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Why S&P Really Downgraded US Credit Rating (vanity but linked to their report)
S&P PDF Official Document ^ | 6 Aug 2011 | S&P and SkyPilot

Posted on 08/06/2011 4:04:09 AM PDT by SkyPilot

As I was watching the "spin" on MSNBC, CNN, and almost every other cable show last night regarding S&Ps decision to downgrade the soverign US credit rating for the first time in our nation's history, it was amazing to me that every liberal commentator and every Democrat appearing on the shows avoided the monster in the room at all costs:

ENTITLEMENTS

Entitlements are breaking the back of this nation. During the debt deal and its aftermath, Democrats made it clear they would not budge (or even address) the crippling effects of Medicare, Medicaid, or Social Security.

S&P's report did - right up front. In fact, it mentions Entitlements as the biggest problem.

Funny how the Lamestream Media missed that language, considering it is on the front page of the PDF document that S&P released on Friday night.

_____________________________________________________________________

Rationale

We lowered our long-term rating on the U.S. because we believe that the prolonged controversy over raising the statutory debt ceiling and the related fiscal policy debate indicate that further near-term progress containing the growth in public spending, especially on entitlements, or on reaching an agreement on raising revenues is less likely than we previously assumed and will remain a contentious and fitful process. We also believe that the fiscal consolidation plan that Congress and the Administration agreed to this week falls short of the amount that we believe is necessary to stabilize the general government debt burden by the middle of the decade. ...Despite this year's wide-ranging debate, in our view, the differences between political parties have proven to be extraordinarily difficult to bridge, and, as we see it, the resulting agreement fell well short of the comprehensive fiscal consolidation program that some proponents had envisaged until quite recently. Republicans and Democrats have only been able to agree to relatively modest savings on discretionary spending while delegating to the Select Committee decisions on more comprehensive measures. It appears that for now, new revenues have dropped down on the menu of policy options. In addition, the plan envisions only minor policy changes on Medicare and little change in other entitlements, the containment of which we and most other independent observers regard as key to long-term fiscal sustainability. Our opinion is that elected officials remain wary of tackling the structural issues required to effectively address the rising U.S. public debt burden.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aaa; downgrade; sp
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
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So there you have it.

Everyone who has a brain knows we have to cut Entitlements, but no one will do it. We now have one in seven Americans walking around with a Food Stamp (now called SNAP) debit card in their back pocket. We have millions of people collecting Social Security checks and SSI disability. Parents of children with mild ailments such as heart murmurs or sleep apnea have learned how to get their children classified as disabled so that they collect checks for life. Illegal aliens have sucked the Medicaid fund dry. Some inner city minority populations depend on government direct deposits in the form of AFDC, daycare cash payments, nutitional assistance, special minority loans for business, and Section 8 housing for almost all of that community's income. Unemployment payments have now reached half a Trillion dollars since Obama took over - half a Trillion for people not to work.

What will Washington do? It looks like they will slash miltiary veterans programs, decimate the Defense Budget, and freeze military salaries come November.

Under debt deal, military pay, veterans programs in play for cuts

This will do almost nothing to stop the implosion, but because Entitlements are "off the table" - our Government will appear desperate to convince the public it is doing something.

This is the beginning of the end. I am filled with a deep and abiding fear that nothing will be done until the whole system collapses.

And the cause of it all will be a segment of Americans and worthless politicians who were motivated by nothing more than pure envy and greed.

"The righteousness of the upright will deliver them, But the treacherous will be caught by their own greed."

Proverbs 11:6

1 posted on 08/06/2011 4:04:13 AM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: SkyPilot

people sure have alot of problems learning that SS is NOT an entitlement.. it has been used like a govt person checking account


2 posted on 08/06/2011 4:07:42 AM PDT by SF_Redux (Sarah stands for accountablility and personal responsiblity, democrats can't live with that)
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To: SkyPilot

Right after your bolded sentence is this:

“or on reaching an agreement on raising revenues”

As far as S&P is concerned either will do. Cut spending or increase taxes. You don’t seriously expect Dems to “see” the problem as excessive spending do you? There will be more and more calls for taxes.


3 posted on 08/06/2011 4:16:22 AM PDT by saganite (What happens to taglines? Is there a termination date?)
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To: SkyPilot

Preach it brother!


