Skip to comments.So How Much Do Public Union Workers Really Make?
Posted on 03/01/2011 11:10:52 AM PST by JohnRLott
President Obama lashed out at Republicans Monday for having "denigrated or vilified" public union employees. Without collective bargaining and the ability to go on strike, he said we wouldn't be able to attract "the best and the brightest to public service." Are public employees simply the best and the brightest? Or are we simply lavishing them with much better employment deals than their private counterparts?
To measure how attractive a job is, economists study how employees vote with their feet -- that is, comparing the rate at which different categories of employees voluntarily quit their jobs.
Over the last six months, private workers have been 3.4 times more likely to quit their jobs than either state and local or federal workers. Indeed, no private industry comes close to the low "quit rate" for government employees. Manufacturing, which has the lowest rate, still faces twice the quit rate as the government. . . .
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
Ever been to the unemployment office? The people who "work" there couldn't get or hold on to a job anywhere else.
What a bunch of mutts.
The really great things about burrowing into one of these bureaucracies are the diversity of jobs available and the opportunity to transfer to different departments without the muss and fuss and trouble of going out to seek another job at a different employer. You keep your sick time, your pension, your vacation time. Once in, most wouldn’t leave on their own.
That makes me absolutely ill. From the Presidency on down, there is absolutely no question that the ‘best and brightest’ do not generally wind up in public office/service. More like the ‘bs’ed and lightest’ (and we're not talking body weight here).
*GASP*! And that is not a fake gasp...I missed this. He ACTUALLY said this????? He SAID IT?
Oh. My. God.
Have you ever talked to the IRS?!
Ideology is everything to this ‘resident.
That proves Obama is an IDIOT! Not that any of us had any questions about it!
Job Growth Lacking in the Private Sector (over the last decade)
FOR the first time since the Depression, the American economy has added virtually no jobs in the private sector over a 10-year period. The total number of jobs has grown a bit, but that is only because of government hiring.
The accompanying charts show the job performance from July 1999, when the economy was booming and companies were complaining about how hard it was to find workers, through July of this year, when the economy was mired in the deepest and longest recession since World War II. For the decade, there was a net gain of 121,000 private sector jobs, according to the survey of employers conducted each month by the Bureau of Labor Statistics. In an economy with 109 million such jobs, that indicated an annual growth rate for the 10 years of 0.01 percent.
Reform advocates are spotlighting those with extravagant pensions
$100,000 or more as a way to get the publics attention and
emphasize that the current system is unsustainable.
Perhaps the real reason why public-sector pension costs have not been tackled is that the full bill has never been revealed to taxpayers.
“The great public-sector pension rip-off”
RE: “That makes me absolutely ill. From the Presidency on down, there is absolutely no question that the best and brightest do not generally wind up in public office/service. More like the bsed and lightest (and we’re not talking body weight here).”
Correct. I worked some 40+ years in the private sector, never belonged to a union, and all that time it was a ‘given’ that few people in public sector jobs would ever be considered qualified for a job in private industry.
Public service ‘work’ was considered to be a joke, an embarrassment, and to be avoided at all cost by those with half a brain.
The reality is that a large amount of public sector workers would never survive in the private sector. Many of them are incompetent, whiny idiots, which is why they went to the public jobs in the first place. In the private sector, you don’t perform, you’re out on your keister. They’re lucky they could hold a job flipping burgers.
They get their buddies to get them jobs from the government and you’d have to practically rape or murder someone to lose it.
This is not to say that all public workers are idiots or are undeserving, far from it. But when our nation is in the largest hole ever, and we keep feeding many of these ungrateful SOBs more of our taxes against our will, this is when we have to say enough is enough.
Or tried to get your driver's license renewed?
Or tried to pay your taxes?
Or tried to find out who to call for a pothole on your street?
Or watched a pothole on your street being fixed (three months after you finally found out to whom to talk)?
*GASP*! And that is not a fake gasp...I missed this. He ACTUALLY said this????? He SAID IT? Oh. My. God.
He has also made statements to the effect that if a business secures a loan they are in the black.
He's simply the dumbest ass possible when it comes to understanding business.
Buddy of mine took a managerial job with the city. I realize that's not Fed, bnt the bureaucracy is the same.
One of the guys in his his dept was a real dog. Showed up when the spirit moved him, didn't work too hard when he was actually present.
Buddy tried everything that he knew to motivate this clown, then finally gave up went to his supervisor looking to fire the guy.
Supervisor said, "Honestly? It will be faster if you went down to this guys cube, shot him, did the time, then came back here to work."
So, my friend did what was done to him ... pawned this loser off on the next new supervisor that came into the department.
That's your (mine, actually) tax dollars at work.
** Supervisor said, “Honestly? It will be faster if you went down to this guys cube, shot him, did the time, then came back here to work.” **
That is so true. I worked in a state bureaucracy for years. Often the only person who knows the process to get someone fired is the person who needs firing.
And to think, he's the head of the Executive branch of government. The CEO if you will.
Any company that ran with that type of mentality would be bankrupt in very short order. And thats exactly whats happening to this country.
I would say, “YES” you have! roflol!
Other federal/state/local agencies who hire ‘unemployable’ people and I have dealt with:
1) DMV—no explanation needed
2) Housing and Community Affairs
3) any agricultural agency— NO employees have ever farmed.Granddad says 20 something feds show up and try to tell him—a 50+ year farmer—how to fricken farm
4) Dept of Energy—have any even worked in an energy industry???
5) OSHA-five come to inspect:one inspects, the other four texts their spouces
6) Alcoholic Beverage Renewal Permit/License Fees—these folks are WORTHLESS
WTF is Obama talking about and bitching because of the collective bargining agreement? My wife has worked for Social Security ODAR for over 20 yrs. There IS NO COLLECTIVE BARGINING with Federal Employees Union . . . . YET.
Thank you, Dr. Lott.
Here are what the best and brightest public service (government workers) are best at doing.
[ Buddy of mine took a managerial job with the city. I realize that’s not Fed, bnt the bureaucracy is the same.
One of the guys in his his dept was a real dog. Showed up when the spirit moved him, didn’t work too hard when he was actually present.
Buddy tried everything that he knew to motivate this clown, then finally gave up went to his supervisor looking to fire the guy.
Supervisor said, “Honestly? It will be faster if you went down to this guys cube, shot him, did the time, then came back here to work.”
So, my friend did what was done to him ... pawned this loser off on the next new supervisor that came into the department. ]
If you want to get fired from a job like this all you have to do is to work as hard as you can and soon you will make all the other drones there look bad by compaison and group envy will kick in and all the drones will convince your supervisor to fire you.
“”...A couple of weeks ago, Obama told leaders of private companies at the U.S. Chamber of Commerce that they had an obligation to hire more workers regardless of whether it meant they would lose money on hiring them...”
*GASP*! And that is not a fake gasp...I missed this. He ACTUALLY said this????? He SAID IT?”
yes in a manner of speaking he said that. But remember he is a commie POS who has never had his own skin in the game
this if rom his Chamber of commerce speech and he tries to make it clear he thinks they should hire Americans.
‘ I understand that you’re under incredible pressure to cut costs and keep your margins up. I understand the significance of your obligations to your shareholders. I get it. But as we work with you to make America a better place to do business, ask yourselves what you can do for America. Ask yourselves what you can do to hire American workers, to support the American economy, and to invest in this nation. That’s what I want to talk about today - the responsibilities we all have to secure the future we all share.”
He keeps saying he understands but he has no clue. and the ONLY reason he is asking for this is his poll numbers are suffering
Here in Washington State, after all the original Public Employee Retirement System 1 (PERS) issues, the state and most other public agencies changed all of that. Back in the day (70’s and earlly 80’s) peaople were retiring form the state with multiple 1000’s of hours of banked sick leave and vacation. Along with all of the early 50 somethings retiring for hang nails etc and these large payouts were also calculated in to their total retirement and made thier check even larger.
They changed the PERS system now and it is capped at 2% per year of service of your highest grossing 5 years of employement.
Upon leaving a person is no longer entitled to any sick pay unless they are retiring and that is usually capped at 25% of 1040 hours, vacation is paid out up to 240 hours max, and the pension fund can be paid out after any employment seperation other than retirement subject to early withdrawal penalty of 20% plus Uncle Sam’s take of 10% and cannot be rolled into a private 401k plan. And if a person does take their pension out and then gets back in to public sector work they have 5 years to pay the early withdrawal back to PERS at current market value and not the value at the time of withdrawal...
How do I know? because I have jumped back and forth between private and public sectors many times...
