Skip to comments.Banned after accusations of abuse, some gymnastics coaches continue to teach
Posted on 11/28/2011 2:01:27 PM PST by petitfour
PASADENA Charmaine Carnes had only been at Flairs, a Pasadena gymnastics club, a few months in 1978 when she was chosen to ride in the front seat of coach Doug Boger's car. Carnes beamed as she shut the car door, convinced that the ride with Boger, then 30, to a competition later that day was the first leg of a journey that would make her an Olympian. Instead, Carnes said, Boger took her and many of her Flairs teammates to a much darker place.
A newspaper clipping featuring Doug Boger, right, with Flairs gymnast Denise Gallion. Gallion said Boger sexually abused her for three years, starting when she was 13.
"I was 8 or 9, and I remember he had this yellow Mustang and it was an honor if you got to ride with him," Carnes said. "And we would be in the car and it started off with him tickling me, and then I realized he was tickling me in my genitalia and I remember just staring at the gearshift in the car."
(Excerpt) Read more at ocregister.com ...
Here is another story that did make it to ESPN in November even though the story hit the wire more than two months earlier. This one is about the girls/women’s US Olympic team and national team coach from 1984. It is sickening.
You can’t put a sexually mature man in alone for any lengths of time with girls or young women with this kind of thing happening. It is a basic natural impulse, something our Creator endowed us with to insure we would not be lonely. It is among the top three most basic human impulses, along with the desire to grow, to be more powerful.
A polite society puts in restraints that assure that no man is ever alone with a woman/girl, that there is always another mature adult present.
Likewise we should understand the darker aspects of such sexual and mating impulses, that they can be in one person quite perverted, and apply era and age appropriate safeguards to protect both predator and prey. For no HUMAN predator ever relishes long his hunger if it is profanely or vilely satisfied.
This especially applies in athletics, where skimpy dress and strange and impolite body contortions are common, and where the power role of trusted coach makes the prey particularly vulnerable, like birds walking into the maw of the tiger.
I don’t think it is man’s nature to physically abuse 10 year old girls and to sexually abuse 12 year old girls. It is the nature of sick men. Maybe this guy can go found a religion or something.
Unfortunately for these girls, this man was left alone with girls all the time. He demanded that parents leave the facilities and not watch practices.
“A polite society puts in restraints that assure that no man is ever alone with a woman/girl, that there is always another mature adult present.”
Heck, we have the same policy with the boys. A coach is never alone with a player. Any meeting is conducted in the snack bar area. If a coach is in the locker room and a player walks in, the coach leaves. We don’t accept players as friends on Facebook, and every e-mail goes to the parents only.
It is among the most basic of animal-human natures, it holds both sex and power combined. It is a very powerful drive.
To deny its potency is to subject more generations of youth to such predations, harms and perditions.
Yes, as humans, enfused with G-dly souls, we are capable of surmounting such traps arising out of our basic nature. But in these cases -- coach-to-youth, because of the intrinsic animal-like nature of athletics (it's not the chess team for gosh sakes) -- the traps require strongly enforced particular rules of proper behavior, with a constant vigilance.
Can be expanded on endlessly. Look at the massive increase in psycho serial rapists and killers since the 60âs when dress became provocative and now has no boundaries. As a crime show buff when you look deeper you’ll find we now have multiple active serial rapists and or killers. Once an Anomaly is now the norm in law enforcement.
Are the accusations true?
I am inclined to believe the accusers. If the USAG put the men on the banned list, then I am inclined to believe there must be a mountain of evidence or at least corroborating stories. They do not like to act on these sorts of allegations because if the media ever decided to do a story on it, the USAG would look bad. Bad press means loss in revenue. for the USAG.
I usher at church as well as teach a University class. Our church has rules where in dealing with kids, there are always two adults especially when taking them to the bathroom and we don’t enter it either and no wiping, no helping them on buckling pants - no touching !!
On my university class, I have several self-imposed rules. First one is I don’t meet students alone in an office. Even though it is aimed at female students, just to be fair, applies to both sexes. Second with female students, I interact with them as little a possible and the interaction is only class related and private matters like grades are discussed through e-mail.
I conduct my office hours in an open area like by the building’s coffee shop in a very open area. Since I am part time, the office that we share is a very isolated office in a dead-end hallway and there is basically no traffic going by. That makes for a lot of opportunity to get in trouble.
> Heck, we have the same policy with the boys. A coach is never alone with a player. Any meeting is conducted in the snack bar area. If a coach is in the locker room and a player walks in, the coach leaves. We dont accept players as friends on Facebook, and every e-mail goes to the parents only.
>> A polite society puts in restraints that assure that no man is ever alone with a woman/girl, that there is always another mature adult present.
I grew up in this sport.
I spent countless hours in the gym with adult male coaches.
Not one of them gave a hint of this kind of behavior.
I grew up in this sport.
I spent countless hours in the gym with adult male coaches.
Not one of them gave a hint of this kind of behavior.
That said, I disagree with your view that men are such animals this kind of thing is inevitable. Many, many men manage to be faithful to their wives and never even think about fooling around with underage girls.
Yes, my life would be poorer if I couldn’t have had any male coaches or have spent hours in private discussion with various professors and teachers or colleagues or managers.
I understand the concerns about being vulnerable to allegations. But the idea that men just can’t help themselves and are prone to sexually attack any woman or girl if given the opportunity doesn’t fit with any reality I’ve experienced.
Of course, any man fighting such urges shouldn’t put himself in those circumstances.
Who estimates that 25% of men have sexually abused young girls?
that being said...with all of these horror stories, there are lessons to be learned...
No child should share a hotel room with an adult who is not their parent/family member/legal guardian.
No child should travel alone with an adult who is not their parent/family member/legal guardian.
Children should not train alone in a gym - with no other athletes present, or other adults presents.
When coaches counsel an athlete, they should remain visible to others...no closed doors...or have an office with a window.
There are many simple thing that can be done that protect the kids - but also protect the adults from false accusations.
This wouldn’t happen if they just allowed gymnastic coaches to marry. Oh wait...
Most bullets, the great majority, of those fired never hit the mark on the prey. Most arrows launched from bowstring the same.
That you emerged into mature adulthood without encountering such a situation certainly doesn’t meant you were never the prey.
Men are men, and our minds are wired — by G-d Himself — to seek growth, power and sex. Women less so, but still they too, so seek.
This world of the living is no easy play, even when it may appear to be for some time.
A quality internal vision is required to read some material correctly. A bad attitude can misread and maliciously read into anything.
The modern dress of the typical 12-year female gymnast or figure skater is more provocative than full nudity. What remnants of material are left are shrewdly and beautifully designed to tease out more sexuality than full nudity would.
See my reply 25 above.
And today, post sexual revolution, post-Bill Clinton, there are no real taboos to anything "sexual", and the laws often make illegal what is the moral reaction while rewarding the perverted by special treatment and grants of favor, title, property, money.
Because you apparently have issues with such urges is not really a good basis for assuming that all or most men do.
Like a panther I could have been waiting for exactly such a immature and childish reaction. A completely delusional statement it is you have made. Picture that panther tearing your fat childish remark to bits with teeth and fangs, and leaving only bones to bleach in the sun.
What more can I say to an adult who would play act a child in mind? With such an immature attitude you are very foolish.
And maybe she simply was unattractive to these particular coaches who otherwise would have perved on her.
I’m sorry to disappoint you.
I have known this group of men over decades.
I also have worked with some of them, and stayed in contact with old teammates and coaches.
Not only has there not been one whisper of this sort of thing....I cannot remember these men putting themselves in these situations...(ex: traveling alone with an athlete, calling athletes into his hotel room, etc...)
I know it does happen in rare cases.
When it happens, the predator is usually prolific.
I do not share your view that men are hardwired by G_D to prey upon young girls.
roflol... Oh good grief. That is a ridiculous reply.
So in your fantasy world you devour him and destroyed his argument.
Now lets you you do so in real life.
Put up !
According to you!!??
gee ....it’s like you think I can’t hear you or something.
This is actually fairly common to allow the gymnast to concentrate on listening to their coach, and remove the distraction of the gym parent who feels the need to intrude and "coach" their child from the sidelines. At the same time, there obviously *does* need to be a way to guarantee that there are always two adults present, especially when/if one is male. The gym where my kid goes has LOTS of windows, is well lit and is very open all of which removes any notion of privacy.
What mouth breathing half-wit added “sarahpalin” to the keywords?
And I didn't say you were unattractive. I said maybe you were unattractive TO THEM.
which means you’re missing the point.
As I said...I spent decades in the sport.
Not only was I coached by men - but I knew,literally, hundreds of others who were as well.
After my competitive years were done, I coached and judged alongside them.
I knew the girls - their parents - and the coaches.
girls talk to each other. Well, so do boys.
As we can see in the PSU Grand Jury presentment, some of that evidence was discovered because young kids talk to each other.
Not only have former athletes (now adults) never whispered a word - nor have the first generation of those I coached (now adults) - nor those following.
And again...I’ve never seen them behave in the way we see these other guys...parents accompany their children to competitions. Hotel room are occupied by the child-with-parents. Parents are driving their own kids to the meets.
Anyways....I’m not claiming it doesn’t happen.
I’m saying it is rare, and that most adults - men or women- do not behave like this.
we allowed parents to watch through a barrier of windows, but they were not allowed to be inside the gym during practice (this is team level - not the lower levels)
The “stage parents” in this sport can get very tough to handle.
Search for "Naughty Teachers" on FR. Clearly, based on these articles, you cant put a sexually mature
man woman in alone for any lengths of time with girls boys or young women men with this kind of thing happening.
Do you not believe me? Just google Alison Peck, Amber Jennings, Autumn Leathers, Beth Ann Chester, Cristie Elliot, Debra Lafave, etc...
Do you still feel your self righteous misandrous superiority?
You sound like a pervert, and a possibly a sexual predator. I hope you are not allowed to interact with children. Per my previous post; statistical data seems to indicate many grown women prey upon young boys.
Of course, by today's standards, being a "Cougar" is "Cool" and "Edgy." It's a wonder they let women near children at all!
Thanks for your reply. I was composing one and it got entirely too long. You summed up my thoughts perfectly. Thanks again.
Passing the trash
Too often, problem teachers are allowed to leave quietly. That can mean future abuse for another student and another school district.
They might deal with it internally, suspending the person or having the person move on. So their license is never investigated, says Charol Shakeshaft, a leading expert in teacher sex abuse who heads the educational leadership department at Virginia Commonwealth University.
Laws in several states require that even an allegation of sexual misconduct be reported to the state departments that oversee teacher licenses. But theres no consistent enforcement, so such laws are easy to ignore.
School officials fear public embarrassment as much as the perpetrators do, Shakeshaft says. They want to avoid the fallout from going up against a popular teacher. They also dont want to get sued by teachers or victims, and they dont want to face a challenge from a strong union.
Pride deafens does it not? The pretty and polite shared delusions of life are often for good merit and sanity. Thinking good thoughts of fellow humans is important to one’s sanity and social well-being.
Yet pride deafens to where those delusions lead to snares easily set by predators hungry for prey. We are humans only in spiritual levels, in body — the very body emphasized in sports, and additionally sexually emphasized in sports like figure skating, dance, and cheerleading (all so similar to and derivative of gymnastics) — in body we are animals.
The old lions of strength and prowess keep all the fertile young females under strict claim as to marital rights. That is the dynamics of a herd, of a harem. Human kings and chiefs have kept large harems that the even the youngest maiden is captured into — that is a sign in most cultures of prime manhood, of the alpha male.
We are not as a culture magic, we only have different pretensions. Shared illusions. Men are still men and sex is—as the Creator designed it—among the strongest of urges.
Here we have our rock star and his groupies, our Clinton and his interns, our Kennedies and their preppy upscale harems, our big men on campus and their fawning fan-girls.
There is no magic age limit to sexual attraction enscribed by nature in our genes and their expression into growing embryos, fetuses, infants and then persons.
The limits are ONLY by what society and culture over generations have developed, what Divine Revelation has made evident.
You seem to believe in some magic! A magic that says the men you knew were not men, but asexual automatons. Stop it. Please. Grow up. Go and learn.
Go read Chaucer, Shakespeare, Faulkner, whatever “classic” literature you may find — it will be there, if the work is truly classic. For classics describe the true innards of the workings of the soul in the body, and the souls and bodies together in a society in the world.
This is not a magic generation. Rather it is a very sexually confused one, where the boundary markers of modesty, innocence and decency have been overthrown.
The gym where my girls were has lots of windows and cameras so that the coaches are not put into a he said/she said situation. And from what I saw with the elite gymnasts, there were always two or more coaches present. When they travelled, the girls were with the female coach. But this would be a smaller gym than the gym for the guy in this article.
You are wrong and wrong again and you have set camp within the chorus of the dim-bulbs, and a un-enlightening chorus it is!
I don’t think the abuse is widespread, but where it is, it needs to be stopped. It’s similar to the Sandusky thing. I don’t think there are football coaches all over the place who are molesting boys.
I don’t know who added sarahpalin as a keyword either, but that needs to go.
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