Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Why carbon tax will work even if climate change theory is wrong
The Vancouver Sun ^ | November 24, 2010 | Don Cayo

Posted on 11/25/2010 7:57:32 AM PST by NRG1973

Just because nobody knows the future is no excuse to do nothing in the face of worrisome possibilities, says Dan Gardner, the author of a solidly researched new book that makes it clear just how shaky – if not dead wrong – expert predictions usually are.

Good policy, Gardner writes in Future Babble: Why Expert Predictions Fail – and Why We Believe Them Anyway, stands up as worthwhile even if the forecast that prompted it turns out to be wrong.

He cites as an example “a stiff carbon tax with the revenues returned to the economy in the form of cuts to other taxes” – which is what we have in B.C., except our carbon tax isn’t so stiff.

“Would it deliver even if climate change turns out to be bunk?” he asks.

“Absolutely. Carbon taxes raise the effective cost of fossil fuels, making alternative energy more competitive and spurring research and development. And reducing the use of fossil fuels while increasing the diversity of our energy sources would be wonderful for a whole host of reasons aside from climate change. It would reduce local air pollution, reduce the risk of catastrophic oil spills, buffer economies against the massive shocks inflicted by oil price spikes, and lessen the world’s vulnerability to instability in the Middle East and elsewhere. It would also reduce the torrent of cash flowing from the developed world to the thuggish governments that control most oil-producing nations, including Saudi Arabia, Iran and Russia. And of course there’s peak oil. If the peaksters turn out to be right, finally, how much of our economy is fuelled by oil will determine how badly we will suffer – so carbon taxes would steadily reduce that threat, too.”

(Excerpt) Read more at communities.canada.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: bunk; canada; carbon; co2; energy; globalwarming; gore; tax; taxes; vancouver
I guess the author is getting nervous about Climategate and wants the carbon taxes to be passed (in Canada) anyway.
1 posted on 11/25/2010 7:57:34 AM PST by NRG1973
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

Good idea. Let’s replace income taxes with consumption taxes.

We could call it the FairTax.

Its amazing that it took a liberal Canadian to think of that. </sarc>


2 posted on 11/25/2010 8:00:13 AM PST by Bryanw92 (Obama is like a rocket scientist....who's trying to do brain surgery with a hammer.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973; Clive; scripter; Darnright; WL-law; bamahead; carolinablonde; SolitaryMan; rdl6989; ...

 


Beam me to Planet Gore !

3 posted on 11/25/2010 8:00:43 AM PST by steelyourfaith (ObamaCare Death Panels: a Final Solution to the looming Social Security crisis ?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973
hey NRG....you forgot this


4 posted on 11/25/2010 8:01:47 AM PST by Vaquero (Dont pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973
Tax=cure

Tax cut=cause

Always....

What a mindset we are saddled with.

5 posted on 11/25/2010 8:02:58 AM PST by EGPWS (Trust in God, question everyone else)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

“Revenues Returned To The Economy In The Form Of Cuts To Other Taxes”?In a PIG’S EYE!!


6 posted on 11/25/2010 8:03:41 AM PST by bandleader
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

It’s scary to think that this guy is walking around loose among us. He definitely has some serious “issues”.


7 posted on 11/25/2010 8:03:50 AM PST by FlingWingFlyer (Don't touch my junk!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

Oh good after the carbon tax collapses the Canadian economy I will get to add socialist give-me-free-stuff Canadian illegal economic immigrants to the current give-me-free-stuff Latin American immigrants.


8 posted on 11/25/2010 8:04:04 AM PST by Reily
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973
“a stiff carbon tax with the revenues returned to the economy in the form of cuts to other taxes”

Simply brilliant! The fevered liberal mind at work.

Every layer of taxation requires a huge new government bureaucracy that will scrape off its take, further diminishing the productive power of society. That's a real recipe for success.

