Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Norway police arrive 90 minutes after firing began
AP/WorldMag ^ | Jul 23, 11:20 PM EDT | By IAN MacDOUGALL and LOUISE NORDSTROM

Posted on 07/23/2011 9:40:14 PM PDT by quantim

OSLO, Norway (AP) -- Police arrived at an island massacre about an hour and a half after a gunman first opened fire, slowed because they didn't have quick access to a helicopter and then couldn't find a boat to make their way to the scene just several hundred yards (meters) offshore. The assailant surrendered when police finally reached him, but 82 people died before that.

Survivors of the shooting spree have described hiding and fleeing into the water to escape the gunman, but a police briefing Saturday detailed for the first time how long the terror lasted - and how long victims waited for help.

The shooting came on the heels of what police told The Associated Press was an "Oklahoma city-type" bombing in Oslo's downtown: It targeted a government building, was allegedly perpetrated by a homegrown assailant and used the same mix of fertilizer and fuel that blew up a federal building in the U.S. in 1995.

In all, at least 89 people were killed in the twin attacks that police are blaming on the same suspect, 32-year-old Norwegian Anders Behring Breivik.

(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS:
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-52 next last

1 posted on 07/23/2011 9:40:17 PM PDT by quantim
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: quantim

When seconds count, the police are just 90 minutes away. Was the island a gun-free zone(tm)?


2 posted on 07/23/2011 9:43:55 PM PDT by coloradan (The US has become a banana republic, except without the bananas - or the republic.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: quantim

Labor party in power proved their lack of security policy and standards resulted in mass numbers of death. The lazy and dumb Labor party is responsible for police arriving more than one hour later, and not proposing laws to strengthen security checks of suspicious people. They should be thrown out the next election for lack of capability to handle their own country.


3 posted on 07/23/2011 9:47:07 PM PDT by Wiz
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: coloradan

Dang, I was just going to post that same remark.


4 posted on 07/23/2011 9:47:51 PM PDT by dfwgator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Wiz
and not proposing laws to strengthen security checks of suspicious people.

Oh they will now, of course the "suspicious" people will only be white Christians.

5 posted on 07/23/2011 9:48:51 PM PDT by dfwgator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: quantim

does the Labor Party own the island,
or were just renting it?


6 posted on 07/23/2011 9:50:24 PM PDT by 50gunsalute
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: coloradan

Not for the outlaw.


7 posted on 07/23/2011 9:51:38 PM PDT by jospehm20
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: quantim

8 posted on 07/23/2011 9:52:24 PM PDT by garjog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: quantim

Wasn’t it about 4 hours before the brave police entered Columbine?


9 posted on 07/23/2011 9:54:49 PM PDT by bgill
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: quantim

Let’s see. It takes the shooter 25 minutes to get from a bombing to start shooting on the island. It then takes the Swat team and police 90 minutes to get to the island.


10 posted on 07/23/2011 10:01:40 PM PDT by taxesareforever (Release Staff Sgt. Frank Wuterich and let him and his family get on with their lives.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: quantim

Let’s see. It takes the shooter 25 minutes to get from a bombing to start shooting on the island. It then takes the Swat team and police 90 minutes to get to the island.


11 posted on 07/23/2011 10:02:09 PM PDT by taxesareforever (Release Staff Sgt. Frank Wuterich and let him and his family get on with their lives.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: quantim

Let’s see. It takes the shooter 25 minutes to get from a bombing to start shooting on the island. It then takes the Swat team and police 90 minutes to get to the island.


12 posted on 07/23/2011 10:02:17 PM PDT by taxesareforever (Release Staff Sgt. Frank Wuterich and let him and his family get on with their lives.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: quantim

Let’s see. It takes the shooter 25 minutes to get from a bombing to start shooting on the island. It then takes the Swat team and police 90 minutes to get to the island.


13 posted on 07/23/2011 10:02:24 PM PDT by taxesareforever (Release Staff Sgt. Frank Wuterich and let him and his family get on with their lives.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: quantim

NPR interview had the local law enforcement guy saying that when a “machine gun” type of weapon was being used the police can’t just go in— they have to be organized. ???


14 posted on 07/23/2011 10:07:16 PM PDT by Havisham
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 50gunsalute

Yes, it’s owned by the youth wing of the party.


15 posted on 07/23/2011 10:10:26 PM PDT by jimnm
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: bgill

I think it was more like 45 minutes, but I’ll admit that can sure seem like hours when a bunch of people are taking potshots at you during that time.


16 posted on 07/23/2011 10:11:43 PM PDT by coloradan (The US has become a banana republic, except without the bananas - or the republic.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: quantim
couldn't find a boat

At least one private boat had been picking up fleeing swimmers, so I wonder what gives.

