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Why 33 rounds makes sense in a defensive weapon
The Washington Post ^ | February 6, 2011 | Stephen Hunter

Posted on 02/06/2011 11:34:59 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet

Sleek, its lines rakishly tilted to boost the ergonomics that index grip placement to barrel, this automatic pistol has but one function: to eliminate human beings easily. That sinister intent is expressed most eloquently in the extended magazine that reaches far beneath the pistol grip, easily tripling the amount of ammunition available to the killer.

It's the Colt Super .38 automatic pistol, customized into a machine pistol by an underworld gunsmith so that Babyface Nelson could use it to kill an FBI agent outside Little Bohemia, Wis., in 1934. Maybe you saw the movie.

Even if you didn't, you can still see the point: There's nothing really new when it comes to guns. To the contrary, the extended magazine that Jared Loughner allegedly carried in his Glock 19 the day he is accused of having fatally shot six people outside Tucson and wounding 13 others, and that President Obama is likely to suggest banning in an upcoming speech, may be traced way back.

During World War I, American armorers tried to adapt the 1903 Springfield into a counter-sniper "periscope rifle" by, among other things, installing a 25-round magazine. The Germans tried to turn the Luger pistol into a "trench broom" by devising a 32-round "snail drum" magazine (it fired the same round as the Glock 19). The Texas Ranger Frank Hamer carried a Remington Model 8 with an extended magazine in his hunt for Bonnie and Clyde in 1934. The Thompson submachine gun of World War II and the M-16 of Vietnam were improved by extending their magazine from 20 to 30 rounds. In 1957, the U.S. Army adopted the M-14 rifle, which was hardly more than an M-1 Garand rifle with an extended magazine. And who wouldn't want our soldiers, Marines and law officers to benefit from extended magazines?(continued)

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Government
KEYWORDS: 2ndamendment; ammo; ammunition; arizona; banglist; extendedmag; giffords; magazine; obama; rtkba; secondamendment; tucson
This in the Washington Post?
1 posted on 02/06/2011 11:35:04 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Except for the last sentence the article reads like something written by Ayoob.

Very good, thanks.


2 posted on 02/06/2011 11:47:11 PM PST by gettinolder (Smashed lips save ships.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

>To the contrary, the extended magazine that Jared Loughner allegedly carried in his Glock 19 the day he is accused of having fatally shot six people outside Tucson and wounding 13 others, and that President Obama is likely to suggest banning in an upcoming speech, may be traced way back. <

(cough)


3 posted on 02/06/2011 11:48:33 PM PST by max americana
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
This in the Washington Post?

My sentiments exactly.

4 posted on 02/06/2011 11:49:52 PM PST by Slings and Arrows (You can't have Ingsoc without an Emmanuel Goldstein.)
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To: gettinolder

Last line too - take another look.


5 posted on 02/06/2011 11:50:31 PM PST by Slings and Arrows (You can't have Ingsoc without an Emmanuel Goldstein.)
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To: Slings and Arrows
There's really a simple explanation to this.......

There's been a transporter malfunction and we've ended up in a parallel universe.

6 posted on 02/06/2011 11:59:35 PM PST by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
This in the Washington Post?

File under 'Thank God for small favors' ???

For an extremely short primer on the history of the pistol, its basic mechanics and self defense it's a very good article.

7 posted on 02/07/2011 12:10:22 AM PST by TigersEye (Who crashed the markets on 9/28/08 and why?)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
 
But the other half of that question must be asked, too: Is it worth it if it costs just one life?
 
That was a pretty weal argument when prefaced by the sentence:
 
 
Those who would ban extended magazines, will say that although hundreds of thousands are in circulation and thousands more will surely be sold before a ban is enacted, it will be worth it if it saves just one life.

8 posted on 02/07/2011 12:13:55 AM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously..... You won't live through it anyway.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Personally, I think a 33 round magazine is probably going to make your pistol more likely to turn into a jam-o-matic, especially if it’s some knock-off magazine and not original equipment.
It would be more effective to carry 2 guns.


9 posted on 02/07/2011 12:16:20 AM PST by smokingfrog ( BORN free - taxed to DEATH (and beyond) ...)
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To: USNBandit

That’ll do it.


10 posted on 02/07/2011 12:22:31 AM PST by Slings and Arrows (You can't have Ingsoc without an Emmanuel Goldstein.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet


The Germans tried to turn the Luger pistol into a “trench broom” by
devising a 32-round “snail drum” magazine (it fired the same round
as the Glock 19).

And this from the Krauts that b-tched and groaned about the use of the
Winchester shotgun (1897?) by the Americans to clean out the trenches.


11 posted on 02/07/2011 12:31:34 AM PST by VOA
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I thought Loughner’s weapon jambed upon the attempt to swap magazines? And, that’s when he was tackled. I had heard that the malfunction may likely have been a result of the extended magazine.

