I just took 1 step forward.
If anyone here wants to organize a weekend adventure, I'm in.
Frowning takes 68 muscles.
Smiling takes 6.
Pulling this trigger takes 2.
I'm lazy.
Posted on 10/08/2010 10:55:12 AM PDT by AuntB
Zapata County's sheriff Sigifredo Gonzalez has told CBS News he has blood evidence from the lifevest of Tiffany Hartley, the wife of David Hartley, that supports her account of a pirate attack on a lake that straddles the Texas-Mexico border.
CBS News correspondent Don Teague reported on "The Early Show" this evidence is in addition to witness testimony that supports Tiffany Hartley's story that her husband was shot in the head by pirates on Mexico side of Falcon Lake.
David Hartley is presumed dead, and officials on both the U.S. and Mexican sides of the lake are searching for his body.
Gonzalez told Teague he believes the Hartleys were attacked by enforcers of the Zeta drug cartel. The Hartleys, Gonzalez says, were innocent victims of a bloody drug war.
Gonzales fears the same cartel enforcers who killed David have permanently hidden his body.
He said, "The body has been disposed of. They have it somewhere they've gotten rid of the body so there's no evidence."
But that's not something Tiffany Hartley is ready to accept, and says she's only now beginning to grieve.
Tiffany Hartley said, "At certain times there's points where you do feel like this is it. I'm never gonna see him again. He's gone. And then at other points he's gonna be walking through that door."
Doubt has been cast on Tiffany Hartley's story by Mexico officials, but she told CNN recently she would take a lie detector test if people continue to doubt her account of the attack.
On "The Early Show" Congressman Ted Poe, (R-Texas), who has been involved extensively in this case as well as ongoing border issues, said he has requested from the State Department that Americans search the Mexican side.
He said, "The Mexican government said yes, then backed off and said, 'No, we don't want the Americans over here.' We need to use the American resources that we have, because that area of the lake is controlled by the Zetas, there is an island on that lake where the Zetas really operate, the drug cartels. If we mean business about trying to recover David Hartley's body we need American involvement and the Mexican government needs to be relentless to find it. They are intimidated now, they really won't go near the area where the Zetas operate."
"Early Show" co-anchor Harry Smith said, "We need to stop and pause a second because even the Mexican authorities themselves are clearly not in control. It's the drug cartel that is in control because…the Mexican authorities backed away when they were threatened."
Poe agreed, saying, "That area of Falcon Lake on the Mexican side, all the way to the American edge of the water is controlled by the Zeta cartels. They bring those drugs into the United States, usually at night by high-speed boats, and they operate -- that is their operation -- and the Mexican government hasn't been able to stop them, won't stop them, refuses to or cannot, whatever the situation is, and they control that area. The government, neither government, controls that area, the drug cartels. And we're being held really hostage by the drug cartels on that area of the lake."
Smith added that while there has been some doubt cast on Tiffany Hartley's story, this is not the only reported incident of violence on this lake.
Poe replied, "American fishermen, fishing both on the American side of the lake and on the Mexican side of the lake -- you can get a permit to do that -- have been robbed by pirates on the lake, some of them have been taken to the Mexican side, stripped of all of their clothing and their valuables and their boat and left stranded there. This is the fifth time since May there's been some type of violence -- but the first homicide."
Poe said he'd like to see the United States to have more involvement in the search.
"The United States needs to use our resources, the Coast Guard. That needs to be operating on the lake at all times, not just this time," he said. "We have been very lax, in my opinion, as a nation, of protecting the entire southern border of the United States, including Falcon Lake. We don't protect it. We wait for something to happen, and then we just sit back, as a nation, and wait for someone else to react. We need to cooperate, need better cooperation with the Mexican government, but need to have really the military presence on the southern border, and that includes putting the National Guard throughout the border, including the Air National Guard, if we are serious about protecting Americans and American property, and keeping the drug cartels out of the United States."
