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Study: Homosexuality, celibacy didn't cause abuse (Catholic Church)
AP ^ | May 17, 2011 | RACHEL ZOLL

Posted on 05/17/2011 9:03:10 PM PDT by PROCON

WASHINGTON (AP) - Researchers commissioned by the nation's Roman Catholic bishops to analyze the pattern of clergy sex abuse over decades have concluded that homosexuality, celibacy and an all-male priesthood did not cause the scandal. The report from the John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York said about 44 percent of the known abuse cases involved priests who were ordained in the 1940s and 1950s, at a time when seminaries did not properly train them to live a celibate life. These men were not equipped to withstand the social upheaval of the 1960s, which was a time of an increase in sexual deviancy and a spike in crime in society at large, the authors said.

(Excerpt) Read more at breitbart.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: excuses; homosexualagenda
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The debate over what caused the crisis has fallen along ideological lines, with liberals blaming mandatory celibacy or the lack of women in positions of authority. Conservatives pointed to gay priests, since the overwhelming majority of known victims were boys.

Is this what this whole debate comes down to?

I believe the latter is most conclusive.

1 posted on 05/17/2011 9:03:13 PM PDT by PROCON
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To: wagglebee; little jeremiah

Ping!


2 posted on 05/17/2011 9:03:51 PM PDT by PROCON (Liberals Mistake Education and Knowledge for Wisdom and Common Sense.)
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To: PROCON

Then what cased it, boredom?


3 posted on 05/17/2011 9:10:19 PM PDT by doc1019 (Palin/Bachmann, unbeatable.)
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To: PROCON

Don’t need a study to know that the offending priests were and are queer pedophiles: the majority of victims were ages 10-14.


4 posted on 05/17/2011 9:10:19 PM PDT by onyx (If you truly support Sarah Palin and want to be on her busy ping list, let me know!)
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To: PROCON
seminaries did not properly train them to live a celibate life.

Huh? "Celibate" is pretty simple to understand. The seminarians were adults when they were ordained, and certainly knew right from wrong.

5 posted on 05/17/2011 9:14:49 PM PDT by LibFreeOrDie (Obama promised a gold mine, but will give us the shaft.)
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To: PROCON
It is both. Looking at a life with no sexual contact with the female persuasion ever, who do you think would be attracted to this fate. My theory is that celibacy attracts those who are homosexual or deviant. The troubled person is sincere at first. He looks at the celibate lifestyle as a way of curing or avoiding what is in his mind. Become celibate and his problem will be solved. However it never works out that way. Down the road the deviancy will overcome that person, and unfortunately, as the study states, children are the most accessible. The whole concept of celibacy has disaster written all over it.
6 posted on 05/17/2011 9:16:29 PM PDT by gusty
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To: PROCON
The John Jay researchers, however, said that the offenders chose boys mainly because the clergy had greater access to them.

Because vulnerable widows, hookers looking for absolution and other easy female targets in a churches daily function would be hard to find? This report just opens up the debate further into what types of real safeguards the Church is putting in place. They shot themselves in the foot with this totally implausible excuse. Gays and young boys is a real thing that occurs. To overlook this is silly.

7 posted on 05/17/2011 9:18:59 PM PDT by Lazlo in PA (Now living in a newly minted Red State.)
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To: PROCON

The devil made them do it.

Seriously.


8 posted on 05/17/2011 9:20:57 PM PDT by 43north (BHO: 50% black, 50% white, 100% RED)
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To: gusty
The whole concept of celibacy has disaster written all over it.

You present an interesting theory; would you include remaining a virgin until marriage in this category?

9 posted on 05/17/2011 9:21:57 PM PDT by PROCON (Liberals Mistake Education and Knowledge for Wisdom and Common Sense.)
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To: 43north
The devil made them do it.

Seriously.

Oh, I'm with you 100%.

Seriously!

10 posted on 05/17/2011 9:24:02 PM PDT by PROCON (Liberals Mistake Education and Knowledge for Wisdom and Common Sense.)
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To: PROCON

No I wouldn’t. What I mean by celibacy is a lifetime of celibacy. That is remaining a virgin until your funeral.


