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Sell a few rabbits, earn $200 Obama fines you $90,000
Radio Vice Online ^ | May 20, 2010 | Steve McGough

Posted on 05/20/2011 8:00:25 AM PDT by Steve495

That’s right. I’m putting this right at the feet of the president himself. A family in Missouri has been fined more than $90,000 by the US Department of Agriculture for selling more than $500 of the furry creatures in less than one year. The families profit was a whopping $200 for the year.

(Excerpt) Read more at radioviceonline.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; News/Current Events; US: Montana
KEYWORDS: federal; fine; government; rabbits; regulation; usda; waiver
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1 posted on 05/20/2011 8:00:31 AM PDT by Steve495
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To: Steve495

Liberalism is a mental disease.


2 posted on 05/20/2011 8:01:31 AM PDT by screaminsunshine (Shut up and eat your Beans!)
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To: Steve495
No problem.

All they have to do is ask for a waiver.

Washington hands them out like party favors.

3 posted on 05/20/2011 8:03:50 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Islamophobia: The fear of offending Muslims because they are prone to violence.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

HA....I was thinking yesterday....when I hit 65 or whatever age they REQUIRE you to join Medicare, I’m going to tell all the medical places....”I have a waiver.” I’ll let them try and prove I don’t.....


4 posted on 05/20/2011 8:05:37 AM PDT by goodnesswins (Unlike the West, the Islamic world is serious.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum
No problem. All they have to do is ask for a waiver. Washington hands them out like party favors.

Yeah, but you may need to "grease the skids" to get it to happen. The good news is that it will only take political donations of $10k to make that $90k fine go away. A bargain.

5 posted on 05/20/2011 8:07:32 AM PDT by kevkrom (Palin's detractors now resort to "nobody believes she can win because nobody believes she can win")
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To: Steve495
It's probably safe to assume these are not some of Holder's Peiople.

It has been well said that really up-to-date liberals do not care what
people do, as long as it is compulsory.
-- George Will


6 posted on 05/20/2011 8:10:18 AM PDT by Iron Munro (Every day we now throw away things people will kill for after TEOTWAWKI)
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To: Steve495
That's what's wrong with bureaucrats, they are breeding like rabbits.
7 posted on 05/20/2011 8:12:28 AM PDT by dblshot (Insanity - electing the same people over and over and expecting different results.)
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To: Steve495

If you’re self sufficient, and not dependent on government and liberals,

you’ll have a big ol’ target on your back.

You’re one of those people that will have to be eliminated before their utopia can come to fruition.


8 posted on 05/20/2011 8:12:48 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter knows whom he's working for)
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To: Steve495
There has to be a bit more to this story for there to be justification of a $90k fine by the USDA. Perhaps the family *has* gone over a guilty line, and thus the find. Some possibilities that might explain this:

1. Taking republican ballots in previous primaries?

2. Donations to conservative political campaigns?

3. Running for office, local or otherwise, on the republican ticket?

4. Serving on a local Republican Town Committee?

9 posted on 05/20/2011 8:16:59 AM PDT by C210N (0bama, Making the US safe for Global Marxism)
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To: Steve495

$200/year.

I made about the same in the 8th/9th grade selling mice and rats to the pet stores for snake feed.


10 posted on 05/20/2011 8:18:19 AM PDT by Rebelbase
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To: Iron Munro

ROFLMAO! ‘Broccoli Stem...’ That made my day! :)


11 posted on 05/20/2011 8:18:41 AM PDT by Diana in Wisconsin (I don't have 'Hobbies.' I'm developing a robust post-Apocalyptic skill set...)
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To: Rebelbase

Until people start eating mice and rats, I think you’d be flying under the radar.

What the ruling class despises is the idea that they can’t control you through controlling your food supply when you raise/grow your own food.

There was an article a while back about a man getting targeted for having “too big” of a garden.


12 posted on 05/20/2011 8:20:50 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter knows whom he's working for)
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To: Steve495

Why can the USDA intervene if no interstate commerce is involved? This fine should be appealed in the courts.


13 posted on 05/20/2011 8:21:01 AM PDT by The Great RJ (1`1)
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To: screaminsunshine
Liberalism is a mental disease.

