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Another strange occurance at my church tonight (possibly terror related)
11/6/10 | 1curiousmind

Posted on 11/06/2010 5:38:04 PM PDT by 1curiousmind

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To: WorldviewDad

Petra is still an absolute favorite of mine!


241 posted on 11/07/2010 2:57:05 PM PST by kimmie7 (I donÂ’t think BO is the antichrist, but he may very well be 665.)
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To: kimmie7
Petra is still an absolute favorite of mine!

Petra played at my school once some time before the summer of 1978.
242 posted on 11/07/2010 2:59:01 PM PST by aruanan
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To: 2nd amendment mama

243 posted on 11/07/2010 2:59:30 PM PST by Errant
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To: aruanan

And they live what they sing. Great group!


244 posted on 11/07/2010 3:01:47 PM PST by kimmie7 (I donÂ’t think BO is the antichrist, but he may very well be 665.)
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To: STARWISE

Whoops, and thanks STARWISE!


245 posted on 11/07/2010 3:05:45 PM PST by SunkenCiv (The 2nd Amendment follows right behind the 1st because some people are hard of hearing.)
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To: WorldviewDad

Another Petra fan here, too.


246 posted on 11/07/2010 3:21:09 PM PST by FourPeas (Pester not the geek, for the electrons are his friends.)
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To: kimmie7; aruanan
I have seen the group several times over the years since around 1984 to just a few years ago during their farewell tour and had a chance to talk with them at length twice. They are still one of my favorite groups, and my kids love their music...including the music from the 1970’s.

More Power To Ya...Worldviewdad

247 posted on 11/07/2010 3:21:16 PM PST by WorldviewDad (following God instead of culture)
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To: STARWISE

That is good information to have! Thanks, Starwise!


248 posted on 11/07/2010 3:44:41 PM PST by luvie (Thank God)
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To: 1curiousmind; Velveeta

Thank you for posting this 1curiousmind.

Thank you for the ping Velveeta.


249 posted on 11/07/2010 4:00:39 PM PST by Cindy
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To: Uncle Ike

Thank you Uncle Ike for the ping.
I appreciate it.


250 posted on 11/07/2010 4:43:53 PM PST by Cindy
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To: STARWISE

That is good, but also starting a separate thread on a suspicous incident (like this poster did) makes it easier for the readers to watch for follow-ups.


251 posted on 11/07/2010 4:52:10 PM PST by Cindy
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To: Cindy

I agree .. both are in order.

Put a title and link on the aggregation thread.


252 posted on 11/07/2010 5:04:17 PM PST by STARWISE (The overlords are in place .. we are a nation under siege .. pray, go Galt & hunker down)
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To: Awgie; All; Cindy
SEMP Report, Nov. 2007 (Dorn Report):

