Gingrich: "Palestinians" an "invented people"

Jihadwatch / AGI ^ | 9th Dec, 2011 | AGI

[yank in the UK]

Gingrich is right in this. PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein said this in 1977: The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "Palestinian people" to oppose Zionism.

[Jewbacca]

The “palestinians” are largely immigrants from Syria, Jordan, and Eqypt.

What-is-now Israel was largely empty for a good 1000 years until the mid-1800s when Jews returned from the surrouding area (purchasing lands from the Turks) and Jewish people from Russia fled the various pogroms.

The exception to this was Jerusalem, which was a mixed town of about 50% Jews, 30-40% Christian arabs, and the rest Druse or arab muslims.

The al-asqa mosque on the Temple mount was pretty much a deserted ruin -— the legend that it was a “holy place” where Mohammed landed being a fairly recent myth for pure Western consumption -— it was BUILT AFTER HE WAS DEAD.

Anyway, “East Jerusalem” became “Arab East Jerusalem” in the early 1900s when German-equiped Jodanian troops commited ethnic-cleansing and kicked the Jewish people out of their homes where they (their families) had been living for 2000+ years.

Regarding the rest of the arab populations, they were basically lower-class arabs who came to Golan and other Jewish areas to get work -— the Jewish returnees in the 1800s were building and needed labor.

100 years later, those arabs claim to be the natives, despite all truth and easy disproving of their claims.

(Same things is happening in Europe, BTW, so your kids will have fun with that.)

[Jewbacca]

“the Islamic mind looks down on women, Jews and Christians and considers themselves the rightful rulers of mankind.”

This is correct. When Jewish people were returning to Israel as-part-of-an-Islamic-run area, immigration and land sales were encouraged.

When the Jewish people shucked off the yoke of the muslims by declaring independence, war was declared.

There was no “stolen land” or any of the B.S. they whine about today.

All that happened was Dhiminnis refused to bow to their “muslim masters,” and this act of rebellion shook the very basis of muslim theology, showing to be false.

[Ditto]

When did the early settlers begin calling themselves “Americans?”

In the early 18th century. But the time of the French and Indian war (1750s), Americans were considered a distinct culture regardless of the origin of their European ancestors.

[MeganC]

You’re using the Western metaphorical interpretation of ‘nation’ to mean something that has to do with arbitrary lines drawn upon a map. I’m using the classical interpretation of ‘nation’ which refers to a people regardless of where they are on a map. When Israel was exiled to Babylon and to Egypt they were still a nation even though they were landless. The same with Native American tribes that are landless or which are no longer on their ancestral lands. Having some survey lines does not make a nation. A people with a collective identity makes a nation.

Which is part of why I worry about the future of America and that’s because we are becoming a place on the map without a collective identity amongst our people.

[kearnyirish2]

I’ve read Tom Friedman, and he doesn’t dismiss the number of Arabs that had been living in the area for centuries. Even in the Old Testament, there are other people already living there.

As far as Europe’s situation, in 100 years they WILL be natives there (and Europe will have to deal with that).

[Jewbacca]

"I’ve read Tom Friedman, and he doesn’t dismiss the number of Arabs that had been living in the area for centuries.

Picture above is the founding of Tel Aviv. Look populated?

Go read Mark Twain's "Innocents Abroad." Aside from being funny, it's a serious travelouge. He explores what-is-now-Israel from top to bottom. With the exception of Jerusalem (which was held down by Orthodox Jewish folk and various Christian monks), it was essentially empty.

Or, you can go find the old Ottoman Empire census of the area. The arab occupants with in the "couple thousand" range, and were primarily bedouins. (Bedoins not being "palestinians" -- and peaceful with Israel.)

"Even in the Old Testament, there are other people already living there."

So? There is no meaingful connection between the Cannanites (who were wiped out) and the Philistines (who were basically Greeks) and the current arab occupiers of Judea and Samaria. Further, the scientists tell us Israel was markedly wetter and greener then, but turned into a true desert during the last 1500 years --- the result of which being depopulation.

[TheThirdRuffian]

“As far as Europe’s situation, in 100 years they WILL be natives there (and Europe will have to deal with that).”

Interesting that Europeans would treat muslims as natice, but historically have always treated Jews as non-natives, even though they were there for thousands of years.

Europe deserves what it gets.

(And no, I am not Jewish.)

[kearnyirish2]

Europe’s treatment of Jews varies from country to country & century to century; some countries have been very accomodating when others wouldn’t. It is impossible to generalize like that; if Europe had been so terrible to them then the Nazis would have had to travel outside of Europe to find them.