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John F. Kennedy's Secret Service agents break their silence in book, documentary
Dallas Morning News ^ | 11/21/10 | By JEFF MOSIER

Posted on 11/21/2010 5:33:08 AM PST by JNRoberts

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To: traderrob6

“when compared to American civilian males of the same age, he was “an excellent shot”.>>>>>>

Does this include “American civilian males” who had never even picked up a rifle? Talk about opinions over facts, you have taken their opinions as facts. Sorry I don’t.


101 posted on 11/21/2010 8:04:25 AM PST by Ditter
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To: Iscool

From Time A Chat You Can’t Refuse:
Former Consigliere Bill Bonanno

Transcript from May 11, 1999

Het_Nikik_1 asks: Who was truly involved in the Kennedy Assassination?

Bill Bonanno: This is going to be a long answer....

Bill Bonanno: I can only relate to you what has been related to me. And in order to do that, we have to go back and understand the situations that were happening at that period of time, the late Fifties and the early Sixties. When Kennedy became President, he was immediately faced with a 3-prong attack on his administration.

Number 1 was the Diem situation in Southeast Asia, where he and his administration backed the Diem government and then in later years, as the story goes, they dumped Diem. Diem fell out of favor with Washington. Kennedy had sent Maxwell Taylor to Southeast Asia and later Cabot Lodge... so that was one thing.

And then the second prong of the three-prong attack was the Bay of Pigs and the Cuban situation.

And the third prong was his and Bobby’s relentless attacks on the people in our world, and for the sake of clarity, the people that were involved in the Mafia.

So at a given period of time in the early sixties he had the French against him, the Cubans against him, and the Sicilian Italians against him.

Madame Nhu, who was the wife of the brother of President Nhu, and the acting First Lady of South Vietnam If you recall your history, she went off to Paris where she was enlisting the aid of the French OAS to support her brother-in-law. So you have a very complicated situation in the years 1960 and 1963.

It came to my attention many years later in 1971 while I was a guest of our government at the federal institution in San Pedro, California, that there was more to the assassination than a lone gunman. One day while I was sitting in the yard, with a number of other inmates, Johnny Roselli, out of Chicago, was very upset, infuriated in fact, about the treatment that he was being given by his people in Chicago. One of this group had made a remark about Jack Ruby, and Johnny made the statement that “Jack was a lot more loyal than that (expletive) Sam.”

Whether or not it actually happened the way it was related to me, I don’t know I do know this: That Johnny Roselli told me that he was the shooter in the sewer below the grassy knoll. And that there were others that were backups behind the wall of the grassy knoll. They were Frenchmen.

I’ve been asked many times whether I believe him, and I irrevocably believe him, because I have known Johnny for a long time. I know the type of person he was, and there would not be any purpose of him saying it if it were not true. Because he knew the people that he was talking with that day in the Yard.

It was not a long gunman. In reality, Lee Harvey Oswald was the fall guy.


102 posted on 11/21/2010 8:09:25 AM PST by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: Ditter

They unlike you or I ARE experts. And how about refuting the other exposed lies while you’re at it Sparky.


103 posted on 11/21/2010 8:17:27 AM PST by traderrob6
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To: abb
Your conclusion can speak as well as to why it was determined, 'perhaps' that Oswald should be only, a 'lone' gunman. History if full of conspiracies and many of them 'real' - whether we realize them as such - or not. There is much written by the arrogance of power and/or the Utilitarian MO per politics.
104 posted on 11/21/2010 8:20:33 AM PST by cricket (Osama - NOT made in the USA. . .and Obama, not made in the USA either. . .)
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To: JNRoberts

I recall the Warren Commission reports on TV and even as a kid they didn’t make sense and seemed to have gaps and holes in them.

The idea that YOU think you can declare the subject closed tells more about you than anyone who doesn’t believe the ‘official’ government report.


105 posted on 11/21/2010 8:28:59 AM PST by Eagle Eye (A blind clock finds a nut at least twice a day.)
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To: cricket

In no way am I attempting to minimize conspiracies or say that they don’t exist.

That there has been an attempt (still ongoing) by Marxists to inflict their political system upon the world’s population cannot be denied.

I don’t necessarily call it a ‘conspiracy’ though. It’s never been a secret at all.