Sheriff: Evidence supports wife’s account in pirate attack By Kevin Vaughan The Denver Post
[snip]ZAPATA, TEXAS — Blood, witness accounts and other unspecified evidence all corroborate the version of events laid out by a Colorado woman whose husband is missing and presumed dead after an attack on a lake straddling the Mexican border, the sheriff leading the investigation said this afternoon.
Zapata County Sheriff Sigifredo Gonzalez Jr. detailed some of the reasons he does not doubt that David Hartley, a 30-year-old Loveland native, was murdered a week ago by a drug gang on Falcon Lake, a 44-mile long waterway bisected by the U.S.-Mexico border.
http://www.denverpost.com/headlines/ci_16279531 Posted:10/07/2010
Eyewitness in Alleged Mexican Pirate Attack Case Comes Forward [ Mexico blocks US from search ] http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2603445/posts
A Fishing Paradise Gains a Deadly Reputation http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/08/us/08pirate.html?_r=2
[snips]
The shooting was the latest in a string of attacks by pirates on the lake that began on April 30. The gangs carry AK-47s and sometimes claim to be Mexican federal police or American game wardens. They have sometimes hijacked high-prowed boats favored by Mexican fishermen and used them to chase down Americans in bass boats, stealing their money at gunpoint.
But Sheriff Sigifredo Gonzalez of Zapata County, on the Texas side of the lake, has said that Mrs. Hartley’s story is credible and that the assault is in keeping with other recent robberies, some of which happened in the same part of the lake.
On April 30, for example, two boats carrying five tourists who wanted photographs of the Guerrero church were robbed at gunpoint by four heavily tattooed men in a fishing boat who identified themselves as “federales.” They demanded cash and even asked, “Where are the drugs?”
A week later, on May 6, three fishermen were robbed at gunpoint near Salado Island. On May 16, another group of boaters was robbed, again by armed men in a fishing boat on the United States side of the reservoir.
More recently, a gang of pirates in a small boat, with “Game Wardin” spelled out in duct tape, tried to stop a Texas fisherman, the police said. The Texan figured the misspelled word meant they were not really game wardens and outran them, the police said.
The governor has also staunchly defended Mrs. Hartley against anyone who doubts her account, saying he finds such theories “really reprehensible.” Mexico Spinning Out of Control?
-Ambassador John Bolton
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJtdP6s1G70
“Doubt has been cast on Tiffany Hartley’s story by Mexico officials, but she told CNN recently she would take a lie detector test if people continue to doubt her account of the attack.”
Video
Falcon Lake Texas Pirate Attacks
http://law.rightpundits.com/?p=1704
Gov. Perry needs to fire up a few Texas National Guard helicopters, arm them to the teeth, and vaporize some of these ‘zeta’ people.
I notice that they assiduously avoid using the term “Mexican pirates” in the headline and in the article.
Indeed, the early articles didn’t even mention that the lake was on the border, so my first reaction was that this was crazy. Pirates on a lake in Arizona? It needed some knowledgeable Freepers to explain what was going on.
Somali pirates. Mexican pirates. Same difference.
The traditional treatment for pirates was to defend your citizens and commerce by going out, into another country if necessary, catching them, and hanging them. This time Obama hasn’t even mentioned the subject. Hey, Hussein,k it’s your job to defend our country against terrorists, illegal invaders, and pirates.
Mexico being Mexico
Play this video
By Neal Barton - KETK News Director
Wednesday, October 6, 2010 - 6:46pm
The drama continues in south Texas.
Falcon Lake, which used to be a mecca for bass fisherman, is now becoming the scene of an international incident.
A couple from Colorado was jet skiing on that lake- not a smart thing to do. But, then again they were newcomers to the area and may not have known just how dangerous it is.
A while back 5 bass fishermen were approached by a boat with “game wardin” painted on it...warden spelled “w-a-r-d-i-n”. They ran away and should have.
Mexico is now being Mexico.
After the woman’s husband was allegedly shot my Mexican pirates, there is no trace of the jet ski or the man’s body. Mexico says they don’t have the money to search. We said we do. But they still won’t let us.
Now governor Rick Perry is calling for a tough respond from the U.S.. Which probably means with this group in power, no response.