4 posted on 08/06/2011 4:17:02 AM PDT by PanzerKardinal (Some things are so idiotic only an intellectual would believe it.)
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To: SF_Redux
Hmm ~ here's the way to deal with it ~ whether or not Social Security is an "entitlement" is irrelevant to the equation. If you NO LONGER COLLECT FICA and you CEASE PAYMENTS TO BENEFICIARIES and REFUND DEPOSITS (which is what they are since they're taken out of after-tax income) ~ the US Treasury ends up in negative territory!

If you do the same with Medicare, Unemployment Insurance and Workman's Compensation System, it only gets worse.

I remember when the big issue with Social Security was what to do with it when it'd completely consumed the entire US debt burden and had cash left over to invest somewhere else.

That was right after the Reagan Era changes.

The Democrats sure answered that didn't they ~ they simply dipped into the kitty and spent it on all sorts of nonsense.

5 posted on 08/06/2011 4:18:20 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: SF_Redux
Everyone who has worked for the past 2 generations has paid into the Social Security ponzi scheme.

Only some will benefit from it. It is not an "earned" Entitlement. There is no money in a "trust fund."

Because so many people receive direct deposit Social Security checks, our politicians will not address how it is killing our nation. In order to protect Social Security, veteran's and active duty military health insurance (TRICARE) is under attack. If a veteran who served in multiple combat zones has not "earned" anything that cannot be slashed, then millions of Americans who draw Social Security because they now are still breathing are subject to the same fiscal laws of nature.

Your attitude is indicative of the problem: people think they "paid" into Social Security, and they want money back. Social Security was nothing more than a tax, and the revenues from that tax have long been spent. See debt: $14.5 Trillion Dollars.

I might as well ask for all of my State, Federal, and local tax money back into the "SkyPilot fund." There is no 'there' there.

We will go into the abyss because people wanted "their check."


6 posted on 08/06/2011 4:19:32 AM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: SkyPilot

Cutting Social Security and Medicare, but leaving the Unconstitutional Department of Education in place, does not make any sense.

Get rid of all unnecessary departments - then AFTER that is ALL DONE, see if any reductions are needed in SS.

Otherwise, SS will just get decreased every year (like it has been because COLA has been denied) in order to pay for more Federal employees.


7 posted on 08/06/2011 4:20:16 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We need to fix things ourselves)
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To: saganite
S&P's ambition is neither ~ their interest is quite obvious ~ they want the interest rate paid on US securities to increase substantially ~ the new debt authorization sold at .25% which is a lot lower than the 5.25% the bondholders would have preferred to get.

Think of what S&P is up to as a manifestation of another stage in a broad based criminal conspiracy.

8 posted on 08/06/2011 4:21:45 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: SkyPilot

skypilot, I am surprised you can even tie your shoes
I guess you can tie your shoes


9 posted on 08/06/2011 4:26:08 AM PDT by SF_Redux (Sarah stands for accountablility and personal responsiblity, democrats can't live with that)
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To: SkyPilot

take away all the freeloaders that never paid a penny into the govt has give it too


10 posted on 08/06/2011 4:27:40 AM PDT by SF_Redux (Sarah stands for accountablility and personal responsiblity, democrats can't live with that)
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To: muawiyah

“spent it on all sorts of nonsense.”

Even worse, they used (and are using) it just to make the loan payments on even MORE money to spend on even more nonsense.

And, really- that’s our debt problem in a nutshell.


11 posted on 08/06/2011 4:28:32 AM PDT by mrsmith
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To: SkyPilot
I believe that if we concentrated on FRAUD in all departments we could make a big dent in our debt.
Back in the early 80's I worked for the US Postal service. I worked at a bulk mail center.
Every month the supply room had orders to throw out brand new supplies. The facility had a huge fence around it so no one could get to the dumpster. It bothered me and I tried to report it. No body gave a damn. This was at least a $1,000.00 per month at this one location. They got brand new supplies every month.
On top of that the Managers of the facility were paid on a production basis. They got a good salary and were paid a bonus depending on volume of mail. They would resort sorted mail to get a higher count so they could get a bigger bonus, no wonder the postal service is broke.

This was one facility. I am sure it went on in every federal department.
I am sure Social Security is paying claims they should not be paying. We all know medicare gets scammed.
Getting the fraud eliminated everywhere could go a long way to getting us back on track.