Communism is more like it. We have such a bloated form of government from the cities, counties, States and especially the Federal Government that all they want to do is make laws to prohibit us from our freedoms. In order for the bloated government to survive they must fine or tax us to death and offer nothing for own own choice. We are all criminals by the millions of laws forced on us. No longer free choice from light bulbs to what color you want to paint your house.

14 posted on 05/20/2011 8:21:08 AM PDT by Logical me
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To: Steve495

I’ll bet the $90,000 is not a figure snatched out of the air. It’s how much the USDA spent investigating the case.


15 posted on 05/20/2011 8:25:20 AM PDT by B4Ranch (Allowing Islam into America is akin to injecting yourself with AIDS to prove how tolerant you are..)
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To: Steve495

Puts me in mind of Rhonda the Rabbit Lady, who appeared in Michael Moore’s first film, Roger and Me. She was the one selling rabbits out of her home “for pets or meat”.

Turns out that not only did Moore not share his enormous riches gained from the film with her, but it also caused the state to shut her down since she did not have the proper permits to sell meat for human consumption.

I met her a short time afterward. She had been forced to take a job slinging hash in a Kmart cafeteria.


16 posted on 05/20/2011 8:26:52 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: The Great RJ

Wickard v Filburn


17 posted on 05/20/2011 8:28:10 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter knows whom he's working for)
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To: Steve495

Notice, if you look at the main letter copy, that the signer is someone named Sarah Conant. However... the signature of this person reads...... “C~~nt” as far as is legibly discernable.

Interesting how federal bureaucrats self identify. Helps them with later federally paid therapy.

What sheer idiocy. I would say that these folks would have had a better chance if they did this through 4H, at least no fines.


18 posted on 05/20/2011 8:28:19 AM PDT by John S Mosby (Sic Semper Tyrannis)
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To: C210N
Hmm, $90K+ fine for not having a license.

I do believe the fault is in their not having responded to earlier correspondence. Given the way this particular letter is put together ~ or should I say chunked together ~ I have no doubt the people receiving the others had no idea at all they were supposed to answer it in some way.

The USDA could use my services, but first they will have to fire half the staff over there ~ when this kind of stuff goes out asking for that much money ~ on a billing that looks like one of those scam operations ~ that means the people behind it are INEDUCABLE!

19 posted on 05/20/2011 8:29:48 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Steve495
Did you really think that we want those laws to be observed? ...We want them broken... We're after power and we mean it... There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What's there in that for anyone? But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced nor objectively interpreted - and you create a nation of law-breakers - and then you cash in on guilt.

(Dr. Floyd Ferris, Atlas Shrugged)

20 posted on 05/20/2011 8:35:11 AM PDT by reegs
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To: Steve495
The whole story at Big Government is worth reading.

The government admits wanting to make an example of them.

21 posted on 05/20/2011 8:35:22 AM PDT by FourPeas ("Maladjusted and wigging out is no way to go through life, son." -hg)
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To: muawiyah

I’m willing to bet a few dollars the family never received any sort of official notice that informed them they needed a license. If it was “multiple times” the USDA would send out letters certified mail and the USDA would be able to prove they were received.

The fine notice was sent certified. If the others were sent certified - as they should have been - I don’t think the family would publicly say they were never told what they were doing wrong.


22 posted on 05/20/2011 8:36:34 AM PDT by Steve495
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To: The Great RJ

Little bit of a distortion here, they were selling rabbit meat, you cannot run a slaughter house in this country without a license and a food inspector.


23 posted on 05/20/2011 8:37:41 AM PDT by org.whodat
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To: Steve495

Don’t sell animals for food unless they are inspected and tagged by the state/USDA.

My chickens were inspected, tested and tagged. Nice and legal. No fines, no nothing. Granted, I sell the eggs not the meat.


24 posted on 05/20/2011 8:38:42 AM PDT by Peter from Rutland
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To: Rebelbase
During the Reagan era, Michael Moore did the movie "Roger & Me". One of the most hard hitting scenes was on the woman who raised rabbits in her back yard and sold them for $5 dressed out. She would club it over the head, gut it, and skin it. It was to define the hardship of croney capitalism and how it is so cruel to the "people".

Oh my, how history repeats itself. The film was released in 1989, but was filmed in 87/88.

25 posted on 05/20/2011 8:42:07 AM PDT by blackdog (The mystery of government is not how Washington works but how to make it stop)
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To: MrB

That is a case LONG overdue for a revisit.