106 posted on 11/21/2010 8:30:48 AM PST by abb ("What ISN'T in the news is often more important than what IS." Ed Biersmith, 1942 -)
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To: traderrob6
Sparky???

LOL! You are really invested in this aren't you?

The lies I want to see refuted are in the Warren Commission report but that won't happen until I am on the wrong side of the lawn. Bucky!

107 posted on 11/21/2010 8:32:58 AM PST by Ditter
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To: traderrob6

Conspiracy theories especially appeal to Democrats because Democrats like to believe they’re smarter than everyone else, and a conspiracy theory makes you think you’ve got inside information that the general public is just too stupid to know about.


108 posted on 11/21/2010 8:33:40 AM PST by Steve_Seattle ("Above all, shake your bum at Burton.")
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To: rbg81

Or Vince Foster.


109 posted on 11/21/2010 8:36:02 AM PST by Eagle Eye (A blind clock finds a nut at least twice a day.)
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To: Eagle Eye
If the conspiracy theorists all had the same story, I'd be more inclined to believe them. But there are as many conspiracy theories as there are conspiracy theorists, at least among those who've written books about it.

I wouldn't say that there are no unanswered questions about the JFK assassination, but Gerald Posner's "Case Closed" answered most of them as far as I'm concerned.
110 posted on 11/21/2010 8:38:46 AM PST by Steve_Seattle ("Above all, shake your bum at Burton.")
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To: Steve_Seattle

“Conspiracy theories especially appeal to Democrats because Democrats like to believe they’re smarter than everyone else, and a conspiracy theory makes you think you’ve got inside information that the general public is just too stupid to know about.”

Bears repeating.


111 posted on 11/21/2010 8:40:24 AM PST by traderrob6
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To: Eagle Eye
The central claim of many of the conspiracy theories - including Oliver Stone's - is that the military-industrial complex is the only real power in this country, and that anything which threatens it will be destroyed.

Now, if you ("you" in general, not "you" in particular) really believe that, then there's no point in voting or participating in politics. Conspiracy theories thus present a strong temptation towards cynicism, apathy, passivity, and disengagement.
112 posted on 11/21/2010 8:51:39 AM PST by Steve_Seattle ("Above all, shake your bum at Burton.")
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To: Steve_Seattle

When it really comes down to it there are two opposing camps, each laughing at the other; there are those who believe most, if not all that the government says and those who believe that the government has no problem lying to cover up truth.

I’m one that tends to believe that there are things going on behind the scenes that that what we see and hear from the government is not always, or even usually precise.

Tell me if you believe that Vince Foster committed suicide, if Hillary Clinton really made her own money in cattle futures, and if Arkancide is just a string of coincidences; or if it is meaningless that Obama has no documented past and that will tell me where you stand.


113 posted on 11/21/2010 9:07:57 AM PST by Eagle Eye (A blind clock finds a nut at least twice a day.)
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To: JNRoberts
Freepers who think it was a conspiracy are a little like the LEFT on this....just plain whacked out

Anyone who knows that there was a conspiricy to assassinate Kennedy in Chicago on Nov 2 and in Tampa on Nov 18, and then believes that there was no conspiricy in Dallas is just plain whacked out.

114 posted on 11/21/2010 9:36:33 AM PST by mjp ((pro-{God, reality, reason, egoism, individualism, natural rights, limited government, capitalism}))
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To: mjp

I never heard about Chicago and Tampa, tell us more.


115 posted on 11/21/2010 9:43:13 AM PST by Ditter
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To: abb; All
I don’t necessarily call it a ‘conspiracy’ though. It’s never been a secret at all.

No secret to those who have 'eyes and ears' for the subtext. But clearly, a successful effort given how many voting citizens do not. We have only to look at Obama; his mission all too clear. Yet, even now, there are still those who believe otherwise.

Would suggest - again - Edward T. Haslam's book, "Dr. Mary and the Monkey". While, perhaps, a bit more detailed than one might enjoy; this book is a great read. If you want to see how some conspiracies - albeit 'not imaginary' plots - unfold, read or just google it and/or google Dr. Alton Ochsner and/or same with with Jonas Salk/Lee Harvey Oswald. . .and/or all; including the google of SV 40.

As it is; this book,brings in the back door, Kennedy connections/CIA/mafia; Cuban ex-pats and et al personalities, by way of Dr. Alton Ochsner who founded 'Ochsner Clinic' in the politically hot milieu in New Orleans. The books main story is about the death (reported as murder and case never solved) of an esteemed researcher and leads to the story of the accidental contamination by cancer virus/SV 40 (Simeon Virus 40) per it's presence in the Salk polio vaccine.

