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Peru researchers make rare ancient insect find
AFP ^ | 8-9-11 | Anon

Posted on 08/09/2011 7:59:49 PM PDT by Pharmboy


Detailed fossilized insect remains preserved in amber for over 23 million years (AFP/HO)

Peru researchers make rare ancient insect find (AFP) – 3 hours ago LIMA — Researchers in Peru said Tuesday they have discovered the remains of ancient insects and sunflower seeds trapped inside amber dating from the Miocene epoch, some 23 million years ago. The rare find was made in the remote mountainous jungle region near Peru's northern border with Ecuador, paleontologist Klaus Honninger told AFP. "These new discoveries are very important, because the insects and sunflower seeds confirm the type of climate that existed during the Miocene period," Honninger said in a telephone interview from the northern city of Chiclayo. The paleontologists discovered "hundreds of pieces of amber up to 12 centimeters (five inches) large containing several types of insects," Honninger said. The insects trapped in the amber -- fossilized tree resin -- are extremely well preserved and include ancient beetles, barklice, flies and spiders.

(Excerpt) Read more at google.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: amber; fossil; godsgravesglyphs; insect; peru
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No dinosaurs left 23 million years ago, so we can't get those dino cells from these insects' blood.
1 posted on 08/09/2011 7:59:51 PM PDT by Pharmboy
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To: neverdem; SunkenCiv

Insect-in-amber ping...


2 posted on 08/09/2011 8:01:37 PM PDT by Pharmboy (What always made the state a hell has been that man tried to make it heaven-Hoelderlin)
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To: Pharmboy

The earth wasn’t even around 23 million years ago. Junk science.


3 posted on 08/09/2011 8:08:24 PM PDT by Salvavida (The restoration of the U.S.A. starts with filling the pews at every Bible-believing church.)
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To: Pharmboy

Aside from the scientific aspect, bugs in large chunks of amber should be worth a pretty penny...


4 posted on 08/09/2011 8:12:26 PM PDT by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly. Stand fast. God knows what He is doing.)
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To: Salvavida

That didn’t take long.


5 posted on 08/09/2011 8:16:04 PM PDT by miliantnutcase
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To: Salvavida

A 6000 year old earth is a rather narrow minded assumption.


6 posted on 08/09/2011 8:30:30 PM PDT by TheZMan (Just secede and get it over with. No love lost on either side. Cya.)
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To: Pharmboy

That looks like a mud dobber wasp, three body parts, skinny connector from mid section to hind section, thin wings, multi-section legs.

I just deleted all of my questions about these bugs and evolution. But I sure do have a lot of questions.


7 posted on 08/09/2011 8:34:51 PM PDT by lurk
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To: lurk
Nice call.


8 posted on 08/09/2011 8:53:15 PM PDT by Pharmboy (What always made the state a hell has been that man tried to make it heaven-Hoelderlin)
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To: Pharmboy

Imagine 10,000 years from now finding Helen Thomas in a big blob of amber!


9 posted on 08/09/2011 9:07:28 PM PDT by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, A Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: TheZMan

10,000 - 20,000 years is my range because:

1. it better harmonizes with anthropology and paleontology.
2. “ “ with history (written account)
3. “ “ with the many civilizations uncovered in Iraq, Iran, Turkey, and Egypt
4. “ “ with modern man/homosapiens
5. “ “ with the inhabiting of the Americas

Other evidence includes:

1. archeology goes further than 4,000 B.C.
2. Hebrews only lists 10 geneologies (possible gap in geneology)
3. one of the sons of Shem mentioned in Luke, is not in Genesis (possible gap in geneology)
4. I do hold that Jesus Christ resurrected on the 3rd day.
In doing so, the record of human history is contained in the Bible; and since God created a mature Adam, He certainly could have created a mature earth (and I hold this view).

I don’t think that is narrow minded. He either resurrected, or he didn’t. Based on the body of evidence readily available to everyone....I say he did.