12 posted on 08/06/2011 4:29:19 AM PDT by DeaconRed (RL Burnside sings : "It's Bad You know" & "Everything Is Broken". . . . So true Today! ! ! !)
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To: SkyPilot

Comparison of nObama’s first year and current year

U.S. Federal Government Spending Comparison, 2008 and 2011
Figures given in billions of U.S. Dollars

Category_______ FY 2008 FY 2011 INC/(DEC) INC/(DEC) %
Pensions_______ 659.8_____793.2_____133.4____20.22%
Healthcare_____ 671.4_____882.0_____210.6____31.37%
Education______ 101.8_____129.8______28.0____27.50%
Defense________ 729.6_____964.8_____235.2____32.24%
Welfare________ 322.3_____495.6_____173.3____53.77%
Protection_____ 47.1_______60.7_______13.6____28.87%
Transportation_ 77.6_______94.5_______16.9____21.78%
General________ 20.8_______33.2_______12.4____59.62%
Other__________ 99.3______158.4______59.1____59.52%
Interest_______ 252.8_____206.7_____-46.1____-18.24%

Total__________ 2,982.5____3,818.9____836.4____28.04%

U.S. Federal Government Revenue Comparison, 2008 and 2011
Figures given in billions of U.S. Dollars

Category_______________ FY 2008 FY 2011 INC/(DEC) INC/(DEC) %
Ind. Inc. Tax___________1,145.8__956.0___-189.8_____-16.56%
Corp. Inc. Tax___________304.3____198.4___-105.9___-34.80%
Social Ins. Taxes________900.2____806.8____-93.4____-10.38%
Ad-valorem Taxes_______140.1____132.9_____-7.2___-5.14%
Fees & Charges___________0.0________0.0_____0.0
Bus & Other Rev__________33.6_____79.5_____45.9___136.61%

Total___________________2,524.0___2,173.6___-350.4____-13.88%

Surplus/(Deficit)________-458.5__-1645.3__-1,186.8____258.84%

Social Security is part of the first number, Pensions.

You want the breakdown of Pensions for 2011 ? Here it is:

Federal employee retirement and disability (602)_____________$127.1
Social security (651)_________________________________________$748.4
Employer share, employee retirement (on-budget) (951)_____($67.1)
Employer share, employee retirement (off-budget) (952)_____($15.1)

Please help me to understand -

FEDERAL EMPLOYEE RETIREMENT AND DISABILTY COST 16% OF EVERYONE’S SOCIAL SECURITY PAYMENTS ?

Just how many Federal employees are retired and at just what pay ?????

And there is NO TALK OF REDUCING FEDERAL EMPLOYEE PAY OR BENEFITS.

AAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH !


13 posted on 08/06/2011 4:31:03 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We need to fix things ourselves)
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To: PieterCasparzen

that would be one good step


14 posted on 08/06/2011 4:31:56 AM PDT by q_an_a (a)
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To: SkyPilot

“...reaching an agreement on raising revenues is less likely than we previously assumed”

They assumed that the government MUST now understand that the game is over. Wrong. Watch now the tragedy unfold.


15 posted on 08/06/2011 4:34:49 AM PDT by TalBlack ( Evil doesn't have a day job.)
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To: SkyPilot
"A reward once given becomes a right." from Frederick Herzberg (American industrial psychologist, from his classic The Motivation to Work, circa 1959).

The War on Poverty, several "Education" Presidents, a couple of Bridges to "Shovel Ready" projects (aka Jobs) and gratis cellphones, etc., have all shown little results except those are now "rights."

16 posted on 08/06/2011 4:42:20 AM PDT by jamaksin
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To: SkyPilot

You can’t explain to a entrenched parasite that he is not entitled...it makes absolutely no logic to him at all. Nice try tho...


17 posted on 08/06/2011 4:47:46 AM PDT by Earthdweller (Harvard won the election again...so what's the problem.......? Embrace a ruler today.)
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To: SkyPilot

Also, and related to your post, is the fact that no one yet knows who will be on the 12-member committee called the “Super Congress,” or how they will vote on various issues. It can all go whichever way they want it to go, with no Tea Party to rein everything in.

That is called uncertainty. Our chance to make a decisive move to head off disaster has passed.

Just as Obama makes end runs around Congress, Congress has made an end run around the Tea Party.


18 posted on 08/06/2011 4:49:03 AM PDT by firebrand (It's a scandal that we have not yet impeached Obama. Can we do it now? Now?)
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To: SF_Redux

Tie your shoes.


19 posted on 08/06/2011 4:52:28 AM PDT by firebrand (It's a scandal that we have not yet impeached Obama. Can we do it now? Now?)
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To: firebrand

Too bad that the ‘Taxed Enough Already’ movement was tagged as a ‘PARTY’.

How come there are ‘INDEPENDANTS’, but no ‘Independent PARTY’????????????


20 posted on 08/06/2011 4:55:12 AM PDT by sodpoodle (Despair; man's surrender. Laughter; God's redemption.)
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To: PieterCasparzen

They could expand that “other” category that increased nearly 60%. We’d like to know what’s included there...but that may be too ‘transparent’.


21 posted on 08/06/2011 4:57:02 AM PDT by SueRae (I can see November 2012 from my HOUSE!!!!!!!!)
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To: PieterCasparzen

Zuckerberg and Gates and other people like them will do a better job at improving education than the government. Let’s foster that philanthropic movement, even if we may not agree with the philanthropists on all points, and we could make the Education Department a useless fossil.


22 posted on 08/06/2011 4:57:31 AM PDT by firebrand (It's a scandal that we have not yet impeached Obama. Can we do it now? Now?)
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To: SueRae

Read it and weap...

http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/spend.php?span=usgs302&year=2011&view=1&expand=0280&expandC=&units=b&fy=fy12&local=s&state=US&pie=#usgs30280


23 posted on 08/06/2011 5:02:47 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We need to fix things ourselves)
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To: SueRae

Or even better, weep !


24 posted on 08/06/2011 5:03:50 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We need to fix things ourselves)
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To: sodpoodle

Well, it’s really the Tea Party movement, not the Tea Party Party. I’m not sure I get your point.

There is an Independence Party in New York State, and it has two functions: to allow Democrats to vote for the Republican running on both the Republican and Independence lines without having to touch the Republican lever, and to confuse the voters who would like to be unaffiliated so that they pick the Independence Party in ignorance.


25 posted on 08/06/2011 5:04:52 AM PDT by firebrand (It's a scandal that we have not yet impeached Obama. Can we do it now? Now?)
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To: Earthdweller

It is not an “Entitlement” when youu paid for it. It is only an “Entitlement” if you are getting the benefits for nothing. I PAID. I want what is rightfully mine.


26 posted on 08/06/2011 5:05:10 AM PDT by SF_Redux (Sarah stands for accountablility and personal responsiblity, democrats can't live with that)
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To: firebrand

Childhood education is the responsibility of parents.

Public schools started being formed in large numbers in America in the 1800’s in yet another misguided attempt at government to “help” citizens.

Every State regulates education with some sort of State Board of Education and is staffed by countless goofball PhD’s on the State payroll who profess to know how best to educate children.

The Federal Department of Education is also staffed with countless goofball PhD’s who profess to know how best to educate children.

It’s the redundancy of goofball PhD’s that provides the opportunity to LET THE STATES RUN THEIR OWN EDUCATION SYSTEMS. How can Federal goofballs know any more than State goofballs ?

As far as letting filthy rich psychopaths dictate how children are educated - I would not recommend that for anyone.


27 posted on 08/06/2011 5:10:24 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We need to fix things ourselves)
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To: SF_Redux
Part of the problem with stopping these "entitlements" is that the government has been taking our money for decades with the promise that we would benefit from it later. If they stop it, then they have become nothing more than thieves in the biggest scam in world history.

The rest of the problem is that the folks who really got ripped off are unlikely to march on Washington - it is those who haven't been paying, but have been collecting anyway that will pillage and burn the country.

28 posted on 08/06/2011 5:10:34 AM PDT by trebb ("If a man will not work, he should not eat" From 2 Thes 3)
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To: SkyPilot

Coming soon - uncontrolled inflation. SS checks won’t be much use even if they are tied to inflation.


29 posted on 08/06/2011 5:10:45 AM PDT by listenhillary (Look your representatives in the eye and ask if they intend to pay off the debt. They will look away)
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To: trebb

there will be a call out for body bags, and they will be filled with bodies that are 2 generations apart


30 posted on 08/06/2011 5:14:27 AM PDT by SF_Redux (Sarah stands for accountablility and personal responsiblity, democrats can't live with that)
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To: firebrand

My point is that the Democrats, RINOs and the MSM can use the term: TEA PARTY - as if it is an organized entity with State, local and national leadership with power players in DC.