11 posted on 05/17/2011 9:26:03 PM PDT by gusty
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To: onyx

>Don’t need a study to know that the offending priests were and are queer pedophiles: the majority of victims were ages 10-14.<

Spot on.

It’s by the AP. The biggest fag propagandists of the MSM, aside from being Obama ass-kissers.


12 posted on 05/17/2011 9:26:39 PM PDT by max americana (.)
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To: gusty

I disagree.

I became celibate, by free choice, in 1982. At the time I was 30 years old and my reasons are personal and definitely not perverse or deviant, as you suggest.

It is true that if you have made up your mind about something and stay focused on your goal, temptation is tolerable and can be ignored successfully.


13 posted on 05/17/2011 9:27:59 PM PDT by SatinDoll (NOT FOREIGN NATIONALS AS OUR PRESIDENT)
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To: PROCON
These men were not equipped to withstand the social upheaval of the 1960s, which was a time of an increase in sexual deviancy and a spike in crime in society at large

So, essentially, no one was to blame!

This is interesting, because, to my knowledge -- and I grew up during those years -- there was not an outbreak of boy-raping in the general population. Now, based on the conclusion of the study, that it was merely the tumultuous era in which this occurred, and no other factor other than "bad preparation for celibacy" would appear to have played a role, my brothers and I should have been quite unsafe working the farm with two celibate uncles every summer.

Yet, strangely, their non-preparation for celibacy seems to have been more effective. Perhaps we can commission a highbrow study ...

14 posted on 05/17/2011 9:28:56 PM PDT by FredZarguna (It looks just like a Telefunken U-47. In leather.)
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To: gusty
That is remaining a virgin until your funeral.

Uh, huh, and then what?..:=)

Thanks FRiend!

15 posted on 05/17/2011 9:29:26 PM PDT by PROCON (Liberals Mistake Education and Knowledge for Wisdom and Common Sense.)
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To: PROCON; 185JHP; AFA-Michigan; Abathar; Agitate; Albion Wilde; AliVeritas; Antoninus; Aquinasfan; ...
Homosexual Agenda Ping

Freepmail wagglebee to subscribe or unsubscribe from the homosexual agenda ping list.

Be sure to click the FreeRepublic homosexual agenda keyword search link for a list of all related articles. We don't ping you to all related articles so be sure to click the previous link to see the latest articles.

Add keywords homosexual agenda to flag FR articles to this ping list.

I disagree with most of the premise. Obviously homosexuality was the cause. Sheesh. And there was a concerted "lavender mafia" in the Catholic Church. And some men and women are just not cut out for life long celibacy; it is a vocation that some have and some do not have. But celibacy is not the cause of men being attracted to boys; the cause of that is homosexual infiltration.

16 posted on 05/17/2011 9:31:08 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: SatinDoll

Thats all fine and good, but I’m talking in general terms. Even if what I stated is true for only 15-25%, you still have a disaster on your hands.


17 posted on 05/17/2011 9:31:13 PM PDT by gusty
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To: PROCON

And after. Unless you remember that old Sam Kinison routine.


18 posted on 05/17/2011 9:32:50 PM PDT by gusty
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To: PROCON

LOL - That’s a new one. Don’t blame it on the homos. Blame it on the hippies.


19 posted on 05/17/2011 9:34:49 PM PDT by SeeSharp
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To: gusty

One of the weird things I noticed about the U.S.Navy, is the preponderance of gay men who were dedicated ship riders. But when you think about it, that isn’t really so strange.

Homosexual men want to be with other men. They definitely have a problem with the presence of women and do not want to associate with them.

OK. So some men become designers of women’s clothes - but they do not create clothes to make women look like women; have straight guys ever realized that!

It makes sense then that homosexual men would be attracted to the celibate priesthood. Most of their dealings would be with men who are other priests.


20 posted on 05/17/2011 9:39:58 PM PDT by SatinDoll (NOT FOREIGN NATIONALS AS OUR PRESIDENT)
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To: little jeremiah
But celibacy is not the cause of men being attracted to boys; the cause of that is homosexual infiltration.

That is the most precise, well-thought out reason I have ever heard!

Thanks!

21 posted on 05/17/2011 9:41:06 PM PDT by PROCON (Liberals Mistake Education and Knowledge for Wisdom and Common Sense.)
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To: gusty; SatinDoll

I’ve got an idea, no forcing men into the priesthood any more! Only volunteers who want to be celibate! And no homos! Problem solved.


