Posted on 09/10/2011 9:08:18 AM PDT by smoothsailing
From the article: The average in-state cost of a four-year degree in Texas, including books, is roughly $30,000
Strikes me as pretty steep for in-state. Perry’s goal is to get it down to $10K. The author’s $30K has to include not only tuition and books, but also #20K in housing, food and fees to reach that cool $30K.
Here are some comparables of top state schools in 3 states from USN&WR for 2010-11 tuition only:
UC –Berkeley (#1 Public; #22 National) $10,868 in-state; $33,747 out-of-state.
UVA (#2 Public; #25 National) $10,628 in-state; $33,574 out-of-state.
UT-Austin (#13 Public; #45 National) $9,418 in-state; $31,218 out-of-state
That's how it looks.
There is no way UVA is $10K for 4 years.
noooooooooooooooooooooooo hahahaha, don’t we WISH !!!
I thought I set out tuition and tuition only for the 2010-11 school year only; same for all the others.
So if your kid is going to, say, UVA, the tuition is $10K+ for that year, then some increase over the four years, probably ending up around $12.5K in his/her senior year for just the tuition. Throw in the rest and it’s a cool $30K/year.
So now we understand why the private comparables are now running $50K. Ugh. This just can’t be sustained.
When I went to school, it was $750 a semester....
Usually in speaking of college costs, it’s done on an annual basis, given the increases from year to year for ALL costs. This writer did say a four year TX degree costs on average $30K, but that would be only for tuition and books. (Bought any college textbooks lately? Worse than tuition, etc!)
So if I’m looking to send a kid to UT-Austin, I start at @$10K just tuition/books, then throw in the housing/food/fees/extracurricular, blah blah blah. ‘Tain’t cheap even at public U’s any more.
Right fight, wrong solution, headed in the wrong direction. Imagine this tool in the hand of a leftist, STATE control of thought. If you think that is headway, you are on the wrong forum.
Let's face it, The Lady ain't running, and Bobo is OUT in 2012, ya'll.
Perry, Romney, Christie, Rubio -- these 4 can win. 2 ain't running, and the other one is someone goofing on being a politician. That leaves Texas, and having spent a lot of time there over the past 20 years, I have always found a lot to like about Texas...
I'm hoping the HOPE scholarship (GA) is still solvent when my daughter graduates HS in 2013.
That’s my hope for your daughter, too! Don’t, under any circumstances, let her take out huge college loans. If it comes to it, let her go to a community college, then get auto transfer to a state 4 year college to finish off.
There’s more than just financial advantage to community colleges. Like maturing, getting a better sense of what they’re in school for, what major they want to pursue, instead of changing the major six times, extending the four years to five or more.
It makes me physically sick when I hear young folks with $50-100K in debt for college loans for a degree that doesn’t lead to a job that can reasonably pay off the loans. There is NO getting out of paying off those loans. MAYBE death, but bankruptcy won’t excuse college loans. They absolutely, positively have to be paid back.
Best to you and your daughter.
This has the virtue of appealing to all political factions. For example, in many cases, a professor will make a few changes in a textbook, thus creating a “new edition.” Not only is the price of the new book inflated, but the professor can require that the students use the “new, improved” version.
That might make sense if the book reveals the latest discoveries in nanotechnology, but if the subject is philosophers from hundreds or thousands of years ago, it is not only a burden for the students, but also a potential conflict of interest for the professor-author.
Acta Philosophorum, $1740 on Amazon. At the college bookstore, I hate to think how much.
One of my instructors in college required an expensive hard bound edition of Moby Dick, but I bought a used paperback. The only problem was when they referred to a page number that was different from my version, but I did OK.
Electronic books may go a long way to lower costs, but only if “the system” allows it to happen.
But one of the dangers in “reforming the system” is that you will create a new bureaucracy. Sometimes the cure is worse than the disease. Like the government “help” we got to “cure” the 2008 crash.
[Rick] Scott Promotes Controversial Education Reforms [Rick Perry has championed] “Gov. Rick Scott has begun discreetly promoting the same changes to the higher education system that Texas Gov. Rick Perry has championed. The proposals include some of the same reforms pushed by conservatives in K-12 schools: merit pay for professors, tenure reform, and generally a much greater emphasis on measurement of whether professors are turning out students that meet certain goals.
The attempt in Texas has caused something of an identity crisis in that states higher education community, with opponents saying what needs to be reformed is Perry's control over university policies.<<<
The Left is getting interested about whether Gov. Perry might shake up public education if elected president and save their bacon from the mess they've created.
Will Rick Perry Unravel the Strange Consensus on Public Education?
Think of what would be necessary to hand control of American education to the UN. The key would the establishment of control points and then handing said control up the chain. That is EXACTLY what Perry is doing here. This move of Perry's hardly qualifies as "smaller government," as administration of these tests is taken from the hands of local authorities, however much you may dislike them individually. Instead of establishing competing customer driven standards, he is setting up a system that pleases only the autocrat.
Perry is pulling exactly the same ruse that Bush did: qualifying as a conservative by TALKING God and country, while at the same time inculcating the power of the State, which is easily handed over to those you would not find at all so pleasing. This was the same mistake as falling for the PATRIOT Act, which in the hands of a Janet Napoletano blathering about conservatives as a domestic threat of terrorism is rather concerning.