President of Mexico Felipe Calderon is happy scolding the U.S. in the House chamber because he doesn’t like our Arizona law is sitting on his hands and not doing anything. He scolds us, but his country right now is a mess and he can’t get it done. But he does find the time to come here and throw himself right in the middle of an American political fight.
Neither Mexico or America can turn their head to this border violence. Something has to be done.
While politicians worry about offending a voting block, innocent Mexicans and Americans are getting killed, or living a life of fear. And living in fear of your life isn’t like living at all.
Maybe we can install solar panels for the border patrol. That may get the current administration involved.
http://www.ketknbc.com/news/pov/mexico-being-mexico-0
Sorry, I meant Texas.
I think we need to take a “Minuteman fishing trip” down there. Time to show some resistance. My guess is we have better shooters and better rifles to reach out and touch some of these sub-humans.
“I think we need to take a “Minuteman fishing trip” down there. Time to show some resistance. My guess is we have better shooters and better rifles to reach out and touch some of these sub-humans.”
Well, one thing is for sure, when it comes to Mexico, this government will only cater to THEM. We’re on our own!
Mexicans commit tens of thousands of brutal crimes in the U.S., and they flee back to Mexico as a matter of routine. What's new?
BTW, the last president called Americans "vigilantes" when they'd had a belly full of the U.S. government aiding and abetting Mexico.
Ya think Obama will do the same?
Time for some Predator drones.
These criminals are not just killers, they are not just cartel members, THEY ARE TERRORISTS.
They are terrorists at and over our border, killing Americans, while Obama and his administration, refuse to do a damn thing—except to bring lawsuits against any state trying to protect it’s citizens.
I smell a Muslim in the woodbox.
Where’s Black Jack Perishing when we need him?!
I just took 1 step forward.
If anyone here wants to organize a weekend adventure, I'm in.
“Where’s Black Jack Perishing when we need him?!”
I would go with the minutemen. We really need to take this upon ourselves if the government won’t do anything.
“We have been very lax, in my opinion, as a nation, of protecting the entire southern border of the United States, including Falcon Lake. We don’t protect it. We wait for something to happen, and then we just sit back, as a nation, and wait for someone else to react. We need to cooperate, need better cooperation with the Mexican government, but need to have really the military presence on the southern border, and that includes putting the National Guard throughout the border, including the Air National Guard, if we are serious about protecting Americans and American property, and keeping the drug cartels out of the United States.”
The gov does not care who dies, only caring for illegals to add to the serfdom in the US.
It just doesn't make sense for him to be killed and for his body to disappear and she returns home without a scratch.
I’m in. I’m lacking a boat but have the other equipment. I’m sure I can get a few folks together here in Oklahoma for this.
I thought they did fire on her but she got to the US side and then they halted their effort..thought I heard that on TV.
I had some doubts about the wife at first as she seemed so controlled but when one is in shock they react in ways that don’t always fit the profile..remember that Susan Smith who cried all over the place and then it turned out she drove her kids in the car into the lake?
We need to bring our troops home from foreign places and protect our borders immediately!
.
Nope, not gonna say it...
Also,I did a Google search and found this story from last May.It speaks of "pirates"...just as she did (a funny way to refer to killers,IMO) and the fact that several Americans were robbed at gunpoint...not killed or even harmed.It also mentions that the guys robbed were checking out the abandoned church on the Mexican side *just* like *she* said on Nightline last night.I wonder if *she* might have seen this story.I wonder whose idea it was to go to this particular place and then to (illegally) cross into Mexico to check out this church.Very curious,indeed (IMO).
I have no way of knowing what happened...I wasn't there...I don't know the area...and I don't know him or her.But particularly since finding that story (there's a link below) I'm suspicious of her.Quite suspicious.
Might she be telling the truth? Absolutely! Even Mexican authorities call that area dangerous.Might she be lying through her teeth? Given the evidence as it appears at this moment,absolutely! As I said before...life insurance...boyfriend/girlfriend......
(link) http://abcnews.go.com/International/Media/armed-mexican-pirates-terrorize-texas-lake/story?id=10737629
There are a lot of questions.
