Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Europe starts confiscating private pension funds
washington examiner ^ | 1/3/11 | Mark Hemingway

Posted on 01/03/2011 3:09:10 PM PST by Nachum

The U.S. isn't the only place that's facing a major pension fund crisis. The Christian Science Monitor has this alarming report:

People’s retirement savings are a convenient source of revenue for governments that don’t want to reduce spending or make privatizations. As most pension schemes in Europe are organised by the state, European ministers of finance have a facilitated access to the savings accumulated there, and it is only logical that they try to get a hold of this money for their own ends. In recent weeks I have noted five such attempts: Three situations concern private personal savings; two others refer to national funds.

The most striking example is Hungary, where last month the government made the citizens an offer they could not refuse. They could either remit their individual retirement savings to the state, or lose the right to the basic state pension (but still have an obligation to pay contributions for it). In this extortionate way, the government wants to gain control over $14bn of individual retirement savings.

The article goes on to detail other pension grabs in Bulgaria, Poland, France and Ireland. Obviously, this is a cautionary tale for America. If fiscal austerity becomes a real issue in the U.S. the way that it's been reaching critical mass in Europe -- don't think that U.S. lawmakers regard your either your personal wealth or money they might owe you as sacrosanct. Government has a habit of looking out for itself.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Foreign Affairs; Government
KEYWORDS: 201101; 401k; confiscating; europe; private; propertyrights; starts; theft

1 posted on 01/03/2011 3:09:18 PM PST by Nachum
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Nachum

So what should we do? Pull the 401k?


2 posted on 01/03/2011 3:12:48 PM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

Most of Europe aren’t democracies, and they certainly are not Republics governed by the rule of law. The UK is the closest it comes, but even they don’t seem to care any longer.

They can all go to hell.


3 posted on 01/03/2011 3:12:57 PM PST by PGR88
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

Well, this is good news for Swiss bankers.


4 posted on 01/03/2011 3:13:38 PM PST by americanophile
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: redgolum

Gold and Silver are the last refuge.


5 posted on 01/03/2011 3:15:30 PM PST by Nachum (The complete Obama list at www.nachumlist.com)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

When the government takes private property it take away your freedom. As the state motto of NH says, “Live Free or Die”.


6 posted on 01/03/2011 3:15:50 PM PST by pleikumud
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

So what should we do? Pull the 401k?


7 posted on 01/03/2011 3:17:44 PM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: PGR88
Have you noticed just how much President Obama pays attention to any law?
8 posted on 01/03/2011 3:18:25 PM PST by ANGGAPO (Layte Gulf Beach Club)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

There was a Harvard prof who was advocating this about a year ago. Mark Levin interviewed her. I’m sure it’s archived.


9 posted on 01/03/2011 3:22:44 PM PST by FrdmLvr (Death to tyrants)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum
Its criminal & pathetic that the govt that is supposed to protect the people now becomes the very criminals that are creating the suffering and robbing the people.

The problem of all govt's is that they eventually become corrupt, and see the people who they are supposed to serve & protect as an infinite source of taxable revenue.

10 posted on 01/03/2011 3:22:48 PM PST by prophetic (0Bama = 1 illegal president = 32 illegal, unconstitutional & unnecessary CZARS to do his job!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum
The most striking example is Hungary, where last month the government made the citizens an offer they could not refuse. They could either remit their individual retirement savings to the state, or lose the right to the basic state pension (but still have an obligation to pay contributions for it). In this extortionate way, the government wants to gain control over $14bn of individual retirement savings.

And the Hungarian pussies haven't started an armed revolution because???

11 posted on 01/03/2011 3:24:08 PM PST by E. Pluribus Unum (DEFCON I ALERT: The federal cancer has metastasized. All personnel report to their battle stations.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum
They could either remit their individual retirement savings to the state, or lose the right to the basic state pension (but still have an obligation to pay contributions for it). In this extortionate way, the government wants to gain control over $14bn of individual retirement savings.

little fish become fish food for big fish when the fish flakes run out. luckily that could never happen here.

12 posted on 01/03/2011 3:24:21 PM PST by RC one (WHAT!!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

What???????????????????


13 posted on 01/03/2011 3:24:54 PM PST by CPT Clay (Pick up your weapon and follow me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

There’s been some talk about doing it here, with the 401Ks.


14 posted on 01/03/2011 3:27:15 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: E. Pluribus Unum
And the Hungarian pussies haven't started an armed revolution because???

