I saw that dialog. I couldn't figure out if Fred was an adult (he made some good points) or a two yesr old ("Please go drink your Kool-Aid over at DU").
But I'll play Devil's Advocate. Suppose we continue with the government in charge of health care (in fact more in control by the time Obama is gone). Will there be enough money to pay for all this? If not, then those seniors will be out of luck. Without controlling entitlements, taxes would have to go up, the private sector ruined and unable to help anyone. Down that path, it might be even worse for the seniors.
Come on DDfD , you are very smart and knowledgeable too hanging around me :) but I will answer anyway since this topic gets me going like Obama-care did, You know medicare is ALREADY broke and being paid by the Federal reserve printing money. You know a private citizen cannot do that. So many (age matters) seniors themselves will still be better off with with death panels than being thrown into the alley when paralyzed by that stroke if they dont have a huge amount of savings.
Is everyone else better off in that case? You know the answer to that, I dont have to tell you. But because of that Ryan has to sell a plan of helping people when they are young by abandoning them when they get old which his plan really does, that is a tough sell.
My # 1 issue is tell the truth about both scenarios. And one important truth is no elected president of either party would ever sign this particular proposal into law if it got that far. That is the bottom line, and it is why I suggested a more realistic alternative that would not have sunk the R party before it started.
Great points in a vaccuum. It's always easy mentally to look at all issues as either all pros or all cons so life appears simple as black or white, until your white gets slaughtered in the election like 2006 and 2008 and ???. after which sometimes some people wake up and ask questions, the sign of a true subversive.