9 posted on 11/25/2010 8:04:32 AM PST by ProtectOurFreedom
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FlingWingFlyer
It’s scary to think that this guy is walking around loose among us. He definitely has some serious “issues”.

You know what's scarier...he isn't the only one that feels this way.

10 posted on 11/25/2010 8:07:40 AM PST by NRG1973
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

“Lets have another tax for the sake of having another tax”


11 posted on 11/25/2010 8:08:01 AM PST by headstamp 2 ("My Boss is a Jewish Carpenter")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973
lessen the world’s vulnerability to instability in the Middle East and elsewhere

WE are the "elsewhere". We have oil running our of our ears. Offshore (near and far), in Alaska, in shale. HUGE amounts of oil. Potential MASSIVE deposits offshore to be exploited as Brazil does. Natural gas too. If only we STOPPED government meddling on behalf of environmental "experts".

12 posted on 11/25/2010 8:11:52 AM PST by FreepShop1
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: headstamp 2

Another tax will cure all of our ills. Where have we heard that before?


13 posted on 11/25/2010 8:17:58 AM PST by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

If we found an acceptable and viable alternative energy source, it would pay for itself without being financed with tax dollars. Wind, solar and ethanol don’t stand on their own and all-electric cars will never compete with the gold standard we’ve been so accustomed to.

Why the hell does the envirowhacko left always push us regressively instead of forward technologically?


14 posted on 11/25/2010 8:19:33 AM PST by umgud
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FreepShop1

yeah if someone wants to make the case that there is a problem with importing oil from the middle east then why would he want to tax his own energy sources?


15 posted on 11/25/2010 8:23:53 AM PST by ari-freedom (Islam is at war against America, while America is at the mall.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

The argument fails on purely economic terms. His arguments are too idiotic to refute in detail and not worth the time. Spare us.

In brief, he is assuming that there is a market failure than can be remedied by targeted taxes and subsidies. If one of his assumptions is invalidated, the whole house of cards collapses. Since the previous pretext (assumption) for targeted taxes is now widely greeted with skeptism if not outright derision, he shifts premises and hopes nobody notices.

Lookit, we’re not that stoopid and we noticed, now cut it out. Capish?


16 posted on 11/25/2010 8:25:13 AM PST by Lonesome in Massachussets (Socialists are to economics what circle squarers are to math; undaunted by reason or derision.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

According to Bjorn Lomborg, even if the Kyoto Protocol had been fully adopted and implemented, it would only decrease global temperature by 0.008 degree Fahrenheit by the year 2100. Similarly, current European Union climate policy will cost $250 billion of GDP annually, yet it will likely decrease global temperature by a mere 0.1 degree Fahrenheit.

So who is actually going to benefit from these carbon taxes?


17 posted on 11/25/2010 8:25:18 AM PST by smokingfrog ( ><}}}}}}(0>)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

Great idea. Let’s tax all government salaries 70% and return the money to the taxpayers.


18 posted on 11/25/2010 8:28:04 AM PST by devere
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

This dude must have been hanging around smoking crack in East Hastings for too long.


19 posted on 11/25/2010 8:45:32 AM PST by Catholic Canadian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

But, but it is working out so well in China (not):

The Unintended Consequences of Carbon Reduction in China

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2632563/posts


20 posted on 11/25/2010 8:50:36 AM PST by epithermal
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973
“Carbon taxes raise the effective cost of fossil fuels”

Yes, & it also raises the costs of EVERYTHING delivered by vehicles, food being a big one, & it raises the cost of powering/heating/cooling your home. Therefore a carbon tax will hurt the poor the most, followed closely by the middle class. The rich will laugh all the way to the bank.

Peak oil is a myth for the foreseeable future, with oil & ng being found virtually everywhere it is search for, & with only a small part of the planet having been searched.

Low energy costs are a boon to any economy. We should be finding/producing all domestic energy sources as a means to independence & to stop enriching our enemies.