Spiegel Online is also running the 90 minutes of shooting report. They write that the police took 40 minutes (!) to arrive after the alarm was received.

A real black eye for the Norwegian police. They're useless.

17 posted on 07/23/2011 10:17:19 PM PDT by longjack
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: taxesareforever

Apparently the dude is a lone wolf one man army.

Maybe could even be in two places at once, even.


18 posted on 07/23/2011 10:18:09 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: longjack

I guess they have donut shops in Norway, too.


19 posted on 07/23/2011 10:18:22 PM PDT by dfwgator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: coloradan

Ok, looked it up. The Columbine shooting began at 11:19 and the SWAT team didn’t enter the school until nearly two hours later at 1:09 and didn’t get to the library until 3:22 (that was the 4 hours - if only they’d been quicker). I’d say the Norwegian police did a bit better. Not much, but they did have to get out to an island compared to just down the street. As another poster said, when seconds count the police are hours away.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbine_High_School_massacre


20 posted on 07/23/2011 10:24:23 PM PDT by bgill
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: bgill

Thanks for the correction. Now that you mention the arrival time and getting to the library, I think what I was remembering was the time between when the SWAT team members were all there, until they first went in the school. That was about 45 minutes.


21 posted on 07/23/2011 10:30:34 PM PDT by coloradan (The US has become a banana republic, except without the bananas - or the republic.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: coloradan

Yes, very little gun ownership in Norway. I’m here now, and just toured downtown Oslo. The locals are in shock. This was totally unexpected, and they were totally unprepared. Most are opposed to any sort of gun ownership...


22 posted on 07/23/2011 11:17:02 PM PDT by Dubh_Ghlase (Therefore, send not to know For whom the bell tolls, It tolls for thee.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Dubh_Ghlase
Oslo Killer Manifesto :

Fake Manifesto?

23 posted on 07/23/2011 11:32:03 PM PDT by Publius6961 (My world was lovely, until it was taken over by parasites.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: bgill; coloradan; Travis McGee

The more militarized the police get the more concerned it seems they get about taking less risk.

Which sorta defeats the purpose.

When I was a boy..even beat cops with SW .38s would not have sat on their black ops clad asses while kids were being shot inside

some would have taken an initiative and tried

juxtapose Columbine with the University of Texas shooting in the mid 60s and you’ll see what I mean

you can count on cops less today then in the old days...but they sure look meaner

the video game generation


24 posted on 07/23/2011 11:47:12 PM PDT by wardaddy (Palin or Bachman..either with Marco....I'm often on a DroidX..in bed late...hence my spelling..sorry)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: longjack

Not overly defending the Norway SWAT team...but they had multiple things going against them. The emergency lines were clogged with calls due to the explosion in Oslo, they had to drive to the wharf due to the lack of an a avilable Helo, and once they got to their all the boats were out trying to rescue the youngsters who were trying to swim to safety.

The real shame is that there apparently wasn’t a security detail on the island. Even if it was just a couple renta cops with service revolvers and radios they probably could have helped and greatly reduced the casualties.


25 posted on 07/23/2011 11:50:44 PM PDT by DJlaysitup
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: Publius6961
Fake Manifesto?

If it's fake, somebody did a lot of work in a short time.

26 posted on 07/23/2011 11:58:53 PM PDT by cynwoody
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: wardaddy

Prior to Columbine training said you set up a perimeter and let SWAT deal with the entry or hostage negotiation.

Prior to 9/11 people were conditioned to sit in their seat on a plane assuming it was a hijacking and let the authorities negotiate a resolution.

Tactics change from experiences both good and bad. Today, the police train for “active shooters” and engagement is the first priority.

People will no longer sit still in a plane when someone attempts to take it over with box-cutters.

Thankfully, events like Columbine and 9/11 are very rare and often beyond imagination. Having scorn for the first officers on the scene in the middle of the chaos at Columbine is like being angry with the passengers on the hijacked planes that hit buildings on 9/11. They did what they were conditioned to do based on prior actions with the mindset that their actions were statistically the right choice. “Active Shooter” was not a police term prior to Columbine. The only one that I can remember right off was the gunman in the clock tower at the University of Texas in the 60’s.


27 posted on 07/24/2011 12:15:34 AM PDT by volunbeer (Keep the dope, we'll make the change in 2012!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: cynwoody
I don't necessarily think it's a fake, but finished skimming through it earlier and a lot of it seems like paste-in's from articles and blog posts.

That said, the diary portion at the end is weird and chilling to read.

