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TSA chief likely to face lawmakers' questions on pat-downs, body scans
CNN ^ | 17 Nov 1089 | CNN Wire Staff

Posted on 11/17/2010 3:32:47 AM PST by SkyPilot

Washington (CNN) -- The head of the Transportation Security Administration will likely get a pat-down on air-travel security measures as he testifies before Congress on Wednesday morning.

The appearance by John Pistole was scheduled before controversy broke out over the past week about the agency's full body scans and pat-downs. But protest movements about the searches make such questioning likely when Pistole testifies about his agency's security efforts before the Senate Committee on Commerce, Science and Transportation.

Hero pilot Capt. Chesley "Sully" Sullenberger on Tuesday joined the opposition to heightened airport security procedures, which critics have called invasive.

Sullenberger, who landed a crippled US Airways jet on the Hudson River last year, said the use of full-body pat-downs and advanced imaging scanners for airline personnel "just isn't an efficient use of our resources."

Federal transport authorities say the machines are a safe and necessary security precaution, especially following recent airline terrorism attempts.

(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Front Page News; Government
KEYWORDS: airports; bigsis; bodyscanner; grope; gropegate; lawmakers; napoletano; optout; scanner; security; tsa; tsapervs
I have never, ever witnessed in my adult lifetime a more arrogant, intransigent, and abusive head of a government agency as TSA head John Pistole has behaved in recent days.

The "shut up and like it" approach will not stand.

Govt thugs usually even throw a bone to the public to get them off of the trail.

The TSA has behaved like the Sturmabteilung, which is probably appropriate, because that is what they and their 67,000 "employees" are.

There is a rider in the 2002 law that allows airports to opt out of the TSA after two years on an individual airport basis.

I expect Republicans to lead the charge to entice airports to do just that, and stab TSA right where they live.

1 posted on 11/17/2010 3:32:52 AM PST by SkyPilot
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To: SkyPilot

The last time I flew was shortly after 9/11, to my father’s funeral, and I have not flown since, and will not ever fly again unless it is truly a matter of life and death. I have no confidence that even with these offensive screenings they can keep passengers safe. Passengers are disarmed and not allowed to be prepared to defend themselves. And now they have these Nazi officials pawing them. Not for me.


2 posted on 11/17/2010 3:40:31 AM PST by Old_Grouch (63 and AARP-free. Monthly FR contributor.)
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To: ExTexasRedhead
The TSA has not realized it yet, but GropeGate has inflamed (and unified) the American public to a degree that has not been seen since 911 or Pearl Harbor. This time, they are not furious with Osama Bin Laden or Japan, but the US Government.

BJ Clinton, for all his faults, was a masterful politician. He would have exploited public anger to HIS advantage by now.

The Community Organizer has zero political skills. All he ever had was a lapdog media and a cult of personality among the stupid.

This scandal (and it is a scandal) will start filling the waters of the White House basement if Dumbo doesn't get it together, and quick.

______________________________________________________________________

Since the TSA molested my family, why doesn’t Obama volunteer to subject his family to the same security procedures? By: Mark Hemingway Commentary Staff Writer 11/16/10 3:05 PM EST Two weeks ago, my wife flew alone out to Colorado with our two young children. Unaware that the TSA had instituted new and incredibly invasive new security procedures, my wife called me distressed after getting frisked by the TSA. Or as my wife put it, “in some cultures I would be married to my screener by now.” She was joking, but make no mistake — my wife was incredibly disturbed by how intimate a security pat down she received. So here’s my not-so-modest proposal: If the President’s Homeland Security department is so adamant that this is the absolute best way to prevent terrorism, I think the President and his family should voluntarily submit to one of the new invasive pat down procedures. I know the Obamas don’t fly commercial at all these days, so they should probably get a pretty good idea what the rest of us are putting up with. The President and his family — preferably with DHS Secretary Janet “The system worked” Napolitano — should show up at Dulles or Reagan airport on a weekday with a camera crew in tow, as airport pat downs are typically done in full view of hundreds of travelers. All of America will to see the TSA handling the President’s crown jewels. Then a rubber-gloved federal agent will run his hands all over his wife and daughter’s privates while he watches. Then I want him to turn to the camera and tell all of America that this is no big deal and we should all be good citizens and comply with the necessary security procedures. It only seems fair