"Preparing American School's for Beslan-Type Terrorist Attacks Biot Report #482: November 30, 2007 The September 1-3, 2004, Beslan school attack hit the nerve of American school safety experts Michael Dorn and son Chris Dorn, who published their insights in Innocent Targets: When Terrorism Comes to School (2005). (1) The authors examine school-related terrorism from a global perspective, insisting that international events such as the Beslan school attack have implications for American schools. The Dorns currently run Safe Havens International, a nonprofit organization whose mission is to help schools improve their school safety programs, according to its website. (2) Detailed background information on the Beslan school terrorist attack is available elsewhere. (3-5) The Dorns examine several important issues, including why terrorists target school children and what schools can do to prepare for terrorist attacks. They note that attacks by terrorists on schoolchildren are rare, but high-visibility events. I. Why do Terrorists Target School Children? Terrorists target schools (and school buses) for at least seven reasons, according to the Dorns. The seven reasons, listed briefly below, are an introduction to the Dorns’ thinking. Interested readers should read the entire (slim) Dorn book to understand the authors’ full treatment of the school terrorism threat. First, terrorists choose schools, particularly elementary schools, because schools are relatively “soft targets”. The term “soft target” is a military term referring to an unarmored or undefended target. For example, schools typically “do not have the level of physical security of many other potential targets such as airports, government buildings and military installations”, which are “hard targets”, note the Dorns. (6) Analysis of past school-related terrorist events shows that elementary schools and school buses are particularly vulnerable to attack, more so than other types of school-related targets, because they are such soft targets. (6) “Very few elementary schools have a dedicated school resource officer on staff or have established other security measures which are more common at middle and high schools,” note the Dorns. (7) In addition, researchers John R. Lott and William M. Landes argue that the federal Gun Free School Zones Act (1996), which seeks to reduce gang-related violence by prohibiting guns in school zones, has produced the unintended (perverse) consequence of making schools a more attractive target for disturbed people who want to end their own lives in a dramatic killing spree. (8-10) Second, terrorists may choose schools because schools are powerful symbolic targets. Schools educate the next generation of people to take the reins of society. Adults of all ages throughout society have special relationships with school-age children (e.g., their sons and daughters, grandchildren, nieces and nephews, neighbors’ children, pupils). A terrorist attack on a school removes any illusion that one is safe anywhere, and permanently stains the entire community. Yellow school buses are plentiful, symbolic, lightly protected, and an extension of the school itself. As such they are an extremely vulnerable target for terrorists, caution the Dorns. Third, terrorists may choose schools because of “the potential for mass casualties with large numbers of children as victims.” (6) Terrorists today seek opportunities to maximize the loss of human life, as exemplified in the Moscow theater attack in 2002, the Beslan school attack in 2004, the Alfred P. Murrah Building bombing in 1995, and attacks on the World Trade Center in 1993 and 2001. Schools congregate large numbers of people at a predictable time and place each day, including normal school days and special events, such as athletic events and graduation ceremonies. Because of this fact, school emergency preparedness plans must address the potential for mass casualty incidents, note the Dorns. (11) Fourth, terrorists may choose schools because “attacks on innocent children evoke a strong emotional reaction” among adults who, incidentally, the terrorists are indirectly targeting. The reaction is especially intense because children are incapable of protecting themselves, and adults, who should be protecting children in the school setting, have failed, in the light of a successful terrorist attack, to fulfill this strong societal obligation and human value. (11) “By targeting school children, terrorists can make people feel an inability to protect the children in their life”, the Dorns argue. (6) Fifth, terrorists may target schools because their attacks draw intensive media coverage. (11) Terrorists regale in this coverage. Intense media coverage may promote future terrorist acts. This fact produces well-meaning media specialists in a bind as to how much and what to air. Sixth, terrorists may target schools because aggressive intervention by the government during an attack may harm innocent children, i.e., during government efforts to secure the release of hostages. This is a win-win situation for the terrorists. “In the minds of terrorists...this type of contention may make the suffering of innocent children acceptable because the children’s suffering is linked to the government the terrorists are attacking”. (11) Seventh, terrorists may target schools because they “have the ability to justify in their minds that the terrible pain they inflict is an acceptable cost in the furtherance of their objectives”. (11) From the perspective of the terrorist, schools are as good a target as any. (11) II. What Can Schools Do? Each school needs to create and regularly update a school safety and security plan designed for results, declare the Dorns. School personnel need training in the plan. The plan then needs activation periodically to improve personnel response competence and to continuously improve the plan based on lessons learned during its activation, i.e. drills or exercises. Detailed instructions on creating a school safety plan and performing exercises is available at the U.S. Department of Education’s website (http://www.ed.gov/admins/lead/safety/emergencyplan...) and in Jane’s Safe School Planning Guide for All Hazards by Mike Dorn, Gregory Thomas, Marleen Wong, and Sonayia Shepherd (2004). Probably the first most important hurdle for many school administrators is to believe that a school massacre could happen in their school, and understand how hard it is to control the process and the damage once the attack is in progress. The element of denial or breeziness (We can handle that, a gunman in the hallway? No problem!) that such an event could happen to them is very strong among many school administrations, and is source of amazement to informed observers, including many parents and students. III. Could a Beslan School Disaster Happen in the United States? Another American writer-consultant named John