26 posted on 05/20/2011 8:43:49 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (explosive bolts, ten thousand volts at a million miles an hour)
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To: Steve495
They were not sent a "notice" of the sort you are thinking about ~ more like an "advisory statement", with the presumption being the guy on the other end knows all about this.

We also sent Final Agency Notice via certified mail.

From that point on if you still had a complaint, you had to go to court.

Fur Shur some were smart enough to know to get a lawyer and he'd immediately send in a letter for "a reconsideration" ~ which was rarely given.

When you get something from some of these federales you probably ought to call a lawyer who specializes in that agency.

27 posted on 05/20/2011 8:45:27 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah
When you get something from some of these federales you probably ought to call a lawyer who specializes in that agency.

As sure a sign we are dealing with too much bureaucracy as anything else I could think of.

28 posted on 05/20/2011 8:48:18 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (explosive bolts, ten thousand volts at a million miles an hour)
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To: Steve495

Things must be real slow at Department of Agriculture.


29 posted on 05/20/2011 8:49:09 AM PDT by Vaduz
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To: Steve495

Outrageous.


30 posted on 05/20/2011 8:49:59 AM PDT by EternalVigilance (GOP mantra: 'Repeal and replace.' Translation? 'We can do socialism better than the Democrats.')
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To: MrB

And the Kulaks are saying, from their graves, “we told you so!”


31 posted on 05/20/2011 8:51:44 AM PDT by Trailerpark Badass (I'm sick of damn idiots)
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To: org.whodat

Can you provide a link that shows they were running a slaughter house? Big Government indicates they were - at the beginning - selling some rabbits for meat, not slaughtering them. Is there a difference between selling for meat and selling meat?

They started this venture more than six years ago, and the official notice from the USDA does not mention selling meat, and only mentions violations starting four years ago. Were they selling rabbit meat or rabbits for meat prior to April 2008?


32 posted on 05/20/2011 8:53:19 AM PDT by Steve495
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To: Vaduz

Wasn’t it just last month they spent a year investigating an Amish guy who sold milk?


33 posted on 05/20/2011 8:55:37 AM PDT by Venturer
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To: Peter from Rutland
“Don’t sell animals for food unless they are inspected and tagged by the state/USDA.”

Why???
Do people not ask why anymore? Why do we need to have the government's permission to do everything?
Did Founders of our nation intend (and fight an die) that we needed a government bureaucracy to give permission to sell a handful of chickens or rabbits to a neighbor?

Why?????

34 posted on 05/20/2011 8:56:39 AM PDT by HereInTheHeartland (Those who endured Valley Forge didn't make their sacrifice to give us free health care)
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To: Trailerpark Badass

In the end, everyone who had their own food was a Kulak.


35 posted on 05/20/2011 8:57:02 AM PDT by massgopguy (I owe everything to George Bailey)
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To: Dead Corpse
When you get something from some of these federales you probably ought to call a lawyer who specializes in that agency.

I just shake my head when I read some of what is written on FR. Some posters (who almost certainly have never run a business in their entire life) apparently think that small business people have money machines at their disposal which they are able to use whenever they want to to pay other people to act as go-betweens with the federal gov't.

36 posted on 05/20/2011 8:58:17 AM PDT by vbmoneyspender
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To: HereInTheHeartland
I almost want to go out and get one the hippie bumper stickers from the 1960’s that says “Question Authority”
37 posted on 05/20/2011 8:59:27 AM PDT by HereInTheHeartland (Those who endured Valley Forge didn't make their sacrifice to give us free health care)
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To: muawiyah

“We also sent Final Agency Notice via certified mail.”

So are you part of the agency that can’t seem to use their brains in a situation like this? This is another example of zero tolerance BS.

There is no excuse for demanding $90,000 from this family, government over-bearing regulation and stupidity.


38 posted on 05/20/2011 9:00:02 AM PDT by Steve495
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To: FourPeas
One bulldyke at a field office ~ there's always somebody like that.

Even straight women can be a problem ~ we had one who you'd see sometimes sitting there watching her watch waiting for the big hand to swing past the 12 so that she could DENY an appeal for not having been filed within the time limit.

Not all the employees are like that ~ frequently the good guys put stumbling blocks in the way of the jerks just to make sure abuse does not happen.

Sounds like USDA had a critical senior employee retire suddenly which left the idiots in charge of things.

Bet they redesigned the billing document (which seems to be of local, not national, design) first thing so they could have some giggles.

"Yeah, let's put the $3 million on bedbug letter #13 ~ that'll make 'em stand up straight"

39 posted on 05/20/2011 9:00:28 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Steve495
You should read my background sheet to see who I mean by "we" ~ and "we" in this case is NOT USDA.

They were down the street. Their headquarters has at least one murder a year. Our headquarters building never had a murder ~ ever ~ but theirs does one a year. It's dysfunctional and should be seriously reorganized.

40 posted on 05/20/2011 9:02:12 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Steve495
I think if you google their names you will find rabbit meat for sell. Selling live rabbits is no more against the law than selling goats, chickens, pigs, cows, etc. A few years ago I ran into a little fellow pulling a small trailer, I ask him what he had in the trailer he said rabbits. Seems he was from new York and he had suppliers in north Carolina raising rabbits for sell in new York city. Have no idea who slaughtered them but his were alive. He said he paid five dollars a live rabbit.!
41 posted on 05/20/2011 9:03:28 AM PDT by org.whodat
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To: vbmoneyspender
Look, an initial consultation with an attorney IS ORDINARILY FREE OF CHARGE.

These specialists will usually let you know the score. In this case the people contacted a lawyer who specialized in USDA (et al) and he seems to have advised them to GET OUT OF THE BUSINESS RIGHT NOW.

Which they did.

They are now getting fined for not having called that same guy earlier.

42 posted on 05/20/2011 9:04:31 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: HereInTheHeartland

Because if you sell eggs to someone and your chickens carry disease you will be “intercoursed skyward”.

The laws protect the consumer. It also protects me from:

- potential lawsuits
- if the animals are lost they are tagged and can be identified
- my health since I eat them too


43 posted on 05/20/2011 9:04:45 AM PDT by Peter from Rutland
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To: The Great RJ
Why can the USDA intervene if no interstate commerce is involved?

I take it you're not familiar with Wickard v Fillburn or Gonzales v. Raich? Look them up and find your answer. Then refer to my tagline for summation.

44 posted on 05/20/2011 9:05:36 AM PDT by Huck (The Antifederalists were right.)
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To: org.whodat
Little bit of a distortion here, they were selling rabbit meat, you cannot run a slaughter house in this country without a license and a food inspector.

Actually the article says they started by selling rabbits FOR meat not the meat itself. This is not a slaughterhouse as the animals were sold live and processed elsewhere. The principal is the same as a hog producer selling to Hormel.

45 posted on 05/20/2011 9:07:22 AM PDT by Cowman (How can the IRS seize property without a warrant if the 4th amendment still stands?)
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To: Dead Corpse

Wickard was revisited recently, and reaffirmed. Scalia wrote a concurring opinion. Thomas wrote a scathing dissent.


46 posted on 05/20/2011 9:08:01 AM PDT by Huck (The Antifederalists were right.)
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To: Peter from Rutland
“The laws protect the consumer. It also protects me from:

- potential lawsuits
- if the animals are lost they are tagged and can be identified
- my health since I eat them too

Yeah I understand all of that logic.
But my point is that we have gotten so used to the government giving us “permission” to do activities like this; we just can't think of a world any differently which is wrong.

How about you and people like you do what is right for food safety because it is the right thing to do?
And if someone does get sick; they can come after you.

And you can choose to do whatever inspections you want to. Not because a govt agency tells you to.

47 posted on 05/20/2011 9:08:34 AM PDT by HereInTheHeartland (Those who endured Valley Forge didn't make their sacrifice to give us free health care)
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To: Iron Munro
It has been well said that really up-to-date liberals do not care what
people do, as long as it is compulsory.
-- George Will

Gov. Mike Dukakis, who was the Donk candidate against GHWB, was known in his home state of Massachusetts as Mandatory Mike. Liberalism is primarily about government power, which is to say, compulsion.

48 posted on 05/20/2011 9:18:01 AM PDT by cynwoody
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To: muawiyah
Their headquarters has at least one murder a year.

Is that called going ag?

49 posted on 05/20/2011 9:21:54 AM PDT by cynwoody
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To: Cowman
Apparently the government disagree with what you say they were doing, and since they agreed it is a moot case. I believe the old advertisement I found was for frozen rabbit meat.
50 posted on 05/20/2011 9:24:21 AM PDT by org.whodat
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