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Berryville Man Files Federal Lawsuit Over FOIA Response(Obama adopted)
Clarke Daily News ^ | 28 Nov 2011 | Edward Leonard

Posted on 11/29/2011 4:39:25 PM PST by bushpilot1

A local man is asking a United States federal court to help him gain access to information related to the citizenship history of President Barack Obama.

Berryville resident, George Archibald has petitioned the United States District Court for the District of Columbia to compel the Department of Justice (DOJ), the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) and former White House Counsel Robert Bauer to produce documents that Archibald says may provide new insight into whether the President’s mother forfeited his US citizenship when Obama was just six-years-old.

(Excerpt) Read more at clarkedailynews.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: birthcertificate; certifigate; eligibility; fraud; naturalborncitizen; usurper
If Archibald’s suspicion is correct it would raise important questions about the legitimacy of Obama’s qualifications to hold the office of President of the United States.

“I’m not a ‘birther,’’’ Archibald said after filing his lawsuit. “I’m simply interested in getting to the bottom of what appears to be stone-walling by the administration against my Freedom of Information request.”

In the suit, filed on November 16 in the District of Columbia, Archibald alleges that a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request that he filed with the FBI’s Winchester, Virginia office on April 15, 2011 asking for information produced during the FBI’s background check of presidential candidate Barack Hussein Obama II was improperly rejected.

In the FOIA request Archibald asks for “information regarding Obama’s birth in 1961, family background, citizenship, residency, immigration, expatriation/repatriation, and other matters related to Obama’ s origins and nationality generated during the FBI’s 2008 investigation of presidential candidates.”

Archibald’s request is based on President Dwight D. Eisenhower’s Executive Order 10450, “Security Requirements for Government Employment,” issued in 1953.

Under the Eisenhower directive, the FBI conducts background checks on all presidential candidates.

Archibald is seeking information that may have turned up in the FBI investigation related to Barach Obama’s citizenship status after his mother wed an Indonesian citizen.

Archibald believes that after Obama’s mother, Stanley Ann Dunham Soetoro, arrived in Djakarta with her young son in 1967, who he says was adopted by stepfather Lolo Soetoro, Barry Obama maintained permanent residency and schooling in Indonesia until 1971 before returning to Honolulu in 1979 to live with his maternal grandparents where he attended high school and later graduated.

Archibald contends that Indonesian authorities would have required the young Obama to naturalize in order to remain in the country and attend school.

“The fact that your mother, Stanley Ann Dunham Soetoro, took you [Barach Obama] to live in Indonesia in 1967, at age six, after she had divorced your father and married Indonesian national Lolo Soetoro – where after arrival at Djakarta you both were temporarily refused admission by Indonesian authorities, who balked at your dual U.S.-Kenya nationality,”

Archibald said in an open letter to Obama asking the President to release the information requested in the lawsuit.

“Your mother responded upon requirement of the Djakarta government authorities by having you legally adopted as a minor child by your Indonesian citizen stepfather Lolo Soetoro; your adoptive name was changed to Barry Soetoro; your claim to U.S. nationality was renounced; and you were legally naturalized as an Indonesian citizen,” the letter continues.

Archibald believes that the FBI may be holding information related to Mr. Obama’s eligibility to stand for the office of President of the United States according to the stated qualifications of Article II, Section 1, Clause 4 of the Constitution of the United States.

“The FBI responded to my request by saying that it generally cannot release these types of personal documents without the authorization and consent of the third party unless the public interest in disclosure outweighs the personal privacy interest and that significant public benefit would result from the disclosure of the requested records,” Archibald said.

“In this situation I think that the public interest would be served from a full disclosure by President Obama.”

Robert Bauer, also named in the suit, was Assistant to the President and White House Counsel from December 2009 until June 2011, and advised President Obama and other Obama administration officials during April and May 2011 when Archibald’s FOIA request and subsequent letters were received and considered by the FBI, the White House and administration staff.