Hungary needs the Spirit of '56.

15 posted on 01/03/2011 3:28:00 PM PST by dfwgator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

Which can be taken by Fedgov Fiat. Happend in the 30’s.


16 posted on 01/03/2011 3:28:00 PM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

This is step one. It will come to America.

Step 2 is tried and true: simply force the rich to give all their money to the state in their wills for lavish public projects. Nero did it (and then killed the rich when they didn’t die fast enough) and Justinian did it, although he put up the pretense of legality by having them amend their wills to give him all their money upon death.

The bottom line is that any time there is a pot of money anywhere, some politician will try to get his hands on it.


17 posted on 01/03/2011 3:29:20 PM PST by Opinionated Blowhard
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

At some point for many there will be nothing left to lose.


18 posted on 01/03/2011 3:33:09 PM PST by printhead
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Opinionated Blowhard

Step 2 = 0 care?

Said hands need to be chopped off either figuratively and/or literally. The one good idea of the muslims is cutting off the hand of a thief.


19 posted on 01/03/2011 3:33:35 PM PST by wally_bert (It's sheer elegance in its simplicity! - The Middleman)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: redgolum

Many used to keep money in the form of Gems too. They are small, easily hidden, and transportable.


20 posted on 01/03/2011 3:34:47 PM PST by Nachum (The complete Obama list at www.nachumlist.com)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: pleikumud
When the government takes private property it take away your freedom

The government is taking the clear position that tax-deferred accounts do not belong to the individual account holder until the taxes are paid. So in their view, private property rights do not enter into the discussion.

21 posted on 01/03/2011 3:37:43 PM PST by Mr. Jeeves ( "The right to offend is far more important than any right not to be offended." - Rowan Atkinson)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

They did that in Argentina a couple of years ago... my friends down there were not happy about that.


22 posted on 01/03/2011 3:39:07 PM PST by Cementjungle
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: E. Pluribus Unum

“And the Hungarian pussies haven’t started an armed revolution because???”

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Because they aren’t armed. We are. They can only do this if they disarm us first, and it ain’t gonna happen.

They’ll take our wealth through taxes and devaluation, not outright confiscation, and even those indirect methods will only be tolerated so far.


23 posted on 01/03/2011 3:41:52 PM PST by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: PGR88
Most of Europe aren't’t democracies, and they certainly are not Republics governed by the rule of law

Neither is or does the US of A anymore. When Bill Clinton was president he voiced the idea of the government confiscating pension funds because the government could make better use of the available cash. Instead, the Fed just started printing more currency. Under Obozo we are emulating European stile government which spells FAILURE for us also so when our gov goes broke (which it will) it to will try to confiscate pension funds from us.

24 posted on 01/03/2011 3:43:44 PM PST by drypowder
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Opinionated Blowhard
"It will come to America."

Democrats target your 401(k)
25 posted on 01/03/2011 3:57:49 PM PST by chickadee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

started hearing talk about this now going on 3yrs.People I know say,”it won’t happen here”.I am not so sure about that.


26 posted on 01/03/2011 3:59:57 PM PST by peteyd (A dog may bite you in the ass,but it will never stab you in the back.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum
It certainly shows how it may unfold.

Turn over your 401k to us or forfeit your Social Security and Medicare.

A scary prospect.

27 posted on 01/03/2011 4:02:49 PM PST by nascarnation
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

When this is attempted here, it’s time to teach these bastards that actions have consequences. It will be time to start killin’. That’s the only way the bastards will learn. It will take a few, but they’ll get the message. And, being the pussies that our washington reps are, they’ll back down. There’s nothing more important to them than their own interests.


28 posted on 01/03/2011 4:08:34 PM PST by jrg
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum
where...

Where will we draw the line?

When will we say enough??

What will finally provoke spontaneous direction action???

29 posted on 01/03/2011 4:08:37 PM PST by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

http://nupn.com/

$32billion in unclaimed bank accounts - which is probably a low estimate.

Watch for the FED to issue a new regulation that unclaimed funds will be confiscated after a time certain. Any subsequent estate claims will be subject to 95% delinquent tax!!!


30 posted on 01/03/2011 4:21:48 PM PST by sodpoodle (Despair; man's surrender. Laughter; God 's redemption.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Chode
Where will we draw the line? When will we say enough?? What will finally provoke spontaneous direction action???

