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E-verify News Conference
The Sacremento Bee ^ | 9/21/2011 | Take Back Washington

Posted on 09/21/2011 10:04:13 AM PDT by tedw

Representatives of almost 30 conservative, Tea Party and limited government groups, representing millions, will affirm their opposition to the bill that would make E-Verify mandatory for all workers and businesses, according to Kathryn Serkes of Take Back Washington. Last week, the group launched a media campaign and sent a letter to Congress outlining their concerns.

Read more: http://www.sacbee.com/2011/09/21/3927076/e-verify-news-conference-today.html#ixzz1Ybi2lzpE

(Excerpt) Read more at sacbee.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: everify; immigration
These misguided "Conservatives" are continuing their attack on E-verify. E-verify is a great system and is supported by the majority of Conservatives and Tea Party members. With friends like this, who needs enemies?
1 posted on 09/21/2011 10:04:14 AM PDT by tedw
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To: tedw; abigail2

E-verify under attack


2 posted on 09/21/2011 10:06:33 AM PDT by tedw (Constitution)
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To: tedw

I read about this yesterday. I don’t understand their opposition at all.


3 posted on 09/21/2011 10:07:50 AM PDT by BfloGuy (Even the opponents of Socialism are dominated by socialist ideas.)
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To: tedw
I don't get this, either. These 30 or so TP "leaders" seem to be claiming all kinds of our civil liberties will be effected with E-Verify legislation. Well, my civil liberties are being violated with the influx of illegals and associated costs (medical, education, welfare, etc.).

Until the gov't does their job, someone has to.

4 posted on 09/21/2011 10:08:54 AM PDT by Jane Long (Soli Deo Gloria!)
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To: tedw

This makes no sense at all. Something here stinks.

I don’t buy it.


5 posted on 09/21/2011 10:11:27 AM PDT by MichaelCorleone (Those who love liberty love Sarah)
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To: tedw

Not long ago I read that Obama’s SS got rejected by E Verify - related? I wouldn’t put anything past the Kenyan usurper.


6 posted on 09/21/2011 10:13:42 AM PDT by MichaelCorleone (Those who love liberty love Sarah)
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To: tedw

I wonder if this has anything to do with someone using E-Verify to find out that Obama’s Social Security Number does not qualify him to work in the USA


7 posted on 09/21/2011 10:16:59 AM PDT by Mr. K (Palin/Bachman 2012- unbeatable ticket~!!!)
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To: Jane Long

Note involvement of Bruce Fein — ex Reagan DOJ appointee — trashed Bush over Patriot Act and Gitmo issues and called for Bush’s impeachment. He is now calling for Obama’s impeachment over the same issues!.


8 posted on 09/21/2011 10:19:41 AM PDT by BohDaThone
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To: tedw

I’d expect Dick Armey and his FreedomWorks “tea party” might be behind this. GOP Texans are a major, major problem for the GOP, the tea party and the country.

Texas has the easiest big business donating to campaigns and Texas is rife with companies that have been making a fortune off of cheap illegal labor—while the rest of us taxpayers pick up the tab for it.

I don’t see FreedomWorks actually listed there, but believe me, this has been a top priority behind Armey’s involvement in this whole movement. There’s likely some backdoor funding or other incentives behind the scenes.

(And no, I’ve no proof at all.)


9 posted on 09/21/2011 10:27:10 AM PDT by 9YearLurker
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To: tedw

Everybody on the thread listen up!
The devil is in the details.

There is nothing wrong with E-Verify, although some of these listed opponents are “conservatives” who actually still want cheap labor. That is hypocrisy, but it is not the defect in this bill. Some of the others are libertarians who don’t want government in anything.

The real defect in this bill and the reason it must be defeated, is that the Chamber of Commerce lobbyists who wrote it have hidden deeply inside it a pre-emption clause that would invalidate all state and local laws passed to control illegal immigration because the feds won’t.

If passed, those laws in Arizona, Georgia, Prince William County Virginia, etc., will be voided. Right now, the only controls on illegal immigration are these state and local laws. The Republican Establishment and the Wall Street Journal and the Chamber of Commerce can’t tolerate these local laws interfering with agenda for open borders and cheap labor. And they think they can sell this law as a control on illegal immigration when in effect it is means of stopping existing controls, knowing that the feds will never enforce immigration laws, even this E-Verify attempt.

This law is a lie. It needs to die.


10 posted on 09/21/2011 10:33:45 AM PDT by oldbill
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To: tedw

ACLU is against E-verify too.

With friends like this, who needs enemies?

More on EVerify:
http://www.cis.org/Everify


11 posted on 09/21/2011 10:35:20 AM PDT by WOSG
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To: BfloGuy

Because you don’t understand the REAL reason behind illegal immigration: businesses (large and small) want cheap labor.

And not just cheap labor, but cheap labor they can abuse as they want. If an illegal immigrant is told to clock out after 35 hours, and work an additional 20 hours off the clock, who can they complain to? If an illegal immigrant is told to ignore safety protocals, then is injured on the job, who are they going to complain to? If an illegal immigrant is told to ignore sanitation regulations in a food processing plant, who are they going to complain to? If an illegal immigrant is told to ignore any of a hundred other workplace regulations, who are they going to complain to?

The real driver of illegal immigrations in this country (and why the GOP never does anything about it) is business. Businesses that want cheap labor AND to ignore all kinds of business regulations. Somthing they can do with an employee that is an illegal immigrant, because the illegal immigrant won’t report/complain to the authorities because of a fear of being deported.

E-verify makes it impossible for these businesses to hire illegal immigrants and stock their company with empolyees they can abuse. That’s the reason they oppose e-verify.


12 posted on 09/21/2011 10:40:35 AM PDT by Brookhaven
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To: Jane Long

there are other ways we can deal with illegals without screwing over the freedoms of everyone else

AttackWatch + e-verify = our worst nightmare


13 posted on 09/21/2011 10:41:10 AM PDT by ari-freedom (Thank you, Bob!)
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To: tedw

What is the agricultural exemption in this bill?


14 posted on 09/21/2011 10:42:15 AM PDT by Comparative Advantage
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To: tedw

Yes, Ted, but with Section 6 in place, this bill is an exercise in futility. We support this bill, but not with the Chamber of Commerce and ImmigrationWorksUSA-authored fig leaf Section 6 to stop Arizona, Alabama and others from punishing employers. the lesson of Obama’s amnesty decree is that the Executive branch cannot be trusted to enforce immigration laws in this nation. Bush and Obama both have made them political footballs as the nation’s workers and legitimate businesses have suffered.


15 posted on 09/21/2011 10:42:55 AM PDT by montag813 (http://www.StandWithArizona.com)
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To: ari-freedom

Shoot them for a bounty?


16 posted on 09/21/2011 10:43:57 AM PDT by Comparative Advantage
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To: BfloGuy
I read about this yesterday. I don’t understand their opposition at all.

It's quite simple. Half the groups are Libertarians, who are idiots on immigration, living in a fantasy world. The other half are fake "tea party" groups who are shills for the Left.

17 posted on 09/21/2011 10:44:21 AM PDT by montag813 (http://www.StandWithArizona.com)
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To: Brookhaven
The real driver of illegal immigrations in this country (and why the GOP never does anything about it) is business.

And you have the reason why Democrats are not only doing nothing about it, but actively encouraging more to come in?

Or were you just trolling with canards?

18 posted on 09/21/2011 10:46:46 AM PDT by BelegStrongbow (St. Joseph, patron of fathers, pray for us!)
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To: tedw
For your reference, here is one of the key provisions of this law, and the reason it must die. If Rep Lamar Smith were honest, he would cut this provision out, but it was written in by the Chamber of Commerce lobbyists who insist it remains in it:

SEC. 6. PREEMPTION.

Section 274A(h)(2) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1324a(h)(2)) is amended to read as follows:

(2) PREEMPTION- The provisions of this section preempt any State or local law, ordinance, policy, or rule, including any criminal or civil fine or penalty structure, insofar as they may now or hereafter relate to the hiring, continued employment, or status verification for employment eligibility purposes, of unauthorized aliens.

By the way, it it is also a de facto amnesty for those illegals already hired, if you read the text concerning "continued employment". So anybody already on your rolls is exempted from this law, and don't think employers will not come up with magical papers showing their employees were already hired.

19 posted on 09/21/2011 10:47:03 AM PDT by oldbill
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To: oldbill

Can you point to the section or sections in the bill where this clause is?


20 posted on 09/21/2011 10:49:18 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: Ratman83

see my post #19


21 posted on 09/21/2011 10:53:43 AM PDT by oldbill
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To: Jane Long

There are no conservatives opposed to E-Verify. if you want to secure the border, you will support this common-sense idea that has worked really well at rooting out documentation fraud. So who IS opposing it?
Radical libertarians, aligned with the ACLU’s extremist views on ‘civil liberties’ are opposed based on hyped-up fears that this will lead to a national ID card, etc.

“These 30 or so TP “leaders” seem to be claiming all kinds of our civil liberties will be effected with E-Verify legislation. Well, my civil liberties are being violated with the influx of illegals and associated costs (medical, education, welfare, etc.).”

They are pushing an open borders attack-all-law-enforcement agenda pushed by the ACLU. It’s really nonsense, you have a social security number already and the credit card companies know more about you than this system would.

So, the thing to watch out for is where these “TP leaders” are really coming from. they are not representative of most Tea party folks.


22 posted on 09/21/2011 10:57:08 AM PDT by WOSG
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To: oldbill

Thank you, just what I was thinking it would be. Once again big government strikes.


23 posted on 09/21/2011 10:59:20 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: Brookhaven

Because you don’t understand the REAL reason behind illegal immigration: businesses (large and small) want cheap labor.”

More precisely: the REAL reason behind illegal immigration is that people want the opptys of this country.
for some that is work from businesses willing to hire them;
for others, they get kids education free and better life for them.
for others, govt bennies and/or they are illegal dependents of legal immigrants. We understate the massive number of illegal immigrants that are family members of legal immigrants.

Businesses are the linchpin in that illegal immigrants taking jobs here, bring families here, etc.


24 posted on 09/21/2011 11:00:51 AM PDT by WOSG
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To: Ratman83

Here is another excerpt, addressing Lamar Smith’s refusal to delete the pre-emption clause written by the Chamber of Commerce:

“There are other clauses in HR 2885 that are unacceptable. One such clause basically exempts the 8 million-plus illegal aliens working for a paycheck, essentially “leaving them alone” in their taking American jobs. It is being referred to as “the grandfathering in” clause. Another horrible part of the bill gives the DHS Chief (Janet Napolitano for the next 15 months) “dictatorial power” over enforcement beyond the power she already has. And the bill has been “sunrised” so that, while the preemption is immediate (wiping 1070 laws out), it takes up to 2 years of continued Invasion by Mexico to go into effect, in essence leaving Arizona–where the Invasion is highest–to the wolves.

For his part, Chairman Lamar Smith refuses to remove Sec. 6, the preemption clause . . .”


25 posted on 09/21/2011 11:07:02 AM PDT by oldbill
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To: oldbill

How come your point is not immediately obvious from following the article link?


26 posted on 09/21/2011 11:09:08 AM PDT by cynwoody
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To: tedw

http://takebackwashington.org/Clint_s_Open_Letter_html.html

If you read the letter they wrote, you conclude that they are full of beans.

- no national ID card
- NO civil rights issues, less intrusive than existing law
- claim it will increase ID theft are illogical and baseless
- ‘harm’ to economy. why? well, because illegals wont get hired!
- etc


27 posted on 09/21/2011 11:21:03 AM PDT by WOSG
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To: cynwoody

it’s in reference to post #19


28 posted on 09/21/2011 11:27:46 AM PDT by oldbill
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To: WOSG
Because you don’t understand the REAL reason behind illegal immigration: businesses (large and small) want cheap labor.”

More precisely: the REAL reason behind illegal immigration is that people want the opptys of this country.

You are missing the point. Of course people want to come here, it's the land of opportunity. But have you ever wondered why we don't have a guest worker program like we have in the past (pre-1960s)? It's because if large numbers of people were comming over the border legally, with guest worker permits allowing them to work legally for a limited time, the companies hiring them would have to follow ever employment regulation.

I'm a big supporter of closing the border. I'm a big supporter of mandating e-verify (is working in GA). I'm also a big supporter of re-establishming some type of guest worker program.

29 posted on 09/21/2011 11:30:27 AM PDT by Brookhaven
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To: tedw
Google is your friend. It appears Donna Wiesner Keene, a Washington insider who served for 8 years under Bush43 is about as establishment as you can get, yet she claims to represent the Tea Party.

If the name Keene sounds familiar, she's married to David Keene, faux conservative and whore extraordinaire.

“Donna Wiesner Keene is CEO of BrainTrain, a business specializing in marketing and communicating political ideas and projects. BrainTrain works with executives and lobbyists to propel ideas toward policy-makers and ordinary citizens. In the 107th Congress, Mrs. Keene lobbied for fundamental tax reform for the Coalition for Fundamental Tax Reform, a coalition she helped grow to represent more than 8 million citizens.

In the second Bush Administration, she worked in disability policy from early intervention to No Child Left Behind to Rehabilitation for the U.S. Department of Education. In the first Bush Administration, as Director of the Executive Secretariat for the Department, she represented the Secretary and Deputy Secretary on the Total Quality Management Task Force, and chaired the Information Technology Committee. She also served as a Reagan Administration Special Assistant for Intergovernmental Affairs in the Office of Secretary of Labor Bill Brock, where she focused on labor issues.”

30 posted on 09/21/2011 11:48:11 AM PDT by bwc2221
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To: bwc2221
Don't forget, David Keene is a good friend or Grover Norquist, Islamic promoter and supporter of amnesty for illegal immigrants.

Three so-called conservatives that should never be trusted: David Keene, Grover Norquist and Dick Armey. Any of the three could sell their mother's soul to the devil and their only concern would be if they got the best price.

31 posted on 09/21/2011 11:54:20 AM PDT by bwc2221
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To: bwc2221

Good research!


32 posted on 09/21/2011 3:54:51 PM PDT by Comparative Advantage
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To: montag813

Sec. 6 below. To be honest,I wish it wasn’t there but this bill is better than the current situation. If you are going to argue the Administration won’t enforce the law, then why bother passing any laws?

This bill is a vast improvement in the national situation, and states still retain their authority to fine and suspend business license laws. If the Feds dont enforce, the States still can. Read the bill.

‘(2) PREEMPTION- The provisions of this section preempt any State or local law, ordinance, policy, or rule, including any criminal or civil fine or penalty structure, insofar as they may now or hereafter relate to the hiring, continued employment, or status verification for employment eligibility purposes, of unauthorized aliens. A State, locality, municipality, or political subdivision may exercise its authority over business licensing and similar laws as a penalty for failure to use the verification system described in subsection (d) to verify employment eligibility when and as required under subsection (b).’.


33 posted on 09/21/2011 4:54:29 PM PDT by tedw (Constitution)
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To: BfloGuy

As a voluntary program? Sure.

Mandatory? No. I’m glad that some people still believe believe in free enterprise.


34 posted on 09/21/2011 5:38:02 PM PDT by BenKenobi (Honkeys for Herman! “10 percent is enough for God; 9 percent is enough for government")
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To: Brookhaven

“the companies hiring them would have to follow ever employment regulation.”

The point of guest worker legislation is to fill jobs that aren’t being filled.

The problem with guest worker legislation is that it doesn’t provide an opportunity for good workers who want to stay in the US legally, and continue to work, so that they can do so.

I’m completely in favour of providing a legal means so that people who are interested in working in the US legally, can do so. Guest worker legislation isn’t the answer though.

As for this bill? It does nothing to help anyone. All it does is force businesses to be immigration patrollers. Not their job. It forces businesses to do the job that the US border patrollers should have been doing before they came to the united states.

If you want to stop having people cross the border to work in the US illegally the solution is to give them a legal option to do so. E-Verify does nothing to solve the problem, just creates another barrier. What is going to happen is that the businesses that don’t care about the law will continue to hire, and businesses that aren’t politically connected to the powers that be will get shut down.

FInally, E-Verify cannot detect identity fraud. So it doesn’t even do the job in keeping out people that you don’t want working for you.


35 posted on 09/21/2011 5:45:10 PM PDT by BenKenobi (Honkeys for Herman! “10 percent is enough for God; 9 percent is enough for government")
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To: tedw
Sec. 6 below. To be honest,I wish it wasn’t there but this bill is better than the current situation. If you are going to argue the Administration won’t enforce the law, then why bother passing any laws? This bill is a vast improvement in the national situation, and states still retain their authority to fine and suspend business license laws. If the Feds dont enforce, the States still can. Read the bill.

I read the bill and discussed it with Kris Kobach and others. States only have license control IF the Feds have already intervened in some way. There can be an unlimited delay and exceptions. The states can NOT enforce the law, and I have spoken on a conference call posing as a friend of the Chamber and was told they can use the preemption to get rid of SB1070 and other state laws against illegals. I is a MESS.

36 posted on 09/21/2011 6:10:29 PM PDT by montag813
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To: montag813

I believe you are in error. If you are familiar with the Immigration and Control Act of 1986 it specifically allowed the states to retain juridiction in the area of licensing. The recent Supreme Court Decision regarding E-verify made that abundantly clear. The bill does not change that. In fact, it says:

A State, locality, municipality, or political subdivision may exercise its authority over business licensing and similar laws as a penalty for failure to use the verification system described in subsection (d) to verify employment eligibility when and as required under subsection (b).’

The statute is pretty clear that in the area of licensing States still have jurisdiction The plain language of the Statute contradict what Kris Kobach says.


37 posted on 09/21/2011 7:25:36 PM PDT by tedw (Constitution)
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To: tedw

I received the following from FAIR which is generally a good immigration organiztion. They, too, accuse the bill of stripping authority from the states. This appears to be only partially true. As I have noted, States still have the ability to enforce thru licensing laws. If they don;t use e-verify, they could lose their business license and that is enough to make employers comply. Yes, the bill could be bettter but it is not likely we are going to get anything better. 1/2 a loaf is better than none. And we do need a consistent nationwide policy. Conservatives should support this.

Press release from Fair:

HOUSE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE VOTES AGAINST STATE ENFORCEMENT AUTHORITY;
Mandatory E-Verify Bill Passes
Wednesday afternoon, the House Judiciary Committee disappointingly voted to preempt the authority of state and local governments to enforce immigration laws during the mark-up of Chairman Lamar Smith’s mandatory E-Verify bill (H.R. 2885). The mark-up, which began last Thursday, resulted in the ultimate passage of Smith’s bill out of the Committee in a 22-13 vote.

While FAIR has always supported mandatory E-Verify, we also urged members of the Judiciary Committee to strip and/or amend language in H.R. 2885 that would prevent state and local governments from enforcing immigration laws when the federal government refuses to do so. As introduced, Section 6 of the bill (entitled “Preemption”) would strip away the authority of state and local governments to go after employers that hire illegal aliens.

In Committee Wednesday afternoon, the amendment to strike Section 6 (Am. #3) was offered by Rep. Howard Berman (D-CA) in what appeared to be an effort by Democrats to undermine the Chamber of Commerce’s support for the bill. The Chamber of Commerce has lobbied hard for the inclusion of language that would bar state and local governments from enforcing immigration laws against employers. However, in a disappointing 16-18 vote, the Committee voted against the Berman Amendment. Democrats largely voted FOR the amendment while most Republicans voted AGAINST the amendment.

Check FAIR’s website for the official vote


38 posted on 09/21/2011 8:53:31 PM PDT by tedw (Constitution)
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To: tedw
I believe you are in error. If you are familiar with the Immigration and Control Act of 1986 it specifically allowed the states to retain juridiction in the area of licensing. The recent Supreme Court Decision regarding E-verify made that abundantly clear. The bill does not change that. In fact, it says:

I can only tell you the concerns of those I have spoken to on the state level. I will get more details from Kobach on that fine print I mentioned earlier. This is a very difficult situation, as I am 100% for E-Verify, yet the movement is divided and I don't like it. I also have battled the Chamber, La Raza, the LDS and ImmigrationWorksUSA who use serious legal firepower to try to thwart enforcement everywhere. I have no trust of the Chamber and I am not alone. And then there are also these Libertarian/Ron Paul/GOProud/fake tea party interlopers who have never said a damn thing on this issue and now have come in to confuse people.

I don't need to preach to you as you have done far more than anyone to fight for E-Verify. I just hope we can all somehow unite to make this happen in the end.

39 posted on 09/21/2011 9:15:40 PM PDT by montag813 (http://www.StandWithArizona.com)
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To: oldbill; tedw
Thanks oldbill, that makes sense. Small business and certain tea parties don't want to lose the cheap labor and now I guess this will take more control from local law and put it into the hands of .... guess who...


40 posted on 09/21/2011 9:38:19 PM PDT by abigail2
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