3 posted on 11/17/2010 3:41:08 AM PST by SkyPilot
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To: Old_Grouch

some people have to fly every day or every week and it’s getting really nutty


4 posted on 11/17/2010 3:43:43 AM PST by ari-freedom (Islam is at war against America, while America is at the mall.)
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To: SkyPilot

Much as I respect Sully, every time I hear “efficiency” cited as a virtue, I get nervous.
When you can say something is unjust, invasive, uncivilized, disgusting, abusive...or just plain WRONG...say that.
“Inefficient” should be for things morally neutral. You use that word, you sound morally neutral.


5 posted on 11/17/2010 3:45:19 AM PST by 668 - Neighbor of the Beast (Starve the beast. Save the liver!)
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To: SkyPilot
I have no more words to describe the outrage I am feeling about this assault on private citizens.

This matter, IMO, is the first real test for the new Congress. They need to get some stones and put a halt to this now. And Pistole needs to go...

Actually, I want them to set up one of those xray machines at the inquiry, with the display available for all to see, and have each member of Congress and the Senate to walk through it.

6 posted on 11/17/2010 3:49:03 AM PST by Never on my watch (Touch my junk and I call the cops!)
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To: 668 - Neighbor of the Beast

What I hear the pilots unions saying is ‘you don’t need to grope us like you grope the cattle’. They are not saying the practice is wrong and should be stopped unilaterally.


7 posted on 11/17/2010 3:54:58 AM PST by Never on my watch (Touch my junk and I call the cops!)
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To: SkyPilot

The abuses will end ONLY when a Muslim woman refuses to allow to be fondled by the TSA. The TSA will claim they could not allow the “Arab Street” to see Muslim women being disgraced in such a fashion. You just watch.


8 posted on 11/17/2010 3:57:07 AM PST by swpa_mom
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To: SkyPilot

Vote with your feet, Do Not Fly.


9 posted on 11/17/2010 3:58:51 AM PST by hadaclueonce ("Endeavor to persevere.")
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To: swpa_mom

CAIR has already told them to refuse. They also claim that whole body scanners are a violation of Sharia law. Big Sis has basically said they can go right through.


10 posted on 11/17/2010 4:06:07 AM PST by OCCASparky (Obama--Playing a West Wing fantasy in a '24' world.)
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To: OCCASparky

That doesn’t surprise me. Maybe everyone should claim to be Muslim.


11 posted on 11/17/2010 4:09:23 AM PST by swpa_mom
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To: Never on my watch
What I hear the pilots unions saying is ‘you don’t need to grope us like you grope the cattle’. They are not saying the practice is wrong and should be stopped unilaterally.

Not true. We are against the process, period. One step at a time...
12 posted on 11/17/2010 4:11:27 AM PST by Tzfat
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To: swpa_mom

It’s already happened.

CAIR: TSA Can Only Pat Down Muslim Women’s Head, Neck
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/cair-tsa-can-only-pat-down-muslim-women%E2%80%99s-head-neck/


13 posted on 11/17/2010 4:11:33 AM PST by TSgt (On 11/08/2010 at 0421 my life changed forever. I became a father.)
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To: SkyPilot

Another way to protest these “pat downs” would be to insist that Pat Downer dons a clean pair of gloves prior to the frisking. Also a family member of mine has a latex allergy and requires latex free gloves.


14 posted on 11/17/2010 4:28:30 AM PST by BulletBobCo
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To: SkyPilot

This is the face of the lifelong bureaucrat ("law enforcement" background notwithstanding) who cannot fathom that there may objections to decisions made in the DC vacuum and which have nothing to do with security and everything to do with staging a power play.

This is the look of surprise when a bureaucrat is called upon to construct a logical case for the policies implemented willy-nilly by an indolent, undereducated lot whose snappy periwinkle uniforms can't disguise the fact that they had dim employment prospects elsewhere.

15 posted on 11/17/2010 4:33:36 AM PST by relictele ( -)
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To: relictele

Last I heard, they are going after that young guy from San Diego who opted out, saying he is faceing an 11,000 dollar fine.

They forgot who runs the show. We the people call the shots, and our congfress is about to unload on these pricks.


16 posted on 11/17/2010 4:47:36 AM PST by PA-RIVER
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To: PA-RIVER

The grim irony (as Tyner himself pointed out) is that the TSA threatened him with fine/suit if he did not return to THE VERY AREA FROM WHICH HE HAD BEEN ESCORTED.

The TSA’s goal, such as it is, had been met i.e. Tyner did not get on a flight. Despite this, the TSA’s you-will-submit dander was up and they launched into all manner of bully-boy tactics. Note that in the narrative the one REAL law enforcement type, a city/county cop, could only shake his head and laugh at the tinhorn TSA.


17 posted on 11/17/2010 4:52:36 AM PST by relictele ( -)
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To: relictele

This morning on the NYC talk radio John Gambling Show “Ranking Member of the House Committee on Homeland Security” Peter King (R-NY) said that there was no alternative to the naked scanners and the indecent pat downs, including lifting bras, that there was no way to get around it.

The ELITES continue to see every and all Americans as a real threat, a likely mad bomber or terrorist.

I am happy that REAL hero and AMERICAN NON-ELITE Captain Sully has come out AGAINST this abuse of the rights of free men and women.


18 posted on 11/17/2010 5:00:16 AM PST by bvw
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To: hadaclueonce

IMO, the only exceptions to the Do Not Fly rule would be emergency travel and trips that take more than one day to drive each way.

Actually, I’d say that if two people are traveling, a two day road trip costs less than the airline tickets. If two people are doing a road trip for business, one of them can continue to work while riding, using cell phones and iPads (or equiv.)

For me here in the Midwest, that covers almost all travel in the lower 48, figuring 600 miles of driving per day. That’s easily doable on the Interstates, but if your trip requires a lot of non-Interstate driving, the formula needs to be adjusted down a bit.

But that’s just me.


19 posted on 11/17/2010 5:02:03 AM PST by savedbygrace (But God.)
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To: SkyPilot
Obama is a different politician. America has never seen anything like him. In his mind, he is God.

Being raised as a Communist in Indonesia, he probably thought he could get away with anal probes. This has probably got him laughing at us.

20 posted on 11/17/2010 5:02:27 AM PST by PA-RIVER
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To: SkyPilot

I hope you are right. I have fired off letters to my representatives about this outrage. I work for an airline and I see this TSA BS all the time. I hope national opt out day Nov24 shuts down airports across the country and gains momentum and creates total chaos for John Pisshole and Nazipolitano


21 posted on 11/17/2010 5:08:22 AM PST by Merlinator (Don't retreat....just reload.)
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To: savedbygrace
If I fly from Philadelphia to Pittsburgh, its a 6 hour trip. That include early arrival drive time, Parking, security groping, waiting in line, delays.

If I drive straight to Pittsburgh, its also about 6 hours. I split the drive with my wife. We take two breaks. No big deal. We save enough money for the hotel.

22 posted on 11/17/2010 5:12:00 AM PST by PA-RIVER
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To: SkyPilot
There is a rider in the 2002 law that allows airports to opt out of the TSA after two years on an individual airport basis.

Does that law require that airports replace TSA with a similar organization? If so, what would their hiring standards be?

There's no sense in it if the abuse will just continue with the same employees under the moniker of another alphabet-soup organization.

23 posted on 11/17/2010 5:15:11 AM PST by Sarajevo (You're jealous because the voices only talk to me.)
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To: 668 - Neighbor of the Beast

I’m told Auschwitz was a VERY efficient camp.

I’ll take Liberty instead, thank you VERY much. . .


