Posted on 01/15/2011 2:24:43 PM PST by BigReb555
Wiki sez:
The proclamation did not cover the 800,000 slaves in the slave-holding border states of Missouri, Kentucky, West
Virginia, Maryland or Delaware, which were Union states; slaves there were freed by separate state and federal actions.
The state of Tennessee had already mostly returned to Union control, so it also was not named and was exempted.
Virginia was named, but exemptions were specified for the 48 counties that were in the process of forming West Virginia, as well as seven other named counties and two cities.
Also specifically exempted were New Orleans and 13 named parishes of Louisiana, all of which were also already mostly under Federal control at the time of the Proclamation.
I rather suspect that this was not the cause of Lee's delay; rather, until the victory at Fredericksburg had knocked the Army of the Potomac back on its heels for a few months, General Lee had bigger fish to fry than dealing with his Father-in-Law's final wishes.
I only wanted to point out that Lee was neither a cruel plantation owner, nor a pro-manumition humanitarian. He was a career military man.
The Rev Ralph David Abernathy should be honored on MLK day not MLK.
MLK was “caught in the act” by MLK closest friend Ralph Abernathy, King’s hand-picked successor as president of S.C.L.C. from 1968 to 1976
AND THE WALLS CAME TUMBLING DOWN An Autobiography. By Ralph David Abernathy exposes MLK.
The state run media has built walls around MLK and the truth about MLK. Ralph Abernathy knew who MLK was and what he did. Abernathy exposed MLK.
Mr. Abernathy’s provided a detailed description of his friend’s last evening and early morning where MLK had sexual encounters with two women and a confrontation with a third close woman companion.
MLK is promoted as a “peace maker” and one who believed in non violence. MLK is not promoted as a whoremonger and adulterer. MLK closest friend Ralph Abernathy, King’s hand-picked successor as president of S.C.L.C. from 1968 to 1976, was an eye witness to the real MLK. If you believe having sex with 2 women on MLK’s last evening is something that you should honor on “MLK day” in his memory I say you are deceived and honoring a whoremonger and adulterer because of your ignorance.
You are in imbecile.
“Would blacks still be slaves?”
What do you think?
“Hostile nations”
Why hostile. Do you mean like Canada and the USA are hostile?
This is no different from the US Constitution, except that in the US Constitution it is not explicit but implied. Why do you think the US had slaves in certain states during the entire Civil War? Even after the Emancipation Proclamation slavery continued in the North after it had been ordered ended in the South.
“and slavery had NOTHING to do with the ideological foundation of GOVERNMENT of the Confederacy”
I have to disagree with you there since the Confederate Constitution contains the following “No bill of attainder, ex post facto law, or law denying or impairing the right of property in negro slaves shall be passed.”
The fact that slavery played an economic and cultural role in the South did not mean that it was otherwise a foundational part of the political ideology of the Confederacy. If slavery were removed from the Confederacy, it’s political philosophy would not have been effected. The GOVERNMENT would not have changed — though the social and economic dynamics would have been quite different.
“...did you used to post under the name StandWatie?...
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No, I just miss him and wonder what happened to him.”
StandWaite aka Darius Whiete aka Non-Sequitor got kicked off FR by none other than Jim Robinson.
It was an action long overdue.
Non-Sequiter was a leftist agitator, and I’d be more than happy to produce some of his more leftist rants if you’re interested.
“What would world history be like if there had been two hostile nations sharing this continent for the past 150 years?”
Are there not “two hostile nations” (”the right” and “the left”) “sharing” America today?
Do you not see the national divisions widening? A growing and almost unbreachable divide?
Consider the rantings of the left regarding Sarah Palin and the Giffords shooting. How do propose that folks of our persuasion reach accommodation with them?
It seems that if nothing changes our current course, that — in the future — we may yet see two or quite possibly several “nations” where one previously existed....
How did Gen. Lee trample on the Constitution?? Did he do something that is not permissible under that document??
Please be precise.
“The fact his family home was turned into America’s national memorial cemetery, says it all and punctuates his treason for all to see.”
I believe that it’s also “a fact” that one of Lee’s sons sued to have Arlington returned. The case went to the Supreme Court, which eventually ruled IN LEE’S FAVOR (emphasis intentional). In a great gesture, the Lee family agreed to receive compensation for the property, instead of the actual return of Arlington to their ownership (to which they were legally entitled).
Arlington was, in effect, “given to” the American people by the Lee family....
sniff sniff
Learn something, do yourself a favor, before you come on one of these threads. Neither man was a traitor.
[Quote]
I believe that it’s also “a fact” that one of Lee’s sons sued to have Arlington returned. The case went to the Supreme Court, which eventually ruled IN LEE’S FAVOR (emphasis intentional). In a great gesture, the Lee family agreed to receive compensation for the property, instead of the actual return of Arlington to their ownership (to which they were legally entitled).
Arlington was, in effect, “given to” the American people by the Lee family....