"There's obviously opposition (to switching to totally computerized material), but there's always opposition to change," Perry said. He said the switch would have to be done cost effectively and that he didn't yet know whether such a move would save money. The governor said he wants to explore the proposal when the Legislature meets in 2011.>>>.......
2. Recognize and reward teachers — This is merit pay for professors. The plan calls for the top 25 percent of professors to earn a bonus. Top bonuses would be $10,000 per class.
3. Separate budgets for teaching and research — This would allow colleges to better evaluate what kind of bang for its buck professors are providing. Splitting the pots of money would make it clearer how and why professors are paid.
4. Require evidence of skill for tenure — This would set easily-defined goals to earn tenure. For instance, a professor would have to earn a rating of 4.5 on a 5-point scale to be eligible for tenure. Likewise, a professor might have to teach at least three classes a semester, with at least 30 students in each class, for a set number of years before becoming eligible for tenure.
5. Results-based contracts with students — This amounts to a mortgage good faith estimate for students. Students would have to sign a document outlining the school’s class sizes, teacher evaluations, SAT scores of incoming students and other data that would allow them to make a better informed decision.
6. Funding in the hands of students — This proposal would take out the middle man in public funding. Some public money is given to schools as a tuition subsidy for student. The Texas Public Policy Foundation argues students will make the best decision if they get the money directly. Critics contend this creates a voucher system for colleges.
7. Create results-based accrediting alternatives — This proposal would gradually move schools away from traditional accrediting and create a national body similar to the Securities and Exchange Commission to evaluate college claims and actual results. Colleges that can not fulfill their recruiting pitch could be investigated for fraud. Establishing new accreditation would make it possible for more schools to enter the market. [snip]
Rick Perry Leads the Way on Higher-Ed Reform [snip] First, runaway college costs are an important “kitchen table” issue for American families. After the economic woes of the past decade, many families are wondering how they are going to afford to send their kids to college (the yearly cost of attending an in-state four-year public college now tops $16,000 per year).
Second, like our public schools, America’s colleges are woefully underperforming. The authors of the recently published book Academically Adrift: Limited Learning on College Campuses found that 45 percent of college students show no improvement in critical skills after two years in college. Troubling statistics are forcing many families to question whether investing time and money in college is really worth it, particularly since many college graduates are struggling to find employment and appear to have gained few marketable skills.
Third, colleges are creating a heavy burden for taxpayers. According to the National Association of State Budget Officers, higher-ed spending accounts for approximately 10 percent of state spending. And federal subsidies for higher education (including grants, loans, tax credits, and direct payments to schools) amount to well over $100 billion annually.
Fourth, colleges have long been an intellectual driver of progressivism in American life. I am sure I am not the only person who found my undergraduate and graduate school years to have been a tiring indoctrination in leftist ideas. It is surely no coincidence that young American voters are more included to vote for the Left after this indoctrination.
For too long, the Right has neglected the need to challenge and reform American higher education. But in the current political climate, reforming colleges and universities (as well as our student-aid policies) is an eminently winnable fight — and one that would yield big gains for students and taxpayers.
Conservative leaders around the country should follow Rick Perry’s lead. [end]
LA Times story that underscores reasons for Perry’s 7 Solutions push:
Take back the liberal arts - Too often, liberal arts courses aren't attuned to undergraduates looking for a broader understanding of the world but toward professor's narrow interests. -
………”Amherst once had a college-wide course called "Evolution of the Earth and Man," team taught by faculty from geology through genetics. It was exactly the sort of thing that drew people into the sciences. However, that offering no longer exists. Such classes don't earn points for the professors who plan them. Instead, they are expected to be doing research that will lead to tenure or higher ranks, which often means they are concentrating on ever more obscure topics.
An American Mathematical Society study of introductory courses found that only 11% were taught by regular faculty. Professors making their mark in "orbit structure of diffeomorphims of manifolds" feel their talents would be wasted teaching Math 101. But they might mull Albert Einstein's words to young researchers: "You do not really understand something unless you can explain it to your grandmother."
There are still colleges where the contents of the bottles match the labels. But they tend to be more modest schools, ones that don't expect their faculties to make national reputations in research. Occidental College in Los Angeles is such a school, as is Hendrix College in Arkansas and the new Quest University Canada in British Columbia. And there are excellent dedicated liberal arts colleges within affordable public systems. New College of Florida and St. Mary's College of Maryland are two; also Arizona State University's Barrett honors college and Macaulay Honors College at the City University of New York, which waives tuition for students who maintain a 3.5 grade-point average.
As high school students and their parents consider college options, they might want to take a careful look at catalogs and course descriptions. In higher education these days, it's buyer beware.” [end]
Insult aside, I like it here and intend to hang around.
I’ll trade you LomanBill for Carry_Okie.
I'm glad also. There of course will be those who will find some reason to hate him for it.
OK, but I want an option on two players to be named later! :)
Why do we even need bricks and mortar schools in the 21st Century? Why do we need to "reward teachers" when the best could earn money like rock stars? Don't you get it? All that "classroom teaching" stuff is over.
Hence, Perry's "solutions" might have been productive back in the 70s, but as of now they are more hazardous than beneficial.
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