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Breyer: Founding Fathers Would Have Allowed Restrictions on Guns
Foxnews ^ | Dec 12, 2010 | Foxnews

Posted on 12/12/2010 11:33:59 AM PST by driftdiver

If you look at the values and the historical record, you will see that the Founding Fathers never intended guns to go unregulated, Supreme Court Justice Stephen Breyer contended Sunday.

Appearing on "Fox News Sunday," Breyer said history stands with the dissenters in the court's decision to overturn a Washington, D.C., handgun ban in the 2008 case "D.C. v. Heller."

Breyer wrote the dissent and was joined by Justices John Paul Stevens, David H. Souter and Ruth Bader Ginsburg. He said historians would side with him in the case because they have concluded that Founding Father James Madison was more worried that the Constitution may not be ratified than he was about granting individuals the right to bear arms.

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Front Page News
KEYWORDS: 2ndamendment; banglist; billofrights; davidsouter; johnpaulstevens; partyoftreason; ruthbaderginsburg; scotus; secondamendment; shallnotbeinfringed; stephenbreyer
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He's a Supreme Court Justice and hasn't figured out the govt didn't grant individuals squat.
1 posted on 12/12/2010 11:34:02 AM PST by driftdiver
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To: driftdiver

Well he is old enough to have been there so maybe he did hear them say that. /sarc.


2 posted on 12/12/2010 11:35:30 AM PST by napscoordinator
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To: driftdiver

A doddering old Communist.


3 posted on 12/12/2010 11:36:33 AM PST by screaminsunshine (Americanism vs Communism)
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To: driftdiver

Breyer has just proven the old saying...

“Tis better to remain silent and be thought a fool... than to Speak..and REMOVE ALL DOUBT!!”

absolut MORON


4 posted on 12/12/2010 11:38:39 AM PST by gwilhelm56 (Mr. Al NotSoSharp... your RACE CARD has been Declined...it's Over the LIMIT!!)
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To: driftdiver

That a Supreme Court judge would talk about the Constitution granting rights is just stunning. But sadly, not surprising these days.


5 posted on 12/12/2010 11:38:58 AM PST by Maceman (Obama -- he's as American as nasi goreng)
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To: napscoordinator

For the life of me, I will never understand why people believe that Supreme Court justices are any smarter than the common politician.....


6 posted on 12/12/2010 11:39:31 AM PST by cbkaty (Never yield to force. Never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy---W Churchill)
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To: driftdiver

The only restrictions our Founding Fathers would have placed on guns is Felons...while incarcerated.

If the felony was bad enough (murder) they would have immediately hung the scum and been done with it instead of worrying about their rights later on.


7 posted on 12/12/2010 11:40:00 AM PST by Domandred (Fdisk, format, and reinstall the entire .gov system.)
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To: driftdiver

“liberals” are only ever about liberty when it involves committing atrocities against the innocent.


8 posted on 12/12/2010 11:40:07 AM PST by Soothesayer ("The vile person shall be no more called liberal" Isaiah 32:5-8)
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To: driftdiver

Liberal justices invoking the Founding Fathers? Isn’t that kind of like atheists citing Scripture?


9 posted on 12/12/2010 11:40:07 AM PST by BuckeyeTexan (There are those that break and bend. I'm the other kind.)
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To: driftdiver

Although I would like to take credit for it.
I will coin a phrase used by another freeper today,
“a judge is a lawyer with a robe acting like a socialworker”


10 posted on 12/12/2010 11:40:48 AM PST by ronnie raygun (V)
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To: cbkaty
For the life of me, I will never understand why people believe that Supreme Court justices are any smarter than the common politician.....

Anthony Scalia, Thomas, and Roberts are a few reasons.
11 posted on 12/12/2010 11:42:17 AM PST by Vision ("Did I not say to you that if you would believe, you would see the glory of God?" John 11:40)
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To: driftdiver

Breyer is an over-educated idiot. He has decided that the role of the USSC is to accept the words and opinions of “historians” above the actual words on the Constitution, and rule in favor of the “historians” without regard for the Constitution as written.


12 posted on 12/12/2010 11:43:46 AM PST by savedbygrace (But God.)
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To: ronnie raygun

To quote another freeper today also;Natural causes-and soon.


13 posted on 12/12/2010 11:43:50 AM PST by Farmer Dean (stop worrying about what they want to do to you,start thinking about what you want to do to them)
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To: driftdiver

More damage to the country from the Clinton administration. This man is a dolt.