[Unquote]
Yes, it is a fact that George Washington Custis Lee sued the U.S. Government and won an appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court by a closely split 5-4 decision arguing the tax delinquency sale of Arlington House was unconstitutional because it failed to adequately comply with due process of law standards. It is also a fact that Major General George Washington Custis Lee and General Robert E. Lee acknowledged their acts of treason against the U.S. Government upon their applications for amnesty and a pardon in 1865 from the U.S. Government.
The statement, “Arlington [House] was, in effect, ‘given to’ the American people by the Lee family....,” is a very very grotesque falsehood. This family played a direct role in the infliction of hundreds of thousands of American deaths and millions more wounded by the Confederate States of America and their own personal acts of treason and armed rebellion. Having lost the war and surrendering themselves to the mercies of the same people upon whom they inflicted such death, destruction, and hardship; they felt it necessary to attempt to recover their lost Arlington House property. In return for their foes’ magnanimous return of their personal freedom without severe punishment for their acts of treason, the Lee family chose not to magnanimously acquiesce to the loss of Arlington House for use as a U.S. military cemetery. The fact is not only did they seek to recover Arlington House, they also tried to petition Congress to dismantle the military cemetery and have the many thousands of soldiers buried at Arlington House disinterred from their graves and moved to someplace else where the sight of their military graves would not disturb the sensibilities of the Lee family upon their reoccupation of Arlington House.
After many years of failures, George Washington Custis Lee finally succeeded in getting the U.S. Supreme Court to decide by a vote of 5-4 that the government officials and policies denied his mother the due process of law needed to forestall the tax sale of Arlington House. Having won the right to receive compensation for the fair market value of Arlington House, he accepted a payment of $150,000 from the U.S. Government which had so recently and generously granted him amnesty and a pardon for his own personal acts of treason, which killed and injured so many of the American families with sons buried at Arlington House and elsewhere. The fact is George Washington Custis Lee had no choice but to sell Arlington House to the U.S. Government. There was absolutely no way the removal of the graves could ever be tolerated. Instead, it was inevitable for the U.S. Government to promptly exercise its right of eminent domain to confiscate Arlington House once more with full due process of law which the U.S. Supreme Court could no longer find unconstitutional.
Given the facts, the readers can judge for themselves whether the Lee family’s actions and threatened removal of the soldiers’ graves were great gestures or something else entirely different.
As for the question of Robert E. Lee having committed treason, even he acknowledged his own treason beyond any shadow of a doubt when he applied for the amnesty and pardon for committing those acts of treason.
I find it very hard to believe that Northern citizens left their families, jobs, and farms, - to take up arms, marched down a thousand miles on foot, to kill their fellow Americans, destroying the land, (Not to mention risking their own lives) just because they had slaves…
I thought it was the States right to succeed anyway?
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The North was making “Progress” and “ fundamental Change” Hmmm. Sound familiar ?
Expanding the power of the Federal Government, wanting more “protection” “subsidies “, and “aid” from the Federal Government… Higher tariffs….. “ Free soilers” - wanting free land… Business leaders, who wanted a stronger central government that would protect industry…
Because the South lacked industry, they were forced to buy back finished products - under a credit financing system designed to keep the Southern farmer always in debt…. Prior to the war, New York City had become the realm of banking…
( Right out of a Standard History Book - Just started reading….) People on here claiming to be “conservatives” … Sure sounds like a Federal Government takeover to me.. Taxation without representation, higher tariffs and trade regulation made it impossible for the south to trade.
Colonel Robert E. Lee USA, later General Robert E. Lee CSA, levied war upon the United States of America and gave aid and comfort to the enemies of the United States of America. General Robert E. Lee surrendered to the U.S. Army in exxcange for amnesty for acts of treason and insurrecction. Robert E. Lee subsequently in June 1865 gave an oath of allegiance to the United States of America and requested amnesty and a pardon for his acts of treason. If you cannot accept Robert E. Lee’s own written admission of treason....
The North still had the high ground.
No, they didn't hold any of the high ground on Cemetery Ridge until the evening of the First Day -- and Ewell brought up Jackson's Corps in the afternoon, coming back down from the vicinity of York, which he was ready to sack when he got the order to concentrate at Gettysburg.
Jackson would have sailed up that height as the first order of business, flanking his way up the ridge and doing whatever it took to get that high ground. Ewell boggled, and balked -- even when ordered.
And Little Round Top wasn't secured until the middle of the day on the Second Day, just a short time before Longstreet's attack jumped off. But that was another battle -- Jackson's corps wound up parked in front of Culp's Hill for the rest of the battle, and the Round Tops were at the opposite end of the ridge.
I still disagree with you. Slavery (specifically the preservation of slavery) was an inherent political component of the Confederacy. The Confederacy was made up of slaveholding states and only slaveholding states, not one free state or territory. Slavery was specifically mentioned in the Confederate Constitution not just as an afterthought but with a specific passage that made negro slavery legal in the Confederacy forever. If you read the Confederate Constitution you will see that.
I am not a Confederacy hater. I believe the Confederacy had many noble aspects however I also am not an Confederacy apologist.
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