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Scientists deliver message to NJ Gov. Chris Christie: Climate change is real and it is man-made
northjersey.com ^ | 12.07.10 | MATT FRIEDMAN

Posted on 12/08/2010 3:59:15 PM PST by Coleus

Three Rutgers University scientists came to Trenton Tuesday to give Governor Christie a message: climate change is real, and it's man-made.  The State House forum, sponsored by several environmental groups, was held in response to Christie's recent comments at a Toms River town hall that he is skeptical that global warming results from human activity. "I've heard over 100 different arguments about why we shouldn’t accept global warming. They're all fallacious and I'd be happy to point out the errors in any of them," said Rutgers professor Alan Robock, a meteorologist.

Responding to a question at the town hall last month, Christie -- a rising star in the Republican Party -- said was "skeptical" that climate change is man made and "more science" is needed to prove it. "I wondered whether he was telling the truth or not. Whether he really was confused or if he was saying what the Republican Party wanted him to say," said Robock. The scientists invited Christie to the event and offered to meet with him publicly. Environment New Jersey Executive Director Dena Mottola Jaborska said they did not hear back, but the Christie administration sent two officials -- assistant counsel Robert Marshall and policy advisor Tricia Caliguire -- to report back to the governor.

Paul Falkowski, director of the Rutgers University Energy Institute, said global warming doubts are based on politics and personal beliefs, not science. "There is no honest argument against human climate change. The issues now rely primarily on political dialogue on how we're going to move this country forward," he said. Falkowski said he was encouraged when Christie said he wanted to make New Jersey more energy efficient, but that his policy decisions, such as hiking mass transit fares while refusing to raise the state's 14.5 cent gas tax is "the wrong message to be sending."


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; US: New Jersey
KEYWORDS: agw; alanrobock; alrobock; christie; climatechange; climatehoax; denajaborska; denamottolajaborska; econuts; falkowski; gastax; globalwarming; goes16; gorebullwarming; jaborska; paulfalkowski; rinos; robock; rutgers; rutgersu; taxes; weather
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a bunch of activist, progressive, liberal democrats with an agenda.
1 posted on 12/08/2010 3:59:18 PM PST by Coleus
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To: Coleus

Maybe some of them could explain the weather then....


2 posted on 12/08/2010 4:00:05 PM PST by struggle ((The struggle continues))
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To: Coleus

Any “scientists” dumb enough to live in Jersey “can’t” be that smart.


3 posted on 12/08/2010 4:00:50 PM PST by Frantzie (Imam Ob*m* & Democrats support the VICTORY MOSQUE & TV supports Imam)
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To: Coleus

Bull Obama.

The lib infection is attacking science...but at least here they’ve got to present real data and math is NOT a friend of libs.


4 posted on 12/08/2010 4:01:45 PM PST by Da Coyote
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To: Coleus

Let them talk to Professor Lindzen at MIT.


5 posted on 12/08/2010 4:02:18 PM PST by beethovenfan (If Islam is the solution, the "problem" must be freedom.)
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To: Coleus

Yes.. the academic brownshirts are on the way... we need a “Night of the Long Icicles”


6 posted on 12/08/2010 4:04:11 PM PST by snarkbait (<<For Rent>>)
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To: Coleus
Yeah right! And the melting of last ice age was also man made! The cave man burned way too many twigs!!
7 posted on 12/08/2010 4:05:08 PM PST by Undocumented_capitalist (Obama&Pelosi are the killers in chief of the unborn.)
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To: Coleus
refusing to raise the state's 14.5 cent gas tax is "the wrong message to be sending."

I'm sure these guys are recommending tax reductions elsewhere so that their proposed gas tax increase is revenue neutral.

ML/NJ

8 posted on 12/08/2010 4:05:09 PM PST by ml/nj
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To: Coleus
New Jersey, the "Superfund State," coughs up three lying unethical psychopaths. Whaddasupprise.
9 posted on 12/08/2010 4:05:09 PM PST by hinckley buzzard
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To: Coleus

If you google “GOES-16” and “sensor” and “data”, you will find many hits on the sensor problems with the GOES-16 satellite. Essentially, the last ten years of data is crap.

And, all analysis based on the GOES-16 is crap, too.

http://ams.confex.com/ams/90annual/techprogram/paper_159905.htm
http://climatechangedispatch.com/images/stories/pics3/2010_Jul04_959EDT.gif


10 posted on 12/08/2010 4:07:12 PM PST by Andy from Chapel Hill
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To: struggle

Oh I’m sure they could. Maybe they could also explain how any of our efforts would make one iota of difference.


11 posted on 12/08/2010 4:07:12 PM PST by Past Your Eyes (I'd open it myself but I don't have any thumbs.)
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To: Coleus

These scientists also believe that climate change may seriously effect Santa Claus’s ability to deliver gifts for Christmas.


12 posted on 12/08/2010 4:07:45 PM PST by windsorknot
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To: Coleus

The thing is, most disciples of man-made climate change don’t believe in it either. If they did, they wouldn’t be burning all those hydrocarbons taking jets down to Cancun.


13 posted on 12/08/2010 4:08:06 PM PST by Jaguarmike
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To: struggle
Maybe some of them could explain the weather then....

All weather is related to climate change!

14 posted on 12/08/2010 4:09:32 PM PST by broken_arrow1 (I regret that I have but one life to give for my country - Nathan Hale "Patriot")
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To: Coleus
I hope he treated them just like he treated the teacher's union idiot that came to his office.
15 posted on 12/08/2010 4:09:43 PM PST by SERKIT (We need more of Barry's "Wet Diaper" news conferences. He gets smaller and smaller each time.....)
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Probably a bunch of PoliSci "Scientists" fronting their creds.

I NEVER see mention in globull warming debates about Sun Spots, the Earth's natural 100K year "wobble", our newly discovered SOLAR SYSTEM'S movement through out galaxy and theory that we bob up and down along axis, planets and the sun flipping magnetic fields, etc...etc.

Of course the Earth's climate changes, what the hell ended the last ice age?? Too many mammoths farting at once? (ah crap, I just gave them an idea)..

All the mean CO2 we humans are belching out is heaven for plants and tree's (CA> Redwoods anyone? See THAT article?!!)

16 posted on 12/08/2010 4:10:15 PM PST by Michael Barnes (Guilty of being White.)
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To: Coleus

Christie to the scientists “”prove it!!”


17 posted on 12/08/2010 4:12:06 PM PST by timetostand (Ya say ya wanna revolution -- OK!)
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To: Coleus

To a liberal, especially one with a PhD, saying it makes it so. It’s the arrogance we see in the White House.


18 posted on 12/08/2010 4:12:29 PM PST by Spok
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.


19 posted on 12/08/2010 4:12:40 PM PST by Coleus (The Immaculate Conception: O Mary, conceived without sin, Pray for us, who have recourse to Thee)
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To: Coleus
a bunch of activist, progressive, liberal democrats with an agenda.

To be more succinct: a bunch of dipsh*ts.

20 posted on 12/08/2010 4:13:02 PM PST by Scott from the Left Coast
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To: Coleus

The climate changes everyday and has since the beginning of time and will continue to do so regardless of what a bunch of scientists want.


21 posted on 12/08/2010 4:13:35 PM PST by SECURE AMERICA
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To: Michael Barnes

It shouldn’t matter to a governor one way or another. NJ is still broke and needs to fix it’s own problems before it tackles the planet. Same for all the other states..first things first. We may not survive as a country and a free society, long before the ocean is lapping at the state house steps.
I wish the CA governor was of the same mind..the state is spending money and making rules to save the planet while the state is broke..


22 posted on 12/08/2010 4:14:24 PM PST by Oldexpat
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To: Coleus

"Hello. I'm Alan Robock, an Environmental Scientist, and I'm here to tell you that you must not argue with scientists like me. Because we get paid big research grants to lie to our students and skeptics like you.

23 posted on 12/08/2010 4:14:30 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius.)
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To: Coleus

But of course climate change is very real and I think that we can all agree that it’s cold at night and warm during the day in most places.


24 posted on 12/08/2010 4:14:54 PM PST by seawolf101
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To: Coleus

Let’s say these scientists are correct and suspend the dissenting ones.

Can they say that 1,000 years from now; the warming we perpetrated was for the better or worse? Of course not.

Said warming may be forestalling a catastrophic ice age, or it may be forestalling even more severe catastrophic warming. They don’t know and can never know. The system is too complex.

When they can start predicting say rainfall or cloud cover in Central Park in NY, on a given day; a year in advance; I’ll pay attention.


25 posted on 12/08/2010 4:18:09 PM PST by cicero2k
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To: Coleus
Suppose global warming is "real" and that it is "man made". Are these clowns really suggesting that the phenomenon is caused by a 14.5 cent gasoline tax in New Jersey?

Also, is it good or bad? Last I checked, warmth was beneficial to life. People save for years to be in Hawaii or the Caribbean for a week. Siberia and the Yukon? Not so much.
26 posted on 12/08/2010 4:18:50 PM PST by Question Liberal Authority (Worst. Post-Racial. And Post-Partisan. Agent Of Hope And Change. EVER.)
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To: Frantzie

Any “scientists” dumb enough to live in Jersey “can’t” be that smart.

Change “scientists” to “Anybody”


27 posted on 12/08/2010 4:20:51 PM PST by Renegade
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To: Michael Barnes
All the mean CO2 we humans are belching out...

Come to think of it: has there ever been any independently-verified inventory of the total amount of CO2 emitted by human sources, and a demonstration that it accounts for the increase in atmospheric CO2? I've never come across any; all I've ever seen is the assumption that it "had" to have come from human activity. One AGW loon I confronted on this point merely snarled back at me. No factual backup; not even an attempt at factual backup.

Word from the wised-up: "where else could it have come from?" = "I'm not willing to do my job."

(No wonder they try that ploy. Here I am, doing part of a peer-reviewer's job for free.)

28 posted on 12/08/2010 4:23:15 PM PST by danielmryan
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To: Coleus

Thank God Governor Christie has his cabinet-level science liaison Prof. Irwin Corey at his side to help explain this topic’s finer technical points...


29 posted on 12/08/2010 4:24:03 PM PST by doyle
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To: Oldexpat
Oh, AGREED!

I just wish more Governor's would spell it out like you and back it up with how much is not factored into the "debate"

Al Gore can go screw himself, the debate is NOT over.

30 posted on 12/08/2010 4:24:03 PM PST by Michael Barnes (Guilty of being White.)
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To: Renegade

LOL! Great one.


31 posted on 12/08/2010 4:34:12 PM PST by Frantzie (Imam Ob*m* & Democrats support the VICTORY MOSQUE & TV supports Imam)
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To: Renegade

“Any “scientists” dumb enough to live in Jersey “can’t” be that smart.

Change “scientists” to “Anybody””

Double dittos to that... and I lived most of my life there (unfortunately).


32 posted on 12/08/2010 4:36:15 PM PST by Pravious
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To: Coleus

It would be great if Christie invited them to a public hearing and asked them questions.

Questions like, “If all the Human CO2 Emissions that were emitted by modern industrial production and still persisting in the atmosphere as a percentage of the total atmosphere were represented as scoops of sugar you need to remove from one pound sack of sugar, would you be able to remove the same percentage from the sack with standard kitchen measuring devices?”


33 posted on 12/08/2010 4:38:39 PM PST by dila813
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To: Cicero

Yet another “Genius”.

I have about 5 of them as neighbors.


34 posted on 12/08/2010 4:44:23 PM PST by mowowie
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To: Coleus

People tell scientist go suck it, you couldn’t solve it anyway, stay out of my wallet you arrogant basta%$#..


35 posted on 12/08/2010 4:49:05 PM PST by aces
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To: dila813; Coleus; Renegade; Oldexpat

Really ??