14 posted on 12/12/2010 11:44:03 AM PST by Lazlo in PA (Now living in a newly minted Red State.)
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To: driftdiver

Breyer is the asshat that almost had his house taken away from him after he ruled that it was fine for towns to steal peoples land away from them. For him to find one view out of hundred of statements made by the founders is foolish. I believe the statement the founders wanted to make WAS the 2nd admendment!


15 posted on 12/12/2010 11:44:12 AM PST by JohnD9207 (John McCain is a proud Ted Kennedy conservative!)
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To: ronnie raygun

A judge is nothing but a lawyer who golfs with politicians.


16 posted on 12/12/2010 11:44:15 AM PST by ex 98C MI Dude (Alea Iacta Est)
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To: driftdiver; screaminsunshine; Maceman

Sweet Merciful Crap! The pure ignorance and arrogance of the man is staggering. It’s quite obvious from the airy-fairy comments he tosses off that he hasn’t spent a single hour studying the history of the 2nd Amendment. He sure doesn’t sound like he ever read The Federalist Papers, that’s for damn sure. His entire attitude is pure self-appointed philosopher-king. “Living Document” all the way.


17 posted on 12/12/2010 11:45:57 AM PST by sinanju
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To: driftdiver

Since they are playing around in the hypothetical and the what-if and the pretend, in my world the Founding Fathers would have lined up every pathetic liberal and shot them in the head, burned their bodies and would have sewn salt on the cursed farms. There is my pretend-like....what a waste....


18 posted on 12/12/2010 11:46:16 AM PST by Doulos1 (Bitter Clinger Forever!)
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To: driftdiver

At the Founding, there were privately owned CANNON that would have cleared out a schoolyard much faster than any AK-47.


19 posted on 12/12/2010 11:48:24 AM PST by PapaBear3625 ("It is only when we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything" -- Fight Club)
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To: driftdiver

How could such an ignoramus get on the Supreme Court?


20 posted on 12/12/2010 11:48:28 AM PST by Recovering_Democrat
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To: driftdiver

It’s because of Supreme Judges such as Breyer that the Founders wrote the 2nd Amendment.


21 posted on 12/12/2010 11:49:05 AM PST by DCPatriot ("It aint what you don't know that kills you. It's what you know that aint so" Theodore Sturgeon))
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To: driftdiver

The scales of liberty are teetering at 5-4 way too often. It would only take one change to tip the other way.


22 posted on 12/12/2010 11:49:47 AM PST by Sender (It's never too late to be who you could have been.)
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To: driftdiver

I like the way Hadley Arkes turns it around, “Why does the government want to restrict my right to protect myself, my children and my family?” Breyer totally rips it out of historical context, as Madison’s contemporaries on the frontier certainly required their guns for protection.


23 posted on 12/12/2010 11:49:52 AM PST by gusopol3
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To: driftdiver; All
"The constitutions of most of our states (and of the United States) assert that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed; that they are entitled to freedom of person, freedom of religion, freedom of property and freedom of the press." Thomas Jefferson
24 posted on 12/12/2010 11:51:00 AM PST by Red in Blue PA (Planning on using 911? Google "Brittany Zimmerman")
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To: driftdiver

They may have until the Bill of Rights came along.


25 posted on 12/12/2010 11:53:36 AM PST by TXConservative25
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To: JohnD9207

I thought that was Souter’s town in New Hampshire that wanted to take away his house...maybe Breyer’s home town tried it on him too.

It sounds like the same selection bias regarding foreign law.


26 posted on 12/12/2010 11:54:30 AM PST by scrabblehack
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To: PapaBear3625

Simple Question:

Was there a Cannon Control Act similar to the Gun Control Act of 68?

Didn’t think so.


27 posted on 12/12/2010 11:55:10 AM PST by Red in Blue PA (Planning on using 911? Google "Brittany Zimmerman")
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To: Sender

Sarah can increase the number and pack the court when we elect her in 2012.


28 posted on 12/12/2010 11:55:29 AM PST by Gadsden1st
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To: JohnD9207

We almost didn’t have a second amendment, because they thought those things were so self evident they didn’t need to be in writing. Thankfully they did write them down.