The TEA movement is comprised of citizens who adhere to the Constitution. Many Americans don’t even know they are TEA people and the MSM is determined to keep it so.


31 posted on 08/06/2011 5:15:54 AM PDT by sodpoodle (Despair; man's surrender. Laughter; God's redemption.)
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To: SkyPilot

The answer is the freeze spending solution. No one get’s more dollars than they got this year...a real freeze, not a “this year + 7.5% increase” fake freeze. 2012 they get the same amount. Period. They will find efficiencies or struggle at the end of the year.

Reduce spending each year 1 or 2 percent (dollar amount and not baseline 7.5% fantasy). The money is there.

In one year we’d control spending; in 2 years we’d have real cuts; and in 2 quadrennia, we’d have a balanced budget.

8 years to get out of the hole.

ObamaCare must be rescinded...there is no money for it. Entitlements would have to be reformed. (Increase retirement age to 70 or 72). Welfare and Medicaid would have to be based on “work for money.” with WPA type projects. Medicare would have to have annual minor medical caps....routine doctor visits, medicine, end non-MD therapy treatments (chiro, massage, “natural”, etc),


32 posted on 08/06/2011 5:23:12 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True Supporters of our Troops PRAY for their VICTORY!)
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To: SF_Redux

I agree, everyone should be issued a check equal to exactly what they paid into the system, then social security and medicare should be shut down.


33 posted on 08/06/2011 5:23:35 AM PDT by TexasFreeper2009 (Obama = Epic Fail)
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To: SkyPilot; All
Write 100 times on the blackboard:

SOCIAL SECURITY/MEDICARE ARE NOT ‘ENTITLEMENT’ PROGRAMS.

It is a program that people PRE-pay into for 50 years before they can use it.

And Medicare: health insurance PRE-paid for for 50 years and THEN, over $100 a month premium, a yearly deductible, 20% co-pay and office visits are not covered.

The program would be solvent had the gov’t not EMBEZZLED trillions from it for other purposes - and did not the gov’t now rob from it to give to millions of young people who have paid little to nothing into it - people perfectly capable of working, but who sit on their lazy arsess collecting a monthly check, food stamps and ONE HUNDRED % medical. NO premium, NO deductible, NO co-pay, office visits covered - AND free counseling (not covered for seniors.) All these people need to be - or claim to be - are current/past alcoholic/druggies/”bi-polar” etc.

These people's largess should not be robbed from Social Security/medicare funds.

GET IT?

Gov’t should be made to repay it's notes to Social Security and the interest built in would keep it solid. Remember, not everyone lives to collect SS, and many not for long.

Separate the SS/med. funds, pull the mooches funds from general and start cutting out the fraud and waste.

But SOCIAL SECURITY is NOT a ‘freebie’ program for seniors. They've paid the dues ahead and are still paying into medicare.

34 posted on 08/06/2011 5:25:46 AM PDT by maine-iac7 (I AM ISRAEL)
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To: SkyPilot

SS is a tax, plain and simple. The SCOTUS has already ruled (Flemming v. Nestor) that we are NOT entitled to payments and that Congress can repeal the Act, anytime it wants.

That said, why then are payments taxable? We are being taxed TWICE. The solution is simple:
1. Eliminate Depts of Energy, Education, HHS and HUD. Also EPA, BATF, OSHA, FannieMae, FreddieMac.
2. Cap all federal employees, elected or appointed, to $100K/yr.
3. Cut 25% of all Versailles employees.
4. Reduce Congressional staffers to 3 per member.
5. True up Medicare to SS eligibilty and eliminate Medicaid.
6. Repeal DeathCare, Davis-Bacon, Baseline Budget and Sarbanes-Oxley.
7. Cut personal Federal income tax to 10%, with only deductions for dependants. Corporate rate cut to 25%.
8. Eliminate all Foreign Aid, including UN contributions.
9. Elect Sarah Palin the next President of the US.
10. DRILL, BABY, DRILL.

THEN we can talk about more serious cuts.


35 posted on 08/06/2011 5:25:46 AM PDT by NTHockey (Rules of engagement #1: Take no prisoners)
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To: NTHockey

Damned excellent suggestions!