24 posted on 11/17/2010 5:22:44 AM PST by Salgak (Acme Lasers presents: The Energizer Border: I dare you to try and cross it. . .)
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To: SkyPilot

Pete King said something interesting about the x-ray scanners too — that they could pick up bombs inserted in body cavities — but then that means, imo, either that they are higher power than has been said officially, or that the operators can dial up the power. Neither situation is acceptable to me, nor should it be to anyone.

I seem to remember reading recent anecdotal reports from people wearing rad badges who said they dosages the badges show is higher than expected. Here’s who you do a basic test — take a penny and tape it to an unexposed z-ray film, and carry it with you through the scanner.


25 posted on 11/17/2010 5:24:09 AM PST by bvw
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To: Sarajevo
We should just sign wavers, be handed billy clubs and be on our way. When Mohammed jumps out of his seat, we beat the snot out of him until we get to the gate, making sure every inch of his body is black and blue, then shove a club up is butt and down his throat. I think this would be effective deterent for Mohammed.

I'm an opt-out for two years now, and damn proud of it.

26 posted on 11/17/2010 5:25:17 AM PST by PA-RIVER
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To: Merlinator

You can make it go big and global by having a savvy Public Relations/Media person alert ALL MAJOR FOREIGN PRESS stationed in the USA well before 24 November, and issue interviews about that day, and press releases/fact sheets in various languages. Once the word spreads worldwide that American citizens are rising up, it will give the foreign press impetus to report on the issue itself...which will then cause a chain reaction of foreigners witholding travel to the USA and in some cases foreign governments issuing, through their diplomatic agencies, “worldwide travel advisories” to their nationals about intrusive US methodologies in play. This thing has a great potential for going BIG in one week, if done right. I believe, from what is now rumored, that the Japanese TV press is already doing some hidden camera work at ORD and/or other US airports to show the TSA abuses and plan on airing it in Japan to millions who watch, many whom might otherwise consider traveling to the US on business or tourism. They will go elsewhere for vacations, or teleconference for business, instead. Our economy does not need that right now, they need business and tourism, but we are talking about the Obama Administration which wants to not only remove freedoms for Americans, but also do further damage to our fragile economy as it is. Brilliant, guys.


27 posted on 11/17/2010 5:28:16 AM PST by AmericanInTokyo (I support "a pathway to kicking your a** off U.S. Soil", if you came here & remain here illegally)
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To: SkyPilot
Mr. Pistole is just following orders from "Pat" Napolitano:


28 posted on 11/17/2010 5:31:18 AM PST by csmusaret (Tax revenue increased 39% from2002 to 2007 as a result of the Bush tax cuts.)
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To: TSgt

If true (about Muslims getting an officially stated “pass” on the TSA grope), it is a violation, then, of the Equal Protection Clause provisions of the US Constitution, for it submits one group of people of one religion to preferential treatment by public authorities, based only on their religion, which and wherein it does not extend to non-members of the religion the same courtesy and protections, and thereby is discriminatory, illegal, and unconstitutional.


29 posted on 11/17/2010 5:32:13 AM PST by AmericanInTokyo (I support "a pathway to kicking your a** off U.S. Soil", if you came here & remain here illegally)
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To: SkyPilot

That is not a current photo. TSA doesn’t wear that uniform anynmore.


30 posted on 11/17/2010 5:43:30 AM PST by jazminerose (o)
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To: csmusaret
Its already going viral in Japan. LINK HERE

It is highlighting, in Japanese, the Johns Hopkins study that these airport machines are not safe and can be connected to skin cancer. It shows a photo of machine, and then the text of the JH study in Japanese. CNN Japan this morning is also now running the story in Japanese, it is spreading in Japan, they are as a people, VERY sensitive people about "radiation" (no pun intended) as well as having images of their private parts on public display, especially in a foreign land. Particularly female Japanese travelers, who bring tons of yen/cash for shopping splurge US tours, will most likely now stay away in DROVES I predict if this kind of story spreads, and will stick with other countries to visit.