Gudick published bestselling Terror at Beslan: A Russian Tragedy with Lessons for America’s Schools (2005), which he based on his research at the site of the Beslan massacre beginning weeks after the incident in September 2004. Gudick is president of Archangel, a non-profit organization “providing a broad scope of security and anti-terror training and services”, e.g., hostage negotiation training, executive protection. (12) Gudick says he had access to some of the Russian Special Forces involved in the hostage situation. Gudick believes that a Beslan-type school disaster is waiting to happen in the U.S. One of his many insights is that the Columbine school shootings in 1999 taught law enforcement to prepare for at most two gunmen, but that Beslan has changed the formula (30-40 men stormed the school). Law enforcement should be preparing for the event of several dozen terrorists entering and taking over an American school, rather than one or two, argues Gudick. Gudick speaks to eight must-dos and must-haves to achieve a desirable outcome in the face of future school terrorist attacks in the U.S. A brief overview of the eight elements is below, but interested readers may benefit from reading the entire book to obtain the full flavor of Gudick’s approach to school terrorist preparedness and response. First, schools must contact their law enforcement to provide training for schools to deal with hostage and assault situations. (13) “Relevant police departments must begin preparing programs and providing training for local teachers and school officials. Schools must work hand-in-hand with them to consider and develop protocols for mass emergency situations and to share knowledge of the chronology of events to be anticipated in a hostage situation.” (13) Second, school authorities must “establish emergency lock down procedures that are current, well constructed, and ready for immediate action in the event of a terrorist siege”. This is one area in which security experts agree. No longer can we respond to every problem by sending our children into the parking lots or fields outside the schools. In the terror attack of the future, this is where the assailants can most easily position shooters and car bombs, which necessitates not only lock down procedures but planned collection points and evacuation routes different from those historically used for fire drills.” (13) Third, police must have school blueprints, floor plans and diagrams. Fourth, school officials should videotape walk-throughs of the entire school and have them available for police or deliver them to the police, keeping a copy for themselves...It is important to remember the terrorists will do their preparatory work well.” (14) Fifth, development and ongoing care of the channels of communication between law enforcement and local schools will facilitate handling of crises when they arise. Gudick, like the Dorns, emphasizes the need to develop radio protocols for school bus drivers. “Few targets are as attractive as school buses for not only capturing large numbers of children, but providing unquestioning access to a school in vehicles which can surreptitiously hold large numbers of people with myriad weapons and explosives. (14) Sixth, school security and surveillance systems can “provide the ability to monitor the goings on in a school, or to know what threats or attacks exist and in what sector.” However, Gudick cautions, terrorists who attack a school target will be in control very quickly, and may use the surveillance equipment to monitor breaching of the building by police in their assault against the terrorists. “America has prepared its schools’ security for threats from within, designed to protect property and life from students acting in an aggressive fashion or stealing property,” notes Gudick. “For this reason they are usually directed at corridors and doorways throughout the school. If taken over, the existence of these systems will only provide the terrorists with a significant advantage, eliminating the need for dividing their forces throughout the school to monitor ingress points.” (15) One way to solve the problem of terrorists taking over the school surveillance system to their own advantage is to rig schools with recessed and hidden cameras, with both the monitor and control of the system outside the school building, contends Gudick. This set up “might deny the terrorists even the knowledge of the existence of the camera system and give law enforcement the advantage of remote viewing of terrorist movements, numbers, fortification and hostage location. Certainly, gambling casinos in Las Vegas and throughout the gaming cities of America have highly developed systems which could be put in schools, allowing terrorists the false belief that they have total control of the cameras, while law enforcement controls another, hidden system throughout the school... These systems are very expensive, but what value do we place on our children’s lives?” concludes Gudick. (15) Seventh, school officials need to gather intelligence on who is gathering intelligence on their schools. “Counter-intelligence efforts should not stop at just keeping an eye out for anyone suspicious watching the school,” notes Gudick. School officials must be vigilant for people asking for school plans, diagrams, and blueprints of buildings, and for information on security systems. Al Qaeda’s Manchester Document informs its readers that fully 80% of all necessary intelligence can be gathered from open sources.” (16) Eighth, teachers and school administrators need to be trained and armed, says Gudick. “Many would be happy to receive this training at their own expense,” he argues. “Teachers and school administrators could undergo a certified and approved training program, allowing them to retain their firearms in the school. Parents could do likewise, just as many parents already travel to and from their children’s schools with the very concealed weapons they are legally authorized to carry, though under most states’ statutes not in schools. Could armed teachers and parents prove an effective fighting force against 50 well-trained, combat hardened and committed terrorists with automatic assault weapons and explosives? Unlikely. But their presence and ability to fight back might just save some lives, or force the terrorists to alter their plan in the initial attack, denying them complete control of the facility and thereby preventing many from ending up as hostages and facing the same fate as the children at Beslan,” declares Gudick. (17) IV. Summary The school terrorism-readiness books by the Dorns and John Gudick present valuable insights and ideas to ponder. Their biggest contribution is increasing awareness and educating school administrators and law enforcement on the important need to upgrade and reform school safety systems in the age of domestic and foreign terrorism.""

