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The latest on the ATF "Gunrunner" scandal: Wondrous things, the subpoena...
Buckeye Firearms Association ^ | 8 April, 2011 | Jim Shepherd

Posted on 04/09/2011 6:02:45 AM PDT by marktwain

In the Paul Newman classic "Absence of Malice" a federal investigator played by Wilford Brimley is trying to get to the bottom of a case that has gone off the rails and threatens the careers of everyone associated with it.

In a pivotal scene, Brimley sets all the involved parties in a room and tells them his deputy "has a briefcase over there full of subpoenas."

"Wondrous things, the subpoena. I hand you one and you have to tell me anything I want to know about whatever's on them or you go to jail. Now two things are going to be certain when I leave here, I'm going to get to the bottom of this mess - and I'm going to have someone's ass in my briefcase. So, deputy, start passing out them subpoenas."

When subpoenas start flying, it's a sign that things are about to get complicated.

Friday morning, Congressman Darrell Issa issued a congressional subpoena to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms for documents related to the Gunrunner probe. Issa had tried nicely to get the documents, writing acting ATF Director Kenneth Melson to request the information by a Wednesday, [March] 30, 2011 deadline.

Melson ignored the deadline.

Seems now he's kicking another hornet's nest when it would seem everyone else in the Justice Department would prefer the whole Gunrunner deal just disappear. Now, instead of drowning a Congressman in a sea of redacted documents, Melson's simply made Issa angry.

The entire Gunrunner story has done more than simply embarrass administration officials, it has demonstrated that government officials were not only dead-flat wrong about the "iron river of illegal guns" flowing into Mexico; they were - in the case of the Justice Department and ATF- allowing the "river" to run unchecked. In fact, they were feeding the river, supposedly so they could follow the firearms to higher-ranking Mexican bad guys.

Instead, this sordid affair seems to have cost Agent Brian Terry his life and blown up in their faces of administration officials who have since 2009, tried to convince the American people that we needed tougher firearms laws to stanch the flow of illegal guns into Mexico. If Gunrunner and Operation Fast and Furious are any indication, tougher oversight over the ATF and Justice Department might be the key to curbing gun crimes.

Now, ATF and the Justice Department face almost certain public hearings on the whole ugly matter, in addition to calls from groups like the Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear ARms (CCRKBA) for funding cuts to ATF.

Republished from The Outdoor Wire.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Foreign Affairs; Government
KEYWORDS: atf; banglist; gunwalker; subpoena
Now it may get interesting.
1 posted on 04/09/2011 6:02:46 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

I’m still not optimistic. Like everything else, I expect this to travel down the road a fair way and then ... just ... disappear.


2 posted on 04/09/2011 6:14:14 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy
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To: marktwain
......who have since 2009, tried to convince the American people that we needed tougher firearms laws to stanch the flow of illegal guns into Mexico.

I'm always amazed by the fact that the left will flat out lie to reach a goal. Doesn't having to lie give them a clue that they might be incorrect about the subject? Pick your subject, any subject (global warming, health care, gun control, "women's health", etc.) and they fabricate lies to push their goals.

I think if I held a position on something, and found myself having to lie to support that position, I might reconsider the correctness of my stance.
3 posted on 04/09/2011 6:14:27 AM PDT by youngidiot (Hear Hear!)
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To: marktwain

Regulating alcohol, tobacco and firearms are not enumerated powers granted to Congress in Article 1 Section 8 of the Constitution. That is a power reserved to the states or to the people per the 10th Amendment. Therefore the BATFE is Unconstitutional and must be abolished.


4 posted on 04/09/2011 6:15:51 AM PDT by Defend Liberty
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To: ClearCase_guy

Sadly you are right, there will be a big fuss for a short time and then hey look a baby wolf!


5 posted on 04/09/2011 6:18:22 AM PDT by fuzzybutt (Democrat Lawyers are the root of all evil.)
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To: youngidiot
Central tenet of the Left: The end justifies the means.

They know that they are building heaven on earth. A utopian society is just around the corner. Therefore, telling lies -- or even killing millions of people -- is perfectly fine. The world will thank them later when everything works out and becomes perfect.

6 posted on 04/09/2011 6:19:19 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy
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To: marktwain

Last I knew, Alchohol, Tobacco and Firearms were all LEGAL. Why do need a government agency to regulate them? They need killing along with the EPA, Dept of Education and Obamacare.


7 posted on 04/09/2011 6:19:23 AM PDT by ez ("Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is." - Milton, Paradise Lost)
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To: ClearCase_guy

I understand that. I’m just taken back that the individuals in the “movement” don’t stop and question what they’re doing. It’s delusional. Really is a mental disorder.


8 posted on 04/09/2011 6:27:32 AM PDT by youngidiot (Hear Hear!)
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To: ez

My my, such uncivil discourse using a term like killing, sarcasm off.

They need be vaporized as one would vaporize a cancer with kemo.


9 posted on 04/09/2011 6:30:36 AM PDT by Mouton (Government expands to fill any voids in freedom.)
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To: Mouton
They need be vaporized as one would vaporize a cancer with kemo.

I vote for using that new laser the Navy is testing.

10 posted on 04/09/2011 6:34:12 AM PDT by Big Bronson
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To: ez

Tax. What else? You have heard of The Whiskey Rebellion, Yes?


11 posted on 04/09/2011 6:45:47 AM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: marktwain

ATF...seems like on of those amputable agencies to me....has been since Waco “blew-up” ...somehow..in their faces.

Somebody oughta send Congress a memo...


12 posted on 04/09/2011 7:02:41 AM PDT by mo ("If you understand, no explanation is needed; if you do not, no explanation is possible")
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To: marktwain

I pray to God we get some of these BATFE criminals on the gallows before Mike Vanderboegh passes on. I think Mike should see the completion of his work. What a good man. He is even now being persecuted by the state of Alabama on account of his exercising his 2nd Amendment rights without getting state permission. What a crock.


13 posted on 04/09/2011 7:56:21 AM PDT by backwoods-engineer (Any politician who holds that the state accords rights is an oathbreaker and an "enemy... domestic.")
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To: youngidiot

Being a liberal means you never have to
admit to yourself that you’re lieing.


14 posted on 04/09/2011 8:00:51 AM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: youngidiot
I understand that. I’m just taken back that the individuals in the “movement” don’t stop and question what they’re doing. It’s delusional. Really is a mental disorder.

A psychological quirk. They lie to themselves, know they're lying, and yet they can turn it off so they believe the lie is the truth. And since they know they are good people (liberals are always good people, ask them, they'll tell you) you're the bad person when you force them (by the underhanded use of logic, facts, and reality) to throw the switch back to on and they realize again that they are lying.

No doubt that's why they hate us. Who wants people messing with their switches?

15 posted on 04/09/2011 8:07:52 AM PDT by Cheburashka (Democratic Underground: The Hogwarts of stupid.)
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To: marktwain

Now Issa is cooking with gas. I hope he nails Holder to the wall.


16 posted on 04/09/2011 8:46:24 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: youngidiot

I you are “always amazed” by the left lying - whew! You must be goggle-eyed every time they open their pie holes. Lying comes naturally to the left, like breathing...


17 posted on 04/09/2011 9:30:27 AM PDT by karnage
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To: youngidiot

The problem is the left is an ethics/morality free zone. As near as I can tell, they will stop at nothing to get their way.

I know that’s a bit cynical, but I have dealt with it in my family for years and they would, and I would, consider them nice people _by their lights_. Just working for their worthy causes and doing whatever it takes.


18 posted on 04/09/2011 11:34:59 AM PDT by Wicket (God bless and protect our troops and God bless America)
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To: youngidiot

[I think if I held a position on something, and found myself having to lie to support that position, I might reconsider the correctness of my stance.]

Then you might very well be conservative.

Facts, or feelings, how do you make your evaluations.
If by feelings, then you may very well have to make up facts to support the enforcement of your feelings on others.


19 posted on 04/09/2011 12:13:23 PM PDT by Blue Collar Christian (Let's roll on this gunwalking thing already! NRA <BCC><)
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To: ClearCase_guy

I’m still not optimistic. Like everything else, I expect this to travel down the road a fair way and then ... just ... disappear.


Same here.....the timeline points to this gun running for the Cartels was going on during the GW Bush admin....so I do not think the GOP will really get far into this

Sad that we have two admin, one GOP and one DNC, willing to help the Mexican Drug cartels....I guess Open Borders, Illegal Alien Amnesty, NAFTA, and North American Union was not enough for these America-haters


20 posted on 04/09/2011 1:21:38 PM PDT by UCFRoadWarrior (Donald Trump wants Obama's BC released...Glenn Beck attacks Birthers....Now, who is supporting Obama)
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To: Cheburashka
A psychological quirk. They lie to themselves, know they're lying, and yet they can turn it off so they believe the lie is the truth. And since they know they are good people (liberals are always good people, ask them, they'll tell you) you're the bad person when you force them (by the underhanded use of logic, facts, and reality) to throw the switch back to on and they realize again that they are lying.

If a problem is sufficiently bad, it's perfectly proper to exaggerate it if that's what is necessary to motivate people to act. The fact that the only reason the problem "is" only severe enough to be worth bothering with might be that it's been exaggerated out of all proportion is irrelevant, if the problem "is" severe enough.

21 posted on 04/09/2011 4:26:00 PM PDT by supercat (Barry Soetoro == Bravo Sierra)
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To: youngidiot
I'm always amazed by the fact that the left will flat out lie to reach a goal. Doesn't having to lie give them a clue that they might be incorrect about the subject? Pick your subject, any subject (global warming, health care, gun control, "women's health", etc.) and they fabricate lies to push their goals.

Communism was supported by the philosophical doctrine of "dialectical materialism".

By its nature, dialectical materialism accommodates cognitive dissonance (believing two opposing things at the same time), pole reversals (whatever the party says today is true, whatever they say tomorrow is true -- even if it is diametrically opposed to yesterday's pronouncement), and justifies lying (lying in behalf of the party is not lying). Et cetera

If you consider liberalism a religion -- as I do -- the state is God, the leadership are priests and "dialectical materialism" is the functional equivalent of a Bible. It tells you how to "think" -- about everything, actually.

Nowadays, you may even find it woven into public school curricula -- courtesy of William Ayers, PhD (educ).

< HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialectical_materialism">Dialectical Materialism

22 posted on 04/09/2011 4:59:32 PM PDT by okie01 (THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA: Ignorance On Parade)
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To: ez
Why do need a government agency to regulate them?

Actually, their role is to collect taxes.

23 posted on 04/09/2011 5:01:12 PM PDT by okie01 (THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA: Ignorance On Parade)
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To: okie01
One more, once. Dialectical Materialism
24 posted on 04/09/2011 5:04:14 PM PDT by okie01 (THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA: Ignorance On Parade)
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To: okie01

Bingo, you hit the nail right on the head right there!


25 posted on 04/16/2011 8:32:45 PM PDT by MtnClimber (Osama and Obama both have friends that bombed the Pentagon.)
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