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Alleged 'dog hater' was defending himself, police now say(UT)
deseretnews.com ^ | 27 July, 2011 | Pat Reavy

Posted on 07/29/2011 2:47:22 AM PDT by marktwain

COTTONWOOD HEIGHTS — He was dubbed the "Dog Hater."

But now Cottonwood Heights police say their investigation has taken a complete 180-degree turn and a man wanted for allegedly pulling a gun on a group of dog walkers may have actually been the victim and was defending himself.

Saturday evening, a man was walking his two dogs with friends near 3000 E. Danish Road. He later told police that his dogs were spooked by fireworks and nipped a man who was walking by.

That man allegedly responded by pulling out a gun and threatening the dog walkers.

But after the incident was reported by the local news, the man who pulled the gun turned himself over to police and gave a different story, which detectives Wednesday said seems to be backed up by the evidence.

The gunman actually had to be treated by a doctor after the dogs knocked him to the ground and bit his leg and face, said Cottonwood Heights police detective Ryan Shosted.

"The guy was attacked by the dogs and feared for his own safety," he said.

The dogs that were being walked were both about 70 pounds, Shosted said. One was an Australian Shepherd and the other a Blue Heeler.

"He was walking past the dog owner and the dogs jumped on his back and knocked him down," he said.

The man had a bruise on his knee consistent with being knocked over. Shosted said the bite on his leg was also "significant" and part of his finger tip was bitten off.

The man, in his late 60s to early 70s, was an Army veteran and had a concealed weapons permit.

(Excerpt) Read more at deseretnews.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Utah
KEYWORDS: banglist; defense; dog; doggieping; ut; utah
The gun owner should own the dog walker. It is good that the police determined the truth, but this looks like the kind of "preemptive police call" that we see criminals use after a crime is foiled by a citizen with a gun.

If they are the first to call, the natural tendency is for the police to believe them, and the other party then has to disprove what they say.

In this case, the citizen with the gun would have been better off calling the police after he defended himself.

1 posted on 07/29/2011 2:47:28 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

The “dog walkers” should be charged criminally for making a false police report trying to further harm the victim.


2 posted on 07/29/2011 3:01:12 AM PDT by DB
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To: marktwain

It is always amusing to watch someone try to walk dogs of that size, and two and the same time is even worse. Sure, a well trained dog is a pleasure, but trouble is a sniff away.


3 posted on 07/29/2011 3:26:13 AM PDT by Palter (Celebrate diversity .22, .223, .25, 9mm, .32 .357, 10mm, .44, .45, .500)
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To: marktwain

These are just dogs acting like dogs, and it doesn’t sound like he was seriously hurt. Besides, this guy was in the army and probably faced a lot worse. The Viet Cong wouldn’t just bite the tip of your finger off.


4 posted on 07/29/2011 4:29:50 AM PDT by Krankor (I pushed my soul in a deep dark hole and then I followed it in.)
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To: Krankor

And that justifies the dogs attacking him from the rear? I don’t think so. Based on your logic, any attack by a dog that doesn’t result in removing the head of an Iraq/Afghan vet must not have been a serious threat.


5 posted on 07/29/2011 4:39:18 AM PDT by Pecos (Constitutionalist. Liberty and Honor will not die on my watch.)
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To: Palter

Blue Heelers and Aussie Shepherds don’t weigh anywhere close to 70 pounds.


6 posted on 07/29/2011 5:15:43 AM PDT by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
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To: Palter
It is always amusing to watch someone try to walk dogs of that size, and two and the same time is even worse.

Then please pray for me. My older dog is half Black Lab and, possibly, Pit, and weighs about 80 lb. He's always been hugely self-confident, bumpy, friendly, and enthusiastic. Unfortunately, his predecesor as "senior dog" passed on in April. Since I basically desire to have small, untrusive dogs, like teacup Poodles, I got a Great Dane puppy to accompany the older dog. The Dane, now 5.5 mo. old, is three inches taller and three inches longer than the older dog and currently weighs about 50 lb., soon to grow to about 150 lb. Between them they go through about 35 lb. of dog food every week and a half @ about $50.00 per bag.

7 posted on 07/29/2011 6:55:07 AM PDT by libstripper
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To: Scotsman will be Free

(Australian Heeler) (Hall’s Heeler) (Queensland Heeler) (Blue Heeler) (Australian ... Weight: Males 32-35 pounds (15-16kg) Females 30-35 pounds (14-16kg) ...


8 posted on 07/29/2011 9:05:41 AM PDT by B4Ranch (Allowing Islam into America is akin to injecting yourself with AIDS to prove how tolerant you are...)
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To: Krankor

What?


9 posted on 07/29/2011 9:10:39 AM PDT by Mr. Lucky
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To: B4Ranch

Yup. Been around them and owned Heelers and Aussies for herding cows. Great dogs, too. Currently have a Kelpie mix and an Aussie/Heeler mix. The Kelpie is fearless and totally loyal. He’s also a whale of a cow dog. The Aussie is good with sheep, but a bit chicken with the cows.