31 posted on 11/17/2010 5:47:25 AM PST by AmericanInTokyo (I support "a pathway to kicking your a** off U.S. Soil", if you came here & remain here illegally)
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To: SkyPilot

Well, as the bionic man, I have a different little problem. I have a new knee ... solid steel I’m told ... cool. So I go up to the scanner and guess what they see ...YIKES! a bionic knee. YOU MUST NOW BE PATTED DOWN ... and so I get “both” treatments. There is no way they’ll let me through that scanner with my iron knee and I’ll be forced to the pat down. I’d rather do the scanner ... no choice for me.


32 posted on 11/17/2010 5:48:57 AM PST by ThePatriotsFlag (You are just jealous because the voices aren't talking to YOU!)
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To: Tzfat
Not true. We are against the process, period. One step at a time...

You and other conscientious pilots may feel that way, but it is not what the Union spokesman said on Laura Ingram. She pressed him on it and he gave the phony 'we are for reasonable security' answer. He refused to say it the entire practice needs to stop. This 'one step at a time' approach to stop this nonsense is unacceptable and self serving.

33 posted on 11/17/2010 5:52:24 AM PST by Never on my watch (Touch my junk and I call the cops!)
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To: PA-RIVER

That’s the spirit.

A couple or three years ago, I drove rather than flew on a business trip of 700+ miles. On the way there, I stayed overnight in a motel about halfway there. On the way back, I just wanted to get home, so I drove the entire 700+ miles in one very long day.


34 posted on 11/17/2010 5:54:24 AM PST by savedbygrace (But God.)
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To: bvw
The ELITES continue to see every and all Americans as a real threat

If "the ELITES" continue down the path they have been on, it may turn out that they have very good reasons for this point of view..

Seems to me that they are working quite diligently to create the very situation that they claim they are so concerned about. The phrase "self-fulfilling prophesy" comes to mind.

Of course, this administration told us in no uncertain terms who they considered to be the enemy very early on, didn't they?

35 posted on 11/17/2010 6:07:15 AM PST by aragorn (We do indeed live in interesting times. NRA, GOA, SAF, CCRKBA. FUBO.)
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To: SkyPilot
"The Community Organizer has zero political skills. All he ever had was a lapdog media, Soros seemingly unlimited financial backing, and a cult of personality among the stupid."

Please forgive me the liberty with your post. ;)

36 posted on 11/17/2010 6:22:08 AM PST by rockinqsranch (Dems, Libs, Socialists, call 'em what you will, they ALL have fairies livin' in their trees.)
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To: SkyPilot

Exactly!


37 posted on 11/17/2010 6:25:17 AM PST by Hulka
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To: Never on my watch
You and other conscientious pilots may feel that way, but it is not what the Union spokesman said on Laura Ingram

First of all, my Union does not have any official role. What they are doing is starting a process to get official attention on the issue. How much attention would they get from the TSA if they came out and publicly shot down back-scatter scanners? None. Step at a time from we pilots is only one avenue. If you don't want our help, so be it - but adding our EXPERT voices to the mix will help EVERYONE.
38 posted on 11/17/2010 7:02:18 AM PST by Tzfat
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To: savedbygrace
Unless your going from California to the East Coast, you can pretty much opt out.

We did the Disney trip two years ago, before the “Muzzie panty Bomber”. So we are done with the big expensive trips and the groping and the “No Muzzie Profiling” that's going to get people killed.

We plan on a 1500 mile round trip vacation next summer, on the ground, dignified, cheap, and safe.

39 posted on 11/17/2010 7:22:24 AM PST by PA-RIVER
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To: Tzfat
...If you don't want our help, so be it..

That seems a bit contentious on your part, although I may be reading it too critically.

My point is that this is not a fight for an incremental roll back. The X-RAY or Grope policy is WRONG for all US citizens, pilots and travelers alike. To lobby for a change that only affects a class of citizens (pilots) is essentially saying it is OK for the traveling class. They need to lobby against the injustice of this across the board, or their righteous indignation rings shallow.

The government made a huge power grab, and it will be perfectly happy negotiating selective steps to roll back the requirements, and still have accomplished the power grab.

That being said, I don't think the pilots (or military for that matter) should have to go through any of this. They have background checks and are entrusted with the care of their passengers.

