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Time Warner Views Netflix as a Fading Star
The New York Times ^ | December 12, 2010 | Tim Arango

Posted on 12/14/2010 6:26:14 AM PST by Gondring

For the past year, executives at big media companies have watched Netflix with growing resentment — for its success in delivering movies and television shows via the Internet, for its stock price nearly quadrupling, for its chief executive being named businessperson of the year by Fortune magazine.

Now many of the companies that make the shows and movies that Netflix delivers to mailboxes, computer screens and televisions — companies whose stocks have not enjoyed the same frothy rise, and whose chief executives have not won the same accolades — are pushing back, arguing that the company is overhyped, and vowing to charge much more to license their content.

“It’s a little bit like, is the Albanian army going to take over the world?” said Jeffrey L. Bewkes, the chief executive of Time Warner, in an interview last week. “I don’t think so.”

[...]

If Netflix is to renew the Starz pact — and thus keep a steady flow of Hollywood movies — it will probably pay many times the current $25 million a year. Richard Greenfield, an analyst at BTIG research, estimated a new deal could cost Netflix more than $250 million a year. Mr. Bewkes suggested a new deal may not be reached, because Netflix’s subscription streaming service, which costs about $8 a month, isn’t high enough for the company to pay top dollar for movies.

[...]

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society
KEYWORDS: cabletv; netflix; reedhastings; tv
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1 posted on 12/14/2010 6:26:16 AM PST by Gondring
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To: Gondring

Netflix relies on poaching assets of other companies. At some point it will end....


2 posted on 12/14/2010 6:28:24 AM PST by misterrob (Thug Life....now showing at a White House near you....)
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To: Gondring
Disruptive technologies are good for consumers, bad for the ruling class.
3 posted on 12/14/2010 6:28:25 AM PST by E. Pluribus Unum (DEFCON I ALERT: The federal cancer has metastasized. All personnel report to their battle stations.)
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To: Gondring

Apparently the US is the only market in which NetFlix delivers movies through the mail. All of their other markets are direct-to-TV downloads.

I wish NetFlix would do away with the mailers and just let us get new movies over the web. Otherwise, my mailers just sit on the counter until one of us goes through the mail.


4 posted on 12/14/2010 6:28:55 AM PST by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: Gondring

I think we like Netflix enough that we would pay more. Especially if it means pi$$ing of Time Warner and their ilk.


5 posted on 12/14/2010 6:29:12 AM PST by Blueflag (Res ipsa loquitur)
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To: Gondring

Go ahead and kill the goose laying the golden eggs Hollywood.

I pay for content now, happily. You make it difficult to live stream movies at a decent price and I will find ways to do it for free.


6 posted on 12/14/2010 6:30:23 AM PST by allmendream (Tea Party did not send the GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism.)
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To: Gondring

When was the last time AOL/Time/Warner got anything right in the past decade or so?


7 posted on 12/14/2010 6:32:40 AM PST by paulycy (Demand Constitutionality. Save America From Bankruptcy.)
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To: misterrob
Netflix relies on poaching assets of other companies. At some point it will end....

How is Netflix any different from a box store with respect to rentals? If Netflix has agreements, and is living up to the agreements, and if it is operating within the law, then what is the issue?

I think Netflix has an excellent business model. Provide the consumer with what he or she wants and sit back and enjoy profits.

How, exactly, are they poaching assets?

8 posted on 12/14/2010 6:32:53 AM PST by IYAS9YAS (Liberalism can be summed up thusly: someone craps their pants and we all have to wear diapers)
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To: Gondring
Netflix probably views Time Warner similarly.

I remember in the early 80s, the president of Sears [then the biggest retailer] gave his view of fledgeling Walmart slowing growing: “Who do they think they are? Sears? hahaha.” A few years later, Walmart grew beyond Sears.

I read a comment recently that Netflix has more subscribers than Time Warner. hmmm.

9 posted on 12/14/2010 6:33:48 AM PST by TomGuy
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To: misterrob
Netflix relies on poaching assets of other companies. At some point it will end....

Yes...it got great deals on initial contracts and has scooped the market, but once those end, the market price point will be higher than now.

10 posted on 12/14/2010 6:34:33 AM PST by Gondring (Paul Revere would have been flamed as a naysayer troll and told to go back to Boston.)
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To: IYAS9YAS
How is Netflix any different from a box store with respect to rentals?