This introductory Salk vaccine is nonetheless,subsequently delivered to millions of school aged children. (And so by theory; a partial explanation, perhaps, as to why we have a cancer epidemic today.)

Beyond the contamination story; this book, by unintended consequences; broadsides into the Kennedy assassination.

from Amazon.com:

[Dr. Mary's Monkey: How the Unsolved Murder of a Doctor, a Secret Laboratory in New Orleans and Cancer-Causing Monkey Viruses are Linked to Lee Harvey Oswald, ... Assassination and Emerging Global Epidemics]

116 posted on 11/21/2010 9:49:19 AM PST by cricket (Osama - NOT made in the USA. . .and Obama, not made in the USA either. . .)
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To: JNRoberts
Always a matter of debate and thanks for the post.

Of interest, but hardly a documentary is Don DeLillo's book. Libra. A mixture of fact and fiction. Putting aside the authors conclusions though, it does go into the actual personality of Lee Harvey Oswald. I know Libra is an astrological sign. I will presume the majority of Freepers dismiss astrology as an indicator of personality traits.

For me the deciding factor and absolutely well documented in most accounts of the awful tragedy of the assassination, is the conduct of Lee Harvey Oswald following the flurry after the shooting. To me he was in a daze, knowing what he had done. The police came in to the repository and Oswald calmly got a soft drink from a vending machine. Dispelling immediate confrontation- clever move. Next, the instinct of survival kicked in. He went in a shoe store fumbling about and not buying. He went into the movie theatre. He slipped in without paying and staff saw him. He shouted "this is it", when the police came in and laid hands on him.

I try to put into context what an innocent employee of the book depository would have done at the time. To me, that innocent employee was not Oswald.

117 posted on 11/21/2010 9:55:42 AM PST by Peter Libra
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To: Eagle Eye

So, whether Mrs. Clinton took a bribe or Mr. Obama was born out of wedlock, is proof as to who killed John Kennedy?


118 posted on 11/21/2010 9:57:30 AM PST by Mr. Lucky
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To: Ditter
Someone else declared that Oswald was an expert marksman.
You can be an "expert marksman" as a general description, but you can't be both an Expert and a Marksman in the Marine Corps. Two distinct classes.

Oswald was a below average shot with a crappy gun.
BS. Even if Oswald was only a Marksman in boot camp (and I think he was actually a Sharpshooter) - 1) he re-qualified at least two or three more times during his tour; 2) he was not below average (Marksman is average); 3) if you haven't been through Parris Island, then you don't have a clue how good even a Marksman can shoot.
The closest a Marine gets to a target is 200 yards, then moves back to 300 yards, then back again to 500 yards. No scopes allowed.
Oswald was less than a 100 yards from JFK and he had a scope.
119 posted on 11/21/2010 9:59:34 AM PST by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: Joe Marine 76
There is NO WAY he squeezed off three shots in seven seconds and much less hit anything.
He only had to get off TWO shots in seven seconds. The clock doesn't start until after the first round is fired.

I have the same Rifle Qualifications as you, but with an M16A2
Tinker Toy.
120 posted on 11/21/2010 10:05:39 AM PST by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: JNRoberts

I think “we” care about being accused of being conspiracy nuts, but “we” don’t care about JFK or his chickens coming home to roost.


121 posted on 11/21/2010 10:06:43 AM PST by anton
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To: Ditter

R Lee Ermey said it best in “Full Metal Jacket”

HARTMAN: Anybody know who Lee Harvey Oswald was? Private Snowball?

SNOWBALL: Sir, he shot Kennedy, sir!

HARTMAN: That’s right, and do you know how far away he was?

SNOWBALL: Sir, it was pretty far! From that book suppository building, sir!

HARTMAN: All right, knock it off! Two hundred and fifty feet! He was two hundred and fifty feet away and shooting at a moving target. Oswald got off three rounds with an old Italian bolt action rifle in only six seconds and scored two hits, including a head shot! Do any of you people know where these individuals learned to shoot? Private Joker?

JOKER: Sir, in the Marines, sir!

