Posted on 10/09/2011 8:44:42 AM PDT by Cincinatus' Wife
..........Now that Chris Christie and Sarah Palin have decided not to run, many political watchers are predicting that there is room on the right for one more contender to join the top ranks. Santorum said his path to victory lies in the Iowa caucuses, “The strategy is to go down and talk to the people of Iowa and do town hall meetings. And I have been to 70 counties of the 99 counties. … We are not hitting huge crowds but we are hitting the people who are the engine of the Iowa caucuses. And they are talking and have influence in their community.”
This week at the “Value Voters Summit” in Washington, DC, the big news did not come from a candidate for president, but rather a supporter of Texas Governor Rick Perry. Baptist minister Robert Jeffress introduced Perry and after the candidate’s speech said that Republican frontrunner Mitt Romney’s Mormon religion is a “cult.”
When asked to comment about Romney’s faith, Santorum who’s a favorite of Christian conservatives, said that he does not believe Mormonism is a cult and that Mitt Romney is a Christian.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
I didn’t know he jumped in on the race baiting crap. Thanks for the info.
Actually Mormonism is a cult, but many think Catholicism is a cult as well. Evangelicals place no one between Jesus and the individual, however that does not keep the Jim Jones types from trying, and all too often succeeding.
I will just accept Jesus at his word. If it were not so He would have told us.
True but I thing GW did some serious arm twisting in that race. As you may recall he had promises from Specter so GW was a big supporter himself.
Perhaps this is Romney’s plan to get a “Christian VP” to innoculate himself... and think he can overcome his pro-choice past by choosing a pro-life candidate...
PS - mormonism is a cult
I’m sorry, the actual quote from Santorum. For some reason Fox is being blocked, or I would have looked. I just googled it from the B.globe, this is what they have him saying:
But when asked if he believed Romney is “a true Christian,” Santorum spoke somewhat haltingly: “Mitt Romney is a true, he says he’s a Christian. I believe he said Christian.”
Freegards
They claim to believe that Jesus is the Son of God. But when you question them you will find that they believer there are lots of Sons of God...Jesus is not the only one in their view.
They think Lucifer was a brother of Christ, thereby also being a son of God. And they believe that Mormon believers will be on a par with Christ one day and rule their own worlds like Christ rules this one.
Clearly they have problems with the special nature of Christ. In truth, Jesus is deity and one with God and he is God Himself.
They are definitely a cult.
June 13, 2011: Rick Santorum Hopes Christian Voters Will Look Beyond Mormon Faith of Romney, Huntsman
"Social conservative Rick Santorum told NBC’s “Meet the Press” that he hopes Christian voters can overlook Jon Huntsman's and Mitt Romney's Mormon faith.
[snip]
Santorum said Sunday he hopes voters will overcome differences in a candidate's faith.
When it came to labeling Romney and Huntsman as “true conservatives,” however, Santorum questioned both their records.
"I think they've held positions in the past that have not been conservative and I think they have to account for those," he shared."......
********************************
October 9, 2011: 2 Romney challengers dodge Christian question
"WASHINGTON—Two Republican presidential candidates refused to say Sunday whether they believe Mitt Romney, a Mormon, is a Christian, while a third said he doesn't agree with a Texas pastor who called the religion a "cult."
Businessman Herman Cain and Minnesota congresswoman Michele Bachmann declined to answer questions about Romney's Mormon religion.
"He's a Mormon, that much I know," Cain said. "I am not going to do an analysis of Mormonism versus Christianity for the sake of answering that."
Bachmann called the issue a distraction.
"I think what the real focus is here, is on religious tolerance. That's really what this is about," Bachmann said. "To make this a big issue is ridiculous right now, because every day I'm on the street talking to people. This is not what people are talking about."
Former Pennsylvania Sen. Rick Santorum, who runs in the GOP presidential campaign as a social conservative, was more direct, saying -- as Texas Gov. Rick Perry did Friday -- that he didn't consider Mormonism a cult.
"I'm not an expert on Mormonism. All I know is that every Mormon I know is a good and decent person, has great moral values," Santorum said.
But when asked if he believed Romney is "a true Christian," Santorum spoke somewhat haltingly: "Mitt Romney is a true, he says he's a Christian. I believe he said Christian.".........................[hard to make sense of that]
It doesn't really mean anything much. "Cult' is an insult used by some denominations to disparage those with different religious beliefs.
I lived in Arizona for ten years and got to know lots of Mormons. They were good patriotic charitable family-oriented people. Maybe their church is a cult, maybe not, but they lived their lives and treated their neighbors better than a lot of "Christians," including some sanctimonious Harper Valley baptist hypocrites.
You think? just ask Presiding Bishop Jefferts Schori of The Episcopal Church about that "faith once delivered to the saints." According to her there's room for mormons, hindus, pagans, zoroastrians, whatever, all just "different pathways" to the same goal. Or ask the United Church of Christ, which has officially declined to witness Jesus Christ as God incarnate.