10 posted on 08/09/2011 9:11:15 PM PDT by Salvavida (The restoration of the U.S.A. starts with filling the pews at every Bible-believing church.)
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To: Salvavida
The earth wasn’t even around 23 million years ago. Junk science.

And the Sun revolves around the Earth?

Do you also believe that fire is magic?

11 posted on 08/09/2011 10:22:42 PM PDT by Alter Kaker (Gravitation is a theory, not a fact. It should be approached with an open mind...)
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To: Salvavida
since God created a mature Adam, He certainly could have created a mature earth (and I hold this view).

So God decided to create the early 10-20,000 years ago, but make it look like it was 4 billion years old? And the universe 13.7 billion years ago?

Why?

To trick us?

He created dinosaur fossils, and ancient supernovae and genetic markers just to test our faith? Some vast joke?

Sorry, I worship an awesome God, not some clownish prankster.

12 posted on 08/09/2011 10:27:34 PM PDT by Alter Kaker (Gravitation is a theory, not a fact. It should be approached with an open mind...)
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To: Pharmboy
But we CAN get giant sloth DNA. Also, those giant carniverous birds' DNA!

Humans apparently killed the sloths off about 12,000 years ago.

13 posted on 08/09/2011 11:12:26 PM PDT by VanShuyten ("a shadow...draped nobly in the folds of a gorgeous eloquence.")
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To: Alter Kaker

Don’t be stupid. We are not so don’t act like it.


14 posted on 08/09/2011 11:22:34 PM PDT by vpintheak (Democrats: Robbing humans of their dignity 1 law at a time)
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To: Alter Kaker
A prankster? No, God gave us His Word. We can be confident in Scripture through the fulfillment of prophecy. But the Bible doesn't set out to try to prove the existence of God: belief in God is assumed from Gen 1:1.

Since you assume 13.7 billion years ago, the obvious question is: how do you, or any other person know?

If you were to research carbon dating (C-14), you will find that there are a lot more problems than what is being packaged and sold as an exact science. For instance, there are at least three (3) assumptions made in using C-14, and any other radiometric dating method. Do you know them?

"If a C-14 date supports our theories, we put it in the main text. If it does not entirely contradict them, we put it in a footnote. And if it is completely 'out of date," we just drop it."

T. Save-Soderbergh and I.U. Olsson (Institute of Egyptology and Institute of Uppsala, Sweden)

Even the C-14 apologists admittedly play a shell game. So why are we in such a hurry to fully accept their conclusions? The global warming myth didn't work either. 1 Th 5:21

15 posted on 08/10/2011 5:51:14 AM PDT by Salvavida (The restoration of the U.S.A. starts with filling the pews at every Bible-believing church.)
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To: TheZMan; Salvavida

/s was inadvertently omitted


16 posted on 08/10/2011 5:56:58 AM PDT by bert (K.E. N.P. +12 ....Rats carry plague)
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To: Pharmboy

Hymenoptera


17 posted on 08/10/2011 5:58:28 AM PDT by bert (K.E. N.P. +12 ....Rats carry plague)
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To: lurk

They can easily examine the DNA of these “23 million year old” bugs/wasps/etc and compare them to today’s insects and see that no real changes occurred.

They’ll just push the timeline for evolution out when they do so, though.

“Time” and “Chance” are secret magic ingredients of Creation deniers.


18 posted on 08/10/2011 6:01:02 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter knows whom he's working for)
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To: Salvavida
Even the C-14 apologists admittedly play a shell game. So why are we in such a hurry to fully accept their conclusions?

Obviously you have no idea what you're talking about. Carbon-14 dating is used to date old pottery, not the age of the earth let alone the universe.

The age of the universe has been determined by three different independent techniques, all of which yield the same age.

19 posted on 08/10/2011 7:36:14 AM PDT by Alter Kaker (Gravitation is a theory, not a fact. It should be approached with an open mind...)
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To: vpintheak
Don’t be stupid. We are not so don’t act like it.