10 posted on 07/29/2011 10:27:30 AM PDT by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
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To: Joe 6-pack

Ping


11 posted on 07/29/2011 10:40:30 AM PDT by SZonian (July 27, 2010. Life begins anew.)
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To: Scotsman will be Free

“Blue Heelers and Aussie Shepherds don’t weigh anywhere close to 70 pounds.”

Some of the Aussies do, although the average is probably 40-50 pounds. Both of mine average 45-50 pounds.


12 posted on 07/29/2011 10:42:30 AM PDT by TexasRepublic (Socialism is the gospel of envy and the religion of thieves)
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To: AnAmericanMother; Titan Magroyne; Badeye; Shannon; SandRat; arbooz; potlatch; ...
WOOOF!

The Doggie Ping list is for FReepers who would like to be notified of threads relating to all things canid. If you would like to join the Doggie Ping Pack (or be unleashed from it), FReemail me.

13 posted on 07/29/2011 10:46:05 AM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Krankor
These are just dogs acting like dogs, and it doesn’t sound like he was seriously hurt. Besides, this guy was in the army and probably faced a lot worse.

The dog walkers deserve to be lynched. It's one thing to lose control of your dog. But filing a false or misleading police report is completely beyond the pale. What if the guy had been hurt more seriously? What if his gun papers were not in complete order?

14 posted on 07/29/2011 11:00:37 AM PDT by cynwoody
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To: libstripper; Palter

A properly trained dog would never have done this in the first place.

I had a pair of blue merle smooth collies Castor and Pollox(genetic freaks at that) that weighed 100 and 130 lbs respectively. It was a great pleasure for me to watch my friend’s little girl Sasha (all 75 lbs of her) walking the boys up the street, completely under her control. My littler dog (the one I have left now) walked alongside withOUT a leash.

No pulling, no chasing, no misbehaving whatever, even when cats and squirrels would dash across their path.

The dog owner here is definitely in deep kimchi, and deserves it for having poorly trained, badly behaving pets, on lead or not.


15 posted on 07/29/2011 12:03:52 PM PDT by Don W (You can forget what you do for a living when your knees are in the breeze.)
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To: marktwain

It sounds like a case of self defense.

The dog owner needs to control his dogs better-—irresponsible dog owners make responsible ones look bad. The owner of the dogs should pay the man’s medical bills.


16 posted on 07/29/2011 12:25:02 PM PDT by Immerito (Reading Through the Bible in 90 Days)
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To: Don W

“blue merle smooth collies”

Oh totally awesome!!!


17 posted on 07/29/2011 1:40:31 PM PDT by the OlLine Rebel (Common sense is an uncommon virtue./Technological progress cannot be legislated.)
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To: the OlLine Rebel

They were indeed awesome dogs. Very smart, extremely good-natured and as tractable as you could imagine.

Their only flaw was that they were “accidents”, as both parents were blue merle, which gave them a double dose of poor genes.

Still, they gave 7 (Pollux) and 8 1/2 (Castor) years of delight and pleasure. Their little urns are sitting on the mantel above the fireplace, along with a photo of each.

Zippy (the 11 1/2 yr old 25 lb Peke-Pom-Sheltie) and I still miss them a lot. So does the stoopid cat, for that matter...


18 posted on 07/29/2011 2:56:31 PM PDT by Don W (You can forget what you do for a living when your knees are in the breeze.)
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To: Joe 6-pack

THANKS for pinging it!


19 posted on 07/29/2011 3:11:28 PM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: marktwain

A 70 lb Blue Heeler? I don’t believe it. I’ve never seen a Blue Heeler over 40 lbs. They are short dogs, built that way to escape the cattle hooves when they nip at their heels. I’ve also never seen an Australian Shepherd that topped 50 lbs.


20 posted on 07/29/2011 3:24:01 PM PDT by afraidfortherepublic
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To: afraidfortherepublic

I’d like to tell everyone, “call off your dogs” (no pun).

It was a policeman who may not even have had opportunity to get more info from the owner. Either way, it may’ve been a guess by any of them - breed/type(mutt?) OR weight. Give them a break.


21 posted on 07/29/2011 8:43:34 PM PDT by the OlLine Rebel (Common sense is an uncommon virtue./Technological progress cannot be legislated.)
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To: B4Ranch

My blue is about 35 pounds. He herds one hell of a tennis ball.

This happened in my town. It’s legal in Utah to shoot animals if you’re in danger. It’s the owner’s responsibility to keep the public safe from them. There is no legal recourse for dog bite in Utah. None. Your dog, you pay. Even the police dogs on duty aren’t exempt from liability if they cause injury. In this story, the dog owner is lucky his dogs are alive. He’d better have good insurance, because he’s already lost the civil case.


22 posted on 07/30/2011 7:44:24 PM PDT by glock rocks (Wait, what ?)
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To: glock rocks

Decisions, decisions, decisions. Do I get a dog or do I not get a dog. What if my neighbor gets a dog and I don’t have a dog. What if my neighbor gets a dog and I do have a dog, and they get into a fight. Then what? Oh, no. That’s what I thought. I’m going to be the one who pays the bill just like the last time and the time before that and the time before that.