HARTMAN: In the Marines! Outstanding! Those individuals showed what one motivated marine and his rifle can do! And before you ladies leave my island, you will be able to do the same thing!


122 posted on 11/21/2010 10:08:20 AM PST by dfwgator (Texas Rangers -Thanks for a great season.)
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To: Mr. K
back and to the left... back and to the left... back and to the left

123 posted on 11/21/2010 10:27:07 AM PST by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: JNRoberts

Leaving behind the conspiracy/no conspiracy arguments, have you ever noticed the parallels between Oswald and Stanley Ann Dunham? Same age and era, both fellow traveler atheist Marxists, both studied Russian, both married communist foreigners, and...

Both born of a bitterness against Eisenhower’s peace and prosperity.


124 posted on 11/21/2010 10:37:47 AM PST by Poincare
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To: oh8eleven

See post #90.


125 posted on 11/21/2010 11:51:15 AM PST by traderrob6
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To: JNRoberts

Back when Oliver Stone’s movie about the assassination came out, my brother met the man who claimed to be X. He tried to convince me and our parents that Stone’s version was correct. He kept telling us, “he was sitting right here in my dining room and told me everything. He’s the real deal.”
My brother was totally convinced Stone had the story right. Time has passed and he has read lots more on the subject and he no longer believes it.


126 posted on 11/21/2010 12:12:53 PM PST by kalee (The offences we give, we write in the dust; Those we take, we engrave in marble. J Huett 1658)
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To: traderrob6; Joe Marine 76; Ditter
Thanks - good post.
I don't know who "Ditter" is, but he's all over this thread like a bad rash and doesn't have a feckin' clue about shooting - especially how a Marine does it.
"Joe Marine 76" isn't much better, but he did shoot an M16 which is almost like qualifying with a real rifle. He's probably a "ten percenter."
Maybe they both stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
127 posted on 11/21/2010 12:14:00 PM PST by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: oh8eleven

I understand about the 7 seconds thingy, but still I don’t believe Oswald could have hit his target.

BTW, the “Tinker Toy” ... that’s funny! Depending on your service dates, you’d probably consider me a youngster?

S/F - JM76


128 posted on 11/21/2010 12:14:31 PM PST by Joe Marine 76 (Semper Fi!)
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To: Mr. Lucky

Is that supposed to be an intelligent response?


129 posted on 11/21/2010 12:28:16 PM PST by Eagle Eye (A blind clock finds a nut at least twice a day.)
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To: Steve_Seattle

There are a lot of supposedly credible people on FR who believe that there were plenty of conspiracies surrounding the clintons, and I think that the Dan Rather memo even fits into that conspiracy category.

US history is full of events where the official version seems to have serious holes or contradictions.

And recent history has shown us that the government is not above abusing citizens (Ruby Ridge, Waco) with recklessness and callousness.

For anyone to ask me to believe the government as my default position is to ask me to ignore a whole lot that I cannot ignore.


130 posted on 11/21/2010 12:36:38 PM PST by Eagle Eye (A blind clock finds a nut at least twice a day.)
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To: Joe Marine 76

Your posts only indicate you can’t hit the broad side of a barn.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4c5Zr7hzzA


131 posted on 11/21/2010 2:41:05 PM PST by Shooter 2.5 (NRA /Patron - TSRA- IDPA)
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To: bert

Thanks Bert.Just watched the whole thing.


132 posted on 11/21/2010 3:28:36 PM PST by fatima (Free Hugs Today :))
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To: cricket
Would suggest - again - Edward T. Haslam's book, "Dr. Mary and the Monkey"
I was intrigued enough to look up the book in my local library and was surprised they have a copy. It's on my read list now.
The title is actually,"Dr. Mary's Monkey", not that it matters. Thx ...
133 posted on 11/21/2010 4:51:28 PM PST by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: JNRoberts
Minimum 4 shots: Back, head, curb, car trim.
Impossible for shot fired from depository to hit curb.
Look up Jim Braden, picked up in DalTex building.
Shot that hit curb was from DalTex.
House Committee correct: conspiracy.
134 posted on 11/21/2010 5:08:22 PM PST by Partisan Gunslinger
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To: Partisan Gunslinger

135 posted on 11/21/2010 6:37:54 PM PST by Shooter 2.5 (NRA /Patron - TSRA- IDPA)
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Will this never end? I have it on very good authority that the late Soupy sales was the actual assassin.


