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Tennessee family home burns while firefighters watch
Yahoo! News ^ | Dec. 6, 2011

Posted on 12/06/2011 4:33:24 PM PST by Free ThinkerNY

A Tennessee couple helplessly watched their home burn to the ground, along with all of their possessions, because they did not pay a $75 annual fee to the local fire department.

Vicky Bell told the NBC affiliate WPSD-TV that she called 911 when her mobile home in Obion County caught fire. Firefighters arrived on the scene but as the fire raged, they simply stood by and did nothing. "In an emergency, the first thing you think of, 'Call 9-1-1," homeowner Bell said.

However, Bell and her husband were forced to walk into the burning home in an attempt to retrieve their own belongings. "You could look out my mom's trailer and see the trucks sitting at a distance," Bell said. "We just wished we could've gotten more out."

South Fulton Mayor David Crocker defended the fire department, saying that if firefighters responded to non-subscribers, no one would have an incentive to pay the fee.

Residents in the city of South Fulton receive the service automatically, but it is not extended to those living in the greater county-wide area.

(Excerpt) Read more at news.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events; US: Tennessee
KEYWORDS: fire; seiu; tennessee; unions
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To: Free ThinkerNY

I understand the fee of $75 dollars is for the fire department to put out a fire. However, does the fee also include rescuing individuals from a burning structure (house/barn/whatever?) Would this fire department have attempted a rescue of a person if the fee had not been paid? Please someone tell me that they wouldn’t have just sat outside and watched the house burn with a family inside.


51 posted on 12/06/2011 4:52:07 PM PST by momtothree
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To: Free ThinkerNY
Many of the rural fire departments in Tennessee are VFD which receive some county assistance to offset operational cost. However in the past year some have gone under due to lack of donations from persons in the communities. When that happens the counties contract coverage with companies like Rural Metro which as SUBSCRIBER based when it comes to fire fighting.

A homeowner has four options when that happens and they are placed in a subscriber only community for coverage. Pay the subscription, pay for the cost of service {retail rate and it is very expensive} when needed, or let it burn too the ground. If there are persons inside I think they are required to attempt rescue in a practical manner by fire fighting standards. Otherwise they are not legally bound to fight a fire of a non subscriber. The last option is organize a VFD in your community.

Best solution is donate to a VFD. These guys work their tails off for free. Wrecks? They respond. Medical emergency? They respond. Someone fallen needing lifting assistance? They respond. VFD's are the best service for the price. They will fight any fire to the best of their ability.

52 posted on 12/06/2011 4:52:13 PM PST by cva66snipe (Two Choices left for U.S. One Nation Under GOD or One Nation Under Judgment? Which one say ye?)
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To: dainbramaged
$75 a year for the fire dept. sounds like a bargain - we donate four times that to our local volunteers every Christmas.

You remind me of William F. Buckley, whose pet liberal project was "mandatory volunteerism." It isn't a "donation" if you've got to pay it to get the service.

53 posted on 12/06/2011 4:52:50 PM PST by Mr Ramsbotham (Laws against sodomy are honored in the breech.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

So when did this city get involved in the insurance business? Was this even legal for a municipality to leverage insurance fees on the public? What are the real estate taxes for, to send the mayor and his cronies on vacation?


54 posted on 12/06/2011 4:53:06 PM PST by HighWheeler
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To: Huskrrrr
Did anyone check to see if the homeowners were Republicans?

If they were Republicans, they were not Conservative. "Actions (or in-actions) have consequences" is known to authentic Conservatives. Whiny liberals don't understand that concept any more than they acknowledge personal responsibility.

55 posted on 12/06/2011 4:53:20 PM PST by re_nortex (DP...that's what I like about Texas.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY
Residents in the city of South Fulton receive the service automatically, but it is not extended to those living in the greater county-wide area

I've seen this in upstate NY villages. Residents of the village pay really high taxes, but get fire/police/trash sevices. Those outside the village pay little tax, and rely on the State police for coverage, have to bring their own trash to the dump and pay a fee for fire coverage.

56 posted on 12/06/2011 4:53:20 PM PST by kidd
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To: DManA

I live near Portland Oregon, and my understanding is that during the course of building a home, there are over 100 different permits that must be applied for and paid. Of course those cost are passed on to the home buyer. So in essence more taxes for local government. I would not mind so much if government were responsible, but it is not. It is wasteful and lazy. I wonder how much of our national treasure has been pissed away.


57 posted on 12/06/2011 4:53:45 PM PST by MPJackal ("From my cold dead hands.")
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To: apoliticalone

>>The fact is the USA is going downhill and that needs reversed now.

It’s going to get worse before it gets better. Nothing gets fixed until we hit the bottom where we can’t pay entitlements anymore. Then, people start learnng that life has consequences, how to set priorities, and to take care of themselves and their families.