Be Ready. Be Vigilint. They would not give it SECOND THOUGHT, and the internet could activate theiro loose cells in the US already in place.

253 posted on 11/07/2010 5:07:22 PM PST by AmericanInTokyo (We must be humble in victory, and GET TO WORK RIGHT AWAY while we have the anti-Obama Momentum)
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To: oneolcop
Chatter can be just that. Chatter. Some of it diversionary. Also probing our week points. False flag. Dry runs. Sound boards. Practice sessions. Survellience by the enemy of our defenses.

But my intuition is that the Islamofascists will try to do something while Obama is out of the US, particularly at some high level function, to embarrass him, and cause mass shock and panic, and get their JEHAD message out worldwide in a most potent format. Just a feeling.

ALL AMERICANS SHOULD BE ON GUARD, and if legal, ARMED, (OR ARMED IN YOUR VEHICLES IN TRUNKS IF ALLOWED, for easy access). This may be a "let's roll situation that will not wait for Big Sis but that the average local American man and woman will have to step up to the plate ASAP when and if it comes down.

254 posted on 11/07/2010 5:11:29 PM PST by AmericanInTokyo (We must be humble in victory, and GET TO WORK RIGHT AWAY while we have the anti-Obama Momentum)
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To: buccaneer81

Sure now call me names, traitor, quisling, kimmel, idiot.

All because God forbid I had an opinion. The opinion is the incident doesn’t amount to much, the FBI was alerted as appropriate.

And because I don’t think this report merits arming the congregation, armed guards, walkie talkies. And oh yes, there was the post that believes this sighting is sufficient basis to “kill them all”.

So idiot, are you calling me an idiot because I don’t believe this sighting justifies the mass murder of every muslim in the United States? I’ll wait for your apology on that.


255 posted on 11/07/2010 5:26:25 PM PST by Williams (It's the policies, stupid.)
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To: Williams

It’ll be a cold day in hell before you get an apology. You are delusional. Does the word “Beslan” mean nothing to you? Man up and face reality, Mr. Chamberlain.


256 posted on 11/07/2010 5:34:22 PM PST by buccaneer81 (ECOMCON)
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To: buccaneer81

Well it’s sad that you showed yourself to be such a jackass with your childish name calling. It also shows you are the last person to calmly size up a situation and devise a course of action.

But then I guess you are Bull Halsey, Ronald Reagan, Margaret Thatcher and Atilla the Hun all rolled up in one name calling bad ass.

Go in peace.


257 posted on 11/07/2010 5:45:22 PM PST by Williams (It's the policies, stupid.)
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To: Springman; sergeantdave; cyclotic; netmilsmom; RatsDawg; PGalt; FreedomHammer; queenkathy; ...
A picture

If you would like to be added or dropped from the Michigan ping list, please freepmail me.

258 posted on 11/07/2010 5:51:19 PM PST by grellis (I am Jill's overwhelming sense of disgust.)
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To: Williams

Au revoir.


259 posted on 11/07/2010 5:55:27 PM PST by buccaneer81 (ECOMCON)
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To: STARWISE

Good going, StarW, and a great idea! Thanks for being brainy and thinking outside the box.


260 posted on 11/07/2010 6:00:07 PM PST by JouleZ (You are the company you keep.)
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