“As a career news reporter and book author with credentialed Congressional and the House experience over many years, I have faced stonewalling and cover-up by many presidential administrations and politicians of all persuasions,” Archibald said. “It doesn’t work.”

US District Court Judge Reggie Walton is expected to schedule a hearing on the matter within the next 60 days.

1 posted on 11/29/2011 4:39:35 PM PST by bushpilot1
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To: bushpilot1
The lawsuit makes no sense. A parent cannot renounce a child's U.S. citizenship.

http://travel.state.gov/law/citizenship/citizenship_776.html

2 posted on 11/29/2011 4:47:41 PM PST by colorado tanker
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To: bushpilot1

Makes sense but a little late I think...


3 posted on 11/29/2011 4:49:59 PM PST by refermech
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To: bushpilot1
the boy could be a space alien and the FBI would never tell...
4 posted on 11/29/2011 4:50:07 PM PST by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: bushpilot1

“Archibald believes that after Obama’s mother, Stanley Ann Dunham Soetoro, arrived in Djakarta with her young son in 1967, who he says was adopted by stepfather Lolo Soetoro, Barry Obama maintained permanent residency and schooling in Indonesia until 1971 before returning to Honolulu in 1979 to live with his maternal grandparents where he attended high school and later graduated.”

Barry Soetoro, Indonesian National, returned to Hawaii in 1971 as an unaccompanied minor. Consequently, he was taken into protective custody by the INS.

Catholic Social Services of Connecticut, an NGO contractor with the US State Department was granted custody of 10 year old Barry. It was Catholic Social Services of Connecticut that filed on Obama’s behalf to obtain his SSN, thus a Connecticut SSN. Obama qualified for his SSN as a Permanent Resident Alien because he did not regain his US Citizenship after the Soetoro adoption was annulled.

Obama naturalized as a US Citizen after he turned 18.


5 posted on 11/29/2011 4:52:22 PM PST by SvenMagnussen (BHO II naturalized as U.S. Citizen after becoming an Indonesian National)
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To: SvenMagnussen

That means Obama has failed to qualify to become President of the United States, correct?


6 posted on 11/29/2011 4:58:39 PM PST by Eye of Unk
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To: colorado tanker

Which is why the court will dismiss this lawsuit.

Another faulty premise up in flames.


7 posted on 11/29/2011 5:01:50 PM PST by Valpal1 (I have a dream... Herman Cain being sworn in by Clarence Thomas.)
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To: SvenMagnussen

Interesting story. All we need now is an authoritative link to back it up.


8 posted on 11/29/2011 5:08:23 PM PST by upchuck (Rerun: Think you know hardship? Wait till the dollar is no longer the world's reserve currency.)
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To: bushpilot1

Amazing not a single journalist, American or foreign, has the guts to ask Barry if he was ever a citizen of Indonesia.


9 posted on 11/29/2011 5:14:17 PM PST by kreitzer
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To: Valpal1
Which is why the court will dismiss this lawsuit.

If I read the article correctly, the lawsuit is regarding the FBI's refusal to give up documents it discovered in it's search, not about whether Obama is a citizen or not. The Defendant is the FBI, not Obama. Barack's citizenship status is irrelevant to the case.

Another faulty premise up in flames.

Yes, your faulty premise has just been burned.

10 posted on 11/29/2011 5:49:32 PM PST by DiogenesLamp (Partus sequitur Patrem)
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To: colorado tanker

I could not find information about an indonesian citizen adopting a U.S. Citizen on this site other than the child must renounce his citizenship on his own. I did find this interesting tid-bit on the U.S. Embassy in Indonesia web site:

NOTE: Indonesian Government stipulates that an adoptive child must be of the same religion as the adoptive parents. Where the religion of the child’s birth parents is not known, the child will be deemed to be Muslim.

I guess if Lolo (a muslim) adopted Barry,Barry had to become a Muslim or the adoption would not have been allowed according to the Government of Indonesia.


