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Is onslaught of 'gun show loophole' legislation--and worse--about to begin?
St. Louis Gun Rights Examiner ^ | 15 March, 2011 | Kurt Hofmann

Posted on 03/17/2011 5:16:29 PM PDT by marktwain

In the wake of President Obama's guest editorial in the Arizona Daily Star Sunday (discussed here yesterday), calling for a "new discussion" about "gun control," some forcible citizen disarmament advocates are incensed that Obama didn't go far enough for their tastes. Washington Post blogger Greg Sargent, for example, comes just short of wailing and tearing his hair over Obama's disinterest in talking about magazine bans:

Throw in the political class’s inability to address high-capacity magazines, and it’s all another mark of how decisively conservatives have won the gun control wars, and of how far off the rails the national conversation about guns has strayed.

The fact of the matter is that a magazine ban bill's chances of passage are remote indeed, with Rep. Carolyn "What's a Barrel Shroud?" McCarthy's (D-NY) H.R. 308 (magazine ban bill) still strictly monopartisan (I know that's not a word. Get over it.), and of the minority party in the House, to boot. This, therefore, reduces Obama to going after what the Huffington Post's Sam Stein describes as the "low-hanging fruit":

The principal debate, then, will likely center around the application of background-check standards to private dealers.

Yep--the outright ban of private sales of firearms is what is apparently considered an unambitious gun-hater's aspiration. And yes--if a requirement for an FBI check of one's legal records (and increasingly, one's medical records) for any gun purchase is not a ban of private firearms commerce, the word "private" has taken on a new, Orwellian meaning.

(Excerpt) Read more at examiner.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: banglist; constitution; gunshow; privatesale
Banning private sales of firearms is a step well on the way to national registration. National registration is functionally equivilant to confiscation:

GUN REGISTRATION IS GUN CONFISCATION (old but good)

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2608785/posts

1 posted on 03/17/2011 5:16:31 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

Ask a Brit.


2 posted on 03/17/2011 5:24:54 PM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks (Go Hawks !)
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To: marktwain
I'd like a "new discussion" about birth certificates and being born with dual-citizenship and the consequent ineligibility issues.
3 posted on 03/17/2011 5:26:26 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum ("If they bring a knife to the fight, we bring a gun." -- Barry Soetoro, June 11, 2008)
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To: marktwain

Give to the NRA NOW!


4 posted on 03/17/2011 5:27:22 PM PDT by RC one (WHOOPS. lol)
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To: marktwain

Yep it’s coming sooner or later we will be just like the UK and people will be wetting their pants if they see a stray 22 round sitting in the street (actually happened complete with a picture of the brave mangina that called the police). Sad how feminized the west has become and contrasts interestingly with the over masculinized Muslim countries, kind of like a bizarre ying yang type of situation. Best you can do is prepare to hide your guns and ammo but what good are they then? Kind of like the Scots that hid their swords in the roof thatching only to be found hundreds of years later when they re-roofed.

And for all those “cold dead hands” types look at what’s happening in Libya, small arms cannot and never will win a conflict, even the American revolution required plenty of heavy arms (cannon, warships, etc.) supplied by the French. Hate to say it but the culture war has been won and the feminist/metrosexual socialists have largely succeeded in stripping us of our constitutional rights. It is only a matter of time, 10 years, 20 years, who knows but it will happen and we will be reduced from citizens to subjects.


5 posted on 03/17/2011 5:35:26 PM PDT by trapped_in_LA
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To: RC one

Donate to the G.O.A. today...


6 posted on 03/17/2011 5:52:24 PM PDT by waterhill (Little 'r' republican: taker of the Founder's 'Red Pill'... Screw you, this is My Country!)
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To: marktwain

The “discussion” is always the same; give the government more ways to infringe upon your right to keep and bear arms.


7 posted on 03/17/2011 5:58:34 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Islam is the religion of Satan and Mohammed was his minion.)
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To: marktwain

I really hate to say this, but the good news is that 0zero is President. It will be a lot easier for squish Republicans to oppose his calls for ‘closing’ the so-called gunshow “loophole” than it would be for them to oppose it if McStain had been elected. McStain, you will recall, wanted to line up all the articles in the Bill of Rights and knocking them down one at a time, The First Amendment with his McStain-Feingold Campaign Finance “Reform” bill, and The Second Amendment with ‘closing the gunshow “loophole”’ bill. For all we know, his next plan would have been the Bringing Soldiers Home from The Rain act, which would have stipulated how soldiers were to be quartered in people’s houses in time of peace.


8 posted on 03/17/2011 5:59:19 PM PDT by coloradan (The US has become a banana republic, except without the bananas - or the republic.)
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To: trapped_in_LA

You are a pussy: not a vagina, just a PUSSY...

YOU deserve slavery...


9 posted on 03/17/2011 6:01:36 PM PDT by waterhill (Little 'r' republican: taker of the Founder's 'Red Pill'... Screw you, this is My Country!)
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To: trapped_in_LA

“Scots that hid their swords in the roof thatching only to be found hundreds of years later when they re-roofed.”

I need a tear-off and re-roof and I didn’t know thatching was that durable. Maybe I’ll go with thatch.

What’s thatch? Isn’t it like sticks and straw? Wouldn’t I be vulnerable to big, bad wolves once the wymen and homos take my black carbine and .45?


10 posted on 03/17/2011 6:11:56 PM PDT by tumblindice (What is this thing called, love?)
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To: waterhill

“YOU deserve slavery...”

I’m just calling like I see it, nothing more. I still vote, I still write to my “representative” not that either matters much in California. But I see the way the west has been trending AND the realities of military conflict or even civil disobedience and it all adds up to one thing and that’s going the same way as every other western country.

We are a welfare/socialist state, if you don’t believe me ask anyone here if they would like to give up their welfare payments (aka Social Security) and listen to them howl! You can’t have a free people and a people dependent on welfare payments at the same time! So call me a pussy all you want it won’t change the realities on the ground, America has changed, the majority no longer wants freedom they want a welfare check! And they’ll throw you and your rights under the bus in a New York minute to get them. So chuck the fantasy that people will rally around your righteous cause, it ain’t gonna happen.

Best advise if you want to keep your gun rights is to join a street gang, you can get any gun you want, no background check and the cops typically don’t hang out in those neighborhoods as it might impact the chances of them seeing retirement. Of course the cost is a shortened life expectancy and doing some time but hey, at least you’re “free”.


11 posted on 03/17/2011 6:22:42 PM PDT by trapped_in_LA
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To: marktwain

I am 60 years old.
Over the years I have bought many guns and I have sold many guns.
The guns I have bought from a certified bonified gun dealer have a paper trail attached to them.
The guns I have bought or sold to/from an individual do not.

Most of the guns that I have bought from a certified bonified gun dealer,
that have my identity attached to the paperwork,
I honestly do not know where they might be now.
I gave some of them as birthday presents or Christmas presents,
I sold some of them,
I traded some of them,
I can remember one that was stolen,
and one that was lost in a river (honest to god serious).

Some are locked away in a trunk...
(what a surprise they will be for my children and grandchildren to discover)

More than a few I really, honestly, have no idea whatever happened to them.
I have loaned then, sold them, swapped them, and whatever.

I have never looked at a gun as anything more than a tool.
How many hammers and screwdrivers have I bought over the years?
Do I know whatever happened to all of them?

Oh, I have a derringer that I bought many years ago as a gift for my father in law and then many years later after his death, his children found it in his possessions and returned it to me...
I have that one put away...somewhere...not sure where...
The “paperwork” for that one “knows” that I am the one who bough it from the dealer
but the “paperwork” does not “know” that it was not in my possession for 30 years.


12 posted on 03/17/2011 6:23:48 PM PDT by Repeal The 17th (My best comments get deleted; if you can read this, it is not on the 'cutting edge'.)
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To: tumblindice

“What’s thatch? Isn’t it like sticks and straw? Wouldn’t I be vulnerable to big, bad wolves once the wymen and homos take my black carbine and .45?”

Basically straw, a great place to hide things and for rats to breed. And yes they do last for quite a while, I read a few years ago about someone in Scotland that found a Claymore when redoing the thatch, granted most house have long since replaced the thatch (and found swords, money and what not) but still the point was that it didn’t do the Scots much good and it won’t do you much good either. And it won’t be the wymen and homos but the cops that work for the wymen and homos that will take your carbine and .45. Then tell you to give them a call after the wolf has eaten grandma and they’ll take a report ;-)


13 posted on 03/17/2011 6:31:41 PM PDT by trapped_in_LA
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To: trapped_in_LA

As your tagline suggests, I think maybe you’ve lived in the Peoples Republic of California too long.


14 posted on 03/17/2011 6:35:08 PM PDT by tumblindice (What is this thing called, love?)
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To: tumblindice

Yes I have, well past time for me to bug out but my wife refuses to leave and I’ve got a job here so can’t really move. Wasn’t always this bad but California reached the tipping point about 20 years ago between those on the government dole and those paying the bills and it has been down hill ever since. You should learn from this and try like hell to not let it happen in your neck of the woods as the longer you can keep the welfare parasites away the longer you’ll have some freedom. Once the tipping point is reached there is no going back.


15 posted on 03/17/2011 6:41:15 PM PDT by trapped_in_LA
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To: trapped_in_LA

Say no more. I went to school in So. CA in the `80s and it was bad then. I was single, moved back asap to the midwest, married, got a job and have been as happy as a possum knee-deep in windfall persimmons.
Best of luck to you. I’m sorry to say that I think you all are going to need it.


16 posted on 03/17/2011 6:47:51 PM PDT by tumblindice (What is this thing called, love?)
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To: marktwain

Amen. As I have said before in other threads about Obama banning private sales and banning firearm heirlooms, THIS IS A HILL TO FIGHT AND DIE ON. This is the whole ball of wax, the whole 2nd Amendment. We must stop this.


17 posted on 03/17/2011 7:02:12 PM PDT by backwoods-engineer (Any politician who holds that the state accords rights is an oathbreaker and an "enemy... domestic.")
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To: RC one
Give to the NRA NOW!

Until they learn that endorsing ANY Democrat at ANY level is wrong, they will not get another dime from me.

18 posted on 03/17/2011 7:03:14 PM PDT by cayuga (The next Crusade will be a war of annihilation.)
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To: trapped_in_LA

I will be ok, you are still a pussy, no vaginas were harmed in this post...

I may have to die... so?... I live for liberty.. you will die on your knees... Your grandchildren will ask why, mine will not...

Like I said last night, we will end up as a scattered confederacies... here and there... Libtardia will prevail on the east and left coasts...

Us in the middle will, uh, be us in the middle, those not to be fncked with...

Go Have Yourself an Historical Day, and relish the sunshine in Libtardoville...


19 posted on 03/17/2011 7:45:17 PM PDT by waterhill (Little 'r' republican: taker of the Founder's 'Red Pill'... Screw you, this is My Country!)
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To: trapped_in_LA; All
“Once the tipping point is reached there is no going back.”

I am not convinced that the tipping point has been reached for the whole country. On the issue of the Second Amendment, we are winning the culture war. I don't think the administration will be able to pass this. The Second Amendment fight shows that we can win. It will not be easy or short, but we can win. What we need to do is to keep fighting and to push more new media. The revelation for me was to understand that the major power in this country was not the government, but the media. Now that we have a small amount of media on our side, we are winning.

Remove the support of the MSM from Obama, and his chance of winning the presidency becomes zero. Consider that, and the fact that our media is growing, while the other side's media is losing market share, and you will see some hope. Unfortunately, it is going to take some time.

20 posted on 03/17/2011 8:32:49 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: trapped_in_LA

I was all ready to fight until I read your post, but I changed my mind - you’re right, might as well give up now. /s


21 posted on 03/17/2011 8:42:05 PM PDT by scott7278 ("...I have not changed Congress and how it operates the way I would have liked..." - BHO)
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To: scott7278

“I was all ready to fight until I read your post, but I changed my mind - you’re right, might as well give up now. /s”

I’m not saying that you shouldn’t fight, just that the odds are stacked against you. Fighting the culture and political forces will slow the progress of decline and enable you to live in peace a little longer. Thinking that you’ll be able to fight with small arms a tyrannical government is crazy, you’ll stand no chance and most of the brainwashed masses will be standing against you.

But as long as we are talking about fighting the culture war how many people on this board have pulled their kids out of public school and sent them to either private or home-school? Damn few I’ll bet but that is where we are loosing the war, they’ve got 8 hours a day to brainwash your kids. If you think that you can counter that with a few minutes a day that they may be interacting with you you’re nuts.


22 posted on 03/17/2011 9:11:09 PM PDT by trapped_in_LA
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To: waterhill

“I will be ok, you are still a pussy, no vaginas were harmed in this post...

I may have to die... so?... I live for liberty.. you will die on your knees... Your grandchildren will ask why, mine will not...”

Oooook, I’ll be sure to leave some flowers on your grave. By the way I would suggest the you read the Prince by Machiavelli it may at least enlighten you on what you’ll be facing. Otherwise I’ll let you go back to obsessing about vaginas.


23 posted on 03/17/2011 9:18:47 PM PDT by trapped_in_LA
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To: cayuga

They aren’t the national republican army, they’re the national rifle association. They serve the second amendment of the constitution, not the Republican party and; what’s more, they have been highly effective at defending the rights of gun owners over the past 10-20 years. I don’t know who you are but anytime I see a supposed conservative bashing them for doing what they’re supposed to do, I think I’m looking at an infiltrator trying to undermine the second amendment by driving some BS wedge issue into the minds of conservatives. Furthermore, I want more Dems getting on board with gun rights. I don’t want this to be exclusively a Republican versus Democrat issue so I have no problem with the NRA endorsing strong 2A Dems over weak 2A Republicans.


24 posted on 03/17/2011 11:57:43 PM PDT by RC one (WHOOPS. lol)
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To: waterhill

I fully support GOA but I think the NRA is far too effective to abandon.


25 posted on 03/18/2011 12:05:51 AM PDT by RC one ("merchants have no country")
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To: marktwain
Throw in the political class’s inability to address high-capacity magazines, and it’s all another mark of how decisively conservatives have won the gun control wars, and of how far off the rails the national conversation about guns has strayed.

This is a confusing sentence. First he says conservatives have won decisively, then he turns around and says the nation has strayed! Try to keep a coherent thought for at least one complete sentence, dude....

26 posted on 03/18/2011 3:24:38 AM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: trapped_in_LA
Best you can do is prepare to hide your guns and ammo but what good are they then? Kind of like the Scots that hid their swords in the roof thatching only to be found hundreds of years later when they re-roofed.

...and the roofer was just darn lucky he didn't get arrested!

27 posted on 03/18/2011 3:27:26 AM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: tumblindice
Wouldn’t I be vulnerable to big, bad wolves once the wymen and homos take my black carbine and .45?

Well, just keep the EBR and .45 and you needn't fear womyn, homos, OR wolves of whatever size! (If it don't start with "4", don't go to war!)

28 posted on 03/18/2011 3:30:48 AM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: tumblindice
What is this thing called, love?

What's that in the road, a head?

29 posted on 03/18/2011 3:34:45 AM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: marktwain
This has been posted around a few places, but it’s a good run down on what we’re facing, It’s a response to E.J. Dionne’s use of the term ‘baby steps’ in creeping towards more gun control:

“What Obama endorsed were, well, baby steps toward strengthening background checks”

You know it’s kind of dumb for Mr. Dionne to use a term like baby steps – the clear implication is that this is just the beginning of a plan that certainly will have confiscation as it’s end goal in mind.

The disarm the law-abiding crowd’s way over used term commonsense at least implies that at least this initiative won’t be part of a ongoing scheme or scam.

As someone else posted on another site pointed out, this commonsense baby step means that the sale of your private property will now fall under the influence of the Feral Government.

A measure to control ALL gun transaction by the government along with the ‘registering’ of this information in a database means that Gov. will now have a proto-registration system.

In effect, you will now need the government’s ‘Permission’ to obtain a means of self-defense, from anyone and anywhere. Instead of being able to simply sell your own personal property, you will now have to turn it over to an FFL so that they can charge you a nominal fee and have the government grants it’s blessing over the sale.

So much for property rights.

A parent won’t be able to hand down some of their property to their children – it’ll have to run its course through the federal bureaucracy.

Does anyone really believe that once the Feds have a hand in any lawful firearm transaction and a database of such a transfer, that the won’t start to us such device to pare down the numbers of people who can defend themselves?

Does anyone believe that they won’t start abusing this device to control your 2nd amendment rights?

Does anyone believe that they won’t start intimidating gun owners with threats of publishing this registration data as they are in Illinois?

Does anyone believe that they won’t start requiring periodic taxation of your guns?

Does anyone believe that they won’t start requiring periodic registration of ALL of your guns?

Does anyone believe that they won’t eventually use this registration database to confiscate guns?

30 posted on 03/18/2011 5:55:45 AM PDT by chainsaw56 (Do you have the right to defend yourself??)
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To: trapped_in_LA
Thinking that you’ll be able to fight with small arms a tyrannical government is crazy, you’ll stand no chance and most of the brainwashed masses will be standing against you.

And that has always been the truth.

31 posted on 03/18/2011 7:17:37 AM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: marktwain
Another oldie but goodie: Registration is the same as Confiscation, the only difference is where the guns are stored.