136 posted on 11/21/2010 6:44:44 PM PST by donaldo
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To: Condor51; cricket; j.argese; earlJam; bert; Thermalseeker; anton; abb; knaff; Flasfyre; ...

Please read whole article, and then decide which story Jack Ruby told was correct one, because even Jimmy Hoffa said it was a conspiracy.....anyone seen Hoffa lately?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Ruby


137 posted on 11/21/2010 7:32:29 PM PST by Kackikat (There is no such thing as a free lunch, because someone paid, somewhere.)
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To: Kackikat

More fuel to the fire, why did so many men die within just a few years by assasination:

http://www.encyclomedia.com/mafia_john_f_kennedy.html


138 posted on 11/21/2010 8:18:13 PM PST by Kackikat (There is no such thing as a free lunch, because someone paid, somewhere.)
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To: Kackikat
Wikepdia???
139 posted on 11/21/2010 9:07:51 PM PST by hflynn (The One has been reduced to The Zero)
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To: Kackikat
Wikepdia???
140 posted on 11/21/2010 9:07:57 PM PST by hflynn (The One has been reduced to The Zero)
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To: Kackikat

There were FAR too many coincidences in the JFK assassination and the ensuing murder of Lee Harvey Oswald to turn a blind eye to the possibility of a conspiracy.


141 posted on 11/22/2010 5:26:11 AM PST by TommyDale
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To: Buckeye Battle Cry
Looking out of the 6th floor windows, I can easily see how a military trained rifleman could make that shot.

I have also visited the Sixth Floor Museum, and the first thing that came to mind when I looked out the windows is what an easy shot it would have been. And Oswald had a 4x scope on the rifle as well.

142 posted on 11/22/2010 5:32:32 AM PST by IndyTiger
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To: kalee

L. Fletcher Prouty, Mr. X, died in 2001.


143 posted on 11/22/2010 12:00:53 PM PST by campaignPete R-CT ("pray without ceasing" - Paul of Tarsus)
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To: hflynn

http://www.jfk-assassination.de/articles/deaths.php


144 posted on 11/22/2010 3:10:49 PM PST by Kackikat (There is no such thing as a free lunch, because someone paid, somewhere.)
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To: oh8eleven

Classic scene...and great episode, too.

The magic lugee!


145 posted on 11/22/2010 3:19:20 PM PST by newfreep (Palin/DeMint 2012 - Bolton: Secy of State)
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To: TommyDale

http://www.jfk-assassination.de/articles/deaths.php

It all started somehow with Marilyn Monroe death in 1962, or the Cuba revolution 1961, when our special forces guys and others fighting for freedom were abandoned in Cuba and had to find their own way out.....it’s all tied together, and Jack Ruby had something to do with Cuba, as well as Ozwald??

Jimmy Hoffa said it was a conspiracy, and he disappeared by 1975, those 13-14 years saw a lot of people murdered or ???
There are more questions than answers, and that usually means a cover-up.


146 posted on 11/22/2010 3:24:27 PM PST by Kackikat (There is no such thing as a free lunch, because someone paid, somewhere.)
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To: Kackikat
Yeah, I am very familiar with the number of unnatural deaths that befell people connected to the Kennedy assassination. Actuary calculations indicate the possibility of these deaths occurring for the stated causes of deaths would be something like 1 in umpteen number of trillions. Still here we are with the Warren Commission Report as our government's answer to what happened. Quite amazing that what really happened has not been revealed to date.
147 posted on 11/22/2010 3:26:13 PM PST by hflynn (The One has been reduced to The Zero)
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To: hflynn

It’s right up there with the Clinton Body Count isn’t it?


148 posted on 11/22/2010 3:29:13 PM PST by Kackikat (There is no such thing as a free lunch, because someone paid, somewhere.)
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To: metesky
...but I wish the rest of the cursed clan would hurry up and join him and his brothers in hell.

With the close of the "lame duck" session, Patrick Kennedy (D-RI) will retire.

And, for the first time since 1946, the United States Congress will be without a Kennedy.

HOO-friggin'-RAY!

149 posted on 11/22/2010 4:29:40 PM PST by okie01 (THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA: Ignorance on Parade)
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To: Shooter 2.5

Still defending the thoroughly corrupt Johnson still, eh?


150 posted on 11/22/2010 5:02:13 PM PST by Partisan Gunslinger
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