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Drone Crash in Iran Reveals Secret U.S. Surveillance Effort
The New York Times ^ | December 7, 2011 | Scott Shane and David E. Sanger

Posted on 12/11/2011 12:00:01 AM PST by 2ndDivisionVet

The stealth C.I.A. drone that crashed deep inside Iranian territory last week was part of a stepped-up surveillance program that has frequently sent the United States’ most hard-to-detect drone into the country to map suspected nuclear sites, according to foreign officials and American experts who have been briefed on the effort.

Until this week, the high-altitude flights from bases in Afghanistan were among the most secret of many intelligence-collection efforts against Iran, and American officials refuse to discuss it. But the crash of the vehicle, which Iranian officials said occurred more than 140 miles from the border with Afghanistan, blew the program’s cover.

The overflights by the bat-winged RQ-170 Sentinel, built by Lockheed Martin and first glimpsed on an airfield in Kandahar, Afghanistan, in 2009, are part of an increasingly aggressive intelligence collection program aimed at Iran, current and former officials say. The urgency of the effort has been underscored by a recent public debate in Israel about whether time is running out for a military strike to slow Iran’s progress toward a nuclear weapon.....

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: iran; obama; osama; pakistan
Why wasn't it destroyed or recovered?
1 posted on 12/11/2011 12:00:07 AM PST by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

What “crash”? Images from Iran showed an intact vehicle.


2 posted on 12/11/2011 12:05:41 AM PST by Roccus (POLITICIAN...............a four letter word spelled with ten letters.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

.........drone that crashed deep inside Iranian territory .......

Deep? I thought that it was near the Afgan border.

I seriously don’t understand why a drone does not have a “black box” like all airliners have, that includes a GPS transponder, and a few pounds of plastic explosive to blow the drone to hell when nesessary!


3 posted on 12/11/2011 12:14:59 AM PST by Noob1999 (Loose Lips, Sink Ships)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Zero gave the order that it not be recovered or destroyed.

His gift to the Chinese.


4 posted on 12/11/2011 12:14:59 AM PST by Reddy (B.O. stinks)
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To: Roccus

They are trying to spin it. The web is faster than their spin.


5 posted on 12/11/2011 12:15:42 AM PST by jonrick46 (2012 can't come soon enough.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
To "crash" and look like this

Photobucket

it must be made of indestructium.

6 posted on 12/11/2011 12:21:26 AM PST by Roccus (POLITICIAN...............a four letter word spelled with ten letters.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I can’t wait to see what the media does with this.

How much more can they stretch their credibility further.


7 posted on 12/11/2011 12:25:31 AM PST by Jonty30 (If a person won't learn under the best of times, then he must learn under the worst of times.)
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To: Roccus; 2ndDivisionVet
What “crash”? Images from Iran showed an intact vehicle.

Was that one the one that supposedly "flew" into Iran and was shot down on that mission? Is it possible that is another one someone conveniently had "flown" to Iran to expose our technology? Whole and undamaged?

So one is shot down < /not >, but did that even matter? Was the shoot down a cover story to cover up another perfect transfer of our U.A.V. technology (a whole undamaged U.A.V.?)

Maybe the whole thing was a plan from the beginning to get that technology into our enemies hands.

Didn't O just come back from a trip and talk with the Chinese? Was trade all he really talked about? The gang in D.C. is not to be trusted at all. Got to wonder who really made out on this deal.

So O got his campaign contributions from both China and Iran? Just in time to fund (along with the "stimulus kick backs") O's presidential election campaign for 2012!

$ux to be U.S. with O in office, huh?
8 posted on 12/11/2011 12:35:04 AM PST by JSteff ((((It was ALL about SCOTUS. Most forget about that and HAVE DOOMED us for a generation or more.))))
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To: Noob1999

“Why a drone does not have a “black box” like all airliners have, that includes a GPS transponder, and a few pounds of plastic explosive..”

