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Greenwood cops want to get rid of machine pistols
Chicago Tribune ^ | 20 Sept 2011 | AP Story

Posted on 09/21/2011 10:08:59 AM PDT by smokingfrog

GREENWOOD, Ind.— Police in a suburb just south of Indianapolis are trying to decide what to do with six new fully automatic handguns the chief doesn't want.

The Daily Journal reports ( http://bit.ly/o5mbjQ )officials at the Greenwood Police Department don't know who ordered the Glock machine pistols. The guns can fire 33 bullets in seconds with a single trigger pull. Police Chief Rick McQueary says they're too dangerous to use for officers who must carefully consider every shot.

McQueary is refusing to pay for the guns because it's not clear why they were shipped to the department in the first place.

(Excerpt) Read more at chicagotribune.com ...


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events; US: Indiana
KEYWORDS: banglist; glock
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I'll take one...
1 posted on 09/21/2011 10:09:04 AM PDT by smokingfrog
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To: smokingfrog

Hey guys, Christmas is coming and I’ve been a good boy...


2 posted on 09/21/2011 10:10:44 AM PDT by Free Vulcan (Vote Republican! You can vote Democrat when you're dead.)
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To: smokingfrog

‘I will gladly pay the tax stamp on Wednesday for a Glock machine pistol today’ ... just sayin’


3 posted on 09/21/2011 10:12:20 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Some, believing they can't be deceived, it's nigh impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: smokingfrog

whoever the dealer is better be ready for an atf raid.


4 posted on 09/21/2011 10:13:00 AM PDT by absolootezer0 (2x divorced tattooed pierced harley hatin meghan mccain luvin' REAL beer drinkin' smoker ..what?)
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To: smokingfrog

Maybe if you ship them to Mexico .... oh, wait ...


5 posted on 09/21/2011 10:13:07 AM PDT by Hodar ( Who needs laws; when this FEELS so right?)
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To: smokingfrog

Actually, making a Glock full auto is not that difficult. Illegal without a stamp, but not that difficult. But why would ya if it isn’t registered and functioning as a short barreled rifle?


6 posted on 09/21/2011 10:13:52 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Some, believing they can't be deceived, it's nigh impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: smokingfrog
McQueary is refusing to pay for the guns because it's not clear why they were shipped to the department in the first place.

Awh man. Operation GunWalker strikes again.

7 posted on 09/21/2011 10:14:13 AM PDT by agere_contra ("Debt is the foundation of destruction" : Sarah Palin.)
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To: smokingfrog

“Police Chief Rick McQueary says they’re too dangerous to use for officers who must carefully consider every shot.”

Didn’t some generals say the same thing about repeating rifles when they first came out?

On the other hand, considering how careful a lot of cops are about how and what they shoot, maybe its a good idea to dispose of them.


8 posted on 09/21/2011 10:19:41 AM PDT by ZULU (DUMP Obama in 2012)
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To: smokingfrog

I have fired one of these things and I can’t see how they would be very useful for anything other than maybe a bodyguard who doesn’t care about anybody but the person he is protecting. It is definitely not something law enforcement would need for any purpose.


9 posted on 09/21/2011 10:21:25 AM PDT by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: smokingfrog

How can such a pistol be controllable? Without a shoulder stock I can see bullets going every which way but into the target.


10 posted on 09/21/2011 10:21:50 AM PDT by RitchieAprile
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To: ZULU

You can just imagine the mess those family dogs would make.


11 posted on 09/21/2011 10:21:53 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: smokingfrog
Someone gots some ‘splaining to do. It's not like a pizza delivery to the wrong address. Departmental procurement officer caught in the act of an attempted diversion?
12 posted on 09/21/2011 10:24:25 AM PDT by PowderMonkey (WILL WORK FOR AMMO)
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To: smokingfrog

IIRC, there are a few “transferrable” Glock 18s around ... running about $250,000 each.


13 posted on 09/21/2011 10:24:53 AM PDT by ctdonath2 ($1 meals: http://abuckaplate.blogspot.com/)
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To: smokingfrog

I can’t see much use for one either but I still wouldn’t mind if they gave them to me.


14 posted on 09/21/2011 10:24:58 AM PDT by yarddog
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To: smokingfrog

Better aim low, really low for the first round, after that muzzle climb will give you, maybe to hits. The rest, who knows. I suspect the pistol has a full auto cutoff.

The military had to limit the AR-15 to three round bursts because of troops just pulling the trigger and hoping. Does not work so well in a fire fight.

Gunner


15 posted on 09/21/2011 10:25:01 AM PDT by weps4ret (Democrats + Liberal Stream Media = Blood Liable)
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To: smokingfrog

Better aim low, really low for the first round, after that muzzle climb will give you, maybe to hits. The rest, who knows. I suspect the pistol has a full auto cutoff.

The military had to limit the AR-15 to three round bursts because of troops just pulling the trigger and hoping. Does not work so well in a fire fight.

Gunner


16 posted on 09/21/2011 10:25:07 AM PDT by weps4ret (Democrats + Liberal Stream Media = Blood Liable)
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To: smokingfrog

Send me two. I want to dual wield those bad boys!! I’ve seen the G18 in action and they are sweet!


17 posted on 09/21/2011 10:25:55 AM PDT by Bryanw92 (The solution to fix Congress: Nuke em from orbit. It's the only way to be sure!)
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To: RitchieAprile

I saw R. Lee Emory demo one of the Glock autos. It didn’t seem that bad. He was squeezing off what sounded like 6 or 7 shot bursts, and they were all hitting the target.


18 posted on 09/21/2011 10:26:54 AM PDT by Melas (u)
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To: MHGinTN

>>Actually, making a Glock full auto is not that difficult. Illegal without a stamp, but not that difficult. But why would ya if it isn’t registered and functioning as a short barreled rifle?

These aren’t modified Glocks. They are Glock 18’s which are built as a full auto version of the Glock 17. There is a selector switch on the side of the slide to switch between auto and semi-auto.


19 posted on 09/21/2011 10:29:26 AM PDT by Bryanw92 (The solution to fix Congress: Nuke em from orbit. It's the only way to be sure!)
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To: MHGinTN
Wednesday for a Glock machine pistol today’ ... just sayin’

None for you. Since the '86 full auto ban (Signed into law by Ronald Reagan) only dealers, police and military can have full auto manufactured after 1986

20 posted on 09/21/2011 10:33:23 AM PDT by from occupied ga (your own government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: Melas

The Gunny is awesome when firing full auto. Glad he was on
our side.


21 posted on 09/21/2011 10:33:37 AM PDT by RitchieAprile
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To: from occupied ga

Type 3 Permit will allow a civilian to have full auto regardless of when manufactured.


22 posted on 09/21/2011 10:35:41 AM PDT by imjimbo (The constitution SHOULD be our "gun permit")
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To: from occupied ga

Type 3 Permit will allow a civilian to have full auto regardless of when manufactured.


23 posted on 09/21/2011 10:35:48 AM PDT by imjimbo (The constitution SHOULD be our "gun permit")
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To: weps4ret
Better aim low, really low for the first round, after that muzzle climb will give you, maybe to hits. The rest, who knows.

I've seen youtube clips of Glocks running full auto both with and without detachable shoulder stocks (SBR?). They do not appear to be that hard to hold on target even w/o the stock. I saw one clip with a guy firing two at once and keeping them both straight and level. But like all full auto pistols, they don't seem to fill a need except to burn up excess ammo.

Regards,
GtG

24 posted on 09/21/2011 10:36:33 AM PDT by Gandalf_The_Gray (I live in my own little world, I like it 'cuz they know me here.)
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To: smokingfrog

Good video about the Glock 18: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHdHuSuUI3s


25 posted on 09/21/2011 10:37:26 AM PDT by USMCPOP (Father of LCpl. Karl Linn, KIA 1/26/2005 Al Haqlaniyah, Iraq)
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To: Bryanw92

As a purchaser and user of Glock 33 round mags in 9mm and 31 round in 40S&W, I am aware of the Glock 18 though never shot one. I use the Glock mags in Kel Tec Sub 2000 versions. The Glock 9mm handgun in full auto wouldn’t be hard to control, but the 40 S&W might be.


26 posted on 09/21/2011 10:37:26 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Some, believing they can't be deceived, it's nigh impossible to convince them when they're deceived.)
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To: smokingfrog
"...officials at the Greenwood Police Department don't know who ordered the Glock machine pistols."

Some police department.

27 posted on 09/21/2011 10:43:56 AM PDT by Paine in the Neck (Where's he getting these ideas? He's not smart enough to be that stupid all by himself.)
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To: agere_contra
Awh man. Operation GunWalker strikes again.

Postal codes in Mexico are issued by SEPOMEX (Servicio Postal Mexicano). They are of five digits and modelled on the US zip code system. The first 2 digits identify a state (or part thereof); and assignments are done alphabetically by state name,

Some one at Glock or at BATF put the 46142 zip code on the shipment, but put USA rather than Mexico on the shipment.

All the police chief has to do is write Mexico on the package and the problem is corrected.

28 posted on 09/21/2011 10:44:37 AM PDT by TYVets (Pure-Gas.org ..... ethanol free gasoline by state and city)
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To: smokingfrog

Proficiency with automatic weapons requires many more hours of range work—work that most people won’t do. Otherwise, automatic weapons (especially short-barreled ones) are practically useless. Even with the required training, they’re only good for very close range work. Work is the key word, and lots of it. Shotguns can be better for that in most cases. Automatic weapons in urban or suburban environments nowadays would be more dangerous to bystanders than bad guys.


29 posted on 09/21/2011 10:52:24 AM PDT by familyop (cbt. engr. (cbt), Army NG, '89-' 96)
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To: RitchieAprile

30 posted on 09/21/2011 10:54:01 AM PDT by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open ( <o> ---)
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To: smokingfrog

BTW, the only uses that I’ve seen for automatic weapons are those of clearing buildings (killing everything in each room) and jungle warfare.


31 posted on 09/21/2011 10:54:50 AM PDT by familyop (cbt. engr. (cbt), Army NG, '89-' 96)
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To: imjimbo
Type 3 Permit ...

I believe I mentioned dealers, which along with manufacturers is what a class three permit is for. And my memory may be faulty on the amount ($500 or $2500 annually), but these is a hefty annual fee associated with a class III license. Along with unannounced inspections by the BATF.

32 posted on 09/21/2011 11:02:08 AM PDT by from occupied ga (your own government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: smokingfrog

Can any nitwit in the police department order an automatic weapon or does the individual have to have FFL and do officers need an FFL?


33 posted on 09/21/2011 11:10:54 AM PDT by School of Rational Thought ("The proposition that the government is always right is manifested either in corruption or benefits)
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To: smokingfrog

Can any nitwit in the police department order an automatic weapon or does the individual have to have FFL and do officers need an FFL?


34 posted on 09/21/2011 11:11:11 AM PDT by School of Rational Thought ("The proposition that the government is always right is manifested either in corruption or benefits)
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To: ZULU
Didn’t some generals say the same thing about repeating rifles when they first came out?

Primary concern in that case was ammunition consumption, although marksmanship advocates - "one shot one kill" - did have some influence, claiming repeaters would encourage what amounts to recon by fire.

In this case, I think the chief is rightfully concerned about collateral damage.

35 posted on 09/21/2011 11:28:57 AM PDT by xsrdx (Diligentia, Vis, Celeritas)
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To: smokingfrog

I’ve fired the Glock 18 and while it’s “controllable” for a military weapon, it is definitely NOT controllable for a police weapon. Cops don’t get to use suppressive fire.

It was stupid of them to buy them in the first place, but I suspect there was a gun-loving officer who just wanted some for range play.


36 posted on 09/21/2011 11:37:00 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: Bryanw92

Not to mention the drop-in backplate that will allow you to switch to a FA Glock in seconds.


37 posted on 09/21/2011 11:38:31 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: smokingfrog

Ooh...ooh...ME!


38 posted on 09/21/2011 11:43:02 AM PDT by DesertSapper (God, Family, Country . . . . . . . . . . and dead terrorists!!!)
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To: smokingfrog

Looks like fun!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qwXO-KTVxk


39 posted on 09/21/2011 11:48:35 AM PDT by sjmjax (Politicans are like bananas - they start out green, turn yellow, then rot.)
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To: School of Rational Thought
http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcfullau.html

I'm guessing that LEO would already have gone through the FBI background check? Seems like just about any LEO could buy one, but not sure if they would still have to pay the tax like everyone else. State firearms laws may still apply.

40 posted on 09/21/2011 11:55:56 AM PDT by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open ( <o> ---)
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To: ZULU

***Didn’t some generals say the same thing about repeating rifles when they first came out?****

Some Civil war general named Ripley, didn’t want those new fangled breech loaders. He felt muskets were good enough for the troops.


41 posted on 09/21/2011 12:12:46 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Click my name. See my home page, if you dare! NEW PHOTOS & PAINTINGS)
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To: RitchieAprile
How can such a pistol be controllable? Without a shoulder stock I can see bullets going every which way but into the target.

Short bursts help, but practice, practice practice is the key, as it is with the full-auto .45 ACP Star modelo "M".

They're not all that bad in 9mm and certainly do have applications in certain situations, such as returning fire from an entire carload of armed hostiles at once.

And, as you say, a shoulder stock does indeed help, especially with sustained fire involving multiple magazine dumps, as in this 298-round session.

42 posted on 09/21/2011 12:14:56 PM PDT by archy (I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous!)
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To: RitchieAprile

Plenty of full auto guns can be controlled...if you know what you are doing.


43 posted on 09/21/2011 12:17:12 PM PDT by Osage Orange (Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum)
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To: smokingfrog

Maybe some part of the department is playing the game that an obscure, but armed, North Carolina organization did. Order some new toy/collectible, keep it in the safe for a year, then sell to members at a discount as “surplus”.


44 posted on 09/21/2011 12:24:46 PM PDT by Oatka ("A society of sheep must in time beget a government of wolves." –Bertrand de Jouvenel)
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To: familyop
BTW, the only uses that I’ve seen for automatic weapons are those of clearing buildings (killing everything in each room) and jungle warfare.

Ever walked point? Does the term *dismounts in the open* have any meaning to you?

Here, take a little ride with TF 1-64, and watch the co-ax do most of the real work.

I guess these silly girls couldn't find their way to the desert...


45 posted on 09/21/2011 12:28:45 PM PDT by archy (I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous!)
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To: Oatka
Maybe some part of the department is playing the game that an obscure, but armed, North Carolina organization did. Order some new toy/collectible, keep it in the safe for a year, then sell to members at a discount as “surplus”.

I recall a Bloomington, IN Sheriff a few years back doing something similar with a dozen or so Uzis and M3A1 greaseguns.

46 posted on 09/21/2011 12:30:29 PM PDT by archy (I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous!)
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To: imjimbo

Wrong!
Post 86 IS very restricted, even NFA dealers have some trouble obtaining them.

And, there is NO SUCH THING as a “Type 3 permit”.

I am an 07/C2, so I could buy up to two of these, if the department would supply the necessary letter for ATF.


47 posted on 09/21/2011 12:30:38 PM PDT by Loyal Sedition (Loyal Sedition, often described as "To the right of Attila The Hun"!)
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To: smokingfrog

You my FRiend have caused a disturbance in the Force.


48 posted on 09/21/2011 12:34:06 PM PDT by dangerdoc (see post #6)
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To: ZULU

WWII about 20,000 rounds expended per kill.

Vietnam, about 250,000 rounds expended per kill.


49 posted on 09/21/2011 12:37:10 PM PDT by dangerdoc (see post #6)
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To: School of Rational Thought

CLEO, Chief Law Enforcement Officer.

Usually the chief, unless he assigns that responsibility to a subordinate.
Often the range/training officer will be authorized.

Random officer donut inspector will NOT be authorized to order such items.

If the department did not order them, BATFE-NFA should never have approved the transfer.
If they were ordered, the company and BATFE-NFA should both have a copy of the order.


50 posted on 09/21/2011 12:40:19 PM PDT by Loyal Sedition (Loyal Sedition, often described as "To the right of Attila The Hun"!)
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