If you believe the earth is 4,000 years or 8,000 or 10,000 years old -- despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary available to anyone with even rudimentary literacy -- I'm not sure what to call it other than stupidity.

20 posted on 08/10/2011 7:39:51 AM PDT by Alter Kaker (Gravitation is a theory, not a fact. It should be approached with an open mind...)
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To: Alter Kaker
all of which yield the same age

BS

21 posted on 08/10/2011 7:40:57 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter knows whom he's working for)
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To: Alter Kaker

I am sorry for your anger towards Christians. You may want to check out the main page of FR. it says some things about people like us. I wish u the best, and ask that you keep your demeaning comments to yourself.


22 posted on 08/10/2011 7:46:20 AM PDT by vpintheak (Democrats: Robbing humans of their dignity 1 law at a time)
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To: Alter Kaker
Wow. You don't know that C-14 dating is being used to date the earth? No offense, but you don't know what you are talking about.

The age of the universe has been determined by three different independent techniques, all of which yield the same age.

And what techniques might those be? Science has never determined it. I'm sure Drs. Snelling, J. Morris, Woodmorappe, and Steven Meyer would love to hear it. Wjhat you left out (conveniently) is that all current techniques assume that the model is correct. As an example, using light to determine age runs into the horizon problem: you assume that all variables remain constant, everywhere. You are left with a hypothesis, but it's not something that can be proved.

So I prefer to go with what CAN be proved: the resurrection of Jesus Christ, and his fulfillment of 365 prophecies attributed to the Messiah. That alone gives me a baseline to "prove all things, hold onto that which is good". And if he is truth embodied in human form, then everything he has said is true.(1 Th 5:21 and John 17:17).

23 posted on 08/10/2011 8:11:39 AM PDT by Salvavida (The restoration of the U.S.A. starts with filling the pews at every Bible-believing church.)
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To: vpintheak
I am sorry for your anger towards Christians.

Don't be silly. I have no anger for Christians. Stop with the non-sequitors and don't start claiming I'm "persecuting" you.

24 posted on 08/10/2011 9:07:47 AM PDT by Alter Kaker (Gravitation is a theory, not a fact. It should be approached with an open mind...)
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To: Alter Kaker

Persecute was not a word I typed. You aren’t persecutiing anyone. What you are doing is making us out to be fools, which is your right to do; although doing so is utterly and profoundly ignorant.


25 posted on 08/10/2011 11:15:53 AM PDT by vpintheak (Democrats: Robbing humans of their dignity 1 law at a time)
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To: Salvavida
The earth wasn’t even around 23 million years ago. Junk science.

Agreed, statements like that are utter nonsense. 23 million years, ya right, uh huh ...
26 posted on 08/10/2011 11:20:41 AM PDT by Scythian
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To: Alter Kaker

Unfortuntely, at the judgement, you will be found to have been the stupid one for believing fairytales, sad but true.


27 posted on 08/10/2011 11:23:34 AM PDT by Scythian
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To: Pharmboy

With the Bible, you can pursue religion, philosophy, morality and even history, but not science.


28 posted on 08/10/2011 11:35:16 AM PDT by ZX12R (FUBO GTFO 2012 !)
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To: ZX12R

Well put, but I’m not one of those on this thread that needs to understand that.


29 posted on 08/10/2011 11:50:14 AM PDT by Pharmboy (What always made the state a hell has been that man tried to make it heaven-Hoelderlin)
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To: Pharmboy
Well put, but I’m not one of those on this thread that needs to understand that.

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you did. For some reason I just thought I'd put it out there, and replied to the originator of the thread.
30 posted on 08/10/2011 11:56:30 AM PDT by ZX12R (FUBO GTFO 2012 !)
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To: Scythian
Unfortuntely, at the judgement, you will be found to have been the stupid one for believing fairytales, sad but true.