I think the real issue is that they get to retire at absurd ages like 52. This makes their pensions unsustainable (as they could continue to draw them for another 40 years), and means that transit agencies and other departments don’t have cash to actually operate because it’s all going to fifty-something retirees sitting around on their arses.
Rush keeps saying the Wisconsin public sector workers are paid twice as much as private but that is clearly not true.
Two of my employees quit their jobs with my company during the past two years to take cushy, lifetime jobs with the local city water/sewer crews. Both of them spoke of their amazement at how little gets done in their new work environment, and both were literally told to slow down their work and quit making everyone else look bad. In no uncertain terms. The standard stories about government jobs are really true.
He was also saying that Wisconsin union teachers make $89,500 per year. His source was Fox News, who’s source was some book that costs $75 that had statistics in it.
I wish it was easier to look these things up.
Sorry. Fox News’s source was CQPress:
(I still had that window open from last week)
Or... the DMV or the USPS.
Wallstreet Journal * FEBRUARY 26, 2011
Wisconsin’s Newest Progressive
The Republican governor wants a new social contract.
By JOHN FUND
“I very much want to avoid laying people off,” Mr. Walker says. But his experience as county executive taught him that “not everyone feels that way. During budget crises I would push for a couple of weeks where workers would only put in 35 hours so we didn’t have to cut jobs, but union leaders would say no. It’s reactionary.” He says there’s a gulf between the interests of union leaders and those of their members. “When they say it’s about worker rights, it’s really about big union bosses running their own political dynasties.” That’s why the parts of his plan that most stick in the craw of union leaders are the ones that would limit their power.
Mr. Walker says that the employee rights that people care about are protected by civil-service rules, not collective bargaining. “We have the strongest protections in the country on grievance procedures, merit hiring, and just cause for disciplining and terminating employees,” he says. “None of that changes under my plan.” Mr. Walker notes that the single largest group affected by his proposal are the 30,000 workers at the University of Wisconsin who were only granted collective-bargaining rights in 2009. “If they only got them two years ago, how can you say they’re set in stone?”
How could one be more of a moron? IF American companies could afford to hire American workers, they d*mn well would. Why would they want the hassle of hiring overseas? Really, does odumbo think at all?
Nice work. Thank you.
In my life experience at least 90% of government workers I have had to deal with on any level did not have good knowledge of their area of responsibility, had a bad attitude and bad work ethic. That goes from teachers to house inspectors to toll takers to police to... Probably if 1/3 were fired tomorrow no one would notice other than their co”workers” who might...just might, be asked to do a little more “work”. It is pathetic.
Try talking to the ATF if you want a real treat.
And sometimes those breaks can go on for HOURS...
That's been my experience as well. Generally, 5% of the government workforce does 96% of the work. I'm a contractor for the Federal government. It pays well. Why does it pay well? Because most of the government workers a) can't do the work; b) won't do the work; c) can't be fired; d) all of the above.
I've had the government contracting officer of our group beg us not to give any work to a certain government "lifer" because he'll screw things up (he spends most of the day either checking sports scores or sleeping). So we do his work for him; he gets the credit, but I get a nice paycheck.
Wisconsin School Staff and Salary Data:
You want to know why a lot of these employees stink? Entitlements. Affimative action hire, veterans preferencee hir, etc.
I know in my own department we have the truly skilled professionals, then we have those HR made us hire due to said entitlement.
It sucks, because when people get hired without the skill set to so the job, the rest of us pick up the slack. That is definately one thing I would change about Federal employement. The other would be merit only raises and promotions (and demotions and firings).
really? you havent’ paid attention to the salaries/ bennies Wisc Teachers make?
the avg salary ( ty google ) for Wisc teachers is over 52k PLUS bennies.
Thanks for that post!
Well, I was looking for a source for the data.
Thanks for confirming my suspicion. I feel for you!
A friend of mine works in an IRS call center. Her job is to help people make payment arrangements before it goes further. (FYI people don’t fall for those we’ll settle commercials 99 percent of people can work it out themselves).
Her boss Geithner would be disqualified from doing her job as you have to have a squeaky clean tax record.
The scary thing is the highly qualified jobs we are paying less than the private sector. It’s the unsklilled that make much more than.
My brother is a highly respected IT professional (he’s one of those that if you’re in the industry you probably know who he is) and he applied for a position with the state of Illinois. He would take a 20 percent cut and those in IT with highly sought after skills would.