I’m not an expert by any means, but I can understand why conventional magazines function more realiably -the spring rate. Beside the point, that with practice they can be changed very quickly. So, if a conventional magazine holds 17 and a second was swaped without a jamb, thats 34 rounds. So, what’s the difference? Not to mention, he could have carried two pistols, again 34 rounds. Or, he might have driven a car thru the crowd. Or, any number of things...etc.


12 posted on 02/07/2011 12:38:10 AM PST by Fitzy_888 ("ownership society")
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To: smokingfrog

The Scherer 25 rd mags work really well in a Glock 21 .45 ACP actually. No jamming ever. Two guns are fun at the range and in movies but very impractical. Tactically speaking, it is far better to carry several Scherer high cap mags.


13 posted on 02/07/2011 12:45:01 AM PST by RC one
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To: smokingfrog
Personally, I think a 33 round magazine is probably going to make your pistol more likely to turn into a jam-o-matic, especially if it’s some knock-off magazine and not original equipment.

That's why only original equipment will do :-)


14 posted on 02/07/2011 2:06:13 AM PST by VeniVidiVici (Only two things come from Texas and I see you're wearing an "I Heart Austin" t-shirt)
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To: VeniVidiVici; 2ndDivisionVet
That's why I'm perfectly happy with a 20 round magazine:


15 posted on 02/07/2011 2:24:54 AM PST by CholeraJoe ("And if you disagree with me, you are worse than Hitler." Greg Gutfeld)
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To: smokingfrog

There was some point in the early 1990s where a company came up to DOD and wanted offer an attachment to the M-16 where you could 200 rounds in a cannister. If I remember correctly, there was a brief discussion about acquiring this cannister. There were two problems discovered after briefly testing this cannister technology. First, the amount of ammo and the weight of the cannister made the entire weapon impractical to handle. If you mounted it onto a HUMMER, maybe it’d make sense. But then they came to the jam-ability of the weapon. Out of every two cannisters, at least one jam would be reported.

I’m of the mind that seven good rounds each in two weapons would be a more practical way of a bad situation...rather than risk a heavy weapon with no practical aim ability or risking a jam.


16 posted on 02/07/2011 2:44:10 AM PST by pepsionice
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To: pepsionice

Are you familiar with the 100-rount C-Mag from Beta Corp?
Two side=by-side drums that feed into a common “tower” in the mag well.

Expensive piece of plastic at around $250 (MSRP), and if you drop a loaded one it will shatter without fail. The DOD bought PALLETS of them and shipped them overseas, but they were so problematic the US Army reportedly destroyed them to prevent them from making it into combat.

I’ve fired them and they work “acceptably” for civvy fun, but I’ve also seen them fail repeatedly on FA fire. Pretty cool in an M249 SAW though.


17 posted on 02/07/2011 3:09:09 AM PST by SJSAMPLE
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To: CholeraJoe

Nice. Anti crackhead remedy.


18 posted on 02/07/2011 3:15:20 AM PST by screaminsunshine (Surfers Rule)
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To: CholeraJoe

I can just see that thing loaded with the Hippy Beat Down bean bag rounds.
Referred to in that mode as “Rancid Patchouli Fog Attenuation Device Mk 1” or some such.
I want one.


19 posted on 02/07/2011 3:44:53 AM PST by Darksheare (I shook hands with Sheryl Crow and all I got was Typhus and a single sheet of toilet paper.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Ranger Hamers' Remington Model 8 in .35 cal.

20 posted on 02/07/2011 4:28:34 AM PST by Tainan (Cogito Ergo Conservitus.)
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To: Vendome

“But the other half of that question must be asked, too: Is it worth it if it costs just one life?”

The answer is: It depends on who’s life is taken, and what they had done that warranted shooting them. Better yet, to paraphrase John Wayne, “some people just need shootin’”.


21 posted on 02/07/2011 4:58:17 AM PST by jdsteel (I like the way the words "Palin for President" drive progressives absolutely crazy.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Because 32 might not be enough.


22 posted on 02/07/2011 5:12:11 AM PST by magslinger (Samuel Colt, feminist. Making women equal to men for over 150 years.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“This in the Washington Post?”

Stephen Hunter, the writer of this piece, is the author of the Bob Lee Swagger books(fictional Marine Corps sniper.) Highly recommended.


23 posted on 02/07/2011 5:18:16 AM PST by Holen1
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To: smokingfrog

Ann Coulter noted the extended magazines make the handgun less concealable.


24 posted on 02/07/2011 5:45:08 AM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: jdsteel

yep


25 posted on 02/07/2011 10:13:37 AM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously..... You won't live through it anyway.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

A thoughtful and well-informed piece about handguns ... and in the WaPo, no less! Will wonders never cease?

Then again, I suspect most Americans are comfortable (fully or partially) with the whole subject of guns. Most Americans know someone who shoots and/or hunts so they’re not petrified of them.

Liberals and progressives, on the other hand, are trying to find the demon in the details of this story. Let ‘em try.


26 posted on 02/07/2011 2:15:54 PM PST by DNME (With the sound of distant drums ... something wicked this way comes.)
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