22 posted on 05/17/2011 9:42:02 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: SatinDoll

Who you hang out with does not have any bearing on ones sexuality. It is who you want to jump into the sack with that does.


23 posted on 05/17/2011 9:45:05 PM PDT by gusty
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To: PROCON

Aw shucks, it just came to me in a flash of insight. ///


24 posted on 05/17/2011 9:45:30 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: PROCON

Extremely stupid study that tries to obscure the homosexuality—man/boy —connection. It is obvious by the numbers and obvious through history that homosexuality is rampant with pederasty. It is a learned behavior...most of the abusers were molested as boys by men. That is the only study that would prove anything.....that homosexuality is learned and the compulsion to perpetuate the behavior is because of childhood abuse that is so ingrained that the obsession for the reoccurrence of those sexual thrills are really too hard to repress. It is unnatural.

The Catholic Church needs to connect the dots....how many of those priests were molested by men when they were boys. I read where lots of them were victims when they were boys. Homosexuals want people to think it is a “natural” behavior that is “genetic”. Rubbish!!!!!! It is a learned behavior and homosexuals want to molest boys, as well as young men.

It is why boys in Afghanistan can’t wait to have their stable of boys to sodomize. It is learned...just like in Ancient Greece. Study Aristotle.....habituation.....it is not that hard to comprehend. It is a behavior and because it is sexual arousal brought up in childhood—it is ingrained and hard to fight. It is why NAMBLA’s motto is—if not by eight, then it is too late.

It is why the Cultural Marxist want sex ed in Kindergarten and elementary schools...to condition and brainwash children into thinking the unnatural is natural. Then the thought of homosexual acts will be considered icky by normally raised children and they won’t be willing to experiment in that lifestyle. It is all about making the unnatural natural.

The Christian worldview prevented homosexuality from being mainstreamed in Western Civilization after it got rid of the pagan worldview which was rampant with homosexuality and pederasty and all unnatural sexual acts and slavery and women as second class citizens or worse.


25 posted on 05/17/2011 9:47:30 PM PDT by savagesusie
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To: little jeremiah

Better idea. Let priests marry (a women) like a normal guy.


26 posted on 05/17/2011 9:47:59 PM PDT by gusty
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To: gusty

You’re confusing the two.

There is no proof homosexuality is biological in origin. If that were true, there would be no switching from homosexuality to heterosexuality (and vice versa).

It appears that human sexuality is very flexible, and that instead of the “I was born this way” it is “I can’t help that I feel this way”. In other words, a personality disorder.


27 posted on 05/17/2011 9:50:55 PM PDT by SatinDoll (NOT FOREIGN NATIONALS AS OUR PRESIDENT)
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To: little jeremiah
it just came to me in a flash of insight.///

And we both know WHO gave you those words, don't we..:=)

28 posted on 05/17/2011 9:50:55 PM PDT by PROCON (Liberals Mistake Education and Knowledge for Wisdom and Common Sense.)
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To: gusty

I’ve got an idea. Don’t become a priest if you don’t want to be celibate.

Some people have a vocation for celibacy. Human beings have free will and are meant to use control over their senses and not run after every single object that they happen to desire. If you don’t want to become a celibate priest or monk, no one is forcing you. And no one is forcing the men who join the priesthood or monasteries, or women who become nuns.

It’s a voluntary austerity they take to serve God. And it is common in other religions as well, as a way to sacrifice for God. If others want to do it, why do you object? It’s all voluntary.


29 posted on 05/17/2011 9:51:42 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: onyx
Don’t need a study to know that the offending priests were and are queer pedophiles: the majority of victims were ages 10-14.

Exactly. Did the study look at how many of the offending priests classified themselves as homosexual? Doubt it. People get too hung up on the word "pedophile", which is prepubescent children (male or female) and for which the offenders can be gay or straight. But the victims here are older, and those offenders are referred to as "pederasts". The victims are almost exclusively boys, and the offenders are almost 100% homosexual. That's the dirty secret no one wants to talk about.

The article is covers this up by saying that homosexuality is not a cause. Homosexuality is different from pederasty, as pederasty is a sub-set of homosexual behavior. So, technically correct, but a damnable lie all the same.