Having biometric identification as the Union calls for is fine with me, but that is not the issue at hand. If our government really doesn't trust the pilots, or the airlines, there are bigger concerns.

40 posted on 11/17/2010 7:32:31 AM PST by Never on my watch (Touch my junk and I call the cops!)
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To: SkyPilot

I too refuse to fly: These body searches and child porn
images are violations of the Fourth Amendment! Consider
that plastic and ceramic knives would pass through such
invasive screening.


41 posted on 11/17/2010 8:14:49 AM PST by upcountryhorseman (An old fashioned conservative)
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To: SkyPilot

“you can’t professionalize if you don’t federalize.” -Tom Dash-hole

look for a bunch more gubbamint union members to be created.

thanks, W.


42 posted on 11/17/2010 8:15:46 AM PST by WOBBLY BOB ( "I don't want the majority if we don't stand for something"- Jim Demint)
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To: Never on my watch
You and other conscientious pilots may feel that way, but it is not what the Union spokesman said on Laura Ingram. She pressed him on it and he gave the phony 'we are for reasonable security' answer. He refused to say it the entire practice needs to stop.

The union spokesman could have pandered to Laura, and given her the answer that her audience wanted to hear. But he didn't. Was he being irrational or unthinking/uncaring? Was he ignoring or miscalculating the thoughts of his membership?

Please explain why you think that he stood his ground. I think that it is germane and central.

43 posted on 11/17/2010 8:23:26 AM PST by qwertypie
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To: qwertypie
Was he being irrational or unthinking/uncaring? Was he ignoring or miscalculating the thoughts of his membership?

He was being very rational and his response was carefully thought out. Whether or not he is 'caring' is irrelevant to me. He is expressing the Union position, I am sure the membership don't want to get X-RAY'd or patted down anymore than I do.

Please explain why you think that he stood his ground. I think that it is germane and central.

Simple, that is the job of a spokesman. As to germane, I wrote this in a follow up post in this thread:

'My point is that this is not a fight for an incremental roll back. The X-RAY or Grope policy is WRONG for all US citizens, pilots and travelers alike. To lobby for a change that only affects a class of citizens (pilots) is essentially saying it is OK for the traveling class. They need to lobby against the injustice of this across the board, or their righteous indignation rings shallow.'

44 posted on 11/17/2010 9:03:38 AM PST by Never on my watch (Touch my junk and I call the cops!)
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To: Never on my watch

Suffice it to say that most pilots are frequent passengers as well. Our families certainly are. Our lobbying efforts are different for that part of our lives.


45 posted on 11/17/2010 9:20:07 AM PST by Tzfat
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To: Tzfat

Point taken. Cheers!


46 posted on 11/17/2010 10:16:20 AM PST by Never on my watch (Touch my junk and I call the cops!)
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To: csmusaret

LOL.


47 posted on 11/17/2010 1:17:22 PM PST by SkyPilot
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To: bvw
I am happy that REAL hero and AMERICAN NON-ELITE Captain Sully has come out AGAINST this abuse of the rights of free men and women.

Acc to the article, Sullenberger did not come out against this "abuse of the rights of free men and women" as such. It says he objected to it as inefficient.

"Sullenberger, who landed a crippled US Airways jet on the Hudson River last year, said the use of full-body pat-downs and advanced imaging scanners for airline personnel 'just isn't an efficient use of our resources.' "

48 posted on 11/17/2010 3:02:42 PM PST by 668 - Neighbor of the Beast (Starve the beast. Save the liver!)
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To: bvw

When is the last time Peter King flew on a commercial flight? Has he or his family ever been subjected to the T&A scanners and pat-downs? Is it possible that he and the rest of the Royalty class have no earthly idea what takes place outside of the arrogant doors of DC?


49 posted on 11/18/2010 3:09:54 PM PST by Joan912 (I used to think that the day would never come...)
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To: Joan912

He has the Beltway disease, I think. A blinding arrogance and detachment from the rest of the country.


50 posted on 11/18/2010 3:26:28 PM PST by bvw
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