Okay - now I’m REALLY not going flying again! ;)


9 posted on 12/11/2011 12:36:48 AM PST by 21twelve
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To: 21twelve

Remember Madam Notsobright? “We should not be the only superpower.” There’s your answer. Commies think the same. The Commiecrats still control the Government with help from our enempt Pubies. Time to clean house of the voted for life Congresscritters. Santorum and Bachman are the clearest choices. Both did well in the bebates IMOP!


10 posted on 12/11/2011 12:46:19 AM PST by DISCO
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Some think it was hacked. I can't imagine that being the case. Something this sophisticated would certainly use encrypted protocols for control. It's not autonomous. Someone was driving it.

Maybe landing was the reaction to a loss of control from jamming or something broken on the bird.

We should have blasted it.

11 posted on 12/11/2011 12:50:30 AM PST by Glenn (iamtheresistance.org)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I think all our spy drones over Iran should be equiped with tactical nuclear self destruct devices that go off if the plane stops flying.

They should also be kept over Iran’s nuke sites 24/7.


12 posted on 12/11/2011 1:00:19 AM PST by Hugin ("Most time a man'll tell you his bad intentions if you listen and let yourself hear"--Open Range)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Why wasn't it destroyed or recovered?

Why would it break it's sat controlled tether and auto land over target?

It's range isn't the question, it's controllers are.
13 posted on 12/11/2011 1:21:29 AM PST by BIGLOOK (Keelhaul Congress!)
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To: BIGLOOK

I am waiting breathlessly for the most important response from the White House to explain why we are the most inept military since 2008 .


14 posted on 12/11/2011 1:25:19 AM PST by juma (What i s the real answer ? Does anyone Know ?)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Another example of Obama’s cowardice and treason.


15 posted on 12/11/2011 1:27:26 AM PST by MadMax, the Grinning Reaper
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To: BIGLOOK

Sucks to be the airman that was flying that drone.

He’s likely going to be hung out to dry.


16 posted on 12/11/2011 1:28:23 AM PST by Jonty30 (If a person won't learn under the best of times, then he must learn under the worst of times.)
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Comment #17 Removed by Moderator

To: mylife

I don’t believe it was a mistake. I assume the procedure, if it turns out that the drone cannot get back to base is to drive it in the ground to remove its operational capability.

Not land it gently.

I’d like to know if any of Obama’s appointees was in position to either fly it or give an order to fly it and land it.


18 posted on 12/11/2011 1:36:42 AM PST by Jonty30 (If a person won't learn under the best of times, then he must learn under the worst of times.)
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The 3rd option is that we have a traitor in the white house and that he has a band of complicate bastards throughout government.


19 posted on 12/11/2011 1:37:15 AM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: Jonty30

Its a head scratcher.


20 posted on 12/11/2011 1:38:22 AM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: juma; Jonty30

Don’t hold your breath long......and if someone gets hung out to dry, it won’t be the one truly responsible for this fiasco.


21 posted on 12/11/2011 1:39:04 AM PST by BIGLOOK (Keelhaul Congress!)
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To: BIGLOOK

I think you’re right.

But they just can’t say “oopsie” either on a ten million dollar drone. You may as well have forgotten the keys to a tank, while running in for some milk or had a rocket launcher stolen off your back porch.

Somebody is going to pay, if only to provide cover.


22 posted on 12/11/2011 1:43:56 AM PST by Jonty30 (If a person won't learn under the best of times, then he must learn under the worst of times.)
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To: BIGLOOK

Here is something that bugs the crap out of me,

Why is Obama talking smack with Iran as he withdraws our presence in Iraq?

We wont have a soul there by this end of this month.

Something stinks


23 posted on 12/11/2011 1:45:35 AM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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Why didnt Obama have shit to say about Iran during the Arab spring?

Same with syria


24 posted on 12/11/2011 1:48:21 AM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: mylife
Good point, My. Consider all that's happened in Libya, Egypt, the rest of N. Africa and now in Syria (certainly no friend either) and consider the prospect of a civil war breaking out in Iraq soon as we leave.

This next year will try all our souls.
25 posted on 12/11/2011 2:00:49 AM PST by BIGLOOK (Keelhaul Congress!)
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To: mylife

The thing that stinks is the Muslim in the White House.


26 posted on 12/11/2011 2:07:33 AM PST by SaraJohnson
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To: JSteff

Bambi is a traitor. He gave away our precious National secrets to our mortal enemies. He must be brought to justice. Soon.


27 posted on 12/11/2011 2:30:47 AM PST by Blado (2008: Year Zero of the Zombie Apocalypse.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

http://www.conunderground.com/breaking-we-were-right-obama-gave-iran-the-drone/


28 posted on 12/11/2011 2:56:40 AM PST by EverOnward
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

What?
That’s the UFO I saw last summer!!!

/sarc


29 posted on 12/11/2011 3:19:32 AM PST by vanilla swirl (We are the Patrick Henry we have been waiting for!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet; Allegra; big'ol_freeper; Lil'freeper; TrueKnightGalahad; blackie; ...
Re: Why wasn't it destroyed or recovered?

First, let me say I am so... thankful for Fox News--

Then they go and show their typical bonehead journalist without a clue card... by posting videos of this...

This...

And this... on their initial story on the RQ-170 incident.

And idiot with thumbs can Google "RQ-170" and get images of it such as this one... from Wikipedia

Yet Fox shows... Boeing's X45-C and... AeroVironment's Global Observer very unstealthy unmanned drone!

Gadzooks, is there anyone... at Fox News with any military knowledge or simple common sense?

Now, on the videos from Iran I've circled in red the apparent 'welds' here... and here... where they took off and reattached the wings.

So the Obamanation has certainly allowed his raghead buddies a good, long look at one of our most secret military aircraft!

Bendy? I... have a question--

What is it... honey?

What are those two huge bumps... on the top of the wings?

Hummmm-- I'll tell ya... tonight at bedtime.

30 posted on 12/11/2011 3:35:20 AM PST by Bender2 ("I've got a twisted sense of humor, and everything amuses me." RAH Beyond this Horizon)
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To: vanilla swirl

Looking at the photograph with the two men standing in front of the “supposed” drone, don’t you think it’s strange that the area beneath the drone is blocked from view? Why would they want to keep you from seeing the underside or landing gear? Strange.........

Is that a “real” drone or perhaps a model copy?


31 posted on 12/11/2011 3:42:58 AM PST by DaveA37
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Wonder why they risked a drone when a satllite could see the same thing?,or are they looking at something else??.


32 posted on 12/11/2011 3:53:03 AM PST by Vaduz
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To: Vaduz
Wonder why they risked a drone when a satllite could see the same thing?,or are they looking at something else??.

Satellites can't take air samples to check for radiation, for one. Nor do they deliver a hellfire missile to a target.

Satellites in low orbit pass overhead rather rapidly. Drones loiter, and grab excellent photos, even in, shall we say, non-visible spectra. Satellites in high orbit may be stationary over a target, true, but the extra distance in that high orbit negates much of that optical resolution. Better to have a low-flying drone.

Sauron

33 posted on 12/11/2011 4:02:50 AM PST by sauron ("Truth is hate to those who hate Truth" --unknown)
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To: sauron

Better to have a low-flying drone may be true but is the risk worth it?.Can they use the tech to find a way to down one?.


34 posted on 12/11/2011 4:15:07 AM PST by Vaduz
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To: Progov

“Looking at the photograph with the two men standing in front of the “supposed” drone, don’t you think it’s strange that the area beneath the drone is blocked from view? Why would they want to keep you from seeing the underside or landing gear? Strange.........

Is that a “real” drone or perhaps a model copy?”

If it truly “crash-landed” then the underside would be damaged. But then, why would they want to hide damage? Unless there is no damage and it had a soft controlled landing. Early in the article it mentions that it is a high altitude drone. If it was high altitude then it couldn’t be “seen” with the naked eye to be taken down by an AK47. It sure looks anti-radar-stealth capable so it probably didn’t show up on radar and taken down by a SAM.