11 posted on 11/29/2011 5:56:41 PM PST by marstegreg
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To: colorado tanker

No a parent can’t renounce a citizenship, but at the age of 18 when he traveled to Indonesia which passport did he choose? That is the biggest question of all. If he chose his Indonesian passport, then he chose his citizenship and renounced the USA. That’s how it works. Legal age which did he choose to use?


12 posted on 11/29/2011 6:02:08 PM PST by jcsjcm (This country was built on exceptionalism and individualism. In God we Trust - Laus Deo)
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To: marstegreg


Here you go!
13 posted on 11/29/2011 6:04:26 PM PST by jcsjcm (This country was built on exceptionalism and individualism. In God we Trust - Laus Deo)
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To: SvenMagnussen

The only problem I see with that story is that in 1971 children did not need a Social Security Number. I got my SSN in 1967 when I applied for a summer job at 16.


14 posted on 11/29/2011 6:07:13 PM PST by COBOL2Java (Obama is the least qualified guy in whatever room he walks into.)
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To: jcsjcm

Wow! You are FAST!!!!!! It boggles my mind how this stuff is ignored by ALL the media.


15 posted on 11/29/2011 6:09:50 PM PST by marstegreg
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To: marstegreg
NOTE: Indonesian Government stipulates that an adoptive child must be of the same religion as the adoptive parents. Where the religion of the child’s birth parents is not known, the child will be deemed to be Muslim.

Somewhere in one of my message threads, a man posted me a copy of the Indonesian law in force at the time Obama lived there. If I recall correctly, the law stated that adoption was automatic if the child was under 5 years of age when the mother married the Indonesian citizen. Of course, that doesn't address whether he was adopted in Hawaii under Hawaiian law, but there is evidence that tends to indicate this might have happened.

Also, Maya Soetoro (Barack's half sister) has made a statement indicating that Barack was adopted by her Father.

Also, on one of Stanly Ann Dunham's passport documents, she stated her child was named "Barry Soebarkha" (or some such) which one blogger claims means "Barry, son of Soetoro" in Indonesian.

There are other bits and pieces that indicate an adoption took place, but the one's I mentioned are easy to find with an internet search.

16 posted on 11/29/2011 6:16:45 PM PST by DiogenesLamp (Partus sequitur Patrem)
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To: jcsjcm
Uh, no. Renunciation of citizenship requires a very specific procedure, including appearing at a U.S. consulate and signing an oath of renunciation.

If Obama was adopted by Soetero and became an Indonesian citizen, then he became a dual citizen. That does not have the effect of renunciation.

It is often said the U.S. does not allow dual citizenship, but it's done all the time. The oath of citizenship simply asks if one is willing to renounce the other country, but does not require it.

That said, I have always been very curious what went on in Indonesia. Was he adopted? If so, how was that handled in the divorce? Did he become an Indonesian citizen? Is he still? Answers could be very embarrassing, which I assume is why they keep such a tight lid on them.

17 posted on 11/29/2011 6:17:21 PM PST by colorado tanker
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To: marstegreg
I guess if Lolo (a muslim) adopted Barry,Barry had to become a Muslim or the adoption would not have been allowed according to the Government of Indonesia.

That would appear to be the case.

Also, did he become an Indonesian citizen? If so, did he renounce that or does he still have it? If he was adopted, how was that and the matter of his religion handled in the divorce?

Lots of interesting questions they are keeping a tight lid on.

18 posted on 11/29/2011 6:20:53 PM PST by colorado tanker
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To: DiogenesLamp

There are other bits and pieces that indicate an adoption took place, but the one’s I mentioned are easy to find with an internet search.

You would think the media would have stumbled on to this by now.


19 posted on 11/29/2011 6:24:19 PM PST by marstegreg
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To: colorado tanker

A) We don’t know that Obama ever had U.S. citizenship to renounce. He was most likely either British or Kenyan at birth or perhaps even stateless.

B) Indonesia doesn’t allow/recognize dual citizenship.

C) Adoption under age 5 results in automatic Indonesian citizenship, as long as the adoption is registered with the Indonesian courts.

D) The U.S. state department has recognized that the U.S. cannot protect the citizenship of children adopted OUT of the United States, especially to countries that are not part of the Hague Convention. Under International Law, Obama would not have been a dual citizen if he was adopted in Indonesia.

E) It may not matter, because Obama was not a natural U.S. citizen at birth and he may have had foreign citizenship as an adult. If he has lied or tried to cover up his foreign citizenship, then he has defrauded the American public.


20 posted on 11/29/2011 6:28:53 PM PST by edge919
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To: jcsjcm

I have seen that image scan Before- look at line number 4- the caption translates to “religion” and the written answer is “ISLAM”


21 posted on 11/29/2011 6:36:06 PM PST by Mr. K (Physically unable to profreed <--- oops, see?)
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To: Mr. K

Yes, you probably have seen this before. All this information was flying like crazy even before the usurper was even elected. Court after court would not hear any information that was dug up since We the People have no standing.

He even admitted on his own fight the smears web site that he held dual citizenship as a British subject and still the courts would not hear a case that he was not a Natural born citizen. You can’t be a Natural born citizen if you have allegiance to another nation. grrr......

And we also knew of the adoption to Soetoro which then gave him Indonesian Citizenship. How many nations does this man have allegiance to? Definitely not the US


22 posted on 11/29/2011 6:44:53 PM PST by jcsjcm (This country was built on exceptionalism and individualism. In God we Trust - Laus Deo)
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To: upchuck

Why isn’t a local newspaper where the plaintiff lives an ‘authoritative’ link? You expect to read about this in the NYT or WaPo? The case documents can be obtained through PACER for $0.08/page if you require ‘authoritative.’


23 posted on 11/29/2011 6:53:52 PM PST by EDINVA
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To: kreitzer

There’s no need to ask if he had Indonesian citizenship.

A boy raised in the Jungle is raised in the Jungle.

A drunk stumbling out of a bar is a drunk.

An Indonesian communist raised in Indonesia is an Indonesian communist.


24 posted on 11/29/2011 7:01:15 PM PST by PA-RIVER
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To: DiogenesLamp
Archibald believes that the FBI may be holding information related to Mr. Obama’s eligibility to stand for the office of President of the United States according to the stated qualifications of Article II, Section 1, Clause 4 of the Constitution of the United States.

Not all documents are subject to FOIA, just because somebody wants a look-see. If no compelling public interest argument is made, the judge is just going to dismiss the suit. Since a parent CANNOT renounce a child's citizenship, the premise that these documents can shed some or any kind of light is faulty and there is no compelling public interest in forcing them into public view. He's got no bait on his hook.

25 posted on 11/29/2011 8:31:05 PM PST by Valpal1 (I have a dream... Herman Cain being sworn in by Clarence Thomas.)
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To: bushpilot1

From the article: “Archibald’s request is based on President Dwight D. Eisenhower’s Executive Order 10450, ‘Security Requirements for Government Employment,’ issued in 1953. Under the Eisenhower directive, the FBI conducts background checks on all presidential candidates.”

No, they don’t. George Archibald looks to be a credible challenger to Orly Taitz for who can be wrong the most.

First, if the FBI ever conducted a background check on Obama, it was not because he ran for president. Second, the results of background checks for federal employment are confidential and exempt of FOIA disclosure. Third, as others have pointed out in this thread, even if Lolo Soetoro had adopted Barack Obama, and even if Obama became an Indonesian citizen under Indonesian law, Obama would still be a natural-born citizen of the Untied States.


26 posted on 11/30/2011 12:51:47 AM PST by BladeBryan
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To: BladeBryan
You stated, “even if Obama became an Indonesian citizen under Indonesian law, Obama would still be a natural-born citizen of the Untied States.”

Really! How can he still be something he never was?

Chears:>) EasyDoesIt

27 posted on 11/30/2011 1:20:30 AM PST by eazdzit (Did your Congressman challenge/Qualify OBAMA? Throw the bums out. WE need a 3rd Party.Palin in 2012)
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To: COBOL2Java

Catholic Social Services of Connecticut maintained legal custody of BHO II until he turned 18. Madelyn Payne Dunham, Obama’s grandmother, was appointed his guardian during this time.

When Obama was 15 or 16, Catholic Social Services applied for an SSN on Obama’s behalf and used their Connecticut address as the return address on the SSN application. Consequently, Obama has a prefix SSN indicating a Connecticut number.


28 posted on 11/30/2011 1:29:51 AM PST by SvenMagnussen (BHO II naturalized as U.S. Citizen after becoming an Indonesian National)
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To: marstegreg
You would think the media would have stumbled on to this by now.

Perhaps they will 'stumble' into this; as time goes along and the lists grow longer, of those who want Obama 'out'. We know this Media is at best; self-serving.

29 posted on 11/30/2011 2:56:35 AM PST by cricket (Newt. . .the 'anti-Obama' ; and America's antidote, for Obama presidency.)
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To: EDINVA
Why isn’t a local newspaper where the plaintiff lives an ‘authoritative’ link?

Because my comment in reply #8 has nothing to do with the local newspaper story.

Go to reply #5 and read the second, third and fourth paragraphs. That is what I referred to.

30 posted on 11/30/2011 4:23:50 AM PST by upchuck (Rerun: Think you know hardship? Wait till the dollar is no longer the world's reserve currency.)
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To: colorado tanker

Obama never renounced his British Citizenship. It takes a very specific form to do so. Form RN.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitecontent/applicationforms/nationality/form_rn.pdf

Obama indicates he was born a dual citizen due to his (supposed) birth father. As such, that status was never taken away from him. Even when his father became Kenyan a couple of years later. Like the US Citizenship and even more so, you can not simply ‘lose’ your citizenship. Form RN is needed.

Without form RN Obama is still, to this day, a citizen of Great Britain.

To see a similar case:

http://thailand-business-news.com/politics/29408-thailand%E2%80%99s-prime-minister-confesses-he-is-also-british


31 posted on 11/30/2011 5:48:08 AM PST by bluecat6 ( "A non-denial denial. They doubt our heritage, but they don't say the story is not accurate.")
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To: BladeBryan

Why was the marriage date for Lolo and SAD published in so many accounts early on so wrong? They were married in 1965, yet most accounts (provided by the Obama camp) indicate the marriage is in 1967 or 1968.

Even the great TIME magazine published the story with a date two years off.

Why was this date so lied about?


32 posted on 11/30/2011 5:58:02 AM PST by bluecat6 ( "A non-denial denial. They doubt our heritage, but they don't say the story is not accurate.")
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To: marstegreg
You would think the media would have stumbled on to this by now.

The media is the Democrat's propaganda troops. They will not report on corruption from their side.

33 posted on 11/30/2011 6:01:56 AM PST by DiogenesLamp (Partus sequitur Patrem)
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To: colorado tanker
The lawsuit makes no sense. A parent cannot renounce a child's U.S. citizenship.

A minor child's citizenship follows that of the custodial parent. This is similar to what happens when someone with minor children becomes a naturalized citizen in the United States: the minor children automatically become naturalized U.S. citizens.
34 posted on 11/30/2011 6:05:47 AM PST by aruanan
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To: Valpal1
Not all documents are subject to FOIA, just because somebody wants a look-see. If no compelling public interest argument is made, the judge is just going to dismiss the suit.

If the judge is a Clinton appointee, this will no doubt be true. If, on the other hand, he is a normal non-kook, non-idiot, non-corrupt judge, he will see the public interest in knowing the particulars of this most Un-American Precedent's origins.

Since a parent CANNOT renounce a child's citizenship, the premise that these documents can shed some or any kind of light is faulty and there is no compelling public interest in forcing them into public view. He's got no bait on his hook.

The parent's might not themselves be able to renounce a child's citizenship, but they can certainly put a child in such a position as to cause it to happen otherwise. A parent that takes a child to live in a foreign country till maturity may very well inadvertently cause the child to attain citizenship in that country, and subsequently through some affirmative act, lose his citizenship in this country. I have seen it suggested that swearing an oath of loyalty to another nation, or getting a passport in another nation as a citizen of that nation, could be regarded as an "affirmative act." Even if such a thing does not meet the legal requirements for losing citizenship, the public has a right to know how willing someone is to sell out their franchise in our society.

In any case, no public interest is served by keeping truthful information regarding those in positions of authority hidden from the public. Indeed, it is very much against the public interest.

It is odd that Muslims around the world do not regard Obama as an apostate, which is the normal view of Muslims who give up Islam for Christianity. Muslim's have tolerance for those who lie about their conversion, but not for those who actually convert. Knowing of blatant duplicity in our leadership is also in the public interest.

35 posted on 11/30/2011 6:19:26 AM PST by DiogenesLamp (Partus sequitur Patrem)
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To: BladeBryan
No, they don’t. George Archibald looks to be a credible challenger to Orly Taitz for who can be wrong the most.

You mean "declared wrong" by idiot judges. Legal priests in robes cannot abide blasphemers.

Third, as others have pointed out in this thread, even if Lolo Soetoro had adopted Barack Obama, and even if Obama became an Indonesian citizen under Indonesian law, Obama would still be a natural-born citizen of the Untied States.

He is not a natural born citizen because there is nothing natural about his birth. His father was foreign and in violation of his visa just to get here. (He lied on his visa application.) If he has any citizenship at all, it is based on the 14th amendment, and not on the original meaning of "natural born citizen" which pre-dates the 14th amendment, and there is some argument as to whether or not he even meets the 14th Amendment requirements of citizenship.

The Adoption issue, in my mind, has more to do with what was on his ORIGINAL birth certificate, and to demonstrate what he is showing now is a subsequently created REPLACEMENT birth certificate, such as the one *I* have. Again, Hawaii will allow the creation of a birth certificate for ANY Hawaiian citizen's children REGARDLESS of where they were born. To my mind, there is still the possibility that Barry was born in White Rock Canada, which would make him a NON-CITIZEN.

Prove he was adopted, by Indonesian Lolo Soetoro, and it may very well demonstrate that his current document MUST be a later date creation of Hawaiian DOH, therefore we still have not seen verifiable proof of his place of birth.

36 posted on 11/30/2011 6:31:21 AM PST by DiogenesLamp (Partus sequitur Patrem)
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To: DiogenesLamp
He should have narrowed his FOIA request to just documents pertaining to Obama's foreign travel after the age of 18.

The public may have a legitimate interest in knowing that a candidate traveled on a foreign passport and what countries he has visited.

But by doing an overbroad request based on a spurious premise regarding the mother's actions, he shot himself in the foot. It's an obvious fishing trip and the courts generally don't regard those as having a compelling public interest. Like I said, he's got no bait on his hook and he's gonna come up empty.

In any case, no public interest is served by keeping truthful information regarding those in positions of authority hidden from the public. Indeed, it is very much against the public interest.

The issue is not public interest, it's privacy. There is a public interest in maintaining personal privacy, even for public figures to a certain extent. That is why you must have a competing (and compelling) public interest in abrogating the privacy of individuals.

The FBI does a gazillion background investigations. There is no reason to declare FOIA open season on those files unless there is a truly compelling reason, something other than curiosity or opposition research. Those files are full of carp because they contain everything said by those interviewed including both the malignant and the simply misinformed gossip.

Never forget that legal precedents can be used by the other side against us. Where the public right to know intersects with the individual's right to privacy is an important fencepost. We shouldn't be moving it around willy nilly. "Hard cases make bad law".

37 posted on 11/30/2011 9:33:23 AM PST by Valpal1 (I have a dream... Herman Cain being sworn in by Clarence Thomas.)
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To: bluecat6

You need to show me evidence Obama was born in Kenya. On the many, many threads I’ve seen, there has never been any evidence.


38 posted on 11/30/2011 9:45:12 AM PST by colorado tanker
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To: aruanan
A minor child's citizenship follows that of the custodial parent. This is similar to what happens when someone with minor children becomes a naturalized citizen in the United States: the minor children automatically become naturalized U.S. citizens.

But it doesn't work the other way. A U.S. parent cannot renounce a child's U.S. citizenship.

39 posted on 11/30/2011 9:46:50 AM PST by colorado tanker
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To: colorado tanker

I never said he was born in Kenya (which was not an independent country on August 4, 1961).

In 1964 the divorce of Obama Sr. and Stanley Ann Dunham established BHO Sr. as the birth father - at least legally, regardless of other theories. Thus, legal father was a British Citizen since he was a citizen of the British East Africa - a British Colony. And thus, Obama II would be a British Citizen. And he claims such at the Fight The Smears website.

http://www.fightthesmears.com/articles/5/birthcertificate

“When Barack Obama Jr. was born on Aug. 4,1961, in Honolulu, Kenya was a British colony, still part of the United Kingdom’s dwindling empire. As a Kenyan native, Barack Obama Sr. was a British subject whose citizenship status was governed by The British Nationality Act of 1948. That same act governed the status of Obama Sr.‘s children.

Since Sen. Obama has neither renounced his U.S. citizenship nor sworn an oath of allegiance to Kenya, his Kenyan citizenship automatically expired on Aug. 4,1982.”

The second part of this is wrong. Obama II never surrendered his British Citizenship. He may have had rights to claim Republic of Kenya Citizenship since his father did become a Kenyan Citizen upon Kenya’s independence. But at no time did Obama II quit being a British Overseas Citizen (BOC).

As noted, one must formally renounce such status to the crown via form RN. Obama II never did. To this day he qualifies as a British Citizen.

See this link starting at page 27.

http://instruct.westvalley.edu/hannigan/Eligibility_Dialogue.pdf

“It is true that the President‘s father converted and lost his British citizenship, however, the Kenyan Constitution (KC) provisioned for minors to maintain dual citizenship. Therefore, as a minor, by virtue of Article 97 of the KC, the President would have maintained his dual or possibly multiple citizenships (Kenyan, British and US).”

...

“Therefore the President seems to hold dual citizenship with Great Briton and the United States.”

...

“The KC article 95 confirms the status of Commonwealth status to its Kenyan citizens. No Act, law or decree therefore removed Barak‘s Commonwealth Citizenship status as received when he received Kenyan Citizenship.”

So Obama II never ‘lost’ his legal British Citizenship status. And for a real life example of this scenario - just look at the situation with the former Thailand PM.

He was the leader of Thailand - and a British Citizen.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/24/abhisit-vejajjiva-thai-pr_n_827557.html

“Thailand’s prime minister has a confession to make: He is also British.

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejajjiva publicly acknowledged his dual nationality Thursday for the first time during a debate in Parliament.

Abhisit automatically holds British citizenship because he was born in Newcastle to parents from a well-to-do Bangkok family. He would have to specifically renounce it to lose it.”

He would have to specifically renounce it to lose it....How?

Here is how:

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitecontent/applicationforms/nationality/form_rn.pdf

It would appear we have subject of British Crown as Commander in Chief. Its fairly certain that is not exactly what they wanted to allow to happen in 1787 and was not supposed to happen if Article II, Section 1 is applied correctly.


40 posted on 11/30/2011 11:08:05 AM PST by bluecat6 ( "A non-denial denial. They doubt our heritage, but they don't say the story is not accurate.")
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To: bluecat6

Suppose Obama has the right to apply for a British passport. So what?


41 posted on 11/30/2011 11:21:10 AM PST by colorado tanker
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To: colorado tanker
There hasn't been any good evidence that he was born here. The most logical explanation from the bits and pieces that can be discovered of Obama's life is that he might very well have been born in White Rock Canada. (A sister city of Blaine Washington, (but with no hospital) which is where Stanly Ann's Aunt Eleanor Birkebeile lived. It was not uncommon at all to send unmarried pregnant girls off to live with a relative until AFTER a baby was born. Especially in 1961. Especially with an Interracial pregnancy. (A felony crime in many states at the time.)

Hawaii will create a birth certificate for the child of a Hawaiian citizen BORN ANYWHERE. For all we know, Stanly called momma in Hawaii from Peach Arch Hospital in White Rock Canada to let her know she had a grandson. (Whom she never told her coworkers at the bank about. Obviously she was ashamed of him.) Realizing what an Idiot her daughter was, Momma set the paperwork in motion to salvage some sort of American citizenship for her grandson.

Is any of that true? Don't know, but it fits the facts better than what they are telling us.

By the way, *I* am adopted, and *I* have a replacement birth certificate issued by the state which is full of official "facts" which are not really true. Unless a state attests that the document is an "ORIGINAL" birth certificate, it is still suspect as far as I'm concerned.

42 posted on 11/30/2011 4:36:36 PM PST by DiogenesLamp (Partus sequitur Patrem)
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To: DiogenesLamp; ethical; Hotlanta Mike; Red Steel; rxsid
By the way, *I* am adopted, and *I* have a replacement birth certificate issued by the state which is full of official "facts" which are not really true. Unless a state attests that the document is an "ORIGINAL" birth certificate, it is still suspect as far as I'm concerned.

That's very interesting.
It would be great if someone like you would contact Orly, and create an affidavit that could be used in court challenges that shows a real life example like yours, where even a certified original BC is not the person's original

THAT would strengthen the argument that in Obama's particular case, it is important for observers to verify the original vaults, original microfiche, original index records, etc...


43 posted on 12/04/2011 1:19:10 PM PST by Future Useless Eater (Chicago politics = corrupted capitalism = takeover by COMMUNity-ISM)
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To: Future Useless Eater
That's very interesting. It would be great if someone like you would contact Orly, and create an affidavit that could be used in court challenges that shows a real life example like yours, where even a certified "original" BC is not the person's "original"

THAT would strengthen the argument that in Obama's particular case, it is important for observers to verify the original vaults, original microfiche, original index records, etc...

This is exactly my line of thinking. If someone could see undeniable evidence that a "birth certificate" can easily be fabricated in accordance with ordinary policies of a State, then they will understand why it is so important to see a document which is attested to be the "original" with no qualifications or weasel clauses.

As far as giving it to Orly, I have some misgivings about that. The last thing I want is for my vital information to be made available to people who will misuse it or use it to cause me problems. I do not believe Orly would do any such thing, but I am not certain she would exercise the necessary care to prevent someone else from doing such a thing. (i.e. the people she might give copies to.)

I have often thought of posting both copies online, but I have deferred for exactly the reason mentioned above. I have posted partial pieces of them online, but I have never posted anything which Identifies me personally.

Anyways, i'm still contemplating how best this tool might be used without being misused, and at some point I fear I may just have to bite the bullet and let what will happen, happen.

44 posted on 12/05/2011 7:38:48 AM PST by DiogenesLamp (Partus sequitur Patrem)
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To: colorado tanker

The way the government officials delayed and covered up this issue and didn’t do everything in their power to quickly resolve (and still haven’t) the issue, has caused me to loose all confidence in their ability to do anything.

I don’t mind obfuscation and denials when it comes to national security, but for this to happen with domestic affairs is unforgivable.


45 posted on 12/08/2011 6:06:41 PM PST by FreeAtlanta (Coffee for your TEA party (www.dougsmugs.com))
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