21 posted on 11/25/2010 8:57:12 AM PST by Mister Da (The mark of a wise man is not what he knows, but what he knows he doesn't know!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973
Carbon taxes raise the effective cost of fossil fuels, making alternative energy more competitive and spurring research and development.
Replacing high-taxed fossil fuels with more expensive "alternative" energy = higher priced energy.

It would reduce local air pollution,
Existing pollution/emmission controls already do that.

reduce the risk of catastrophic oil spills,
Drilling closer to shore could also do that.

buffer economies against the massive shocks inflicted by oil price spikes
Increased domestic drilling could do that.

and lessen the world’s vulnerability to instability in the Middle East and elsewhere.
Increased domestic drilling could do that.

It would also reduce the torrent of cash flowing from the developed world to the thuggish governments that control most oil-producing nations, including Saudi Arabia, Iran and Russia.
Increased domestic energy production could also do that.

And of course there’s peak oil. If the peaksters turn out to be right, finally, how much of our economy is fuelled by oil will determine how badly we will suffer – so carbon taxes would steadily reduce that threat, too
Increased domestic energy production could do ALL that WITHOUT a new tax!!

22 posted on 11/25/2010 8:59:07 AM PST by DTogo (High time to bring back the Sons of Liberty !!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973
Just because nobody knows the future is no excuse to do nothing in the face of worrisome possibilities, says Dan Gardner...

Pass a carbon tax to address a Global Warming threat that may or may not be happening just because it might be a threat? So now we need to enact policies based on the apocalypse fantasies of others, independent of the actual truth? I can dream up a lot of other maybe-problems we should pass taxes to prevent:

1. A tax to prepare for Alien Invasion.
2. A tax to offset the coming Zombie/Vampire Apocalypse.
3. A tax to prevent the coming Ice Age.
4. A tax to avoid the world being taken over by "damn, dirty apes".

This is just more proof that environmentalism is a stalking horse for lefty causes.

23 posted on 11/25/2010 9:23:31 AM PST by Mongeaux (''I would sooner be governed by the first 2,000 names in the Boston phone directory," W.F. Buckley)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

That’s why I left Vancouver for America. The V Sun is probably the most idiotic “newspaper” in North America. The free dailies are more entertaining with their lies than paying for it.


24 posted on 11/25/2010 9:56:42 AM PST by max americana
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973
He cites as an example “a stiff carbon tax with the revenues returned to the economy in the form of cuts to other taxes”

OK, a tax to hurt the economy that is returned to the economy after passing through the wasteful expense of bureaucracy is still a net loss.

25 posted on 11/25/2010 10:03:47 AM PST by Right Wing Assault (The Obama magic is <strike>fading</strike>gone.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NRG1973

Just because nobody knows the future is no excuse to do nothing in the face of worrisome possibilities, says Dan Gardner.

He also says, “The sky is falling, the sky is falling! We must run and tell the king!”


26 posted on 11/25/2010 11:12:05 AM PST by flowerplough (Pennsylvania today - New New Jersey meets North West Virginia. Or maybe we're North Alabama.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Bryanw92

You are aware that the GVRD is exempt?


27 posted on 11/25/2010 12:01:27 PM PST by BenKenobi (Don’t worry about being effective. Just concentrate on being faithful to the truth.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: BenKenobi

I don’t even know what a GVRD is (and neither does Google).


28 posted on 11/25/2010 7:32:19 PM PST by Bryanw92 (Obama is like a rocket scientist....who's trying to do brain surgery with a hammer.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Bryanw92

Greater Vancouver Regional District.

It’s a very cunning plan. The people who support the tax aren’t paying the tax. So you’ve got their perpetual support and as long as they are exempt, they’ve got no reason to ever question the green orthodoxy. In fact they are happy because they see themselves as the blessed and that they are punishing others.

Best of all, the actual pain is well out of sight. Hit the hinterlands, the wealth producers.


29 posted on 11/25/2010 10:13:15 PM PST by BenKenobi (Don’t worry about being effective. Just concentrate on being faithful to the truth.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson