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Taxes taking toll on ‘folks’ (Big Government™ Alert)
The Boston Herald ^ | 2011-09-17 | Bill O'Reilly

Posted on 09/17/2011 8:04:57 AM PDT by rabscuttle385

The folks are getting hosed. According to the American Debt Advisor outfit, 80 percent of us now owe money to creditors. If you exclude mortgages and car payments, about 50 percent of us are in debt. And that’s why the economy is having so much trouble. Consumers have to be very careful about what they buy, or risk sinking into insolvency.

Some pundits place the blame on unemployment, which is currently just over 9 percent. But that’s not what is driving debt. Taxation is.

The mean salary in America is just about $50,000. But if you live in Los Angeles, Boston, San Francisco or New York, earning 50K means you’re poor. The cost of living in most urban areas is now so high that a $250,000 salary is middle income. President Barack Obama might not understand this, but we, the people, do.

New Yorkers like me pay federal income tax, state income tax, New York City income tax and property taxes if we own a home. In fact, per capita property tax in the Empire State is about $1,900 a year. Sales tax per capita, another $1,700 per year.

Gasoline tax in New York: 45 cents a gallon. Cell phone tax and fees of 23 percent are added to your monthly bill. There are also tolls, and taxes on your driver’s license, cigarettes and alcohol. The hits just keep on coming.

The only relief for New Yorkers is knowing the tax situation is worse in New Jersey.

All over the U.S., working folks are bleeding take-home pay. Obama says he wants to extend the payroll tax cut, and that’s fine. But that’s a proverbial drop of water into a bottomless well.

Folks just don’t have much money to spend. So how on earth is the economy going to improve? Who’s going to buy stuff? With so much money being taken from everyday Americans by their elected representatives in Washington and in the state capitals, there’s simply not enough cash being spent in the marketplace to return the nation to economic prosperity.

Recently I saw a bumper sticker that read: “Taxes buy civilization. Progressive values are American values.”

Well, balderdash. Taxes are strangling working Americans. They are creating a society not of self-reliance (almost unaffordable), but of dependence on institutions we can’t control: banks, credit card companies, government-generated handouts. Now the feds have seized control of the health industry. That will mean even more taxation down the road.

Obama made a bet that his big-government vision would create jobs and prosperity. It has not worked. It never works. Ask Cubans and Venezuelans. Americans now find themselves struggling to pay the bills and utterly dependent on whoever is paying them a salary.

Upward mobility? Please. Most Americans are just trying to survive. This is not what the pursuit of happiness is all about.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Editorial; Government
KEYWORDS: biggovernment; lping; nannystate; taxes; tyranny

1 posted on 09/17/2011 8:05:02 AM PDT by rabscuttle385
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To: Abathar; Abcdefg; Abram; Abundy; albertp; Alexander Rubin; Allosaurs_r_us; amchugh; ...
Taxes are strangling working Americans. They are creating a society not of self-reliance (almost unaffordable), but of dependence on institutions we can’t control: banks, credit card companies, government-generated handouts. Now the feds have seized control of the health industry. That will mean even more taxation down the road.

Libertarian ping! Click here to get added or here to be removed or post a message here!

2 posted on 09/17/2011 8:07:14 AM PDT by rabscuttle385 (Live Free or Die)
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To: rabscuttle385

bump.


3 posted on 09/17/2011 8:11:23 AM PDT by ken21 (ruling class dem + rino progressives -- destroying america for 150 years.)
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To: rabscuttle385

My husband is a Realtor in a rural area. Average home costs are around $50,000 or so. But, there are more expensive homes, just not lots. He has to sell many homes and lucky he’s top seller and lister in our area. Our taxes last quarter were around $1,500 on $8,000. Our income is down about 40% from 3+ years ago. If people had to pay their taxes out of pocket, instead of having them withdrawn every month so you don’t really see it. There’d be a louder outcry. Ever quarter I just get angrier and angrier. Especially when I see the way our tax dollars are thrown away. After they’ve wasted billions of our hard earned money, and they run out of our money, they just come after us for more.


4 posted on 09/17/2011 8:12:18 AM PDT by MsLady (Be the kind of woman that when you get up in the morning, the devil says, "Oh crap, she's UP !!")
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To: ken21

and this is why we are YEARS away from fixing the housing problem...unless instead of trying to keep people in houses they can’t ever afford, and thus prop up housing prices...clean them all out..let prices correct, let others start to buy...we are prolonging the problem..


5 posted on 09/17/2011 8:14:36 AM PDT by ken5050 (Save the EARTH...it's the ONLY planet with CHOCOLATE!!!)
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To: MsLady

Has a conversation with a friend...30% set aside just in FICA, not including city and state, plus property, gains, and etc.

I can’t do it. I just can’t do it. I am working from before sun-up until after sun-down and going backwards.

I need to hire help...and can’t see a way clear to actually pay them too. Wow...think about that idea. Due to government taxation...I can’t afford to hire.


6 posted on 09/17/2011 8:19:10 AM PDT by EBH (God Humbles Nations, Leaders, and Peoples before He uses them for His Purpose)
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To: rabscuttle385
Obama says he wants to extend the payroll tax cut, and that’s fine.

No matter what taxes the Feds cut, the States move in immediately and take up the slack. That mentality is endemic and a thorough "cleansing of the hives" is needed.

7 posted on 09/17/2011 8:19:24 AM PDT by Oatka ("A society of sheep must in time beget a government of wolves." –Bertrand de Jouvenel)
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To: rabscuttle385

There have been new hidden taxes in every bill that’s been passed since the commiecrats took over congress in 2007, and started expanding these programs and making them more available to Americans as they they put a choke hold on businesses and cratered the vast of majority of them or ran them completely out of the country.

They’ve all but nationalized every business in the US with their controls.

And soon the vast majority of households will be cranking up a generator to support the flickering flow of energy into their houses...if...if they can afford the fuel to do so.

Liberalism...progressivism...socialism...aka communism is doing exactly what Marx told them to do. Destroy every freedom loving society on the planet.


8 posted on 09/17/2011 8:19:48 AM PDT by RowdyFFC
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To: rabscuttle385

Everyone I know are or have maxed their credit to survive. Two daughters that have to share my modest income to survive. California is a total toilet and will never recover.


9 posted on 09/17/2011 8:20:33 AM PDT by Logical me
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To: ken5050

yep.

i enjoyed your story about how you daughter came to learn about taxes.

we’ve all been there.


10 posted on 09/17/2011 8:21:10 AM PDT by ken21 (ruling class dem + rino progressives -- destroying america for 150 years.)
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To: rabscuttle385
Good article. More and more Americans are starting to 'get' what government is all about. It's all about Taxes and Regulations. . and filling their pockets. . and on top of that, socialism doesn't work. .
11 posted on 09/17/2011 8:23:24 AM PDT by Art in Idaho (Conservatism is the only hope for Western Civilization.)
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To: rabscuttle385

The kernel..the nugget of it all is taxes, regulation, and immigration

The story of American jobs and labor is deeply intertwined with predatory Federal, state and local taxation and regulation....

South Koreans sleep soundly on their border with NORKS because of American Taxpayer dollars and the American GI.

Why can’t Texans, New Mexicans, Arizonans and Californians?....BECAUSE

Illegal immigration is THE KEY to the perpetuation of the status quo in DC......

Predatory tax and regulatory policies-actions that basically serve to perpetuate and grow governments-leave what business is left in the country seeking disposable labor.

Illegal Labor is the Feds out for preserving the status quo regarding Taxes and Regulation. Interestingly, that is WHY the Feds encourage in-state tuition etc for illegals under-the-table -their presence providing disposable labor allows Federal, State and local regulatory and tax excess in the status quo to continue

Immigration is the ultimate litmus test as to the candidates in question commitment to meaningful regulatory and tax reform. If they are wishy-washy on the subject...they have no real intent to disturb the DC status quo...no matter how big their cowboy hat and six-gun.

Real”leadership” is that which will place Flyover Country’s interest ahead of the Feds....haven’t yet seen anything meaningful anywhere from anybody to indicate that might happen. We have just one more election cycle to make that happen via rule of law. Otherwise its the end of the run for America.


12 posted on 09/17/2011 8:24:35 AM PDT by mo
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To: rabscuttle385

I think taxes are way too low. I think people are not paying enough in taxes.

I think the federal budget (all all state and local governemnts) should not only be balanced, but it should also be running a surplus so we can be paying off our national debt.

(This concept also applies to the wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Libya. All wars should be paid on a pay-as-you-go basis. If you do not want to pay for a war, then don’t do it. If you do want the war, then pay for it.)


13 posted on 09/17/2011 8:27:05 AM PDT by CGalen
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To: CGalen
I think taxes are way too low.

How high do you want to make them?

I think people are not paying enough in taxes.

You're right.

The entitlement class is not paying any. They should.

But that's not what you meant, is it?

14 posted on 09/17/2011 8:36:41 AM PDT by Flycatcher (God speaks to us, through the supernal lightness of birds, in a special type of poetry.)
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To: EBH
Bears repeating:

Due to government taxation...I can’t afford to hire.

15 posted on 09/17/2011 8:38:18 AM PDT by Art in Idaho (Conservatism is the only hope for Western Civilization.)
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To: CGalen
paying taxes is voluntary, or so the IRS says anyway, so tell me, do you pay more than the IRS asks for since you don't think you are taxed enough???
16 posted on 09/17/2011 8:41:49 AM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: CGalen

You are free to pay more in taxes. Are you?


17 posted on 09/17/2011 8:48:08 AM PDT by gogogodzilla (Live free or die!)
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To: rabscuttle385
More and more Americans now understand Government does not produce any jobs. The Free Market, unencumbered by taxes, rules and regulations, and fueled by competition, is our job creation machine.

Down with Big Centralized Government!

People say the next election is going to be about jobs. That's certainly important, but as this article points out, the cause of no jobs is burdensome Taxation and Regulation.

The War of 2012 will center around Taxation, Rules, Regulations and Jobs. Get Government out of our lives!

Did I say Taxed Enough Already? Why don't more Americans see and understand this? Spread the word. . .

18 posted on 09/17/2011 8:50:25 AM PDT by Art in Idaho (Conservatism is the only hope for Western Civilization.)
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To: EBH

It’s horrible, absolutely horrible what our government is doing. Criminal really. I don’t think we can handle another 1.5 years of this administration.


19 posted on 09/17/2011 8:55:31 AM PDT by MsLady (Be the kind of woman that when you get up in the morning, the devil says, "Oh crap, she's UP !!")
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To: CGalen

I’m really looking forward to paying $10,000 next week to the IRS, but since I’m such a nice person, I’d like to give you that joy. Paying for Solyndra gives it an extra kick.

SOLYNDRA
LIGHTSQUARED
FAST & FURIOUS

Will the trifecta open some eyes?


20 posted on 09/17/2011 8:59:20 AM PDT by bronxville (Sarah will be the first American female president.)
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To: CGalen
i repeat, paying taxes is voluntary, or so the IRS says anyway, so tell me, do you pay more than the IRS asks for since you don't think you are taxed enough???
21 posted on 09/17/2011 9:01:54 AM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: Chode; CGalen
I don't think CGalen is going to answer our questions.

He/she/it appears to be a Hit & Run troll.

And not a very smart one.

22 posted on 09/17/2011 9:06:56 AM PDT by Flycatcher (God speaks to us, through the supernal lightness of birds, in a special type of poetry.)
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To: Flycatcher
bingo... just another know nothing RAT scheizekop shooting it's mouth off
23 posted on 09/17/2011 9:10:34 AM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: mo
Great points. The immigration battle is the key to all the others. Will be interested to hear more from Sarah about her plans to attack this as it all ties together with immigration, taxation, rules, regulations - as you pointed out.
24 posted on 09/17/2011 9:14:28 AM PDT by Art in Idaho (Conservatism is the only hope for Western Civilization.)
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To: MsLady
If people had to pay their taxes out of pocket, instead of having them withdrawn every month so you don’t really see it. There’d be a louder outcry.

YES! Instead of having the sums deducted from their check before it gets in their hands, they'd get all of it and then have to give a heaping chunk of it away four times a year. There would be a sea change in attitudes across this land, because millions would think as they are writing those checks, "Boy, if I could keep this I would..."

Personally, I think one of the big reasons liberals/marxists/socialists/Obama rarely mention those of us who are self-employed is because we realized all of this long ago. We know how much government takes from us and we also see how they waste it (hi, Solyndra).
25 posted on 09/17/2011 9:19:07 AM PDT by LostInBayport (When there are more people riding in the cart than there are pulling it, the cart stops moving...)
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To: CGalen

When you get your next check from Attackwatch.com, check the stub and see how much you’ve already paid. In case you don’t know what a check stub is, the stub is not the part you cash, it is the part with all the numbers and the photo of Obama with sunlight streaming out of his behind.


26 posted on 09/17/2011 9:25:52 AM PDT by LostInBayport (When there are more people riding in the cart than there are pulling it, the cart stops moving...)
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To: LostInBayport
Instead of having the sums deducted from their check before it gets in their hands, they'd get all of it and then have to give a heaping chunk of it away four times a year. There would be a sea change in attitudes

Ya betcha there would be. There'd be such a cry in the land the government in Washington would be shaking in their wing tips.

27 posted on 09/17/2011 9:30:11 AM PDT by MsLady (Be the kind of woman that when you get up in the morning, the devil says, "Oh crap, she's UP !!")
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To: CGalen; darkwing104; 50mm; paulycy; Old Sarge
I think taxes are way too low. I think people are not paying enough in taxes.

IBTZ

28 posted on 09/17/2011 9:33:05 AM PDT by rabscuttle385 (Live Free or Die)
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To: rabscuttle385

This article says the mean income of America is $50,000.

Thats a mean income all right, it’s a little more than I make and it’s mean trying to live off it.


29 posted on 09/17/2011 9:57:39 AM PDT by Venturer
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To: Venturer
Read somewhere there's 18 taxes on a loaf of bread. .

We're talking about a major top down overhaul here. . Federal and State for starters. . then county, city and eventually back to The Free Markets!

Go Sarah!

30 posted on 09/17/2011 10:33:35 AM PDT by Art in Idaho (Conservatism is the only hope for Western Civilization.)
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To: rabscuttle385; CGalen; darkwing104; 50mm; paulycy

31 posted on 09/17/2011 2:39:56 PM PDT by Old Sarge (Marking time on the government's dime...)
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To: MsLady

nothing like having everyone become an independent contractor, would bring on tax reform faster.


32 posted on 09/17/2011 3:43:35 PM PDT by griswold3 (Character is Destiny)
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To: rabscuttle385
Four years ago, on a gross salary 6% less than I am making now, I was taking home almost exactly the same after tax. Starting January 1st 2012, state tax deductions will take another 2% chunk out assuming the 2% 401K reduction expires. I am determined to vote against the politicians (virtually all Democrats) who are responsible for this.
33 posted on 09/17/2011 8:41:28 PM PDT by Post Toasties (Leftists give insanity a bad name.)
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To: gogogodzilla
To: CGalen

You are free to pay more in taxes. Are you?

Of course not. People (like Buffett) who say other people should pay 'a lot more taxes' are usually not paying their share as it is, and they figure that they won't pay their share regardless of the tax rate, so they are free to call for higher taxes on others. Clearly, people like this should be ignored.

34 posted on 09/17/2011 9:12:39 PM PDT by Post Toasties (Leftists give insanity a bad name.)
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To: CGalen
I think taxes are way too low. I think people are not paying enough in taxes.

I like your thinking. Increasing taxes would put the deathknell on this administration.

If only we didn't have a GOP House, it would work.

35 posted on 09/17/2011 10:45:50 PM PDT by superloser
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To: CGalen
I agree with you that taxes are too low. Everyone should pay taxes or not be allowed to vote and I mean Federal Income Tax. I also believe that all tax rebates for those who pay no taxes should be eliminated, that will also help with the budget.

Everyone should pay taxes and I think it should be the same percent.

36 posted on 09/17/2011 11:06:07 PM PDT by SledgeCS (I will vote for Obama when he says "The F'ing MUSLIMS attacked the USA and are the enemy")
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To: ken5050

The housing problem won’t be fixed until demand catches up with supply.


37 posted on 09/18/2011 2:38:03 AM PDT by DB
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To: DB

You’re wrong on that...The supply ( inventory) is there..and so is the demand..but NOT at the current prices. They have to fall further, across the board...many more foreclosures have to ocur..the maket is artificially inflated...


38 posted on 09/18/2011 5:29:52 AM PDT by ken5050 (Save the EARTH...it's the ONLY planet with CHOCOLATE!!!)
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To: MsLady

“Ever quarter I just get angrier and angrier. Especially when I see the way our tax dollars are thrown away.”

-—<>-—<>-—<>-—<>-—<>-—<>-—

I know what you mean!

These progressives may like that their “taxes buy civilization”, but right now I what I see is waste - signs warning of a “stop sign ahead” proliferating wildly, for example -— what’s up with that? That is followed a year or two later with flashing lights on the stop signs ahead. I even have seen flashing lights on the “stop sign ahead” signs. C’mon- all of this balderdash costs ME money - loads of it. For what? It burns me more and more!

Nearly all of the additional government expenditures we have been getting over the last 20 years has been counterproductive to jobs and family life. Time to end the madness and roll it all back... and I mean roll it ALL back.


39 posted on 09/18/2011 7:06:52 AM PDT by AFPhys ((Praying for our troops, our citizens, that the Bible and Freedom become basis of the US law again))
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To: AFPhys
I totally agree. Government is just making more jobs that produce nothing but waste.

I just saw on foxnews the other day a study that showed the more we hand out welfare, the more the population of poor people grow. We've thrown trillions of dollars at poverty and it hasn't changed a thing, other than make more lazy people and a reason many men neglect the children they bring into this world. The larger the illegitimacy rate has gone up, causing even more poverty.

It's time for welfare as we know it to be ended. And handed back to the communities, churches and charities, were people are held to a higher rate of accountability. There are far to many people now on welfare who just know how to work the system, it's gone far beyond abused.

40 posted on 09/18/2011 8:30:53 AM PDT by MsLady (Be the kind of woman that when you get up in the morning, the devil says, "Oh crap, she's UP !!")
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To: ken5050

My point was there is way too much inventory. Houses were way over built in the last decade. That and the associated debt are the root cause of the housing mess. Government and banks are doing everything they can to keep prices up while there is way too much inventory which is in conflict with basic market principles. That unnatural state of things is where we are. Yes, housing is going to have to further correct - because of over supply. Until that oversupply is finally consumed the housing market won’t be “normal” again.


41 posted on 09/18/2011 2:05:32 PM PDT by DB
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To: AFPhys

I’d argue that we became too wealthy...

What I mean by that is, we believed we could afford to pursue every little Utopian idea and our wealth would pay for it all with no real negative impact. Be it the endless environmental regulations to endless public employee pensions and employee rules.

Those people were wrong.


42 posted on 09/18/2011 2:10:20 PM PDT by DB
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To: Flycatcher

I meant that we should balance the budget.

If you are going to spend $4 trillion dollars, then you should pay $4 trillion in taxes.

You should not spend money on wars, entitlements, and everything else without paying for it.

Stop borrowing money!


43 posted on 09/21/2011 11:15:24 AM PDT by CGalen
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