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Avery PTO (St. Louis Suburb School Ends Sponsorship of Cubs Scouts due to "social justice")
Avery School PTO ^ | 10/4/11

Posted on 10/31/2011 12:25:53 PM PDT by Recovering_Democrat

Boy Scout/Cub Scout Charter Discussion

Bob Casey—Pack 303, Britt Kennedy-Troop 303, Brad Schnell, PTO liaison, and Joe Mueller from the Greater St. Louis area council represented the Boy Scouts and answered questions.

PTO members checked in at the door and received a blue card to be exchanged for a written ballot. The voting process was explained.

Issues: Executive Committee role in supervising scouting activity and concerns if this is the role of the PTO. Boy Scouts/Cub Scouts are the only organizations that the PTO charters. Issues were brought to the Exec Council this summer and the PTO Exec council did feel, at times, that a lot of our attention was needed on the scout/PTO relationship for a short period of time late last summer/early fall.

Missouri PTA/PTO statement: They offer guidelines for local PTA/PTO organizations. The recommendations are not binding. In March 2011, they suggest that PTOs/PTA’s should not charter organizations that require the PTO/PTA to make judgments or vouch for the character or morals of the other group’s members. They outline concerns with liability issues. Missouri law states that as individuals, the PTO exec board is protected. However, the funds the PTO raises are at risk. Shannon Wright pointed out that we do have a liability policy for Avery PTO.

One parent asked how Girl Scouts are differently structured. Kathleen Unwin explained that GS charters are handled through a separate non-profit; Girl Scouts of Eastern MO. Boy Scouts are governed through a congressional mandate. Marie Richter asked for clarification on the national structure versus Girl Scouts. It would literally take an act of congress to change the way it is structured.

Another parent asked if a group of Avery parents could, in theory, get together and from their own non-profit to hold the charter. The answer is yes, but, the Boy Scouts prefer a strong and established community based organization.

National policy regarding membership and leadership: One parent asked if a young boy has homosexual parents would that child be denied an opportunity to join scouts. All the adult scout leaders responded “no”. The boy could join scouts. That parent followed up with another question, is it true that if a young man is gay, he cannot be a member? Joe Mueller (Boy Scouts representative) said “no”—if a young man says he is gay, he is referred back to his parents for counseling. A gay parent, however, can participate as a parent for the scout member.

Bob Casey said as far as he is concerned, “it is like don’t ask, don’t tell”. There is no screening on the application form regarding sexual orientation. Bob stated that he would sign off and approve in this pack any application for leadership. The issue in 2000 came up because of publicity. It would not be an issue, unless said leader “preaches” about their sexual orientation to the children. The subject of sexual orientation is not in the scouting curriculum. Bob disclosed that he has been asking a lot of questions regarding sexual orientation at the local and national level.

One parent expressed the feeling that by supporting an organization that discriminates, we are, by defacto, discriminating against gays. She continued to encourage Avery to be a voice of change. There is a non-profit called “Scouting for All” and our local troop may elect to be involved in this organization. The Scout leaders said that they would need to investigate this organization.

Michelle DiMarceles (Avery staff member)—stated that national policy is in conflict with WG School. Even though the local 303 group may not discriminate, discrimination is occurring at the national organization level.

Tracy Baden (Avery Teacher) expressed concern since she is committed to social justice and feels blessed that we are at a school that embraces the concept of social justice. However, she finds it disconcerting to know that our PTO, is signing a document that identifies themselves as the sponsors of an organization that does discriminate. She, though, is supportive of the PTO and all that the organization does for Avery in general. Further, she is troubled that it does not match our district mission statement at all.

Bob Casey said, he would be willing to sign to form for a homosexual parent to be a leader. He has been really pressing people down at the local and national council. Kurt Gilker-committee member for the Scouts says we (the scouts here at Avery) are on the same side of this discrimination issue. But raised the question to see if this troop and pack is willing to be agents of change?

Bob Casey continued with the best opportunity for change being from the inside out.

Mr. Barbre (Avery teacher) stated he feels saddened that we would even tie ourselves to this organization because of the discrimination issues.

Motion moved to end discussion. Britt asked to speak on behalf of Troop 303 that consists of 28 scouts, ages 11-17 years. Talked about the positive aspects of scouting—that it teaches acceptance and tolerance for everyone. That is what they teach the boys. They share a common goal of education for our children.

Motion moved to vote.

Final vote: Written ballots were submitted. Rachel Hermann read the ballots. Votes were tabulated by Jeff Smith, Shannon Wright, Kathleen Unwin, and Denise Pearl.

Troop: 19 Yes, 22 No

Pack: 20 Yes, 22 No

PTO will not sign the charter. PTO sponsorship of Pack 303 and Troop 303 will end on December 31, 2011.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Front Page News; News/Current Events; US: Missouri
KEYWORDS: boyscouts; bsa; cubs; cubscouts; gays; homosexualagenda; scouts
Found out about this through a friend of a friend.

Here are the "minutes" from the meeting where it was decided the Boy Scouts are hatemongers who don't deserve sponsorship.

I am disgusted with the way people and organizations with strong moral bearings are denigrated, even in our own localities.

1 posted on 10/31/2011 12:25:56 PM PDT by Recovering_Democrat
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To: Recovering_Democrat

My understanding is that most of the school troops are low-income minorities.


2 posted on 10/31/2011 12:27:12 PM PDT by AppyPappy (If you aren't part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem.)
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To: Recovering_Democrat

How exactly did the pack or troop discriminate against anybody? I don’t see that anywhere in the minutes.

Hope they find a local org. to sponsor them.


3 posted on 10/31/2011 12:30:21 PM PDT by ConjunctionJunction
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To: Recovering_Democrat

Leftist truly deserve the world they are creating for themselves.

It’s too bad the rest of us are along for the ride in tha handbasket.


4 posted on 10/31/2011 12:31:44 PM PDT by chrisser (Starve the Monkeys!)
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To: Recovering_Democrat
Bob Casey said, he would be willing to sign to form for a homosexual parent to be a leader.

Bob Casey is trash, and a dishonor to Scout leaders everywhere, including me.

5 posted on 10/31/2011 12:39:10 PM PDT by Last Dakotan
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To: Recovering_Democrat

Parents of boys - get active in Scouting. If you don’t the Sodomites will...


6 posted on 10/31/2011 12:40:09 PM PDT by Last Dakotan
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Support Free Republic

7 posted on 10/31/2011 12:40:12 PM PDT by DJ MacWoW (America! The wolves are here! What will you do?)
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To: Recovering_Democrat

I’ve seen this coming a long way off. When my boys were young & I was a Cub Scouter, committee members wanted to change our pack sponsorship from a local church - which had been sponsoring us, but had a fading congregation. They hoped that we’d get better support, largely through the provision of meeting & storage facilities - through the school. But I could see the trouble that would be brewing down the road by tying the pack to that secular organization. You just can’t beat a church/synagogue/mosque, or maybe a VFW, as a loyal sponsor of Scouting principles.


8 posted on 10/31/2011 12:44:34 PM PDT by Nevermore (...just a typical cracker, clinging to my Constitutional rights...)
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To: Recovering_Democrat

Everything about those meeting minutes is as wrong as a football bat. First off, Kathleen Unwin totally misstates the chartering process. Second, Bob Casey, apparently representing the troop & pack, appears to have clearly stated his disagreement with national scouting policy. The local council needs to deal with him by removing him from whatever office he holds since he has an intention to violate national policy by signing a fraudulent membership application.

It would not be pretty sight had I been a parent in attendance for that PTO meeting.


9 posted on 10/31/2011 12:45:32 PM PDT by T-Bird45 (It feels like the seventies, and it shouldn't.)
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To: Recovering_Democrat

I thought Washington State had the corner on the stupid and misinformed.

Sad to hear that Missouri is afflicted with as potent a strain of stupid as the one we are currently terminal with out here.

I guess nobody stood up and said,

“Well, the policy is there because we don’t want admitted sodomizers near kids. We feel that the male libido and sodomy, plus the outside chance someone with these qualities may be attracted to boys, a safety issue. Within the Pack and Troop we voted that if we didn’t have to put children in the remotest proximity of the threat of sexual molestation, then we wouldn’t.

The son of gay parents is welcome to join as a Wolf, not as a Tiger. The idea here, is that, again, why take a risk? The risk of sexual molestation of a child by a heterosexual male is exactly zero. The risk of a homosexual male is non-zero, and actually somewhere around 8 percent.

Our parents thought putting their boy at an 8 percent risk of being sodomized, or to be forced to perform fellacio in the woods somewhere outweighed their strong desire to be accepting of all people.

And we background check every single solitary volunteer to ensure that risk remains as close to zero as possible.

I’ve invited Mr. Dirk Diggler to come by and apply to the Avery PTO to charter the Man-Boy Love Association here at the Avery School, given the opportunity your withholding support for the BSA represents, and given your wish to be as inclusive as possible.

We want to be accepting of everyone here, so you can take the $35 charter fee the PTO saved and the facility use you recovered and apply it to your expansive sense of inclusiveness by bringing the Man-Boy Love Association to Avery School.

I’m hoping that mollifies some of the sadness some of you felt in being connected with something as vile and narrow as the Boy Scouts of America.

Here’s hoping your young daughters end up marrying one of these very normal MBLA members to raise a batch of grandkids for you. The FBI may come by down the road and visit your daughter’s house to ask some questions. Its a good bet that agent will have been a Boy Scout.

Be sure to include some KY Jelly in the ‘ten essentials’ camping kit for your very accepting group of inclusive scouters.

Have an expansive and accepting day!”


10 posted on 10/31/2011 12:48:31 PM PDT by RinaseaofDs (Does beheading qualify as 'breaking my back', in the Jeffersonian sense of the expression?)
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To: Recovering_Democrat

Such actions are from bigots and heteorophobic, just as good a word and homophobe.


11 posted on 10/31/2011 1:04:17 PM PDT by goat granny
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To: Recovering_Democrat

Seen and experienced the same thing... although less politely so...

PTOs make for HORRIBLE Chartered Orgs. Better to get a different org.


12 posted on 10/31/2011 1:05:29 PM PDT by JWinNC (www.anailinhisplace.net)
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To: RinaseaofDs
It just amazes me that people do not seem to get the concept of protecting children from potential pedophiles and that this is controversial
13 posted on 10/31/2011 1:09:02 PM PDT by rdcbn
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To: ConjunctionJunction

Dear Lord... I went to that grade school. It is part of the Webster Groves school district in Webster Groves, mo. The neighborhood is made up of mostly liberal tree hugging do gooders now...... How sad.......


14 posted on 10/31/2011 1:31:52 PM PDT by birddog
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To: SandRat; Scoutmaster

ping


15 posted on 10/31/2011 1:50:54 PM PDT by SZonian (July 27, 2010. Life begins anew.)
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To: birddog

OMFingG, I was born there! But I went to Clark.


16 posted on 10/31/2011 1:59:25 PM PDT by ichabod1 (Nuts; A house divided against itself cannot stand.)
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To: Recovering_Democrat
In these days of “Planned Parenthood” taking it out on the children is “social justice”. This is the problem with socializing Homosexuality, they do not take part in society, they take over.

If God does not judge the United States at this point, an apology to Sodom and Gomorrah might be due.

17 posted on 10/31/2011 2:14:30 PM PDT by American in Israel (A wise man's heart directs him to the right, but the foolish mans heart directs him toward the left.)
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To: Recovering_Democrat

I’m sure the local or state T.E.A. Party organization would love to sponsor the BSA.


18 posted on 10/31/2011 2:21:42 PM PDT by TexasCajun (Fast & Furious , Solyndra & Light Squared would be enough to impeach any White President !!)
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To: Recovering_Democrat

Round here all the packs that were sponsored by schools or PTO’s were told to find new chartering organizations a few years ago. This was a preemptive measure on the part of our council to prevent this from happening. I thought it was a dictate from national I guess I was wrong. Someone down there at council has more smarts than I gave them credit for. American legion posts are usually willing to sign on the dotted line for packs and troops but are usually short on suitable meeting space but sometimes the school will let them meet just do not want to be the sponsor.


19 posted on 10/31/2011 2:23:43 PM PDT by scottteng (Tax government employees til they quit and find something useful to do)
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To: SZonian; RonF; AppauledAtAppeasementConservat; Looking for Diogenes; wisconsinconservative; ...

Scout Pings


20 posted on 10/31/2011 2:46:50 PM PDT by SandRat (Duty - Honor - Country! What else needs said?)
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To: Recovering_Democrat
You don't want a PTO as a chartered organization. As a practical matter, too many members of any public school PTO have agendas that are not compatible with Scouting. How in the world is the Pack Committee going to be established and run? And continuity? We have committee members who have been members for well over 20 years.

As a legal matter, you start getting into a grey area. Does the PTO receive any public support? The reason that Exploring was moved from the Boy Scouts of America into an affiliated corporation, Learning for Life, was because Law Enforcement Career Exploring Posts and Fire & Emergency Services Career Exploring Posts were often sponsored by Police Department or Fire Departments.

The ACLU was successful in winning suits against the Departments and the BSA because of the mix of public funds and the BSA's policy that youth believe in a higher being (God - as you define him or her).

Exploring was moved into Learning for Life, which doesn't require belief in a God, and Venturing was eventually introduced into the BSA as the co-ed program for the BSA.

21 posted on 10/31/2011 4:53:16 PM PDT by Scoutmaster (You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred.)
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To: Scoutmaster
Somebody should have asked about how the Girl Scouts and the Boy Scouts differ on their treatment of leaders based on gender.

The Boy Scouts have female leaders at all levels (I know plenty of female Assistant Scoutmasters and a few female Scoutmasters, and the world is chock full of female Den Leaders, Webelos Leaders, and Cubmasters). They camp with their units.

If you're male - say, a divorced or widowed dad - and you want to be active in Girl Scouting with your daughter(s)? Good luck. They few I know who manage to fight the battle face discrimination. At summer camp, they are either herded into a building and locked in at night, or they are transported in vans in the evening to another site.

Why? Well, because you have to protect the girls from possible sexual abuse.

It doesn't matter than the Girl Scouts have openly lesbian leaders, or that there seems to be some strange hypocrisy to the idea that girls must be protected from men, but boys don't require protection from homosexual men.

The Girl Scouts are immune from criticism.

22 posted on 10/31/2011 5:00:43 PM PDT by Scoutmaster (You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred.)
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To: ConjunctionJunction

of course these same idiots would be the first to sue if the Boy Scouts allowed a homosexual leader in who then molested their kid.....


23 posted on 10/31/2011 6:05:06 PM PDT by cherry
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To: AppyPappy
My understanding is that most of the school troops are low-income minorities.

My troop was sponsored by an elementary school PTA. We raised funds by collecting newspapers and showing movies in the cafeteria on weekends. I assure you that we had nothing like the extravagant equipment I observed at the troop my son attended at a Catholic church. The big difference was that the parents were involved to excess at the Catholic church sponsored troop. Extravagant outings with fancy gear. My own troop required the boys to do the work to finance their own outings. They were far more modest, but we never felt "entitled". We did no more than we could afford. I made Eagle in that troop as did quite a few of my peers.

24 posted on 10/31/2011 6:18:21 PM PDT by Myrddin
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To: OriginalChristian

Ping.


25 posted on 11/01/2011 1:36:19 PM PDT by OriginalChristian (The end of America, as founded, began when the first Career Politician was elected...)
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To: Recovering_Democrat
Lots of things wrong with this. Starting with the title.

(St. Louis Suburb School Ends Sponsorship of Cubs Scouts due to "social justice")

The school didn't sponsor the Pack and Troop. The PTO did. It is BSA policy to not accept public schools as chartering organizations.

In March 2011, they suggest that PTOs/PTA’s should not charter organizations that require the PTO/PTA to make judgments or vouch for the character or morals of the other group’s members. They outline concerns with liability issues.

The PTA has done the same thing. The chartering organization is responsible for selecting leaders for a Scout unit and for ensuring their character and suitability for leadership. Some organizations don't feel that they can do this, or don't wish to accept the liability.

One parent asked how Girl Scouts are differently structured. Kathleen Unwin explained that GS charters are handled through a separate non-profit; Girl Scouts of Eastern MO. Boy Scouts are governed through a congressional mandate. Marie Richter asked for clarification on the national structure versus Girl Scouts. It would literally take an act of congress to change the way it is structured.

Both the BSA and the GSUSA have Congressional charters. Other than the establishment of the National organization, neither charter prescribes the structure of the underlying organization. No doubt "Girl Scouts of Eastern MO" is the local GSUSA Service Unit, repsonsible to their national organization. The local Boy Scout units fall under whatever their local Council is, which is also a not-for-profit organization and is responsible to the BSA's National Council just as the GSUSA's local Service Unit is reponsible to their national organization.

Hopefully someone connected with that Pack and Troop is aware that Federal law requires that schools receiving Federal money (certainly all public schools) cannot discriminate against youth organizations wishing to use their facilities for meetings and activities on the basis of their membership policies. In other words, the school can't tell the Scouts they can't meet there because they don't permit gays and atheists.

I had a gay leader once. He was an Eagle Scout. He came to the outings, stuck to the program, and never said "boo" about what he did when he wasn't at a Scout activity. I was glad to have him. We practice two-deep leadership very strictly, so neither he nor any other leader was left alone with any of the kids.

26 posted on 11/03/2011 3:28:29 PM PDT by RonF
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