58 posted on 12/06/2011 4:55:52 PM PST by Bryanw92 (The solution to fix Congress: Nuke em from orbit. It's the only way to be sure!)
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To: Figment; traditional1
"Nope they’re volunteers. It’s like insurance."

Volunteer is NOTHING like insurance. Volunteers do not get paid...hence the VOLUNTEER. Insurance you pay for.

Volunteer is doing something to help another for NO compensation. Insurance is PAYING for such help.

59 posted on 12/06/2011 4:57:08 PM PST by NoGrayZone (Stay involved..because stupid people are running America! - Herman Cain - Amen!!!)
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To: re_nortex
And you think that they would have learned a less from last year, also in Obion County.

I thought that this seemed familiar. It's the same story (check the names of the players). This happened more than a year ago.

Why is Yahoo posting this as news now?

60 posted on 12/06/2011 4:57:39 PM PST by Washi
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To: Free ThinkerNY

This is sad to me as I have always considered firefighters and paramedics the real hersos in our society. They train to enter burning buildings, handle hazardous materials, and perform all kinds of dangerous duties to save our lives and properties.

When I see this type of story I can only wonder just how screwed up our govenrments are to allow this to happen.

If this is about a fee then, frankly, this is about the government acting as a for-profit corporation and is unconstitutional.


61 posted on 12/06/2011 4:58:16 PM PST by CodeToad (Islam needs to be banned in the US and treated as a criminal enterprise.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY
Sounds like a rerun of a story from last summer.

Ridiculous story, as it was then.

62 posted on 12/06/2011 4:58:55 PM PST by Tanniker Smith (I didn't know she was a liberal when I married her.)
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To: freedumb2003
...think of this more on the order of flood insurance.

You can't stop a flood, and you can't contain the flood to just your house.

They should have gotten ObamaFire. Force everyone to buy fire insurance, because people are irresponsible and can't be trusted to do the right thing, so the lazy force everyone else to pay more. < /sarc>

-PJ

63 posted on 12/06/2011 4:59:47 PM PST by Political Junkie Too (If you can vote for President, then your children can run for President.)
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To: cripplecreek
Thus further wasting funds.

Fires have a tendency to spread if not tended to. Their presence was necessary.

64 posted on 12/06/2011 5:00:15 PM PST by Tanniker Smith (I didn't know she was a liberal when I married her.)
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To: cripplecreek

Do you pay taxes for that?


65 posted on 12/06/2011 5:00:44 PM PST by NoGrayZone (Stay involved..because stupid people are running America! - Herman Cain - Amen!!!)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

No tickee . . . no washee


66 posted on 12/06/2011 5:01:13 PM PST by YHAOS (you betcha!)
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To: traditional1

Way it ought to be... Big cities like mine (*) can afford to include it in with the taxes. Those small towns most likely do not get enough revenue.

So, you no pay ‘da fee, you no get service. Way it works. This is not the same story; this is a new one.

(*) = FWIW I don’t live in Detroit proper, I live in the Southern Suburbs. So, we’re not as big as the big D. But we’re big in our own right. So, it’s tossed in with the taxes; which is like $800 in the summer and about $1300.00 in the winter. For that we get trash collection, fire and police and SUPPOSEDLY road maintenance! Although, you couldn’t tell it by our street here... 8-/


67 posted on 12/06/2011 5:01:29 PM PST by DetroitRight
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To: Free ThinkerNY

So when did this city get involved in the insurance business? Was this even legal for a municipality to leverage insurance fees on the public? What are the real estate taxes for, to send the mayor and his cronies on vacation?


68 posted on 12/06/2011 5:01:29 PM PST by HighWheeler
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To: Free ThinkerNY
none of the volunteer forces here charge you anything, not a penny...
69 posted on 12/06/2011 5:02:00 PM PST by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

“”I suppose they expect to be able to buy car insurance after they wreck their car, too?””

obozo says - “What’s wrong with that? Makes sense to me. That’s at the top of my priority list.” (As soon as I can find that list)


70 posted on 12/06/2011 5:02:05 PM PST by Thank You Rush
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To: Free ThinkerNY

So, what if one of these peoples children were trapped in the buring trailor?


71 posted on 12/06/2011 5:03:16 PM PST by Husker24
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To: Political Junkie Too

>>Force everyone to buy fire insurance, because people are irresponsible and can’t be trusted to do the right thing, so the lazy force everyone else to pay more<<

That is what they do. It is called taxation (frequently municipal).


72 posted on 12/06/2011 5:03:35 PM PST by freedumb2003 (Spoiler Alert! The secret to Terra Nova: THEY ARE ALL DEAD!!!)
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To: Bryanw92
If you’re going to let the place burn because a fee wasn’t paid, then don’t taunt the victims by showing up at their home’s destruction and watching.

They showd up to protect the property of the people that were smart enough to pay BEFORE they had a fire, if the fire spread.

73 posted on 12/06/2011 5:04:08 PM PST by verga (I am not an apologist, I just play one on television.)
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To: Mr. Jeeves
Would have been smarter to put out the fire and bill them $5,000 for the service. Somebody isn’t thinking.

I agree with you on that (maybe fiddle with the amount a bit) but I'm sure you'll get arguments on this thread.

Last time this story came up, I had someone who insisted that the chance of a fire is so low that a bill of $10,000 in the off-chance of a fire would be the chosen option over the $75 fee so no one would pay.

I wanted to insist that the dude was loopy and smoking something more than the house, but I didn't want to get flagged by the moderator.

74 posted on 12/06/2011 5:04:28 PM PST by Tanniker Smith (I didn't know she was a liberal when I married her.)
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To: MeganC

“Nope. In a lot of rural areas fire protection comes from either purely volunteer fire departments”
_____________________________________________

Yes and no....Someone has to pay for the fire truck/trucks and other equipment.
As a volunteer, I paid nothing towards the trucks.
They were obviously paid for by tax money from county and town.

I understand the point that if one person gets by without paying, no one would pay.
As for service not paid for, I think it would be easy for the fire department to file a lien on property that they save.

Watching a house burn, however, would be unconscionable for me.


75 posted on 12/06/2011 5:04:45 PM PST by AlexW
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To: CodeToad

Its a moral issue to me but I grew up in a small town where our local fire chief was an ass but he wouldn’t let your house burn down even if he had to put the fire out with a bucket brigade.


76 posted on 12/06/2011 5:04:54 PM PST by cripplecreek (Stand with courage or shut up and do as you're told.)
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To: AndrewB
They should have paid if they wanted the service.

Maybe, but on the other hand we used to have this thing called ethics...doing the right thing, even when no one is looking, much less when everyone is looking.

A neighbor in need is exactly where we should focus our attention, and if its your profession, I think its callous to stand by and watch suffering when you have the capacity, much less the duty by profession, to help.

There is a lot wrong with this story. Bad acting all around.

77 posted on 12/06/2011 5:06:06 PM PST by Magnum44 (Terrorism is a disease, precise application of superior firepower is the cure)
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To: NoGrayZone
Do you pay taxes for that?

Oh yeah but its not a whole lot. We had a local police department till a couple years ago when we just contracted with the county. I've got mixed feelings about the police thing because we're already paying as much as when we had our own cops. Plus we're in a virtually zero crime area.
78 posted on 12/06/2011 5:08:59 PM PST by cripplecreek (Stand with courage or shut up and do as you're told.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

I have heard of this before. They should have paid the 475 dollars. Was it an all volunteer fire dept? There has to be some way to support it.


79 posted on 12/06/2011 5:10:29 PM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: AlexW

Agree...see post 77


80 posted on 12/06/2011 5:10:37 PM PST by Magnum44 (Terrorism is a disease, precise application of superior firepower is the cure)
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To: cripplecreek

If you pay taxes then your fire dept. should put out your fire.

Doesn’t matter how much you pay...the fact is you pay them and the fire dept. is included.....or should be.


81 posted on 12/06/2011 5:12:25 PM PST by NoGrayZone (Stay involved..because stupid people are running America! - Herman Cain - Amen!!!)
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To: re_nortex

Wow! It rough for those folks, but this is in the same County and there was that previous incident.


82 posted on 12/06/2011 5:12:44 PM PST by Anti-Bubba182
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To: cripplecreek

That, too. That fire department doesn’t operate without any tax money from those people. They drove over the roads those people paid taxes for. They used all kinds of public funds to do their thing, yet, they had the morals of thugs to watch that happen. This isn’t the first story from that part of the planet that did that. I would laugh my ass off if the house was for the only doctor in the area and he returned the favor.


83 posted on 12/06/2011 5:12:52 PM PST by CodeToad (Islam needs to be banned in the US and treated as a criminal enterprise.)
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To: Washi
I thought that this seemed familiar. It's the same story (check the names of the players). This happened more than a year ago.

This year and last year.

84 posted on 12/06/2011 5:12:52 PM PST by re_nortex (DP...that's what I like about Texas.)
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To: re_nortex

Wow! It rough for those folks, but this is in the same County and there was that previous incident.


85 posted on 12/06/2011 5:13:01 PM PST by Anti-Bubba182
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To: Mr. Jeeves

Why would they pay after the FD put the fire out if they didn’t want to pay before there was a fire?


86 posted on 12/06/2011 5:14:25 PM PST by SuzyQue
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To: Free ThinkerNY

This is one of those situations where it’s hard to justify not simply requiring that the fee be paid as part of the property taxes. But I guess that’s the law.


87 posted on 12/06/2011 5:15:47 PM PST by Brilliant
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To: Mr. Jeeves
Would have been smarter to put out the fire and bill them $5,000 for the service. Somebody isn’t thinking.

And if they don't have the five thousand bucks, they have to be, like, indentured servants until they pay it off.
88 posted on 12/06/2011 5:16:09 PM PST by Krankor (I think it's time we stop, children, what's that sound. Everybody look what's going down)
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To: Pontiac
I am guessing that they would perform life saving service if required

Oh, sure. Remember, no pay, no service. Better to make an example of them. If someone dies, it's even a stronger message.

89 posted on 12/06/2011 5:17:57 PM PST by paul51 (11 September 2001 - Never forget)
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To: AlexW

I just can not imagine watching a home burn and not doing anything to save it.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

What if you were to be fired if you acted? Or lose your accreditation? What if your fire department would lose its liability insurance if you acted?


90 posted on 12/06/2011 5:18:29 PM PST by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS! This means liberals AND libertarians (same thing) NO LIBS!)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

The idea that a group of people would call themselves “firefighters” and then refuse to put out a house fire just doesn’t sit well with me. I mean, not a one of them said, “we can’t just sit here and watch a house burn down”?


91 posted on 12/06/2011 5:19:25 PM PST by sand lake bar (You have not converted a man because you have silenced him.)
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To: Anti-Bubba182
Wow! It rough for those folks, but this is in the same County and there was that previous incident.

And that's the point I was making. Since this occurred last September nearby, that should have made it more than abundantly clear that the fire department had a policy that was enforced without compromise. It was well publicized and I can't comprehend how anyone wouldn't have taken away a lesson from the prior incident.

92 posted on 12/06/2011 5:19:25 PM PST by re_nortex (DP...that's what I like about Texas.)
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To: AndrewB; MeganC
They should have paid if they wanted the service. No sympathy from me. If they don’t want to pay for the service then they should not receive it. Period.

That's right, you no pay, we all stand by in our fire trucks, and watch your home and all your possessions burn to the ground...

It's the American way...

It's what keeps us united, Americans watching out for each others...But no money? Screw you all!

Merry Christmas everyone in Tennessee!

93 posted on 12/06/2011 5:20:01 PM PST by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit))
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To: Mr. Jeeves
Would have been smarter to put out the fire and bill them $5,000 for the service. Somebody isn’t thinking.

Which would have been challenged in court as extortion.

94 posted on 12/06/2011 5:21:50 PM PST by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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To: momtothree
Please someone tell me that they wouldn’t have just sat outside and watched the house burn with a family inside.

It's an extra twenty bucks if they have to carry someone. Cash only up front please.

95 posted on 12/06/2011 5:22:03 PM PST by paul51 (11 September 2001 - Never forget)
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To: SuzyQue

“Why would they pay after the FD put the fire out if they didn’t want to pay before there was a fire?”
_________________________________________

As in my previous post...They would pay as soon as a lien
is put on their property.
The lien would cover the period that they occupied the house.

Fire protection should be part of your property taxes.
If rented, it should be part of your rental.


96 posted on 12/06/2011 5:22:56 PM PST by AlexW
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To: Brilliant
This is one of those situations where it’s hard to justify not simply requiring that the fee be paid as part of the property taxes. But I guess that’s the law.

I am generally libertarian in my philosophy, but this is one instance where compulsory taxation makes more sense. But if the County is going to have this stupid system, they have to enforce it, or else no one will pay, which would be the worst of both worlds.

97 posted on 12/06/2011 5:25:18 PM PST by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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To: re_nortex
That's right, and if ya don't happen to have the cash, we'll sit around and watch your stinking home burn to the ground.

Merry Christmas America!

98 posted on 12/06/2011 5:26:33 PM PST by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit))
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To: paul51
If someone dies, it's even a stronger message.

Except if you let some one die when you could have saved them you leave yourself and your department open for wrongful death lawsuits.

99 posted on 12/06/2011 5:28:15 PM PST by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: CodeToad

When I see this type of story I can only wonder just how screwed up our govenrments are to allow this to happen.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`

Not about government at all. In fact - quite the opposite. We have CITIZENS deciding that NO. They don’t want government interference (fire department) being involved in their lives. This is a Libertarian wet dream.

These people have decided that they will handle fire protection on a private level basis.

They knew going in that they did not have big gubmint protecting their home. They knew they only need pay $75.00 to get fire protection. But they were stupid.

So. Maybe they need the gubmint to intervene in their stupid lives?


100 posted on 12/06/2011 5:28:38 PM PST by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS! This means liberals AND libertarians (same thing) NO LIBS!)
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