28 posted on 07/24/2011 12:17:04 AM PDT by Heatseeker (Elizabeth Cheney for President)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: quantim

“The shooting came on the heels of what police told The Associated Press was an “Oklahoma city-type” bombing in Oslo’s downtown: It targeted a government building, was allegedly perpetrated by a homegrown assailant and used the same mix of fertilizer and fuel that blew up a federal building in the U.S. in 1995.”

The cops over there remembered the OK bombing and relayed it to the AP??? This is a set-up by the AP. We’re all being set-up.


29 posted on 07/24/2011 12:20:23 AM PDT by bronxville (Sarah will be the first American female president.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: volunbeer; Travis McGee; Squantos
I don't think prior to 911 that folks would have remained in their seats either had they known it was a suicide flight.

Prior to 9-11 the point was to HOLD hostages as a rule...there were no hostages on 9-11

I grew up in a time when no cop woulda sat around outside a kill zone..especially with kids being slaughtered waiting for armor..no way.

Training does not excuse that.

Cops..God love them..have gotten more militarized, more “separate”, bigger an better and more sophisticated weapons

and less balls or heart...(with exceptions)...training or not

look at Dillinger, Bonnie and Clyde and so forth..oddly enough I had this discussion with my older two lads today...those cops...locals...and highway patrol and deputies actually engaged fire at great risk with desperate men much better armed with BARS and Thompsons and semi auto pistols while they mostly had revolvers, lever action centerfire rifles and shotguns

look back even much closer...West Hollywood bank robbers...talk about brazen...but the cops fought back..engaged...took huge risks to save fellow officers and civilians caught in a serious urban gun battle to rival Chechnya or Bosnia

the Columbine guys...even after the battle wagons arrived sat on their hands...a bit afraid to enter a building where kids were known to be killing kids fearing explosives and armed nutbags...well hell...if you can't handle that then be a librarian

training...whatever...no excuse..it's the culture

never when I grew up would cops do that...they would hang their head in shame for that crap...not ask for bigger budgets or in this case likely PSTD time off ...

I'd rather have 20 good old fashioned Mississippi Highway Patrol or Texas Rangers circa 1955 with sidearms than a panel truck full of steroid addled guys in black gear all strapped down with crap I can't get without a transfer stamp plotting strategy like they think they are SEAL TEAM SIX

speaking of which ...does anyone think serious engagement forces like SEALs or any other unit likely to see action would just stand around waiting for more bigger better while the Taliban was across the wire cutting their buddies balls off and they could hear his screams?

I doubt it...even if they knew they would take casualties

We got too much damn SWAT or SWAT wannbes...and they ain't SEALs or Green Beanies or Force Recon whatever...no matter how much they suit up

30 posted on 07/24/2011 1:46:36 AM PDT by wardaddy (Palin or Bachman..either with Marco....I'm often on a DroidX..in bed late...hence my spelling..sorry)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: taxesareforever
It takes the shooter 25 minutes to get from a bombing to start shooting on the island.

On the map, it looks like about 25 miles from downtown Oslo to Utoya, with a good highway that goes right by the edge of the lake. It should have taken no more than 25 minutes to drive. Getting across to the island was another problem, of course.

31 posted on 07/24/2011 2:00:02 AM PDT by giotto
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: giotto

32 posted on 07/24/2011 3:09:42 AM PDT by Issaquahking
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: quantim

"When they came for the children
where were the Norwegiann police?"

33 posted on 07/24/2011 3:30:30 AM PDT by Diogenesis (No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session. - Mark Twain)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: quantim

This seems crazy. An island with a fairly large youth summer camp going on — and no one on the mainland has quick access to transportation to take police or any kind of emergency transportation there?

If not police helicopters, what about Oslo hospitals? Do they have helicopters?

What was the camp’s plan for emergencies?

Nothing takes away from the demonic actions of this shooter. But you do kind of expect that the police and EMS can get to a summer camp fairly quickly if needed to for ANY reason.

I pray for the people of Norway and am very sorry for their tragic loss.


34 posted on 07/24/2011 4:31:08 AM PDT by fightinJAG (Please stop posting "helpful hints" in parentheses the title box. Thank you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: bgill

But IIRC, the SWAT team got to the school quickly and set up operations. Entering the school was another matter.


35 posted on 07/24/2011 4:33:37 AM PDT by fightinJAG (Please stop posting "helpful hints" in parentheses the title box. Thank you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: coloradan

Yes. What is a worry about this story is the idea that the police did not have ready access to appropriate transportation to get to the island at all.

You’d think they would have transportation assets at their disposal and several back-up plans for quickly getting around the city and its environs.

This would be as though SWAT couldn’t get to Columbine simply because it couldn’t find a van to load up in.