36 posted on 08/06/2011 5:31:10 AM PDT by who knows what evil? (G-d saved more animals than people on the ark...www.siameserescue.org.)
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To: maine-iac7
My FRiend, I have thirty years paying into “it” The govt DID embezzle and it is now insolvent, be happy you got something for your “investment” The system must be stopped. I'm not even asking for my money back just stop taking my money now and let me decide it's fate.
37 posted on 08/06/2011 5:40:51 AM PDT by VaRepublican (I would propagate taglines but I don't know how. But bloggers do.)
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To: TexasFreeper2009; All
I agree, everyone should be issued a check equal to exactly what they paid into the system, then social security and medicare should be shut down.

Interesting attitude.

"exactly" - So, if you had put away money every paycheck for 50 yrs into a private savings account at your bank, you'd be fine if the bank then kept all the interest accrued over the years as they got to use that money and make a fine profit on it - and THEN also kept the interest that should be yours? and all YOU get is the money you put it?

Somehow, I think you'd scream bloody murder.

38 posted on 08/06/2011 5:43:18 AM PDT by maine-iac7 (I AM ISRAEL)
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To: NTHockey

DIITO THAT


39 posted on 08/06/2011 5:44:57 AM PDT by maine-iac7 (I AM ISRAEL)
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To: PieterCasparzen

Thanks!! Bookmarked the site..


40 posted on 08/06/2011 5:46:47 AM PDT by SueRae (I can see November 2012 from my HOUSE!!!!!!!!)
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To: NTHockey

All excellent ideas...that will never see the light of day.


41 posted on 08/06/2011 5:49:26 AM PDT by P8riot (I carry a gun because I can't carry a cop.....Eagle Scout since Sep 9, 1970)
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To: maine-iac7

It’s not “private”. Jees your acting like government is benevolent.


42 posted on 08/06/2011 5:49:33 AM PDT by VaRepublican (I would propagate taglines but I don't know how. But bloggers do.)
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To: VaRepublican

How much have you currently received, I will get nothing as I continueto “invest”.


43 posted on 08/06/2011 5:50:54 AM PDT by VaRepublican (I would propagate taglines but I don't know how. But bloggers do.)
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To: SkyPilot

Didn’t see it last night but I’m waiting for a liberal pundit to arrive at the conclusion that S&P is a racist/terrorist organization.


44 posted on 08/06/2011 5:57:24 AM PDT by Don@VB (Power Corrupts)
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To: maine-iac7
Of course people should also get interest, sorry I should of been more explicit.

The goal is to end the bleeding, yes... it would cost the government a fortune to issue checks = all everyone ever paid into the SS and medicare system + interest, but at least then the programs could be ended and the financial healing could start.

45 posted on 08/06/2011 5:59:35 AM PDT by TexasFreeper2009 (Obama = Epic Fail)
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To: maine-iac7

So, the people who started receiving it in the 1940s paid into it for 50 years?

It’s not insurance...never has been.

Either Social Security and Medicare will be means-tested, or the government will go bankrupt. Those are the choices. It’s looking like it’ll probably be the latter.


46 posted on 08/06/2011 6:00:56 AM PDT by B Knotts (Just another Tenther)
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To: TexasFreeper2009

sometimes to save the patient... you have to remove an arm or leg.


47 posted on 08/06/2011 6:02:34 AM PDT by TexasFreeper2009 (Obama = Epic Fail)
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To: SF_Redux
SS is a Ponzi scheme, it works as long as more people are paying into it than taking withdrawals. That has reversed itself as the baby boomers came on stream as recipients ... they paid into it for years so feel entitled. Many were under the impression their contributions were being carefully shepherded (invested) by government and upon reaching retirement age it would be available to withdraw. Now reality has set in ... the U.S. government makes Bernard Madoff look like a pauper when it comes to the Ponzi scheme business.
48 posted on 08/06/2011 6:02:34 AM PDT by BluH2o
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To: VaRepublican
Missed the whole point, didn't you -

“jees?”

Jeeze.

49 posted on 08/06/2011 6:04:39 AM PDT by maine-iac7 (I AM ISRAEL)
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To: SkyPilot

bm


50 posted on 08/06/2011 6:05:52 AM PDT by Vision ("Did I not say to you that if you would believe, you would see the glory of God?" John 11:40)
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