Did the ‘witness’ see the husband’s unmanned jet-ski going in circles?
If husband was wearing a life-jacket his body would have been floating.
She has blood on her clothing - and she claims she tried to drag her husband on to her jet-ski.
She says he was shot in the front of his head - he should have fallen backwards.
Why the perps didn’t shoot her and take both jet-skis and both bodies to rob or dispose of is really strange.
How long after he was shot was the incident reported?
A cop has come forward saying he stopped their truck with the two jet-skis on board. Reason for stop - different tags.
There have already been warnings to campers and hikers in the national forests in Oregon due to Mexican drug cartels shooting at anything and anybody who gets too close to their marijuana fields. Yes, Mexican marijuana fields in US parks and we’re allowing it.
My son an I would love to use a trip to Mexico to get the guns sited in for deer season. This trip would give us a great opportunity to do that task without having to harm anything of any value like a paper target.
The solution to this problem is so simple, its killing me. Fight back. Put some people on that lake and use the tried and true military tactic of movement to contact. When they come out into the lake to try something, have your men on line to deal with them. If they try it again, then they get the same treatment. And as far as the island that is mentioned in the article. I’d be willing to bet that there are certain units of the US military that are very well trained in amphibious assaults and would love the opportunity to provide the family, citizens of Texas and the country, some answers to the problem. Too bad theirs a complete pussy in the White House and I really don’t have much to say for the governor of Texas either.
I believe Jefferson did exactly that with the U.S. Marines.
The mental disease of Liberalism makes a game of crime, and gamers of criminals. If shoot them when defending their fields was in play, the criminals would not be as numerous, both by attrition and fear of death for their crimes. Toerating all manner of anti-civilization ebhavior is another hallmark of the mental disease of Liberalism. I’m too old now to give a darn what liberals think, I refuse to tolerate what they define as politically correct for my nation. Liberasls are killing the Republic by remaining here to rot in place and spread their plague.
Was this *before* or *after* the murder is said to have occurred?
Traffic stop was before the incident. The ski tags were different from the truck tag in some way (maybe State?).
That was a good link to the May 2010 incident. Important to remember - Americans should not stray into Mexico - for any reason.
That is not true she has had many tears in multiple interviews.There is also a witness who saw the persuit from the shore.I think it’s time we quit trying to blame her and try to realize just what happened and hold Mexico accountable for what has happened here.Wake up America there is a war gong on on our border and innocent civillians are being shot upon.
There is dash cam video of the stop it was 1.5 hours before he was reported shot.The jet skis were rented and the trailor had Mexican plates the truck they rented had texas plates.All checked out it was before.
“It just doesn’t make sense for him to be killed and for his body to disappear and she returns home without a scratch.”
We’re talking about MEXICO here, do you understand that?
NOTHING Mexico does makes sense.
And typically, what sympathy does the VICTIM get...cast blame.
Often the rape, assault victims of Mexicans are left alive...do you also doubt ALL those stories. Mexicans know there are plenty of you to cast doubt first on US citizens. They know they can get away with anything.
Hey, it’s only murder, move along.
” ‘No, we don’t want the Americans over here.’
Nope, not gonna say it... “
Enough irony there to wall up the entire border!
June, 2010
Bomb plot alert at Falcon Dam
[snip]An alleged plot by a Mexican drug cartel to blow up a dam along the Texas border — and unleash billions of gallons of water into a region with millions of residents — sent American police, federal agents and local disaster officials scrambling last month to thwart such an attack, authorities confirmed Wednesday.
Whether the cartel, which is known to have stolen bulk quantities of gunpowder and dynamite, could have taken down the five-mile-long Falcon Dam may never be known.
But it may have been derailed by a stepped-up presence by the Mexican military, acting in part on intelligence from the U.S. government, sources said.
The warning was based on what the federal government contends were “serious and reliable sources” and prompted the Homeland Security Department to sound the alarm to first responders all along the South Texas-Mexico border.