Rysard Kapuscinski wrote in The Shah of Shahs: "All books about all revolutions begin with a chapter that describes the decay of tottering authority or the misery and sufferings of the people. They should begin with a psychological chapter, one that shows how a harassed, terrified man suddenly breaks his terror, stops being afraid. This unusual process, sometimes accomplished in an instant like a shock or a lustration, demands illuminating. Man gets rid of fear and feels free. Without that there would be no revolution." (Quoted in the Wall Street Journal, 7/2/2009, p. A13)

The question, then, is when do we stop being afraid to take action? And to borrow from an old children's tale, who will bell the cat?

31 posted on 01/03/2011 4:26:57 PM PST by JoeFromSidney
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: redgolum
So what should we do? Pull the 401k?

Convert the 401K to an individual IRA.
The 401K requires the permission of the gov. By the time you find out that they are taking them it will be too late to get the money out.
Roll it to an individual IRA now before their plans get any further. They may try and get the IRA's as well but you can withdraw your IRA in a day or less (with penalty and taxes due) but at least it's mostly yours.

32 posted on 01/03/2011 4:45:44 PM PST by Politically Correct (A member of the rabble in good standing)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: nascarnation

Molon labe.


33 posted on 01/03/2011 4:56:48 PM PST by MeganC (January 20, 2013 - President Sarah Palin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Nachum
Politicians have been salivating to get their hands on this pot of money since 1993.

You can begin to withdraw penalty-free at age 59 1/2. My hubby and I are doing that....beginning gradually to get our money under our control. It gives me cold chills to think about our retirement cushion, such as it is, sitting there all fat and juicy for the politicians to confiscate.

The quicker we get it in hour hands and away from the tax man the better I'll feel.

34 posted on 01/03/2011 4:58:42 PM PST by WarEagle (Can America survive a President named Hussein?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: JoeFromSidney
it's been said America Is At That Awkward Stage Where It's Too Late To Work Within The System, But Still Too Early To Start Slitting Throats...

i'm not so sure anymore

35 posted on 01/03/2011 5:06:17 PM PST by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Opinionated Blowhard

“The bottom line is that any time there is a pot of money anywhere, some politician will try to get his hands on it.”

Said politician is flirting with disaster.


36 posted on 01/03/2011 5:13:29 PM PST by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: dagogo redux

If only that terrible fishing accident hadn’t happened. I hate to think of all my guns sitting at the bottom of Lake Ontario. Or maybe it was Falcon Dam. I’m pretty old so my memory is pretty bad.


37 posted on 01/03/2011 5:21:14 PM PST by Brucifer (Proud member of the Double Secret Reloading Underground.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: FrdmLvr

Google “teresa ghilarducci”, one of Obama’s advisors on the subject. Ms. seize and redistribute herself.


38 posted on 01/03/2011 5:40:12 PM PST by SueRae (I can see November 2012 from my HOUSE!!!!!!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

Obama plan was or is to force anyone with a 401K to allocate part of that money to purchase U.S. Bonds.


39 posted on 01/03/2011 5:46:19 PM PST by steveab (When was the last time someone tried to sell you a CO2 induced climate control system for your home?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SueRae

Thank you, SueRae. The name of this woman who wants to grab your savings is Teresa Ghilrducci and she’s with some institution called “Schwartz Center for Economic Policy Analysis” (SCEPA) What she’s proposing is that the government take over your 401k, your PRIVATE retirement savings, by having you turn it over to the government, then the government will GUARANTEE you have a stipend in your old age, called a GRA, a Guaranteed Retirement Account.

http://www.newschool.edu/nssr/news.aspx?id=18826


40 posted on 01/03/2011 6:25:17 PM PST by FrdmLvr (Death to tyrants)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: Politically Correct

Part of my problem is that if I pull the 401K, I loose some of what the company matched.


41 posted on 01/03/2011 6:35:10 PM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: FrdmLvr

Ghilarducci

401(k) Foe Teresa Ghilarducci, the Most Dangerous Woman in America

http://money.usnews.com/money/blogs/capital-commerce/2008/10/29/401k-foe-teresa-ghilarducci-the-most-dangerous-woman-in-america.html

Ghilarducci interviewed on plan to socialize 401(k) plans (instant Mark Levin classic)

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2117260/posts


42 posted on 01/03/2011 8:52:45 PM PST by FromLori (FromLori">)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: FromLori

“Hmmmm” Bookmark


43 posted on 01/03/2011 11:22:53 PM PST by Publius6961 ("In 1964 the War on Poverty Began --- Poverty won.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson