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Teachers Fired for Reporting Abuse, Lawsuit Claims
http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=14914129 ^

Posted on 11/13/2011 5:52:51 AM PST by TigerClaws

Two teachers, including a former teacher of the year, are suing the Catholic Archdiocese of Miami, claiming they were fired for reporting suspected sex abuse involving the principal and a seventh grade girl.

Chanell Morello and Lynn Hoffman immediately contacted the Florida Department of Children and Families and the Miami Archdiocese after the student made Morello aware of an incident allegedly involving St. Anthony Catholic School principal Norma Kramer.

(Excerpt) Read more at abcnews.go.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: catholic; codeofsilence; retaliation; sexabuse; sourcetitlenoturl

1 posted on 11/13/2011 5:52:52 AM PST by TigerClaws
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To: TigerClaws
Both women have been unable to find teaching jobs since being let go from their positions.
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Wow!

2 posted on 11/13/2011 5:57:36 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: TigerClaws

Is it really that difficult to not have sex with kids?


3 posted on 11/13/2011 5:59:42 AM PST by OnlyTurkeysHaveLeftWings
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To: OnlyTurkeysHaveLeftWings

For homosexuals, it appear to be absolutely impossible not to have sex with children.


4 posted on 11/13/2011 6:26:05 AM PST by Tax-chick ("Without common referents, we are all merely inarticulate refugees from Babel."~Nicknamedbob)
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To: Tax-chick

See also: Housewives and “not guilty” teachers.


5 posted on 11/13/2011 6:28:40 AM PST by OnlyTurkeysHaveLeftWings
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To: TigerClaws
The principal lifted the student's skirt, "exposing her bare buttocks and genital area to a school employee and another student," according to the complaint.

I'm having a bit of trouble understanding why this is sexual abuse...

My first question is why is a seventh grader girl going "commando" to school wearing a skirt

My second question is if a school employee and an other student saw this event, and the principal was sexually abusing the girl, that's got to be the height of stupidity or arrogance

Seems to me a lot of pertinent facts from the story is missing...

6 posted on 11/13/2011 6:39:43 AM PST by Popman (Obama is God's curse upon the land....)
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To: wintertime

Maybe there aren’t any schools left in Miami without a pedophile or three in the part of administration that handles hiring.

Hope they win their suit.


7 posted on 11/13/2011 6:40:01 AM PST by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: TigerClaws
The principal lifted the student's skirt, "exposing her bare buttocks and genital area to a school employee and another student," according to the complaint.

I'm having a bit of trouble understanding why this is sexual abuse...

My first question is why is a seventh grader girl going "commando" to school wearing a skirt

My second question is if a school employee and an other student saw this event, and the principal was sexually abusing the girl, that's got to be the height of stupidity or arrogance

Seems to me a lot of pertinent facts from the story is missing...before we hang her from the highest tree

8 posted on 11/13/2011 6:40:28 AM PST by Popman (Obama is God's curse upon the land....)
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To: OnlyTurkeysHaveLeftWings

If you ask around FR, you’ll find those women are just doing young males a favor. Why, maybe this woman principal was just doing a young lesbian a favor, helping her develop her identity ... (/s)

Once society accepts sex outside marriage, all other distinctions short of violent coercion are specious. If the 7th-grade girl had been ... whatever it was, kissing and groping, perhaps ... with another 7th grade girl, it’s bigoted and hateful to suggest there’s anything wrong with it. If it had been a 7th grade boy, why, they’re just Romeo and Juliet. Legal lines are drawn in the clouds, just so adults can pretend they don’t believe “anything goes.”


9 posted on 11/13/2011 6:40:31 AM PST by Tax-chick ("Without common referents, we are all merely inarticulate refugees from Babel."~Nicknamedbob)
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To: Tax-chick

Hell, at least the 7th graders are on an even keel with one another.

I have a jaundiced view of adults getting handsy with minors. Maybe it’s just me.


10 posted on 11/13/2011 6:49:57 AM PST by OnlyTurkeysHaveLeftWings
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To: OnlyTurkeysHaveLeftWings
at least the 7th graders are on an even keel with one another

Do you really imagine that? Junior high schools have vicious power inequities, but because, "It's just kids' being kids," the more vulnerable have very limited options. (I'd go for a few castrations, myself.)

Maybe it’s just me.

No, it's not just you ... and it's not just you imagining that age makes a real difference.

11 posted on 11/13/2011 6:58:20 AM PST by Tax-chick ("Without common referents, we are all merely inarticulate refugees from Babel."~Nicknamedbob)
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To: TigerClaws

oh...................kay..............

So the STUDENT came to school with no underwear on, a la Britanny Spears, and the principal showed the student’s shiney hiney, and the two “horrified” teachers turned the PRINCIPAL in to Child Service?

The STUDENT should have been sent home and told not to return unless she had underwear on. And maybe shorts on too.


12 posted on 11/13/2011 7:00:27 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: TigerClaws

I’m hoping the $15,000+ mentioned in the article is a typo...should be more like $1.5 million.

Even if the principal’s actions were an innocent mistake(!), the teachers should not have been fired for THEIR actions.


13 posted on 11/13/2011 7:13:06 AM PST by moovova (Report my sarcastic, fear-mongering, hate-filled lies to www.AttackWatch.com by clicking HERE.)
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To: TigerClaws
I'm certainly not defending anything Penn State did, but it is cases like the one in this article which convince people to keep their mouth shut or look the other way. You see abuse? You see harassment? If you say something, you may end up paying a heavy price.

This is especially true if you blow the whistle on a homosexual abuser. You wouldn't want to be branded an intolerant homophobe, would you??

14 posted on 11/13/2011 7:26:59 AM PST by ClearCase_guy (I won't vote for Romney. I won't vote for Perry.)
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To: OnlyTurkeysHaveLeftWings
“Hell, at least the 7th graders are on an even keel with one another.” (OnlyTurkeysHaveLeftWings)
“Do you really imagine that? Junior high schools have vicious power inequities, but because, “It's just kids’ being kids,” the more vulnerable have very limited options. (I'd go for a few castrations, myself.” ( Tax-Chick )
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I must agree with Tax-Chick about the power inequities. In many ways, our typical Prussian-style schools resemble prisons. No one should be surprised that we see cliques ( protection gangs) and prison social pathology in these schools.

However....If we are going to treat kids ( whose only crime was being born) like prisoners then we must make a distinction between true sexual harassment and sexual abuse among the students, and social immaturity. Immature, rude, and insensitive comments should be rebuked sharply with guidance given and the victim reassured and comforted. The problem though is it takes the wisdom of Solomon to sort out the behavior due to immaturity from true sexual harassment.

My suggestion: If you have kids don't put them in a Prussian-style school.

15 posted on 11/13/2011 7:30:02 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: wintertime
The problem though is it takes the wisdom of Solomon to sort out the behavior due to immaturity from true sexual harassment.

Yes, that's true. Also, whether the cause of the unacceptable behavior is considered "immaturity" or "adult evil" doesn't necessarily affect its impact on the target. To use an analogy, a person you shoot by accident is just as dead as one you shoot entirely on purpose.

16 posted on 11/13/2011 7:51:05 AM PST by Tax-chick ("Without common referents, we are all merely inarticulate refugees from Babel."~Nicknamedbob)
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To: Tax-chick
Good point.!

Personally, I think it is unnatural and cruel to put children into kiddie prisons ( wrongly called “schools”) and then play mind games with them by telling them it is good for them to suffer the inevitable prison-gang pathology found there.

Again: The solution is to keep kids out of these places ( private or government).

17 posted on 11/13/2011 8:08:50 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: wintertime
and then play mind games with them by telling them it is good for them

Yes, that's the part that makes me feel homicidal!

18 posted on 11/13/2011 8:13:19 AM PST by Tax-chick ("Without common referents, we are all merely inarticulate refugees from Babel."~Nicknamedbob)
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To: yldstrk

There could be many reasons why the student didn’t have underwear on. The principal could have simply called her parents to come and pick her up and explained why. There is no reason for her to show off her private parts to people in a room. I would definitely say what the principle did was inappropriate and wrong but I don’t exactly define it as abuse.


19 posted on 11/13/2011 8:26:24 AM PST by momtothree
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To: Tax-chick
Yes, that's true. Also, whether the cause of the unacceptable behavior is considered "immaturity" or "adult evil" doesn't necessarily affect its impact on the target. To use an analogy, a person you shoot by accident is just as dead as one you shoot entirely on purpose.

Ideally children shouldn't be placed in prison-like schools. The problem I see is that I don't want boys labeled with the legally loaded labels of sexual predator or sexual harasser when they are merely being the immature, and still undomesticated, creatures that they are. In normal social situations ( unlike socially pathological schools) those who are doing the harassing are chastised and the victim is taught ways to prevent, deflect, and protect themselves from future incidents.

I think that in these school situations there is a political agenda. Boys are to be cut down at the knees, labeled, and crippled with the label of "sexual harasser" while the equally cruel alpha-girl gets to skate on by without and consequences.

Just like Nurse Ratchet in "One Flew Over the Cochoo's Nest", there are a lot of "Educator Ratchets" out there from pre-K to graduate school. They hate men ( especially white men) and especially enjoy having testicles of little boys on the menu.

As a woman who studied in a nearly all male environment I was certainly subject to sexual comments and unwanted advances. I **learned** how to manage these without running to the dean for every little socially snagged hang nail. If a man or woman is to succeed in the professional world it is best that they learn these big boy and big girl skills.

20 posted on 11/13/2011 8:27:02 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: momtothree

whatever. I am betting the student wanted to show off her privates and the principal was irritated that the student had done it again


21 posted on 11/13/2011 9:03:00 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: wintertime

Yeah, try having been on e of the 10% in the military in 19080s and female. These dorks sergeants would walk up and say “Ma’am, I probably should nt say this........” and I would say “then don’t”. That shut a lot of them up


22 posted on 11/13/2011 9:05:40 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: yldstrk
“Ma’am, I probably should nt say this........” and I would say “then don’t”. That shut a lot of them up
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Exactly my point. There are ways to manage things **before** they escalate. Emotionally mature and balanced men and women learn who to do this.

One thing that has helped me is to make it know early in a working relationship that I am a **firm** Christian. It is amazing how well behaved and mannerly men are when they know that. Keeping things professional ( lady-like) in dress and speech sets the proper tone as well and there are far fewer ( no) “misunderstandings”.

Wrecking a man's career over something that is not genuine sexual harassment will wreck a woman's career, too.

23 posted on 11/13/2011 9:27:22 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: wintertime
I don't want boys labeled with the legally loaded labels of sexual predator or sexual harasser when they are merely being the immature, and still undomesticated, creatures that they are.

I agree. I'm not opining on what the legal situation should be, exactly, but on the stance to be taken toward the behavior, which is that it is not acceptable, whether in the school, the neighborhood, or the workplace.

24 posted on 11/13/2011 12:31:07 PM PST by Tax-chick ("Without common referents, we are all merely inarticulate refugees from Babel."~Nicknamedbob)
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