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Declare ethanol a failure
Scripps Howard News Service ^ | Dec. 14, 2010 | Dale McFeatters

Posted on 12/15/2010 7:32:27 AM PST by george76

We've tried the ethanol experiment, and it's failed.

Ethanol hasn't significantly affected our dependence on imported oil, nor has it significantly cut carbon emissions. It has, however, cost taxpayers a bundle, including raising food prices.

Corn-based ethanol is uneconomic as a fuel, especially compared with gasoline and diesel. Ethanol requires mandates to make motorists use it and a generous subsidy of 45 cents a gallon to get refiners to produce it.

Even if ethanol were a solution to any of our energy problems — and it's not — ethanol can be produced cheaper in countries like Brazil with abundant sugar cane. But to protect the domestic industry from competition, that government imposes a 54 percent-per-gallon tariff on ethanol imports.

There is still time to block the extension.

(Excerpt) Read more at deseretnews.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Editorial; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; US: Georgia; US: Illinois; US: Iowa; US: Nebraska
KEYWORDS: corn; energy; ethanol; foodprices; oil; taxpayers
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1 posted on 12/15/2010 7:32:32 AM PST by george76
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To: george76

Be sure and apply for your check from the oil industry.


2 posted on 12/15/2010 7:39:05 AM PST by hgro (Jerry Riversdun)
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To: hgro

If you guys out in Iowa and Nebraska want to take the Saudis down a few pegs by producing cheap, abundant Ethanol fuel, go ahead and knock yourselves out.

The three-decade lab experiment thusfar has concluded that you just can’t do it without massive taxpayer subsidies.


3 posted on 12/15/2010 7:43:24 AM PST by Buckeye McFrog
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To: hgro
Brazil ended subsidies for ethanol over ten years ago and eliminated its ethanol tariff early this year. The U.S. should reciprocate.

The ethanol tax credit alone costs American taxpayers over $6 billion per year.

4 posted on 12/15/2010 7:50:04 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: george76
I just sent this note to John Boehner's office:

Dear Sir,

If you believe in free markets and cutting government spending, consider this:

Ethanol hasn't significantly affected our dependence on imported oil, nor has it significantly cut carbon emissions. It has, however, cost taxpayers a bundle, including raising food prices.

Corn-based ethanol is uneconomic as a fuel, especially compared with gasoline and diesel. Ethanol requires mandates to make motorists use it and a generous subsidy of 45 cents a gallon to get refiners to produce it.

The subsidy to 2015 will cost taxpayers nearly $5 billion.

What are Republicans going to do about this?

Regards,

5 posted on 12/15/2010 7:52:51 AM PST by Cobra64
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To: hgro

Have you already cashed your check from Archer Daniels Midland?

End the subsidies. Enough already.


6 posted on 12/15/2010 7:56:30 AM PST by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: Buckeye McFrog

Ethanol produces more CO2 gases per BTU when burned than gasoline. It also takes more carbon-based fuel to produce it than can be recovered from it. It’s not a viable alternative to fossil fuels. It’s also corrosive and requires modifications to gas-burning fuels in order to use it. It isn’t as efficient as gasoline - you need more of it to go the same distance. It raises the cost of food and costs the taxpayers money. It’s a scam to funnel taxpayer money to Midwestern politicians.


7 posted on 12/15/2010 7:57:21 AM PST by mbynack (Retired USAF SMSgt)
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To: george76

I sure wish they would get it out of the gas in Florida. It ruins outboards.


8 posted on 12/15/2010 7:57:37 AM PST by screaminsunshine (Americanism vs Communism)
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To: Cobra64

I just sent it to DeMint’s office.


9 posted on 12/15/2010 7:59:20 AM PST by Cobra64
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To: Cobra64

Dear Sir,

Unfortunately due to many votes in the Corn Belt we can not do anything about this at this time. Sorry about that and I had a good cry over it if it makes you feel any better. Don’t forget to vote Republican.

Sadly,

John


10 posted on 12/15/2010 8:00:26 AM PST by screaminsunshine (Americanism vs Communism)
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To: screaminsunshine
Very true.

and making ethanol from corn requires 29 percent more fossil energy than the ethanol fuel itself actually contains.