This is why attacks on Mormons on religious grounds rings hollow as a dead log.
Luther summed it up nicely despite his antipathy for moslems-- he said he would rather the governed by a "wise Turk" than a "foolish Christian."
I don't want to see Romney either but I'll take him over Obama any day.
This is a silly issue because the quote came, not from Perry, but from the minister at Perry’s church. Santorum was being extra careful about his statements, as he has been through out this campaign, in an effort to avoid the controversy that his statements about homosexuality have caused.
I am quite sure that Rick Perry, if asked directly, would not label Mitt Romney as a member of a cult.
I am really, really tired of the nonsense from the media, with all the irrelevant gotcha’ questions and articles. I did finally see one negative Romney article that claimed that Romney was a secret Keynesian.
Don’t know about the Baptists, but the Catholic Church does not recognize Mormon baptisms, because they don’t have the same understanding of the Trinity as Christians.
“Perry told a reporter in Iowa that he did not agree with Jeffress.”.......
“At an event in Iowa later Friday, Perry was asked if he believes Mormonism is a cult. “No,” Perry said.”....
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2790182/posts#1
All the candidates are being asked if they think Romney’s religion is a cult. All have been “nice-nice” about it.
However, when the same MSM asked the candidates about the painted rock, none defended Rick Perry against the smear that he’s a racist (if one did, I apologize for the omission as I’m not aware of one).
So Romney must be cradled and loved and Perry must be assumed guilty by the others and made to be evil — and the headline writers are still running with it.
Be not afraid that will not be the choice that we have.
“I’d say let’s look a lot closer at Santorum.”
How about this; on the day that Perry, a decades long supporter of Israel, who visited Israel twice, met with Netenhahu, Shimom Perez and other business and political leaders, and received the Defender of Jerusalem award made a great speech to a Jewish group in NYC, Santorum, who clearly had no clue what he was talking about, had to whine about it...
“There he is, reading a speech that I’m sure he didn’t write, and has never taken a position on any of this stuff before, and [the media is] taking this guy seriously.”
No wonder Santorum lost by 20% last time he ran.
Cite please?
Would like to see the context, if you wouldn’t mind.
Thanks.
8But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
9As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
I have never heard how Mormons reconcile their "religion" with the Apostle Paul.
Thanks. Except for one small thing puzzling me:
The article doesn’t actually sound anything like how you described what you described.
Quoting here:
““I’ve forgotten more about Israel than Rick Perry knows about Israel,” Santorum said during a conversation with POLITICO on Tuesday,..”
Santorum is also quoted in the article you cited:
““Good fences make good neighbors, that’s all there is to it,”
(in reference to border security)
Not really seeing anything to complain about there.
What did I miss?
What negatives does Huntsman have other than being Morman? I liked the looks of him when Huck interviewed him. Firs time I’ve seen him. He sounds conservative.
My point is that Santorum clearly had no idea of Perry’s long time, very personal commitment to the security and survival of the stae of Israel. Perry made a fine speech, calling for an end to taxpayer money for the Palistinian terror regime, and ending pressure on Israel to endanger their security. Instead of just saying “nice speech”, Santorum had to shoot his mouth of with a personal attack on Perry that had no basis in fact. He just assumed that Perry knows nothing about Isreal and someone must have written the speech for him. ““I’ve forgotten more about Israel than Rick Perry knows about Israel” . Really? He sounded like a jealous 9 year old, not a serious candidate for president.
I liked Huntsman originally, had high hopes.
Let’s just say, those high hopes turned out about as realistic as my high hopes for Palin.
Let someone else fill in the details. I’ll probably get criticized, just for having high hopes for the guy originally.
Don’t think he has a whole large fan base here.
Sounds like the sort of thing sometimes called “competing”.
Given the circumstances, perhaps we should take another look at him. He looks and sounds presidential. He appears intelligent. I would like to know more about him. Apparently he did a good job in Utah as governor.
That’s my understanding.
He was I believe a competent respected Governor.
And he’s got deep pockets to run with.
They’re not playing patty-cake. They’re competitors. After someone wins, they’ll all sing kumbayah.
So why don’t we start talking him up and start a vetting process. With me, the Morman thing is not an issue. If a person operates from a moral base he shouldn’t have a problem performing as the leader of a diverse nation. I have looked at all the other candidates and I find them all wanting, and boring. I was actually impressed by this man I had not seen before. I didn’t watch any of the debates because Sarah was not in them. My focus was always on her and I am now without a candidate for which I can vote.
Huntsman would do himself a big favor, if he would get a bit more. How to say this appropriately?
Riled up.
“.........................[hard to make sense of that]
The fox reporters who wrote this piece up sure didn’t know how either. I take it to mean he didn’t want to just come out and say he was or wasn’t. He should have just said, something like “he acts like a Christian to me, but as far as LDS as a whole go, I stick to the teaching of my Church.”
But he definately didn’t say he was a Christian, he said he thinks he calls himself a Christian in a garbled way.
Freegards
I think part of Huntsman’s failure to really catch on has to do with the fact he spent a couple years as US Ambassador to China.
As Ambassador, he was a professional diplomat. In China for as long as he was, he undoubtedly “went native” to some degree. He speaks Mandarin, and probably internalized a lot of the less expressive customs of the Chinese.
Thing is, that’s not how Americans are. So he learned a bunch of habits - qualities really - which won’t work for him in a GOP primary.
I think he’s probably a very capable guy. More than anyone gives him credit for.
He did seem “measured”, but pleasant. I want to find out more about him and try to get a perspective on his strengths and flaws.
Little weasel. I used to like and respect Santorum.
That explains why he is “measured”. Thank you for the info.
I’m not attacking anybody. My firm position is that a candidate who opines about who is and who is not a Christian makes me want to vomit.
However, a candidate who opines that the LDS phenomenon IS Christian in the usual sense is a dope.
There is abundant information from the founders of the LDS whatever-it-is on what they thought about Christianity for anyone who cares to look.
A better way to say it is that LDS is about as Christian ans bishopess Schorl.
Quite welcome.
Well put.
Without pronouncing it a cult, I must say that Mormonism does have some cultish aspects. Santorum probably hurt himself with mainstream Christians by pronouncing his belief that Mormonism is not a cult.
The best I can say is that I'm "agnostic" as to whether Mormonism is a cult. I won't say that it is, but neither can I say that I am convinced it is not.
It hurts Romney, regardless, but there are so many other things which disqualify Romney. His Mormonism is way down the list...
You should have seen the hit piece on Perry in the WSJ. I couldn’t even read the whole thing, lots of meaningless criticism about his days at Texas A&M, including his grades, as if Obama’s school records would be any better.
“Can you clear up this confusion? What is Baptist definition of a Christian and ‘a cult’?”
I was raised Presbyterian - don’t remember how long ago I heard this, but the definition of a cult (per Christianity) is anything that adds to, or takes away from, the Bible.
I believe a pastor told me this. If that’s the case, why can’t or won’t any of our self-proclaimed Christian candidates just state the above for clarification? It would (or should) eliminate the mystery or seeming outlandishness of using the Cult label. All of them, including Herman, are capable of simply explaining this standard definition and not that “cult” in this context is anything like the Jim Jones type most of the public envisions when they hear the word.
This whole thing could get put to rest if just one candidate had the courage to explain what the conference minister meant, in one simple sentence.
“it’s more then obvious the establishment and conservatives would rather lie to protect Romney then say the truth about that.”
The conservatives aren’t trying to protect Romney - I think they either don’t know the simple answer of what’s a cult or they lack the courage to say it for fear of looking like nut jobs (which wouldn’t have to be if they knew the right answer).
But if they don’t wish to commit and want to be politically correct, the best response might be, “it’s not for me to say whether another person is Christian or not - only God knows what’s in his/her heart.”
I did like that Herman wouldn’t take the bait today, saying he refused to get into a discussion about people’s religion or be distracted from the immediate, more important issues facing Americans now.
“none defended Rick Perry against the smear that he’s a racist (if one did, I apologize for the omission as I’m not aware of one).”
Although, when asked about the N word being part of the original camp’s name, Herman Cain said that was very insensitive (which it was, by whoever first put it there), he’s also said that no way does he think Perry’s a racist.
“What negatives does Huntsman have other than being Morman? I liked the looks of him when Huck interviewed him. Firs time I’ve seen him. He sounds conservative.”
Bless your heart.
He’s TRYING to sound conservative - he is not. He’s a globalist, extreme “moderate” (or further Left), was an appointee of BHO (and praised him highly both while serving and in a farewell letter). Yes, he’s a charming, pretty boy, I’ll grant you that.
But he’s no fan of American exceptionalism (or sovreignty, for that matter).
“He looks and sounds presidential.”
I personally think Herman Cain looks and sounds just as presidential.
But for someone who’s straight out of Central Casting as presidential appearance is concerned, look no further than Mitt Romney.
“He was I believe a competent respected Governor.”
And b. hussein’s appointed Chinese ambassador.
“And he’s got deep pockets to run with.”
(Billionaire) daddy’s money.
“and I find them all wanting, and boring.”
Have you listened to Herman Cain’s speeches? He brings crowds to their feet, cheering, wherever he goes.
A remarkable person with a most impressive resume to rival any of the others.
The “cult” classification is not what I was focusing on either. Rather, it is the fact that Mormonism (even though Mormons are often people of good conscious) is a polytheistic religion. It is NOT Christian.
And, yes, those things that most disqualify Romney for me have to do with his perspective of the role of government. I think he is basically a good man, but that he stands on shifting, sandy ground when it comes to Constitutional principles.
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