30 posted on 05/17/2011 9:53:40 PM PDT by GreatOne (You will bow down before me, Son of Jor-el!)
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To: gusty
My theory is that celibacy attracts those who are homosexual or deviant.

Or morally tough. I know a lot of priests, and they include the best men I know. Basically, if you're not giving anything up if you swear off women, they don't want you at most seminaries today. Certainly didn't seem to be the case in the 1970s, but the landscape has changed.

Young priests today are very conservative, very self-disciplined, and they are the future. Many of the older ones hate this about them. (TS.)

31 posted on 05/17/2011 9:55:50 PM PDT by SamuraiScot
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To: SatinDoll

I never stated what the origin of homosexuality is. I have no idea to be honest. I just use the old Dice Clay definition. You either do or you don’t (I cleaned it up a bit). In my own case, one look at Barbara Eden on “I Dream of Jeannie” when very young, I knew which side I wanted to be on.


32 posted on 05/17/2011 9:56:23 PM PDT by gusty
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To: max americana

I hadn’t noticed AP, but you’re right about that outfit!


33 posted on 05/17/2011 9:58:31 PM PDT by onyx (If you truly support Sarah Palin and want to be on her busy ping list, let me know!)
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To: little jeremiah
You are going to need interrogators from Gitmo to separate the good from the bad at the seminaries.
34 posted on 05/17/2011 9:59:51 PM PDT by gusty
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To: savagesusie
I didn't see your analysis while typing mine, but well said! I've said for years that homosexual behavior is a developmental behavioral disorder. There's no evidence you're born with it, and it's not a psychological defect like other disorders. It's learned behavior from how you were treated while growing up, and doesn't necessarily mean one was molested to engage in the behavior as an adult. Dr. Charles Socarides did a lot of studies on this.

Look at how many women become lesbians later in life. Too many times screwed over by men is always the story. But this phenomena is never mentioned when discussing male homosexual behavior, for obvious reasons.

35 posted on 05/17/2011 10:00:49 PM PDT by GreatOne (You will bow down before me, Son of Jor-el!)
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To: SatinDoll

Yes but you are a woman..quite a different celibate animal than a man

And not capable of the same level of pederasty as a rule if you fall


36 posted on 05/17/2011 10:05:34 PM PDT by wardaddy (ok...Trump beating on Obama---Sarah----Michelle.....any of them are ok for now---tain't picky)
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To: GreatOne
Did the study look at how many of the offending priests classified themselves as homosexual? Doubt it.

I doubt it, too. Why ask the direct question when it's so much fun to avoid the issue?

Thank you very mch for your detailed explanation and your PREFECT© conclusion:

The victims are almost exclusively boys, and the offenders are almost 100% homosexual. That's the dirty secret no one wants to talk about.

The article is covers this up by saying that homosexuality is not a cause. Homosexuality is different from pederasty, as pederasty is a sub-set of homosexual behavior. So, technically correct, but a damnable lie all the same.

37 posted on 05/17/2011 10:06:17 PM PDT by onyx (If you truly support Sarah Palin and want to be on her busy ping list, let me know!)
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To: gusty

LOL!


38 posted on 05/17/2011 10:08:46 PM PDT by SatinDoll (NOT FOREIGN NATIONALS AS OUR PRESIDENT)
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To: wardaddy

And you would know how.....


39 posted on 05/17/2011 10:10:34 PM PDT by SatinDoll (NOT FOREIGN NATIONALS AS OUR PRESIDENT)
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To: little jeremiah

Why do I object. Personally it doesn’t effect me. I’m not Catholic. I am looking at it from a systems point of view. The way it is set up will lead to abuses. It is a symbiosis of celibacy colliding with homosexuality. Do not put your head in the sand, believe me a large segment of the American public equate Catholic priests and pedophiles together. Be honest, how many jokes have you heard like that. Many if your are honest. The jokes would not be funny unless there was some truth to them.