Aren't you the fellow that believes bigfoot is real? If so, it seems to me, that you believe in fairy tales too.
31 posted on 08/10/2011 12:03:14 PM PDT by ZX12R (FUBO GTFO 2012 !)
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To: Alter Kaker

Arguing science vs. faith always ends badly.


32 posted on 08/10/2011 12:10:10 PM PDT by Pharmboy (What always made the state a hell has been that man tried to make it heaven-Hoelderlin)
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To: ZX12R

Oh...no “sorry” necessary. Nuance is hard to convey in a post...in agreeing with you, I just meant to reinforce that thought for others. Thanks again for your reasoned addition to the thread.


33 posted on 08/10/2011 12:19:09 PM PDT by Pharmboy (What always made the state a hell has been that man tried to make it heaven-Hoelderlin)
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To: ZX12R
Aren't you the fellow that believes bigfoot is real?

I, too, thought that had been confirmed.

34 posted on 08/10/2011 12:32:39 PM PDT by no gnu taxes
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To: no gnu taxes
I, too, thought that had been confirmed.

That is a Wookie, a close relative, yet different species. It's a misidentification often made by amateurs. So don't feel bad. Only an expert could tell the difference.
35 posted on 08/10/2011 12:48:00 PM PDT by ZX12R (FUBO GTFO 2012 !)
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Boop His Beak!

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36 posted on 08/10/2011 1:08:14 PM PDT by TheOldLady (FReepmail me to get ON or OFF the ZOT LIGHTNING ping list.)
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To: Pharmboy; StayAt HomeMother; Ernest_at_the_Beach; 1010RD; 21twelve; 24Karet; 2ndDivisionVet; ...

 GGG managers are SunkenCiv, StayAt HomeMother & Ernest_at_the_Beach
Thanks Pharmboy.

A 'look back in amber' ping.

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.


37 posted on 08/10/2011 2:49:36 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Yes, as a matter of fact, it is that time again -- https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: Pharmboy

If the amber was from North America we could resurrect a large Epicyon, Orrorin tugenensis’ best friend.


38 posted on 08/10/2011 3:14:15 PM PDT by Sawdring
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To: Salvavida; TheZMan; miliantnutcase; Alter Kaker; MrB; ZX12R; Pharmboy; Doctor Stochastic

C-14 dating isn't used to date the Earth. A different radiometric method used to date the Earth is the Uranium to Lead ratio (Uranium decays into Lead at a measurable rate).

In 2005, in the topic Long-Destroyed Fifth Planet May Have Caused Lunar Cataclysm, Researchers Say, FReeper Doctor Stochastic posted this useful link:
Radiometric Dating, A Christian Perspective
by Dr. Roger C. Wiens
First edition 1994; revised version 2002
[snip] Radiometric dating -- the process of determining the age of rocks from the decay of their radioactive elements -- has been in widespread use for over half a century. There are over forty such techniques, each using a different radioactive element or a different way of measuring them. It has become increasingly clear that these radiometric dating techniques agree with each other and as a whole, present a coherent picture in which the Earth was created a very long time ago. Further evidence comes from the complete agreement between radiometric dates and other dating methods such as counting tree rings or glacier ice core layers. Many Christians have been led to distrust radiometric dating and are completely unaware of the great number of laboratory measurements that have shown these methods to be consistent. Many are also unaware that Bible-believing Christians are among those actively involved in radiometric dating. This paper describes in relatively simple terms how a number of the dating techniques work, how accurately the half-lives of the radioactive elements and the rock dates themselves are known, and how dates are checked with one another. In the process the paper refutes a number of misconceptions prevalent among Christians today. This paper is available on the web via the American Scientific Affiliation and related sites to promote greater understanding and wisdom on this issue, particularly within the Christian community. ...differences still occur within the church. A disagreement over the age of the Earth is relatively minor in the whole scope of Christianity; it is more important to agree on the Rock of Ages than on the age of rocks. But because God has also called us to wisdom, this issue is worthy of study. [/snip]

39 posted on 08/10/2011 3:22:29 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Yes, as a matter of fact, it is that time again -- https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: no gnu taxes

*kof-kof*


40 posted on 08/10/2011 3:30:21 PM PDT by Monkey Face ("...I believe in angels; something good in everything I see..." ABBA)
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To: SunkenCiv

Thanks for enhancing the info on this thread.