29 posted on 12/12/2010 11:56:24 AM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: Maceman

What’s far more disturbing is that — excepting most of those here at FR — so few “citizens” even understand that let alone reject it.


30 posted on 12/12/2010 11:58:05 AM PST by Dick Bachert (11/2 was a good start. Onward to '12. U Pubbies be strong or next time we send in the libertarians!)
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To: driftdiver

What an a-hole.

The Constitution is clear, there are no restrictions on guns and there are no restrictions on speech.


31 posted on 12/12/2010 12:00:25 PM PST by trumandogz
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bflr


32 posted on 12/12/2010 12:00:34 PM PST by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
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To: Doulos1
As I once wrote here: "the founding fathers did not sit down to tea with their overlords. they shot them"

Of course the 2nd means exactly what it was intended to mean as written.

33 posted on 12/12/2010 12:05:32 PM PST by bill1952 (Choice is an illusion created between those with power - and those without)
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To: driftdiver
Unethical, incompetent a-hole. Madison was President for eight years, if he wanted to regulate private ownership of arms he had plenty of time to do it. This is intellectually corrupt, just what we have come to expect from Breyer. One of the most despicable arrogant failures in SCOTUS history.
34 posted on 12/12/2010 12:05:43 PM PST by hinckley buzzard
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To: driftdiver
There have been a few Supreme Court justices that were simply not that bright. This is an excellent example. The argument is not only intellectual vapid and demonstrably incorrect, but even if it were correct it still wouldn't change the constitution. Put him in the corner with a dunce cap on.
35 posted on 12/12/2010 12:07:10 PM PST by Durus (The distance between us has grown, and I struggle to quantify it. Windage adjustments are done.)
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To: driftdiver
Breyer is totally IGNANT. James Madison and George Mason were very engaged in the process of getting a federal Bill of Rights.

People who debate the gun issue have been found citing Madison one way, and Mason another way.

Mason, et al, finally voted for the Constitution ONLY after being assured by Madison (etc) that the State's lists of enumerated rights for the people would not be endangered by the absence of a Bill of Rights at the federal level

Breyer takes that as an argument that only the militia rights of the states were at risk of a federal problem. This is "EVASIVE BEHAVIOR" that clearly suggests that he, Breyer, KNOWS he is lying about both Mason and Madison when it comes to the Bill of Rights.

Wouldn't trust that puke near an empty cashregister.

It would be difficult for Breyer to have looked into what Madison and Mason thought about the Bill of Rights without recognizing that for the Founders knowledge of the plight of the Huguenots in France was still important.

Many Americans knew that their own grandparents were Huguenots and that they had refused to surrender their arms at the end of the Religious Wars (in France) and knew that those arms were all that stood between them and a tyrant.

In the end they were correct, which is why the Huguenots had to flee France forever. So, it wasn't concern over "the militia" that was at issue, but "freedom of religion" which had to be understood in America as best protected by private individuals armed to the nines!

Breyer is such a enemy to the American people ~ can we send him back where his kind came from?

36 posted on 12/12/2010 12:08:09 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: driftdiver
Breyer said---

"Do you like to shoot pistols at targets? Well, get on the subway and go to Maryland."

Dear Lord, what an idiot.

By his reasoning, he should ask some law-breakers living in Maryland---Do you like to shoot pistols at people? Well, get on the subway and go to D.C., where if I had my way everyone would be defenseless.

37 posted on 12/12/2010 12:08:20 PM PST by deoetdoctrinae (Gun-Free zones are playgrounds for felons)
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To: Domandred

The Founders placed restrictions on black slaves owning guns.


38 posted on 12/12/2010 12:09:07 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: cbkaty

Bump!


39 posted on 12/12/2010 12:14:00 PM PST by BenLurkin (This post is not a statement of fact. It is merely a personal opinion -- or humor -- or both)
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To: driftdiver

In the matter of the right to keep and bear arms, the relenat question is not what the intent of the Founders was, but rather what was the intent of the author of the 2nd Amendment, and the intent of the States that ratified it.


40 posted on 12/12/2010 12:17:31 PM PST by tacticalogic
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To: driftdiver

He belongs in the proletariate, because he’s the worst type of snob: ignorant, arrogant and incompetant.

The man isn’t even book smart. He’s learned nothing from history or from our Founders. He’s cherry picked to suit his own Marxist “feelings.”


41 posted on 12/12/2010 12:21:17 PM PST by onyx (If you truly support Sarah Palin and want on her busy ping list, let me know!)
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To: trumandogz
The Constitution is clear, there are no restrictions on guns and there are no restrictions on speech.

He apparently has never heard of the Minutemen.

42 posted on 12/12/2010 12:24:53 PM PST by He Rides A White Horse (unite)
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To: bill1952

Very well put.
Merry Christmas.


43 posted on 12/12/2010 12:24:58 PM PST by Doulos1 (Bitter Clinger Forever!)
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To: driftdiver

No. They thought it was a good idea for the citizenry to be armed, especially against powers like him.


44 posted on 12/12/2010 12:32:06 PM PST by madison10
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To: driftdiver

Stevie has been drinking the bong water again.


45 posted on 12/12/2010 12:35:15 PM PST by reg45
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To: driftdiver

...you will see that the Founding Fathers never intended guns to go unregulated...

Cannons were unregulated. You would have thunk that they would have been regulated if anything was.


46 posted on 12/12/2010 12:37:36 PM PST by mountainlion (concerned conservative.)
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To: driftdiver
From my cold dead hands!
47 posted on 12/12/2010 12:41:29 PM PST by DTogo (High time to bring back the Sons of Liberty !!)
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To: driftdiver

The Founding Fathers on the Second Amendment

“I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them.”
George Mason
Co-author of the Second Amendment
during Virginia’s Convention to Ratify the Constitution, 1788

“A militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves …”
Richard Henry Lee
writing in Letters from the Federal Farmer to the Republic, Letter XVIII, May, 1788.

“The people are not to be disarmed of their weapons. They are left in full posession of them.”
Zachariah Johnson
Elliot’s Debates, vol. 3 “The Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution.”

“… the people are confirmed by the next article in their right to keep and bear their private arms”
Philadelphia Federal Gazette
June 18, 1789, Pg. 2, Col. 2
Article on the Bill of Rights

“And that the said Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the Press, or the rights of Conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms; …”
Samuel Adams
quoted in the Philadelphia Independent Gazetteer, August 20, 1789, “Propositions submitted to the Convention of this State”

The Founding Fathers on Arms
“Firearms stand next in importance to the constitution itself. They are the American people’s liberty teeth and keystone under independence … from the hour the Pilgrims landed to the present day, events, occurences and tendencies prove that to ensure peace security and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable … the very atmosphere of firearms anywhere restrains evil interference — they deserve a place of honor with all that’s good.”
George Washington
First President of the United States

“The supposed quietude of a good man allures the ruffian; while on the other hand arms, like laws, discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as property. The same balance would be preserved were all the world destitute of arms, for all would be alike; but since some will not, others dare not lay them aside … Horrid mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of the use of them.”
Thomas Paine

“To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them.”
Richard Henry Lee
American Statesman, 1788

“The great object is that every man be armed.” and “Everyone who is able may have a gun.”
Patrick Henry
American Patriot

“Are we at last brought to such humiliating and debasing degradation, that we cannot be trusted with arms for our defense? Where is the difference between having our arms in possession and under our direction and having them under the management of Congress? If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands?”
Patrick Henry
American Patriot

“Those who hammer their guns into plowshares will plow for those who do not.”
Thomas Jefferson
Third President of the United States

“The constitutions of most of our States assert that all power is inherent in the people; that … it is their right and duty to be at all times armed; … “
Thomas Jefferson
letter to Justice John Cartwright, June 5, 1824. ME 16:45.

“The best we can help for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed.”
Alexander Hamilton
The Federalist Papers at 184-8


48 posted on 12/12/2010 12:43:46 PM PST by SampleMan (If all of the people currently oppressed shared a common geography, bullets would already be flying.)
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To: ExTexasRedhead; Impy; fieldmarshaldj; sionnsar; JulieRNR21

Can you believe that a sitting Supreme Court justice, who is sworn to rule on the Constitution alone, would say such a thing? It calls into questions his very qualification to serve.


49 posted on 12/12/2010 12:48:47 PM PST by Clintonfatigued (Illegal aliens commit crimes that Americans won't commit)
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To: Vision

I agree with you on two of the three and raise you an Alito. Thomas is an idiot and comes off as one whenever he opens his mouth. He was a token pick who would never have been selected were he a white man but tokens can vote and he votes just fine.


50 posted on 12/12/2010 12:49:22 PM PST by DemonDeac
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