40 posted on 05/17/2011 10:11:15 PM PDT by gusty
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To: SatinDoll

So true...it took years for my wife to realize what I was telling her...that her homo pal who cut her hair wanted her to look like a little boy actually

I do like Karl Lagerfield even myself as a designer of clothes for chicks...gay as hell but very pro life and conservative by Euro standards


41 posted on 05/17/2011 10:11:17 PM PDT by wardaddy (ok...Trump beating on Obama---Sarah----Michelle.....any of them are ok for now---tain't picky)
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To: gusty

Percantagewise, more public school teachers molest kids, both opposite and same sex, than has ever happened in the Catholic priesthood.

Maybe they should allow teachers to get married!

Oh wait....


42 posted on 05/17/2011 10:14:28 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: PROCON
The John Jay researchers, however, said that the offenders chose boys mainly because the clergy had greater access to them.

I doubt it.

Normal heterosexual adult males do not find 12 year old boys to be sexually attractive, no matter how accessible they are.

Do the Jay researchers presume that the offenders would have sexually assaulted any human being who was available? If the pederast priests had been given access only to 80 year old women, then -- ?

It would be helpful to know what percentage of pederasts are homosexual and vice-versa. I have been unable to find an agenda-free source for that information.

43 posted on 05/17/2011 10:18:26 PM PDT by TChad
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To: gusty

There is an excellent book about the Lavender Mafia that purposely infiltrated the Catholic Church and once a bunch of fags got in the church they covered up for each other and some seminaries wouldn’t even let normal men in.

It was a homosexual problem, not a celibacy problem. And it’s getting fixed now.

The problem is the normalization and promotion of homosexuality and any sexual deviancy and immorality, that is the actual problem. Not celibacy.

And what about those who are not married? Do they all become pederasts just because they aren’t married? Do all celibate people become deviants? All religions teach that people should refrain from sex until marriage. People who follow this standard don’t all become homosexual predators.

It’s not the celibacy, it’s the fagggotry. Keep fags out of the seminaries and the problem is solved.

And of course the media loves it because the media hates God and anything that besmirches the Catholic church is a festival for them.


44 posted on 05/17/2011 10:19:11 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: little jeremiah

That reminds me of a post I read on FR a year or two back. When I read it I nearly fell out of my chair laughing. It was in response to one of those female teacher with 16 year old boy stories. This guy wrote that for a 16 year old boy all sex was good, unless you were walking bowlegged out of the rectory.


45 posted on 05/17/2011 10:20:19 PM PDT by gusty
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To: little jeremiah

As I stated before, no nookie until marriage is not what I am talking about. A lifetime of no nookie is. Be honest, what normal guy what sign up for that. For the sake of argument, if there was a rash of incidents for the last couple of decades of priests fooling around with adult women, do you think the Catholic Church would have a bigger or lesser mess on its hands.


46 posted on 05/17/2011 10:28:47 PM PDT by gusty
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To: little jeremiah

The instances of abuse have decreased very sharply since the late 70’s early 80’s. I think part of that is due to the homosexualists not having a reason to turn to the priesthood in order to “hide” as it became more acceptable to be an open homosexualist in general society, especially in a group that officially teaches what they do is a sin. Most of the sickos seem to be are old queens or dead, being ordained in the late 40’s-60’s. The younger priests all seem conservative as opposed to their elder peers.

The bottom line is like you said, don’t let homosexualists become priests.

Freegards


47 posted on 05/17/2011 10:30:03 PM PDT by Ransomed
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To: Ransomed

You could be right. Your reasoning seems logical. Question, as I don’t know, has there been a drop in the number of men taking up the priesthood in the present, or has the numbers remained consistent with the past. And if it has dropped, what problem in staffing will this create.


48 posted on 05/17/2011 10:36:29 PM PDT by gusty
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To: gusty

Some men have the fortitude or the self-sacrifice to give up marriage for serving God. Not many, but some. And what about men who can’t find a wife? Or whose wives cannot perform their marital function due to health problems? There are many situations where human beings need to restrain the sexual urge. Come on, we’re not animals. We have will power. And there are ways to tame the sexual impulse, or inflame it.


49 posted on 05/17/2011 10:38:13 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: Ransomed; gusty

That is good news. And from what I’ve read, there is some increase in the numbers of men and women entering into holy orders (if that is the right term) lately. Young men and women who want to serve God and are willing to sacrifice marriage and all that entails.


50 posted on 05/17/2011 10:41:27 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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