Dogs pee on the carpet sometimes, did you know that? How do you clean the carpet after the dog pees on it? Should I call the same carpet company as the last time? Or should I use this coupon that came in the mail?

No, dammit I’m going to buy new carpet. I deserve it. This carpet has been peed on and clean ed more times than I can shake a stick at. Should I train the dog not to pee on the carpet or is it too late for that? Is he going to pee on the new carpet too?

Decisions, decisions, decisions. I don’t recall anyone ever telling me that my life was going to be easy, but nobody ever said it was going to be this hard either!


23 posted on 07/30/2011 8:23:18 PM PDT by B4Ranch (Allowing Islam into America is akin to injecting yourself with AIDS to prove how tolerant you are..)
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To: B4Ranch

Don’t forget the tennis ball bill... that can add up over time...


24 posted on 07/30/2011 8:45:38 PM PDT by glock rocks (Wait, what ?)
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To: cynwoody
My old neighbors dog bit me once, fine. But then it killed my chicken,
so while I called animal control, she called the police against me.

Some dog owners don't deserve dogs.


IN FACT, "Most" dog owners just want something to boss around
and bitch at all the time!!

25 posted on 07/30/2011 8:55:21 PM PDT by MaxMax
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To: Scotsman will be Free
My Australian Shepherd mix weighs 75. Looks just like an Aussie, only stockier. He was about 9 months in this picture:

Photobucket

26 posted on 07/30/2011 9:00:05 PM PDT by Mr Rogers
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To: marktwain

If you pull your gun ALWAYS CALL THE COPS AS SOON AS YOU CAN SAFELY DO IT!!!

THE FIRST PERSON TO CALL THE COPS IS THE VICTIM!!

That being said, call your lawyer next. If you carry a gun have a lawyer on retainer.

The retired Texas DPS Sgt who gave the CHL renewal class I took not long ago told us these things about 5 times.


27 posted on 07/30/2011 9:10:15 PM PDT by SUSSA
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To: glock rocks

Oh balls.


28 posted on 07/30/2011 9:53:28 PM PDT by B4Ranch (Allowing Islam into America is akin to injecting yourself with AIDS to prove how tolerant you are..)
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To: Mr Rogers

Mix being the key. What else is he?


29 posted on 07/31/2011 4:23:30 AM PDT by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
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To: Scotsman will be Free

What else is he? Doesn’t matter.

The news article is not arguing that there were purebred dogs involved in the attack, or that this happened at a dog show.

If you wanted a written phrase to describe what Rusty is, “Australian Shepherd” would be it.

Also, with Australian Shepherds, many breeders (now that it is an AKC breed) no longer breed for herding, but looks. And the ‘breed standard’ only mentions height, not weight - so yes, I suspect you can now get purebred Aussies that weigh well over 50 lbs. The Australian Shepherd that I knew from 30 years ago is largely gone.


30 posted on 07/31/2011 7:44:36 AM PDT by Mr Rogers
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To: Mr Rogers

Just asking out of curiosity. I’ve always preferred mixed breed dogs because they seem healthier and hardier generally speaking.


31 posted on 08/01/2011 12:04:07 PM PDT by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
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To: Scotsman will be Free

Rusty came from the pound. The Aussie in him is obvious, but he is stockier and his head is heavier than most purebred Aussies I’ve met. We honestly don’t know what else is in him.

For most purposes, I prefer mutts. I have a purebred Border Collie, but there really is no need for a purebred unless you have a specific task that a dog needs to be bred for, and I don’t own any sheep or cattle.

I like herding dogs, but the AKC has been butting in on their breeding lines. I adored the Australian Shepherds I knew from the 70s, but the breed is now mostly marketed to dog sports. I hope the Border Collie doesn’t go the same route...

Oh, and the best dog I’ve ever owned had a Border Collie for a mother, but she got loose and, as the farmer put it, “wasn’t too picky”. I’d guess Chris had German Shepherd in him, and maybe some Lab, but what a great dog he was!


32 posted on 08/01/2011 1:00:58 PM PDT by Mr Rogers
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To: Mr Rogers

I’ve got two dogs, currently. Blue is an Aussie Shepherd/Blue Heeler mix. He’s a tri color, blue merle and talks alot. He’s good with sheep, but too chicken for cattle. My wife got him at a draft horse show as a pup.
My second dog is a Kelpie/German Shepherd mix. Ranger is his name and he’s a black and tan with a white blaze on his chest. He’s a good cow dog, especially after he learned to avoid getting kicked(the hard way). I got Ranger for free when he was about one year old from a gal who didn’t like him(he killed her prize show duck)and who swore up and down he couldn’t herd cattle to save his soul. I have never had a more loyal dog.
Border Collies are great dogs. They are handsome, friendly, and working machines. Never had one, but I do admire the breed.
I no longer have cattle or sheep, but I use them for feral pig hunting. What a hoot. Got a sow this morning.


33 posted on 08/01/2011 2:10:03 PM PDT by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
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