You do bring up an interesting possibility; it’s only a model! Why would we acknowledge it as our lost drone when we know it to be fake?
Did Obama actually give the order not to self-destruct? Or is this just a huge misdirection story?

I’m beginning to feel that we’ve been had. Gloriously deceived in every way.
We are living in Alice in Wonderland. Nothing is as it is portrayed.


35 posted on 12/11/2011 4:20:56 AM PST by vanilla swirl (We are the Patrick Henry we have been waiting for!)
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To: Noob1999
I seriously don’t understand why a drone does not have a “black box” like all airliners have, that includes a GPS transponder, and a few pounds of plastic explosive to blow the drone to hell when nesessary!

Since intitial reports said they lost contact with the drone, I would assume that the Iranis were able to jam signals and that may have prevented a "push button" remote destruction. In the past, it would probably have had an auto self-destruct, but with the idiots we have in power today, it may have been nixed due to the possibility of debris falling on "innocent women and children" or the possibiity of it being near someone.

The fact that it landed intact really bothers me. I don't know if it has on-board autocontrols that could find a place to land and execute the landing - that opens the door for one of two things:
1. The pilot had control and landed it.
2. The Iranis had data to be able to control it.

The whole thing stinks like a dumpster behind the fishmarket on a 95 degree day.

36 posted on 12/11/2011 4:41:23 AM PST by trebb ("If a man will not work, he should not eat" From 2 Thes 3)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Iran has been under surveillance for years - by Israel and the US.
37 posted on 12/11/2011 5:41:51 AM PST by elpadre (AfganistaMr Obama said the goal was to "disrupt, dismantle and defeat al-Qaeda" and its allies.)
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To: Progov
don’t you think it’s strange that the area beneath the drone is blocked from view? Why would they want to keep you from seeing the underside or landing gear? Strange.........

If you look at pictures of other RQ-170s, you'll see a large optics package on the underside, right behind the nose gear.

My belief is that the truly "sensitive" technologies of the -170 are there, and were either destroyed in the "soft" landing, or by a small self-destruct pyrotechnics package. The Iranians clearly don't want to us to see that area, and therefore what they really got from the aircraft. If there weren't damage, they'd surely be showing that area.

People should keep in mind that the airframe-based stealth technologies seen in the -170 look pretty dated, if not non-existent (like the complete lack of faceting on gear and panel doors). Composite airframe components (assuming that's what the -170 is made of. It could be made of laminated wood for all we know) are nothing new - the Iranians could get that from Russia and China. Neither is RAM - the Iranians could get samples from the Serbs from that F-117 that was shot down.
38 posted on 12/11/2011 5:59:14 AM PST by tanknetter
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To: 2ndDivisionVet; Noob1999
Why wasn't it destroyed or recovered?

I seriously don’t understand why a drone does not have a “black box” like all airliners have, that includes a GPS transponder, and a few pounds of plastic explosive to blow the drone to hell when nesessary!

Everyone has been asking these same questions since the incident but - what if it wasnt accidental? What if we created a mock up and intentionally let the Iranian's get this thing and download some virus filled software onto their computers when they captured it?

I'd like to think this is true but I also remember reading somewhere that this software is very easy to hack in order to take control of one. I think the article even mentioned the Iranians who were doing the hacking.

But - it's also possible Barack OAllah's stealth government allowed this to be captured by the Iranian's - his track record with dealing with the Mad Mullah's is a very poor one, and for a reason.

39 posted on 12/11/2011 6:08:10 AM PST by capydick (''Life's tough.......it's even tougher if you're stupid.'')
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

My fiancee’ read an unsubstantiated report that it was taken down by an EMP which is why it looks so good. He also read that its possible the CIA is running a little covert operation and the drone is a fake. Who knows?


40 posted on 12/11/2011 6:58:30 AM PST by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: Roccus; CodeToad

Must have just glided sedately down, and found some flat terrain.