Mexico’s Zeta cartel was planning to destroy the dam
http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/bomb_plot_alert_at_falcon_dam_95481059.html
We need to secure our southern border with mexico and if Obama and nopalitano do not put our military on our south border . WE THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA WILL secure it. PS maybe they are in cahoots with the mexican government or drug cartels thats why they are not doing much YOU CAN COUNT ME IN
We need to secure our southern border with mexico and if Obama and nopalitano do not put our military on our south border . WE THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA WILL secure it. PS maybe they are in cahoots with the mexican government or drug cartels thats why they are not doing much YOU CAN COUNT ME IN
And yes...I'm in favor a serious wall to keep illegals out,etc,etc,etc.
Tiffany Hartley said, "At certain times there's points where you do feel like this is it. I'm never gonna see him again. He's gone. And then at other points he's gonna be walking through that door."
They fired “at” her as she was fleeing... Jet skis are very fast and if she was scared and zig-zagging them missing isn’t a mystery at all. she said the first guys poing their guns at her seemed unsure what to do and went back to the main boat and then is when she took off and they started firing at her... Maybe they were trying to decide whether to kill her or rape her and their hesitation allowed her to escape.
Not sure how long they had been married. Apparently, he worked in Mexico -but even so, they were pretty reckless if they were both aware of the drug cartels’ activity in that area.
This is much like the mysterious disappearance of the bridegroom from a cruise ship. Strange!
I’m still stressing over 7 year-old Kyron Horman’s vanishing in Oregon.
Found these references:
Falcon Lake, is about 70 miles west of the Hartley’s home in McAllen.
David Hartley worked for an oil company in Reynosa, Mexico.
The morning after the incident,a bunch of us were in the staff room of the ER (which is where I worked and where she was brought the evening before) and,as you can imagine,it was *the* topic...particularly given that one of the nurses from the previous evening's shift was there and was giving us the *detailed* story.Then,just before the start of the shift,the Head Nurse walks in and says "the husband did it".Everyone said she was crazy...respectfully,of course ;-).
Well,long story short,within a few months the husband's story starting to fall apart largely because his brother,who helped him dispose of the gun,developed a conscience and called the cops.Among other things,it was learned that he had major financial problems *and* had a girlfriend.Soon after all this was revealed,he jumped off of one of the city's major bridges into the harbor...dead.
As I said,until I see that *both* their lives (and their marriage) were normal...clean...uneventful...stable...I'm unconvinced.
I am well aware of that case in Boston.
As I said,until I see that *both* their lives (and their marriage) were normal...clean...uneventful...stable...I’m unconvinced.
This story may well go down as it has been told by the wife. However as you point out there are times when things just arent the way they are told. This is being sold as a shooting but what if no shooting occurred and this is a ploy to change one’s identity? I see nothing that has been reported that would disclaim an identity disappearance. I’m not saying that is what happened but a possibility.
Your instincts are right. Tiffany Hartley is lying. Either she killed him, faked his death, or is lying about why they were trolling Mexican waters to begin with and he got killed. But her story doesn’t add up and in her various interviews she trips herself up over and over. And first off, these Mexican pirates have historically approached people to rob them at gunpoint, but in her case they suddenly start shooting to kill from far away? and get a good kill shot on him but miss her repeatedly? Then she says they get close to her and let her go but later she is pursued by them again? She’s a liar and the more she blabs to the media the more the holes are discovered.
Tell that to the witness that saw her being chased back to the border with gunfire, and the fisherman who had a similar experience when he had drifted over to the Mexican side of the lake while in a fishing tournament and they started firing on him, and he gunned his fishing boat (like Jet Skis they are quite powerful and fast) and pulled away from them.
When she said the pirates came up and to her after they shot her husband and she was trying to get him on her jet ski and then just left her there I thought that was odd. Why would they just leave here there after they’ve just shot her husband?
Her statements in the media have also contradictory. She said her husband was shot in the back of the head and then other times in the front of the head.
A good question.Under those circumstances it's *very* illogical for them to have done anything but kill *her* as well.Although it seems possible to me that she's telling the truth in this case,at this point I wouldn't bet a nickel that she is.
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