41 posted on 08/10/2011 3:38:44 PM PDT by Pharmboy (What always made the state a hell has been that man tried to make it heaven-Hoelderlin)
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To: SunkenCiv

How do I know that this article wasn’t written by the hand of the devil himself? (just kidding)

I do agree, however, with the statement in the article that it’s more important to agree on the rock of ages, than the age of rocks, still knowing that the rocks are inconceivably old.

Nice article. Thanks for posting.


42 posted on 08/10/2011 3:39:32 PM PDT by ZX12R (FUBO GTFO 2012 !)
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To: Sawdring
If the amber was from North America we could resurrect a large Epicyon, Orrorin tugenensis’ best friend.

A what?
43 posted on 08/10/2011 3:43:02 PM PDT by ZX12R (FUBO GTFO 2012 !)
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To: SunkenCiv
A disagreement over the age of the Earth is relatively minor in the whole scope of Christianity; it is more important to agree on the Rock of Ages than on the age of rocks

I like it!

44 posted on 08/10/2011 3:46:44 PM PDT by airborne (Paratroopers! Good to the last drop!)
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To: SunkenCiv

I swear I killed one of those after it somehow got into our house the other day. About the size of a wasp, and looking like a huge, black ant? Yep. I killed one. Probably the last living relative, too.


45 posted on 08/10/2011 3:49:25 PM PDT by TheOldLady (FReepmail me to get ON or OFF the ZOT LIGHTNING ping list.)
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To: ZX12R

You have an internet connection, web browser and a favorite search engine, right? Think of man’s best friend.


46 posted on 08/10/2011 4:01:00 PM PDT by Sawdring
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To: Sawdring
You have an internet connection, web browser and a favorite search engine, right? Think of man’s best friend.

I looked it up, and I still don't get it. Is this anthropologist humor that only the same would get? Sorry, I can be dense. But I'll buy one of those epicyons if you resurrect them.
47 posted on 08/10/2011 4:24:30 PM PDT by ZX12R (FUBO GTFO 2012 !)
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To: Pharmboy

Well, perhaps we could get Mammoth DNA instead. :-)


48 posted on 08/10/2011 4:28:55 PM PDT by Immerito (Reading Through the Bible in 90 Days)
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To: Salvavida

“3. one of the sons of Shem mentioned in Luke, is not in Genesis (possible gap in geneology)”

In the thinking of Old Testament times, to “begat” someone simply meant to be their ancestor. So, I great-great grandfather could be said to have “begat” me without it being in error at all. It does not diminish the infallibility of scripture to say that gaps (by our reasoning) in geneologies exist.

I am curious....do you hold to a world wide flood...Noah’s Flood? It explains a great many things seen in geology.


49 posted on 08/10/2011 5:01:47 PM PDT by Sola Veritas (Trying to speak truth - not always with the best grammar or spelling)
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To: Sola Veritas

Personally, I think that is the weakest of the arguments I posed, and when I came across it in my notes, I was surprised I didn’t call my professor on it. I’m going to ask him why this would be considered a gap, when him and both siblings cover that gap. It is true that not all geneologies are in Scripture; only those that God needed to include. But that is a good point you bring as far as the use of “begat”. I’d have to study it.

Yes, I absolutely believe in a world-wide flood. God made that clear. :-)


50 posted on 08/10/2011 6:15:27 PM PDT by Salvavida (The restoration of the U.S.A. starts with filling the pews at every Bible-believing church.)
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