Netflix is making money.

If Netflix has agreements, and is living up to the agreements, and if it is operating within the law, then what is the issue?

Agreements are not forever. They have to be renewed and everyone wants a piece of the pie.

11 posted on 12/14/2010 6:35:15 AM PST by SeeSac
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To: Gondring

Cable Company crybabies.

The only thing worse than calling your cell phone carrier is calling the cable company. They should try focusing on
improving their customer service instead if bitc#ing about their competitors.


12 posted on 12/14/2010 6:35:20 AM PST by NeverForgetBataan (To the German Commander: ..........................NUTS !)
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To: misterrob
Netflix relies on poaching assets of other companies. At some point it will end....

Libraries rely on poaching assets of other companies. At some point they will end....
13 posted on 12/14/2010 6:36:15 AM PST by aruanan
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To: Gondring

Their stock price seems to a little on the exuberant side..

I use Netflix on a Roku device and love it. The Roku also has an Amazon channel which we use on the occasion where we really want to see a specific movie.

One loophole Netflix needs to close is that up to 5 households can share one subscription.


14 posted on 12/14/2010 6:37:49 AM PST by IamConservative (Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day. - Truman)
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To: Gondring

But doesn’t the streaming version of netflix not allow you to view the special features they put on the disks like audio commentaries and deleted scenes? That’s why I still like the mail service.


15 posted on 12/14/2010 6:37:55 AM PST by tellw
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To: paulycy; allmendream
Bingo! (to you both)
16 posted on 12/14/2010 6:39:52 AM PST by Waryone (RINOs, Elites, and Socialists - on the endangered list, soon to become extinct.)
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To: IYAS9YAS
"How, exactly, are they poaching assets?"

I'm sure an Internet Service Provider would have a thing or two to say about that.

17 posted on 12/14/2010 6:40:04 AM PST by KoRn (Department of Homeland Security, Certified - "Right Wing Extremist")
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To: misterrob
Netflix relies on poaching assets of other companies. At some point it will end....

I disagree with your first comment (they're not poaching assets just because they're making bank), and agree with the second (cable companies missed the first streaming boat and are trying to get it back into the harbor so that they can launch theirs). I've never cared for Time Warner, but good gosh I love Netflix.

18 posted on 12/14/2010 6:40:30 AM PST by AnnaZ (I keep 2 magnums in my desk.One's a gun and I keep it loaded.Other's a bottle and it keeps me loaded)
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To: Blueflag
I think we like Netflix enough that we would pay more. Especially if it means pi$$ing of Time Warner and their ilk.

I am of like mind...and very much for the same reasons. I'm at $8 per month now, and would gladly accept a price increase to $12/month. I wonder tho at where my "tipping" point would be with Netflix?? $15/mo? $20/mo? $39.95/mo. When would the cost be "too much to pay"?

At any rate, I will not let my Netflix go until such time as I can obtain cable/satellite service "al a carte". In the meantime, I have my digital "rabbit ears", my 44" HDTV, six free TV channels (for news and such), and Netflix for whatever movies I want to watch.
OK...on occasion I hook up to Hulu for something, but that's pretty rare.

Fie on T/W and their ilk!

19 posted on 12/14/2010 6:41:08 AM PST by Logic n' Reason (You can roll a turd in powered sugar; that don't make it a jelly donut)
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To: misterrob

“Netflix relies on poaching assets of other companies. At some point it will end.... “

Time Warner’s price is too high, and their service sucks eggs through a straw. My son uses the internet for all his content. Hulu, Netflix, etc. He just got a digital antenna for live news.

Time Warner is on thin ice.


20 posted on 12/14/2010 6:44:22 AM PST by brownsfan (D - swift death of the republic, R - lingering death for the republic.)
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To: rarestia
I wish NetFlix would do away with the mailers and just let us get new movies over the web.

Netflix may not do away with DVD mailers for a while, but they are putting major emphasis on growing their streaming movies/TV programs.
21 posted on 12/14/2010 6:48:33 AM PST by TomGuy
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To: Gondring

eztv.it + utorrent + USB ext drive + ( WDTV | popcorn hour ) == no need for cable tv for shows

if you’re looking for sports or news broadcasts, you’re stuck with cable or an antenna


22 posted on 12/14/2010 6:51:52 AM PST by sten
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To: Logic n' Reason

I signed up for Netflix and got the Roku box for streaming in the spring. It is great. I watch it 2-to-1 over cable TV.

And the streams/DVDs — NO COMMERCIALS.

==

Major networks are now trying to get into the streaming. They think they can make $$$. They will, in all probability, eventually drop that, as they will try to go proprietary viewers [meaning download a special program just to watch].

Some networks are already trying to pull back from the streaming services, including Hulu, which, ironically, is owned by a couple of major networks who are stiffling it out of existence.


23 posted on 12/14/2010 6:56:05 AM PST by TomGuy
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To: TomGuy

Another factor is SlingBox.


24 posted on 12/14/2010 6:58:05 AM PST by dfwgator (Welcome to the Gator Nation Will Muschamp)
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To: Gondring

Whatever old men.


25 posted on 12/14/2010 7:01:25 AM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it.)
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To: KoRn
"How, exactly, are they poaching assets?"

I'm sure an Internet Service Provider would have a thing or two to say about that.

lol... you mean like the cable company?

Previous poster had it right... "Cable company crybabies" I quit cable service 2 years ago, and I don't miss it a bit except for fox news. I do however pay the same cable company for internet service... and yes i'm a big fan and customer of Netflix.

If the cable company wants to cry about losing their business to Netflix by making it cost me more, they will only lose more of their own business. Maybe they should take a closer look at their own content. It's not all about price ya know.
26 posted on 12/14/2010 7:06:50 AM PST by Safrguns
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To: Gondring
Yes...it got great deals on initial contracts and has scooped the market, but once those end, the market price point will be higher than now.

Perhaps. Or maybe Netflix will make movie companies compete with each other to get access to its distribution.

27 posted on 12/14/2010 7:08:15 AM PST by PapaBear3625 ("It is only when we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything" -- Fight Club)
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To: misterrob

They recently significantly raised their prices. That’s an indication to me that they see an end to market share growth, and need to increase profits by other means. So maybe their salad days are over.


28 posted on 12/14/2010 7:08:42 AM PST by rightwingcrazy
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To: sten
...if you’re looking for sports or news broadcasts, you’re stuck with cable or an antenna...

www.atdhe.net

29 posted on 12/14/2010 7:10:43 AM PST by FReepaholic (Yoiks...and away!!)
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To: KoRn
I'm sure an Internet Service Provider would have a thing or two to say about that.

How? If the provider provides a service to the customer and the customer downloads gigs of docs for business or pleasure, what's the issue?

If the provider provides unlimited service as a contract to the customer, and the product downloaded by the customer breaks neither the law nor the contract, how is that "poaching"? I notice folks don't scream their heads off at music streaming by radio stations or other sources, but only want to go after Netflix. They don't mention Amazon provides the same service, although not the same amount of content.

Are they somehow different from Hulu, or NBC, or ABC, or Fox, or CBS? They all allow one to stream full episodes of their shows, as do many other networks.

30 posted on 12/14/2010 7:11:47 AM PST by IYAS9YAS (Liberalism can be summed up thusly: someone craps their pants and we all have to wear diapers)
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To: Gondring

You guys are such idiots. You don’t like people counterfeiting your programs and movies but you can’t get your head around the consumer demand and fulfill it.

Consumers want to use all three screens to view entertainment and news. That is the computer screen, TV screen and Cell phone screen. Moreover, they want to use these screens on demand or for time shifting so they can watch programming and movies at their leisure as their time allows.

Netflix and on demand features enable the consumer to control when they watch a particular program or movie but the consumer also demands control over when they watch their favorite “whatever”.

The consumer will push demand for control over when and where they are entertained and they understand technology better than the executives of the large entertainment corporations.

Increasingly the technology to time shift and watch programming when it is convenient or can be schedule around their is becoming easier to acquire and basically a no brainer with nerds writing programs that enable consumers to do such.

We no longer want to sit down on the couch at a particular time, chosen by some executive who is living in the past, a time that relied on selling ad space for time slots.

We will watch your ads even if we couldn’t care less about the product offering. In return we demand the ability to enjoy your products on the medium we choose and the schedule our lives allow.

Make it harder on us and watch your revenues stay flat.

Make it easier for us to enjoy your product on our time, wherever we choose and you will at least see an improvement in revenue, margin and ad rates.


31 posted on 12/14/2010 7:12:55 AM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it.)
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To: TomGuy

We love the Instant Queue, but the title selection leaves a little to be desired. We love being able to catch up on entire seasons of shows, but we’d really like to be able to see the newest releases through the IQ.


32 posted on 12/14/2010 7:13:55 AM PST by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: Logic n' Reason

In the meantime, I have my digital “rabbit ears”, my 44” HDTV, six free TV channels (for news and such), and Netflix for whatever movies I want to watch.
OK...on occasion I hook up to Hulu for something, but that’s pretty rare.


I have a similar setup, and this is why the cable compaines hate streaming over the internet. It has caused people to drop their cable enterly (the cash cow for cable companies). The term is “chord cutters”, and it is a big problem for cable compaines.

When we turned in our cable box recently, there were two people there getting new boxes, and eight people turning in their box. A business can’t survive where you are losing 8 customers for every 2 new customers.

BTW, we use Hulu a lot. Subscribed to Hulu plus (which just went down in price again).

Price wise, I think Netflix could increase their $9 a month fee without much of a hit. When you compare it to the cost of cable TV per month, it is still a great deal.


33 posted on 12/14/2010 7:14:58 AM PST by Brookhaven (Moderates = non-thinkers)
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To: All

Then maybe Time Warner shouldn’t be able to make movies AND have cable.

Cable was supposed to be commercial free paid TV— what happened to that?

Enough already.

I love Netflix but I will drop it if it starts bumping up too much in cost.

We don’t NEED Hollywood but Hollywood does NEED an audience.


34 posted on 12/14/2010 7:17:02 AM PST by Irenic
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To: brownsfan
"Time Warner’s price is too high"..

You got that right! Most subscribers are paying over 100 bucks a month for TV! I know some folks forking out nearly 250 bucks a month for cable. That's a car payment! What a rip-off. The only service Time Warner provides that has value is its High Speed Internet, which is the perfect medium for my viewing needs, at a mere fraction of the cost. The digital cable box is a useless waste of money that will become extinct.

35 posted on 12/14/2010 7:20:51 AM PST by Musketeer
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To: Gondring

I wish NetFlix would do away with the mailers and just let us get new movies over the web.

Netflix is one of the Postal Service’s largest mailers. I am a bulk mailer and have noticed a huge decrease in all mail except for Netflix.


36 posted on 12/14/2010 7:21:15 AM PST by HChampagne (I am not an AARP member and never will be.)
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To: FReepaholic

God bless you for that link!


37 posted on 12/14/2010 7:22:06 AM PST by Safrguns
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To: TomGuy

Some networks are already trying to pull back from the streaming services, including Hulu, which, ironically, is owned by a couple of major networks who are stiffling it out of existence.


Steaming is the future. Networks that don’t get into it big time will be like the old land-line phone companies that didn’t get into cellular early. They’ll end up having to spend big bucks to buy their way in (or be absorbed by another company).

TNT’s is an example of a cable TV channel that is screwing it up big time. They aren’t on Hulu and their internet streaming is a clunky disaster; incredibly hard to use.

I suspect you’ll see several channels/TV-content-providers get together and create an alternative to Hulu (maybe several). Hulu’s model of having advertising during the shows seems like a workable business model. Heck, how many cable TV channels are 100% advertiser supported (they are given to the cable company for free)—lots.


38 posted on 12/14/2010 7:25:24 AM PST by Brookhaven (Moderates = non-thinkers)
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To: Irenic
...too much in cost.

And therein lies the rub....exactly what is the price point that is $0.01 less than "too much"?

Netflix has to peg that exactly...then slowly, over time, with some enhancements, climb toward that point. Also...that point will change over time.

Neat marketing/pricing problem, yes?

39 posted on 12/14/2010 7:27:33 AM PST by Logic n' Reason (You can roll a turd in powered sugar; that don't make it a jelly donut)
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To: rarestia

Unfortunately, rural customers often can’t get movies downloaded. Either their internet is balky and slow, or the universal 5G limits now in place prevent it.


40 posted on 12/14/2010 7:31:19 AM PST by MortMan (To Obama "Kill them all and let [God] sort them out" is an abortion slogan.)
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To: Gondring
>>Time Warner Views Netflix as a Fading Star
 
American On Line Kettle... criticizing Netflix Pot?
 
Maybe AOL is just pissed off because Netflix is evidently successfuly utilizing the AOL marketing strategy; whereas AOL... didn't.
 
Where's the CONTENT, AOL?   FAIL.

41 posted on 12/14/2010 7:37:10 AM PST by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: Gondring

for what other distribution means?

If netflix is the only viable means of distribution (except for the “left over” low end viewers who still depend of broadcast TV schedules for the opiate TV of the masses) how will they distribute?

The only solution would be for those producers to have their own download stream which does not violate netflix patents.


42 posted on 12/14/2010 7:41:48 AM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: PapaBear3625
Yes...it got great deals on initial contracts and has scooped the market, but once those end, the market price point will be higher than now.

Perhaps. Or maybe Netflix will make movie companies compete with each other to get access to its distribution.

Exactly. Content creators (like Paramount) don't care where or how their film is viewed, they just want to make money off the film. The cable company and Netflix are just two different distribution systems for their product.

I wouldn't be surprised to see a "film" version of Hulu pop up either (call it Hulu-Film for now), where Hulu-Film made its money off of monthly subscriber fees, and the film company gets the money from advertisements shown during the film. The more popular a film, the more money the film company makes.

There are several more business models I can think of that make good sense for content providers over the internet.

With the advent of internet ready TVs, the cable companies business model of delivering 100 static channels is just another of history's "buggy whips". Twenty years from now, the idea of having cable TV will be as antiquated as having a land-line phone is today. Your grandma might still have one, but nobody under 30 will.

And that is really what has the cable companies upset. They can see their cash cow (cable TV) fading away, and there isn't anything they can really do about it.

43 posted on 12/14/2010 7:42:46 AM PST by Brookhaven (Moderates = non-thinkers)
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To: Logic n' Reason

And therein lies the rub....exactly what is the price point that is $0.01 less than “too much”?
********************************************
We had the the 3 DVD’s out/unlimited for 16.99.

Price went up so we’ve switched to 2 DVD out/unlimited for 14.99.

We won’t pay 15 a month for 1 DVD.

I think the 16.99 was/is our limit, we will only step it back from there, until it’s no longer ‘worth it’ to us.


44 posted on 12/14/2010 7:43:55 AM PST by Irenic
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To: Gondring

Netflix streaming service is worth, IMO, 5X as much as typical cable and costs one-fourth as much. They could stand to increase their prices quite a lot.

I have watched 5 years worth of Bones, 4 years of Psych, 5 years of Lost, 6 years of The Dead Zone, etc., all at my own pace & convenience.


45 posted on 12/14/2010 7:56:15 AM PST by Sloth (If a tax cut constitutes "spending" then every time I don't rob a bank should count as a "desposit.")
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To: Irenic

I think the 16.99 was/is our limit, we will only step it back from there, until it’s no longer ‘worth it’ to us.


Cable companies faced the same dilemma back in the day. Their solution: allow advertising. Unfortunatly, they had no way to filter out advertising for coustomers that didn’t want it.

Netflix does. They could have a “standard” price that includes advertising during the shows, and a “premium” price that delivers the shows without advertising.

People like you, that won’t go beyond a certain price point, could choose the standard packgage and live with the advertising.

People that didn’t want the ads could pay a little more each month to eliminate them.

Anyway, I expect some competition to Netflix to emerge eventually. At the moment they have the market to themselves, but you know that can’t last forever. Hulu seems the closest thing, but they seem to target a different audience.

The barriers to competiton on the internet are lower than they are for cable. Competition will eventually come and push prices down.


46 posted on 12/14/2010 7:59:56 AM PST by Brookhaven (Moderates = non-thinkers)
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To: Gondring

You don’t charge more to a “fading star”, they see it as a threat.


47 posted on 12/14/2010 8:01:27 AM PST by discostu (Keyser Soze lives)
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To: rarestia

You can change your netflix subscription to download only.


48 posted on 12/14/2010 8:02:23 AM PST by discostu (Keyser Soze lives)
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To: discostu

Yes, but you can’t get new releases. I get BluRay through the mail. They don’t have the same titles in BR that they do on the Instant Queue. BluRay is an extra $2 a month.


49 posted on 12/14/2010 8:04:48 AM PST by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: rarestia

Then apparently you don’t want them to get rid of the mailers. I prefer the mailers to download, I’m still a physical object guy.


50 posted on 12/14/2010 8:09:12 AM PST by discostu (Keyser Soze lives)
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