Even out of fuel, its brain, as they say, “wants to live,” so it will maintain level flight control until it meets the ground.

Better its final command should be, “Blow myself into a million bits” while on missions over hostile terrain.


41 posted on 12/11/2011 7:13:13 AM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Dennis M. Gormley, a missile and drone expert at the University of Pittsburgh, said reverse-engineering the aircraft itself would be difficult even for a sophisticated military. “Unless somebody put the engineering drawings in the U.A.V.,” he said, using the abbreviation for unmanned aerial vehicle, “it won’t be easy. In any complex piece of aviation equipment, you have to replicate the tolerances precisely.”

Somebody put the engineering drawings in the U.A.V.? Not likely. But with all the politically-correct crap goin' on out ther' HB1s are probably swarming all over our black programs nowadays -- as Obama apologizes for America racist past, no doubt.

.. or something like this from the Clinton past, a letter published by the Nytimese themselves describes it: "Another example of disregard for the security of our nuclear-weapons information was the elimination of color-coded access-control badges at Energy Department nuclear laboratories, beginning in 1994. Badge color, visible across a large room, displayed one's security status -- badges enabled personnel to readily discern whether there was anyone within hearing range who should be excluded from hearing classified information." Spilling Our Nuclear Secrets.

Or this more reliable source for news here

Back then the Asian Victims of America (AVOA) industry flooded our print and electronic news with howls about yet another victim of this awful country. That victim was Wen Ho Lee who was quickly exonerated -- though Clinton Attorney General Reno expressed concerns and Lee agreed to help find those tapes he made in exchange for being let go. He never did more than send FBI agents on one wild-goose chase after another. I believe. If you read the linked FR article you'll discover that Lee fooled the FBI as a kind of hobby, I suppose. D'oh!

42 posted on 12/11/2011 7:34:11 AM PST by WilliamofCarmichael (If modern America's Man on Horseback is out there, Get on the damn horse already!)
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To: Noob1999
I seriously don’t understand why a drone does not have a “black box” like all airliners have, that includes a GPS transponder, and a few pounds of plastic explosive to blow the drone to hell when nesessary!

They do. Something or someone failed.

43 posted on 12/11/2011 7:36:35 AM PST by CAluvdubya
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To: Roccus

Did they put it in a burka?


44 posted on 12/11/2011 7:36:35 AM PST by Yardstick
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To: Roccus

Did they put it in a burkha?


45 posted on 12/11/2011 7:36:58 AM PST by Yardstick
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To: Progov

It is a bad copy, very bad copy. Nobody has yet pointed out the BBQ grill on the air inlet that does not show on the Kandahar picture in addition to the very crappy leading edge of the wing and front body. The wing junction is not symmetrical. The opening for the air inlet is not correct either. I could make a far better copy out of Styrofoam from the one picture.

Something very screwy about the whole story


46 posted on 12/11/2011 7:39:20 AM PST by mazda77 (and I am a Native Texan)
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To: WilliamofCarmichael
Dennis M. Gormley, a missile and drone expert at the University of Pittsburgh, said reverse-engineering the aircraft itself would be difficult even for a sophisticated military. “Unless somebody put the engineering drawings in the U.A.V.,” he said, using the abbreviation for unmanned aerial vehicle, “it won’t be easy. In any complex piece of aviation equipment, you have to replicate the tolerances precisely.”

I say bullcrap on that assertion by the missile "expert" as the availability to reverse anything is easily obtained. Here is a company I use to do just that. To a tolerance of less than three thousandths of an inch.

47 posted on 12/11/2011 7:50:05 AM PST by mazda77 (and I am a Native Texan)
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To: mylife

FDR, who was George Washington compared to this guy, was surrounded by communist sympathizers, including his second vice president and wife.


48 posted on 12/11/2011 11:11:13 AM PST by 2ndDivisionVet (You can't invade the US. There'd be a rifle behind every blade of grass.~Admiral Yamamoto)
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