36 posted on 07/24/2011 4:36:14 AM PDT by fightinJAG (Please stop posting "helpful hints" in parentheses the title box. Thank you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: DJlaysitup

Adding those facts into the scenario make it more understandable. Thanks.

I was so focused on the island massacre when reading this, I wasn’t thinking about the real-world impact of the bombing downtown, too. And I imagine that in the first hours, as on 9/11, there’s an incredible pressure from wondering how many attacks are going to follow-on and how to have first responders positioned just in case.

OTOH, the bombing would have raised the stakes when reports started coming in that something was also occurring at the summer camp.

I have lived in coastal areas and the police had many marine assets, including dedicated marine patrols, as well as access to Navy and Coast Guard assets. I can’t imagine the police not having ready boats to get out to the island. But, as you point out, these stories are always more complicated than it may appear at first blush.


37 posted on 07/24/2011 4:44:26 AM PDT by fightinJAG (Please stop posting "helpful hints" in parentheses the title box. Thank you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: quantim

The Norwegian police are political correctness gone amok. And now these Keystone Cops are going to investigate what went wrong?


38 posted on 07/24/2011 4:50:50 AM PDT by ardara
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jimnm

Not knowing the language I’m probably mistaken, but there are enough similarities in many words to suspect that Utoya might mean Utopia, given the political orientation of the group that owns it.


39 posted on 07/24/2011 4:52:10 AM PDT by RegulatorCountry
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: Dubh_Ghlase

I wonder how they feel about gun ownership today?


40 posted on 07/24/2011 5:35:07 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: quantim
One marksman in helicopter = end of massacre.
41 posted on 07/24/2011 5:40:36 AM PDT by Shqipo (I am the unofficial originator of the Mega-Bump! Only use judiciously.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: volunbeer
Today, the police train for “active shooters” and engagement is the first priority.

Exactly. Not too long ago, we had an active shooter scenario in Albuquerque at a business. Former employee came back to get his girlfriend, and settle other scores. The 911 call arrived at 9:26, officers were in the building by 9:28. When officers arrived the perp shot himself. He did kill 2 and injure some others, but that was prior to the 911 call being made.

APD doctrine is when this happens, every cop just pours into the area and goes inside immediately. Some searched for the perp, other's pulled out the wounded and put them in their cars to move them to where the EMT's were (outside a perimeter).

42 posted on 07/24/2011 5:49:34 AM PDT by Tijeras_Slim
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: coloradan
When seconds count, the police are just 90 minutes away. Was the island a gun-free zone(tm)?

It was a camp for future socialist leaders of Norway. Of course it was gun-free.

Of course you already knew it was gun-free, since there was no return fire.

43 posted on 07/24/2011 6:01:29 AM PDT by Cheburashka (If found, please return this Ring of Power to Sauron, Lord of Darkness. Return postage guaranteed.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Georgia Girl 2
I wonder how they feel about gun ownership today?

They vote for socialists. Don't expect any changes, except more laws against guns.
44 posted on 07/24/2011 6:04:25 AM PDT by Cheburashka (If found, please return this Ring of Power to Sauron, Lord of Darkness. Return postage guaranteed.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: wardaddy

Well said, I agree 100%. As soon as there were a couple of armed cops (any unit, with or without armor) on the island, they should have headed out on their mission to save lives or die trying.

Otherwise, like you said, BE A LIBRARIAN.


45 posted on 07/24/2011 6:29:00 AM PDT by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: 50gunsalute

Labor/AUF own the island.


46 posted on 07/24/2011 9:22:57 AM PDT by bjorn14 (Woe to those who call good evil and evil good. Isaiah 5:20)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: DJlaysitup

I am in Oslo and watching the police press conference now and they said he had lots of ammunition left when they arrested him. They clarified the timeline as one hour between the first call and when he was taken. The said there was one policeman on duty at the boat launch when the shooting started.


47 posted on 07/24/2011 9:29:50 AM PDT by bjorn14 (Woe to those who call good evil and evil good. Isaiah 5:20)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: Dubh_Ghlase

Correction. There is a lot of gun ownership in Norway but it is rifle/shotgun ownership. Very few people have pistols though and you would never get a permit for personal protection.


48 posted on 07/24/2011 9:34:14 AM PDT by bjorn14 (Woe to those who call good evil and evil good. Isaiah 5:20)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: RegulatorCountry

Utøya mean Out Island. It is the middle of a fjord.


49 posted on 07/24/2011 9:44:52 AM PDT by bjorn14 (Woe to those who call good evil and evil good. Isaiah 5:20)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: wardaddy

How many died while they wasted dressing up as ninjas?


50 posted on 07/24/2011 9:57:39 AM PDT by bgill
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-52 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson