Skip to comments.North Korea Tests 'Super-EMP' Nuke
Posted on 06/20/2011 10:09:45 AM PDT by justlittleoleme
North Koreas last round of tests, conducted in May 2009, appear to have included a super-EMP weapon, capable of emitting enough gamma rays to disable the electric power grid across most of the lower 48 states, says Dr. Peter Vincent Pry, a former CIA nuclear weapons analyst and president of EMPact America, a citizens lobbying group.
Samore, who handles arms control and non-proliferation issues, warned that additional strong sanctions will be imposed on the North with the support of Russia and China."
North Koreas nuclear tests have been dismissed as failures by some analysts because of their low explosive yield. But Dr. Pry believes they bore the signature of the Russian-designed super-EMP weapon, capable of emitting more gamma radiation than a 25-megaton nuclear weapon.
Rep. Trent Franks, who authored the SHIELD Act, warned of catastrophic consequences should Congress fail to act.
The U.S. society and economy are so critically dependent upon the availability of electricity that a significant collapse of the grid, precipitated by a major natural or man-made EMP event, could result in catastrophic civilian casualties, he said. This vulnerability, if left unaddressed, could have grave, societal altering consequences.
(Excerpt) Read more at newsmax.com ...
I hope that's an exaggeration.
The EMP is a great ‘first strike’ weapon.
During a possible conflict, any site capable of launching such a weapon would be destroyed during the fueling stages. This is a weapon you launch to start an offensive; not after a conflict has been engaged.
So....where, exactly, did they test it?
Confirmation of such via what?
Send Jimmy Carter with check book ASAP>
That's nice. How?
If the Norks wanted to first strike us, all they'd have to do is tell us the rocket they were about to launch was "just a harmless test". They launch it...and by the time we realize what they've done, it's too late. POP! and the entire electrical grid, as well as all the computers and fancy-dancy electronic stuff we rely on...gone.
It may not be, but the statement could also be read as an indictment of the condition of our power grid. This administration seems to have made every effort to get as many power plants off the grid as possible, and make it as difficult as possible to add new ones, so it might not take much to bring the whole grid down.
Next, North Korea plans to develop an electrical grid to test the weapon.
if it's a solid fuel missile, that implies bombing the factory...
First strike? It is a single strike weapon. The grid goes down and there is chaos. It would take years to recover.
Life expectancy would drop to 1850’s levels.
Dr. Peter Vincent Pry, a former CIA nuclear weapons analyst and president of EMPact America,
Says it all! I can see those contracts rolling in.
Just think.... they could reduce us to a turd world islamic state before Obama....
Ever watch the fueling of the Apollo rockets during the Moon launch days? Notice the frost and ice, amidst the fog? When you fill a rocket, there is a pressure change as you are filling a volume (P=nVRT).
The Vessel will get cold.
We can see that; just like they can see ours.
You mean they finally got something better than a fizzle with their nukes?
I wonder what Dumbo might suggest?
Apologize for America
Ask Holder to look into this
Demand North Korea hire our unemployed to help out?
Take out a Mullah
Ask yourself, what would happen to our nuclear power plants in an EMP attack? I'll go with total meltdown - across the country.
Oh, I understand that...what I wonder is: How do we know WHAT is in the payload? If they’ve got one of these ‘super-EMP’ weapons, how do we know? It might be a harmles dummy payload, or it might be a USA-ending weapon. How would we know?
“ONE SECOND AFTER” By WILLIAM R. FORSTCHEN
Interesting book, although the author is not the best storyteller. Doesn't understand that good writing is about showing, not telling. Misses several key opportunities to hit this one out of the park.
Actually it would be lower. In the 1850s, people had the skills, knowledge and infrastructure to live in a functioning 1850s level society.
Not too many 21st century Americans and Europeans would have the slightest idea how to get food and shelter if there was a sudden permanent loss of access to electricity. Moreover, the breakdown of society would mean that there would be no recognized private property, other than what people could take and protect by their own use of force.
To say nothing of the loss of respect for one another and work ethic that characterized what was then a largely Judeo-Christian society.
I know we have an abundance of hearty, self-sufficient, gun-toting, food growing Freepers (alas, I am not one), but everyone else would essentially be screwed.
Dang, you beat me.
If China really wanted to screw us, they would tell Little Kim to launch the EMP. He gives the order from a helicopter heading to the Chinese border. So we nuke North Korea, so what? China can toss a nuke at us via their proxy, and then have plausible deniability against retaliation.
Ask yourself, what would happen to our nuclear power plants in a lightening strike?
Keyword: electronic circuit breaker
Nuke plants should be very well protected from gamma due to all the rebar and metal in the outer buildings. The control systems would essentially be protected by multiple Faraday cages.
A very interesting question. At Fukushima, I think the earthquake didn't do anything really massive to the nuclear plants. And I think the tsunami didn't do anything really massive to the nuclear plants. But those events did create a power outage and the power outage led to meltdowns.
I don't think Japan expected such a turn of events, and it is not clear to me that America has either.
EMP is well known and measurable. They don’t need to build a grid to test it.
All our serious enemies (Iran, NK, Chavez, Castro,...) understand that successfully delivering a high EMP yield weapon would be a knockout blow. We would be left with our submarines. They could destroy all our enemies. That should be made clear to the Russians and Chinese. They may be able to knock out our electric grid, but they will have nothing left but smoldering craters.
I doubt it.
Keep in mind, that North Korea is a proxy for the Chinese military, which is drooling at the prospect of attacking the U.S....but doesn't want to be counter-attacked. Hence the use of a decoy nation. Which we have been altogether too lame about accepting as an "independent" just regarding it as a "friend" of China's.... not the puppet it is.
We should be telling the Chicoms that if North Korea attacks us...they will be held directly responsible...first and foremost.
Uh...That should be PV=nRT. And the frost you see on those rockets comes from the liquid oxygen and/or liquid hydrogen part of the propellant.
“Life expectancy would drop to 1850s levels.”
It would be WAY less than 1950’s levels, since all the survival/farming/hunting skills have been lost. PLUS, with no electricy to refrigerate food, or run gas pumps, etc., mass STARVATION would ensue in just WEEKS! The few remaining would ENVY the people of Angola!
1) The Apollo rockets used LOX/Kerosene for the first stage, and LOX/LH2 for the second and third stages. LOX and LH2 frost the vents on their containers when filled, because LOX and LH2 are COLD. LOX ~ 90K, LH2 ~ 20K. The frost has nothing to do with pressure changes while filling a volume.
2) The North Korean Taepodong missile is powered by nitric acid/kerosene. Neither of these is cold, but both are liquid. There may be detectable venting of gases, but it won't be the frost and fog of a Saturn V.
3) US ballistic missiles (currently Minuteman III and Trident II) are solid fueled.
Most likely nothing would happen to the nuke plant itself. They would lose the external infrastructure such as transformers, generators, and other devices which are not protected. They’ll be forced to shutdown though as the system to distribute the electricity would be heavily damaged.
I would guess that there would be some radio chatter ... but in an ideal execution - we wouldn’t know until our lights went out.
S. Korean Lawmaker, “Russia might have given N. Korea know-how of miniature nukes”
WikiLeaks: North Korea Shipped 19 Advanced Nuclear-Capable Missiles to Tehran
And the life expectancy in nork would be under 15 minutes when Boomers retaliate. So yeah it’s a first strike weapon.
I saw one of those military tv shows saying that a EMP burst in the air, I forget the exact altitude, could essentially turn the lower 48 states into the Dark Ages over night. You can protect your stuff with faraday cages but they are pretty expensive. Just imagine the chaos that would ensue if the lights everywhere suddenly went off.
This is why the administration is talking to google. Google wants to connect us all to an electrical grid so our electricity can be monitored and rationed down the road.
By doing that, a smaller weapon could fry the grid. They wouldn’t have to launch something to impact the entire country. Feasible it could be done by sabotage of a few monitoring locations.
China could already knock out satellites. A coordinated attack that blinds us and then hits selected targets has the same impact and it could be brought back relatively quickly.
The Grid is a very complex control loop. That’s why a single mishap in New York; that only affects a small sub-station can bring the entire city to it’s knees. It’s happened not that long ago.
Your point is very well taken; you don’t need to destroy a power generation system, you can unbalance the load, and cause this instability to trip safety breakers - and if you do it ‘smart’ you can bring down a huge area, for long enough to really do some damage. And the damage need not be physical, you can do a lot of damage to the morale of the population by removing something they depend upon, and take for granted.
faraday cages are not really expensive just very cumbersome. A faraday cage is just a box made out of conductive material. This prevents the electrical pulse from impacting whatever is inside.
On a small scale a simple metal box will protect small electronic items. Of course its hard to use them while they are in the box.
A Faraday cage doesn’t have to be expensive... All you need is a wooden ammo crate, some aluminum foil, aluminum tape (used for sealing ductwork), and a ground wire. Place the items to be protected inside, cover the box with the foil, secure the foil with the aluminum tape, and then fasten the ground wire to the aluminum covering the box and then to a ground rod. It is important that you run the ground wire to a good ground, and do not use the ground circuit found in you home. Use a separate gound rod. Easy...
Im confused at those alititude numbers.. its approx only 60 miles from sea level to space.. so these would be detonated from outer space??