27 posted on 09/13/2010 8:17:56 PM PDT by B4Ranch (Conflict is inevitable; Combat is an option. Train for the fight.)
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To: neverdem
I want to buy a[nother] handgun for home defense. Post-Heller, how do I get the excise tax on firearms overturned and get my $55 back?
28 posted on 09/13/2010 8:29:50 PM PDT by ctdonath2 (+)
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To: B4Ranch

Thanks for the tip. And the link! I’d no idea laser sights had come that far.


29 posted on 09/14/2010 4:34:11 AM PDT by Free in Texas (If islam is so great, why are there "religious police" who's main task is to beat you into a mosque?)
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To: neverdem
Gura’s second victory before the Supreme Court, McDonald v. Chicago

That lawsuit never should have been necessary.

After Heller, Morton Grove, IL, the first city to pass a Handgun Ban, and which Chicago modeled, repealed their ban at the next Town Council meeting. Knowing their Handgun Ban law was doomed and all lawyer fees would be a waste of the peoples money. As such Mayor Daley should have gotten the hint.

But nooooooooo, not King Richie. HIS laws superseded everything. And in IL they did as HIS CITY had 'Home Rule' dammit. No stinking constitution or SCOTUS decision was gonna stop HIM. He was MAYOR DALEY you morons. He doesn't like guns so that was that. Deal with it peons!

If you have trouble says the mayor, just dial 911 and the police will be right there to save you. Except the mayor hates HIS police almost as much as guns. So they're underfunded, have equipment that doesn't work, and are only about 3,000 Cops short. But not to worry says Richie, the police will be 'right there'.

In the meantime he's spending $10 Mill the city doesn't have to chase the Olympics he'll never get and spend more of the peoples money that isn't there fighting for a Law that anyone with an IQ above freezing knows is going to be struck down. So it's no wonder he decided not to run for reelection. The people have finally seen the King doesn't have any clothes.

Oh. And last I looked the streets of Chicago are not running red with blood. At least not from people who now have 'legal guns'. It seems that all the killings are from those two 'protected voting blocks' he so depended on for votes.

The Amish and Norwegian Grannies.

30 posted on 09/14/2010 6:34:17 AM PDT by Condor51 (SAT CONG!)
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To: neverdem
Heller says it is an individual right subject to reasonable regulations.

Heller says it's an individual right subject to any restriction short of prohibition, except where it is subject to prohibition (e.g., in federal buildings). The Heller right is secondary to an unenumerated right of self-defense and has nothing to do with militias, organized or unorganized, and certainly nothing to do with a blanket individual RKBA. That's why the police can still deny an individual permission to have a gun on the basis that it's not needed.

I'm 100% behind the RKBA, but we need to see Heller for what it is, an attempt to replace the Second Amendment with a vague 'right' that's easily manipulated by the powers-that-be.

31 posted on 09/14/2010 9:33:28 AM PDT by Grut
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar

Exactly and why economic repression is so vicious. It directly strikes at the heart of liberty.

Add to guns, insurance, services like plumbers, electricians, cabs and other vehicles for hire, etc.

All this gimmicking the system harms people, wastes money and creates benefits for the few and costs for the many.


32 posted on 09/16/2010 8:12:41 PM PDT by 1010RD (First Do No Harm)
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To: neverdem

The truth is that Slaughterhouse has to be overturned. Scalia, for all his conservatism is completely wrong.

That we had a half dozen Thomases on the court. You can see why he was attacked with such visceral fury.

Thomas would return to us our Constitution, our Rights and our country.


33 posted on 09/16/2010 8:15:16 PM PDT by 1010RD (First Do No Harm)
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