Banning private sales of firearms is a step well on the way to national registration.

That has to be repeated.

The fact is that the forcible disarmament cretins see Federale authority over every gun transaction as the one BIG step to confiscation through the intermediate step of registration.

If the gun grabbers can pull this off, they immediately have a way of permanently recording the possession of every occurring gun sale from now on AND the means to turn every other gun owner into an outlaw.

Make no mistake: This baby step is that powerful.

Some don’t want to think about this too hard and don’t want to oppose this commonsense move by the gun grabbing Fascists.

Is EVERY freaking new infringement on our rights termed commonsense?

It’s a cold hard fact of life that the bad guys don’t wear signs that let you know who they are.

It’s also a cold hard fact of life that Socialists will outright LIE about their true intentions and make you think this is just a minor change in how things work, that it’s just “Commonsense” and it won’t be a burden.

But if you examine the true implcations of what Obama and the gun grabbers want to do here, you will understand the danger to your freedom this really is.

32 posted on 03/18/2011 7:34:03 AM PDT by GYL2 (Always mystify, mislead and surprise the enemy Thomas J. (Stonewall) Jackson)
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To: RC one
They aren’t the national republican army, they’re the national rifle association. They serve the second amendment of the constitution, not the Republican party ...

The Republican Party has nothing to do with this.

My first reply to you was Until they learn that endorsing ANY Democrat at ANY level is wrong, they will not get another dime from me.

I didn’t write that I expected the NRA to endorse all Republicans, but that they should never endorse a Democrat. There are plenty of bad Republicans, but there are no good Democrats. When push comes to shove, they will follow Nancy and Harry.

When I started to write this reply, I intended to try to explain to you why electing any Democrat is dangerous. Then I read your Free Republic homepage, and decided to quote you. The italics below are your own words:

The Democratic party has secured absolute power in America now. They will use their new power to entrench themselves in their seats of power. Their policies will ensure that their committee chairs and majority positions are safe forever...

This is the party that sees baby killing and sodomy as constitutional rights but does not consider the right to keep and bear arms as such…

This is the party that extols the virtues of marxists likes Hugo Chavez, Fidel Castro, and Che Guevara yet openly calls men like Ariel Sharon and George Bush criminals and worse...

…the longer these ticks have to dig in, the harder they will be to dig out...

And yet, you have no problem with the NRA endorsing some of these “ticks”, as long as they’re “pro-gun ticks”.

I’m not an infiltrator trying to undermine the second amendment by driving some BS wedge issue into the minds of conservatives.The infiltrators are those willing to elect Democrats, the mortal enemies of conservatives, on the basis of a pro-gun claim or record. The Rat can be elected as a “pro-gun moderate”, but in reality that might just mean he is a little to the right of Stalin.

I don’t know who you are… I’m a Life Member of the NRA, and in the last 30+ years have contributed a fair amount to NRA-ILA, NRA-PVF, Second Amendment Task Force, Golden Eagles and others. But that was then, and this is now. I will contribute to no organization, no matter what they stand for, if in any way they help elect a Democrat. My money, my rules.

As for Republicans, to get back to where we started this, I see them as little more than “Democrat Light”. The country is in deep trouble.

33 posted on 03/18/2011 10:22:39 AM PDT by cayuga (The next Crusade will be a war of annihilation.)
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To: cayuga

The NRA endorsed Ted Strickland (D) over John Kasich (R) in the 2010 Ohio election because Kasich supported the AWB and Strickland didn’t. Strickland had an A+ rating and Kasich had a B-. Everyone knew that Strickland was going to lose anyways so ikt didn’t matter in the least that the NRA endorsed the candidate with the better rating (as they should). I wasn’t even a little bit upset that the NRA endorsed Strickland because I knew it didn’t matter. At the same time, I would be highly skeptical of any organization that purports to represent the second amendment and then endorses political candidates based on their political affiliation as opposed to their second amendment voting record. that just doesn’t make sense.

What really sucked in that Ohio election is that Mike Dewine (Rino) got elected as Ohio AG thanks to the wave. I didn’t vote for him because he has an NRA F rating. I didn’t vote for Strickland either though despite his A+ so I supported both the second amendment and the conservative movement by being aware of who stood where on the issues thanks, in large part, to the integrity of the NRA.

Elections are complicated especially when you’re voting on the issues instead of the party.


34 posted on 03/18/2011 12:59:54 PM PDT by RC one ("merchants have no country")
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