You know what would be REALLY great ??

How about if Governor Christie backed his words with ACTIONS....

Like pulling New Jersey out of the Regional Greenhouse Gas Initiative. THAT would be something !!

Until he starts walking the walk, HE is all hot air !

But no, methinks he likes that 60+ million NJ rakes in EACH YEAR.


36 posted on 12/08/2010 4:51:05 PM PST by onona (dbada)
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To: Coleus

Humans causing globulllwarming is like Hussein peeing in the ocean to cause globul flooding!
ITS THE SUN and SUNSPOTS!!!


37 posted on 12/08/2010 4:54:04 PM PST by Leo Carpathian (fffffFRrrreeeeepppeeee-ssed!)
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To: onona

Having the conversation so he can undress them in public would allow him to politically to take that action.

If he does it without this conversation, they just label him anti-science again.


38 posted on 12/08/2010 4:58:17 PM PST by dila813
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To: dila813
Questions like, “If all the Human CO2 Emissions that were emitted by modern industrial production and still persisting in the atmosphere as a percentage of the total atmosphere were represented as scoops of sugar you need to remove from one pound sack of sugar, would you be able to remove the same percentage from the sack with standard kitchen measuring devices?”

I have heard this question before and it was answered kind of. The amount of CO2 emitted by man to the atmosphere in 2006 if we were to think about it in terms of a liquid would be one and half drops out of an eye dropper into an Olympic sized swimming pool. Tell that to your liberal friends, let them tell you how reducing it to 1 drop would change the composition of the pool water. See how silly it is, how insane the line of reasoning is "To do something" just to do something. This whole scheme was cooked up by the European Greens in the early 1990's as another way to package socialism, cause it wasn't selling as naked Socialism. I mean who could be against the earth right? They are in retreat on this and scrambling around for the shriveling grant money as this farce dies. Watch the Jesse Ventura show Conspiracy Theory on this subject, the cast of characters at the top of this fraud, its goals, how they bought up all the liberal science departments and how many good scientists sold their soul to this new religion.

39 posted on 12/08/2010 5:04:00 PM PST by pburgh01
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To: onona

What I want to know is where the hell all the toll road money goes that is collected on the Parkway and Expressway?

AND, I still think Christie is Obama in a white suit !


40 posted on 12/08/2010 5:06:11 PM PST by Renegade
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To: Coleus; Defendingliberty; WL-law; Normandy; TenthAmendmentChampion; FrPR; enough_idiocy; ...
 


Beam me to Planet Gore !

41 posted on 12/08/2010 5:09:52 PM PST by steelyourfaith (ObamaCare Death Panels: a Final Solution to the looming Social Security crisis ?)
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To: Frantzie

Christie should be able to identify which departments at the university to de-fund.


42 posted on 12/08/2010 5:10:58 PM PST by pointsal
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To: danielmryan
Come to think of it: has there ever been any independently-verified inventory of the total amount of CO2 emitted by human sources, and a demonstration that it accounts for the increase in atmospheric CO2?

The inventory comes from fossil fuel consumption, cement making and (to a smaller extent) forest clearing data. Those give a fairly precise figure for the amount of CO2 produced each year. Next those are compared to the natural increase for each year (the caveat being that the natural increase fluctuates with the NH growing season, so year to year growth has to be used).

It turns out that manmade CO2 is about double the rise observed in the atmosphere. That means nature is absorbing 1/2 of the "extra" which also means that there is and will be no such thing as a positive feedback from CO2 to warming to more CO2. It is all negative and will probably get more negative. Water vapor is another story, but it's a story about weather and has not been shown to produce large positive feedbacks.

43 posted on 12/08/2010 5:15:39 PM PST by palmer (Cooperating with Obama = helping him extend the depression and implement socialism.)
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To: danielmryan
These AGW scientists have a theory, CO2 traps infrared on its way back to outer space. So they program computers with this theory, munged up with an extremely poor historic database of world temperature series, and project global warming from this mess. However when these computer programs are back tested, they fail miserably at matching recent high quality temperature series, both in trend, magnitude, and shape.

These climate models are FUBAR, and a scientist with any integrity would divulge this up front. What they are left with is "we have no idea what the climate will be like ten years from now" - but it is likely to be much the same as it is now - yawn! As it was 50 years ago by my limited experience.

44 posted on 12/08/2010 5:15:59 PM PST by GregoryFul (Obama - Jim Jones redux)
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To: Coleus

One of those three protesting climate scientists, Alan Robock, is getting NOAA grants. Don’t stop his gravy train!!!

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:fTAFRaXUOJsJ:www.climate.noaa.gov/index.jsp%3Fpg%3D/cpo_pa/cpo_pa_index.jsp%26pa%3Dcppa%26sub%3Drobock_GC03-393.jsp+%22Alan+Robock%22+grants&cd=5&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

I did not delve into the other two scientests


45 posted on 12/08/2010 5:16:51 PM PST by dennisw (- - - -He who does not economize will have to agonize - - - - - Confucius)
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To: Coleus

Can someone run a search on their political giving...


46 posted on 12/08/2010 5:19:15 PM PST by tubebender (If you can not read, this thread will tell you how to get help)
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To: struggle
“I've heard over 100 different arguments about why we shouldn’t accept global warming. They're all fallacious and I'd be happy to point out the errors in any of them,” said Rutgers professor Alan Robock, a meteorologist.

In 2008, the Farmers Almanac stated that the earth had entered a global cooling period that would probably last decades. The journal based its prediction on sunspot cycles. Said contributing meteorologist Joseph D’Aleo, “Studying these and other factor suggests that cold, not warm, climate may be our future.”
(Joseph D’Aleo is a Certified Consultant meteorologist and co-founder of The Weather Channel. He was chairman of the American Meteorological Society's Committee on Weather Analysis and Forecasting.)

Florida Farmers Assess Freeze Damage

Hey Alan...let's see your record of real life predictions...computer modeling doesn't count.

47 posted on 12/08/2010 5:22:49 PM PST by Tex-Con-Man
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To: struggle

Yeah, they shoulda picked a warmer day...


48 posted on 12/08/2010 5:25:10 PM PST by flowerplough (Pennsylvania today - New New Jersey meets North West Virginia. Or maybe we're North Alabama.)
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To: pburgh01
I'm not sure how useful that analogy is since the few cups of additive in the swimming pool (natural CO2 in the natural atmosphere) make the difference between warm and rather cold (water vapor alone is not going to keep the earth warm).

My preference in those cases is the political argument. Use the swimming pool and show us shrinking our economy when we take out a few cups of water (CO2 is proportional to economic activity). Now show China dumping gallons in (they are building two coal based power plants a week). The science is hopelessly politicized since the government has bought the research results they want (that calls for more government control). So at this point politics should be the preferred mode of argument.

49 posted on 12/08/2010 5:25:35 PM PST by palmer (Cooperating with Obama = helping him extend the depression and implement socialism.)
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To: GregoryFul
These AGW scientists have a theory, CO2 traps infrared on its way back to outer space. So they program computers with this theory, munged up with an extremely poor historic database of world temperature series, and project global warming from this mess

GW from CO2 and increased CO2 is a pretty well-tested theory. The simplest models are just a small slice of atmosphere and the radiation is calculated and more is trapped as more CO2 is added. The models you are talking about are global circulation models that are too coarse (in both time and space) to properly model weather. So they are fed parameters instead of figuring out the weather. But the weather will change with warming (see Eschenbach's writings). Also the models don't consider external influences on weather, like the Russian heat wave caused by blocking which can be caused by our current low solar ultraviolet levels or other solar/celestial factors (the link is imprecise but real and there is no link from CO2 to blocking).

So the models can easily be jiggered (by the parameters) to match whatever temperature series they want, both backwards and forwards. It is simple GIGO.

50 posted on 12/08/2010 5:34:39 PM PST by palmer (Cooperating with Obama = helping him extend the depression and implement socialism.)
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