11 posted on 12/15/2010 8:01:08 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: screaminsunshine

LOL. Nice!


12 posted on 12/15/2010 8:06:22 AM PST by Attention Surplus Disorder ("Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit smoking" - Barack Hussein Obama)
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To: Cobra64

corn ethanol uses tons of water ( a big problem in many states ) and removes corn from the food supply, thus creating higher food prices.


13 posted on 12/15/2010 8:07:02 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: hgro
ethanol uses more energy than it makes
14 posted on 12/15/2010 8:09:32 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: Cobra64

I’ll bet the only response you get is a solicitation for money to put more “conservatives” in office in 2012.


15 posted on 12/15/2010 8:13:23 AM PST by madprof98 ("moritur et ridet" - salvianus)
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To: screaminsunshine
Sad, but most likely true. What a shame there's little Conservative spine.

DeMint, Pence, Ryan, and "the twins" (Palin/Bachmann) exhibit the most Conservative spine.

16 posted on 12/15/2010 8:15:37 AM PST by Cobra64
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To: george76

Failure my ass. Do you know how many tax dollars are funneled to Agri-Business for that crap? Trust me, it’s a resounding success.


17 posted on 12/15/2010 8:16:46 AM PST by Wolfie
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To: hgro

Oil companies are invested in ethanol. They know a money making scam when they see it.


18 posted on 12/15/2010 8:36:21 AM PST by Cold Heart
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To: george76

It is more efficent to fuel a horse with corn than convert to ethanol.


19 posted on 12/15/2010 8:40:50 AM PST by oyez (The difference in genius and stupidity is that genius has limits.)
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To: screaminsunshine
That's some honkin' funny stuff right there, yessir!

LOL...... and thanks.

20 posted on 12/15/2010 9:49:59 AM PST by willgolfforfood
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To: george76
The water claimed to be used by ethanol is commonly known as "rain" and the corn applied as ethanol feedstock is not otherwise available as human food.

That being said, subsidies or special tax breaks for any industry, ethanol and oil industries included, are a bad idea.

21 posted on 12/15/2010 9:57:22 AM PST by Mr. Lucky
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To: george76

Subsidy of 45 cents a gallon to get refiners to produce it.
Any questions about the IQ of a congressperson.


22 posted on 12/15/2010 10:01:09 AM PST by Vaduz
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To: oyez
It is more efficent to fuel a horse with corn than convert to ethanol.

Washington Roebling, at the dedication to the Brooklyn Bridge, compared its construction to the pyramids. The Egyptians, he explained, put a few grains of rice in the bellies of some Hebrews, while we used coal to power steam engines. Thus, the Egyptians used the sun's energy more efficiently than us.

23 posted on 12/15/2010 10:02:27 AM PST by Lonesome in Massachussets (Socialists are to economics what circle squarers are to math; undaunted by reason or derision.)
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To: george76
You might want to Google on something to the effect of “Pimentel Debunked” if you're seriously interested in the energy consumed by the production of a corn crop.
24 posted on 12/15/2010 10:03:49 AM PST by Mr. Lucky
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To: Mr. Lucky

West of the Mississippi River does always get enough rain.

Thus many large —expensive—water storage projects.

Hence the old west sayings


25 posted on 12/15/2010 10:07:35 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: Mr. Lucky

Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn Does.

the corn-based ethanol lobbyists and politicians are pushing for high tarriffs to keep Brazilian ethanol out. That further increases the price at the retail pump level.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=grass-makes-better-ethanol-than-corn

Livestock eat corn. If corn price go up, then meat prices will go up, too.


26 posted on 12/15/2010 10:24:33 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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West of the Mississippi River does NOT always get enough rain.
27 posted on 12/15/2010 10:26:46 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: screaminsunshine
I sure wish they would get it out of the gas in Florida. It ruins outboards.

It also ruins the fuel systems in cars with carburetors and to a degree fuel injectors. (the alcohol attacks the rubber parts)
28 posted on 12/15/2010 10:33:34 AM PST by Foolsgold (L I B Lacking in Brains)
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To: george76

Livestock also eat distillers dried grain and digest it far more efficiently than whole corn.


29 posted on 12/15/2010 10:38:08 AM PST by Mr. Lucky
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To: george76

Only about 16% of the US corn crop is irrigated and almost no irrigated corn is used as ethanol feed stock.


30 posted on 12/15/2010 10:40:21 AM PST by Mr. Lucky
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To: Vaduz
Any questions about the IQ of a congressperson.

According to Dick Morris, about 10% of the money in these earmarks is returned to the politician in the form of campaign contributions. In most places this is called a kickback. Sometimes it's called money laundering. But in Congress it's business as usual.

31 posted on 12/15/2010 11:05:03 AM PST by mbynack (Retired USAF SMSgt)
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To: Mr. Lucky
The water claimed to be used by ethanol is commonly known as "rain" and the corn applied as ethanol feedstock is not otherwise available as human food.

The argument is that the land used to cultivate this corn had been used to produce food prior to the subsidies.

32 posted on 12/15/2010 11:08:16 AM PST by mbynack (Retired USAF SMSgt)
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To: hgro
Be sure and apply for your check from the oil industry.

Anybody with the scantest amount of common sense knows you don't have to subsidize something that is a good product.

Using a base food staple as an engine fuel is dumb, forcing the taxpayers to pay for it is stupid.
33 posted on 12/15/2010 11:11:54 AM PST by wasp69 (space for rent)
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To: screaminsunshine

Check out http://www.pure-gas.org.

Non-ethanol gas is called “recreational gas,” and many marinas and gas stations sell it. Perhaps there is one near you.

I use recreational gas in my 1990 Airstream motor home and my 1991 Cadillac whenever I can — both run better, get better gas mileage. And, in my own small way, I’m sticking it to the environmental whackos when I use it.


34 posted on 12/15/2010 11:53:47 AM PST by Taxman (So that the beautiful pressure does not diminish!)
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To: mbynack
By that argument, removal of any land from vegetable production somehow consumes huge volumes of water.
35 posted on 12/15/2010 11:55:03 AM PST by Mr. Lucky
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To: Mr. Lucky

It’s time to re-think corn irrigation.

corn farmer... in the 1950s when Georgia farmers averaged 25 bushels per acre...

the times and technology have changed. Georgia averaged 130 bushels per acre in 2007, and...there are other reasons, including improved hybrids, better fertilization, improved weed control, and other factors for Georgia’s better corn yields.

Irrigation requires a relatively high investment in equipment, fuel, maintenance and labor, but it offers a significant potential for increasing net farm income. Frequency and timing of water application have a major impact on yields and operating costs.

http://southeastfarmpress.com/its-time-re-think-corn-irrigation


36 posted on 12/15/2010 12:40:32 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: BikerTrash; Carry_Okie; jazusamo; familyop; GladesGuru

Ethanol is made mostly from corn in the United States, and more than one-third of the country’s corn crop goes into making it, said Professor Lee Meyer, from the UK College of Agriculture’s Department of Agricultural Economics.

The U.S. Department of Agriculture projects a greater percentage of the corn crop will go toward ethanol production in the next few years.

“Though corn production is on an upward trend, production has not increased nearly as quickly as the use of corn for fuel,” Meyer said. “Something has to give. That means less corn is going to be used for feeding livestock.”

Corn is the primary feed for chicken and hogs, and it is often used for the last stage of feeding cattle. Its price has increased by approximately 40 percent in 2010.

http://southeastfarmpress.com/grains/corn-common-denominator-fuel-meat-prices

What is missing ? Thanks


37 posted on 12/15/2010 12:50:22 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: george76

Irrigation in a humid state such as Georgia doesn’t deplete water resources. Georgia cropland averages well over a million gallons of rainfall per acre per year.


38 posted on 12/15/2010 12:57:51 PM PST by Mr. Lucky
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To: george76
The US corn crop has increased from 6.5 Billion bushels per year to over 13 Billion bushels per year since 1980. In 2010, ethanol is expected to require a little over 4 Billion bushels of corn, leaving 9 Billion bushels of raw corn for other uses. In addition to this corn, the dry milling process will leave 72 Billion pounds of distillers grain which makes an excellent high protein livestock ration.
39 posted on 12/15/2010 1:22:59 PM PST by Mr. Lucky
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Measuring Corn Ethanol's Thirst for Water Total water requirements for the irrigation and conversion of one liter of ethanol by state, as well as the total water used in ethanol production by state. Credit: Environmental Science and Technology
40 posted on 12/15/2010 2:01:54 PM PST by anglian
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To: george76

Posted at The Oil Drum November 29, 2007 - “The National Academy of Sciences has published a report titled “Water Implications of Biofuel Production in the United States”. The paper outlines impacts and limitations on both water availability and water quality that would follow the pursuit of a national strategy to replace liquid fossil fuels with those made from biomass.” COMMITTEE ON WATER IMPLICATIONS OF BIOFUELS PRODUCTION IN THE UNITED STATES http://www.theoildrum.com/node/3285


41 posted on 12/15/2010 2:19:22 PM PST by anglian
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To: anglian

Thank you


42 posted on 12/15/2010 3:13:23 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: george76
Thank the ethanol producers for your $3.50 loaf of bread, $5 gallon of milk, and practically every other commercially produced food product that contains flour and/or corn sugar or is derived from domestic farm animals. Very few prepared food or drink products are free of corn derivatives, and even some plastics are partially composed of chemicals derived from corn. The price of meat and poultry products are also greatly influenced by corn prices since corn is one of the basic ingredients in commercial animal feed.

Add the dollars your government uses to subsidize the unprofitable ethanol industry and you have a huge pile of taxpayer $ being misspent primarily to keep the Gorons and other Greenies happy and voting for "progressives".

43 posted on 12/15/2010 3:46:12 PM PST by epow ( A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger. Proverbs 15:1)
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To: epow

Even Al Gore recently said that ethanol was a mistake.


44 posted on 12/15/2010 3:55:13 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: Mr. Lucky
The water claimed to be used by ethanol is commonly known as "rain"....

True enough, but "rain" water is essential to agriculture and often in short supply in many parts of our corn farming areas. As I'm sure you know, the aquifers that underlie many large swaths of prime US agricultural regions are in serious danger of depletion, so "rain" water isn't anything to be wasted by supplying an inefficient, taxpayer subsidized industry such as ethanol production. Affordable food and fiber are far more important products than subsidized gas-ahol that only a relative handful of far-left Green fanatics want to force on the rest of us.

45 posted on 12/15/2010 4:16:48 PM PST by epow ( A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger. Proverbs 15:1)
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To: Mr. Lucky

“The water claimed to be used by ethanol is commonly known as “rain””
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Look at South Carolina on the map, notice the lakes, rivers and swamps, read the annual rainfall figures. Corn growers, even here, use a lot of irrigation pumps. One old gent that I see in church on Sundays has run a big farming operation in Darlington county for almost his entire adult life. He tells me there is little point in planting corn, even sweet corn in the garden unless you are prepared to water it. The annual rainfall may be plenty for corn but there is usually a dry spell that lasts for several weeks right at the time the corn needs it most and should be getting two or more inches of water a WEEK for maximum production. As school children we used to recite, “April showers bring May flowers”, nowadays the month of April is often bone dry here. It is not unusual to have very little rainfall from early April until late May or even longer. This is when corn needs a lot of water.


46 posted on 12/15/2010 6:24:52 PM PST by RipSawyer
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To: Cobra64

Excellent.


47 posted on 12/15/2010 7:34:07 PM PST by 1010RD (First Do No Harm)
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To: george76
Even Al Gore recently said that ethanol was a mistake.

Yep, as my old grandpa used to say, even a blind hog finds an acorn now and then, and Algore appears to have found one.

Speaking of hogs, I can't think of a blinder 2-legged hog than Algore. Even his recently expanded waistline and drooping jowls remind me of a fat-jowled brood sow slurping up Grandma's kitchen slop and dishwater back on the old farm.

48 posted on 12/15/2010 9:49:44 PM PST by epow ( A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger. Proverbs 15:1)
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To: mbynack
In most places this is called a kickback. Sometimes it's called money laundering. But in Congress it's business as usual.

Spiro T. Agnew was run out of office for one instance of that.

49 posted on 12/16/2010 8:33:40 AM PST by thulldud (Is it "alter or abolish" time yet?)
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To: mbynack

You can never trust a hack we can only keep voting them out of office,waiting for 2012.


50 posted on 12/16/2010 10:56:23 AM PST by Vaduz
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