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Elliott Abrams Caught Misleading on Newt
http://spectator.org/blog/2012/01/27/elliott-abrams-caught-misleadi ^ | 1-27-2012 | Jeffrey Lord

Posted on 01/27/2012 9:38:08 AM PST by sheikdetailfeather

As Ronald Reagan used to say: Well.

Yesterday we took note of former Reagan State Department official Elliott Abrams' piece over at NRO that went after Newt Gingrich on his relationship with Reagan. While voting regularly with Reagan as a young congressman from Georgia, Gingrich, claimed Abrams, "often spewed insulting rhetoric at Reagan, his top aides and his policies to defeat Communism." Abrams then goes on to cite " a famous floor statement Gingrich made on March 21, 1986."

Or sort of cites it.

In fact, I'm sorry to say, what appears to be going on here is that Elliott Abrams, a considerably admirable public servant and a very smart guy, has been swept up in the GOP Establishment's Romney frothings over the rise of Newt Gingrich in the Republican primaries. He is even being accused of trolling for a job in a Romney administration. No way!!!! Really????

(Excerpt) Read more at spectator.org ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: abrams; elliott; elliottabrams; establishmentlying; misleading; newt; newtgingrich; ronaldreagan; rush; rushlimbaugh
Limbaugh just said Abrams must have been spoon fed a lot of the incorrect garbage by the Romney campaign!
1 posted on 01/27/2012 9:38:10 AM PST by sheikdetailfeather
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To: sheikdetailfeather

“Elliott Abrams Caught Misleading on Newt”

Why don’t people ever say “lying” anymore? Is Calling someone a liar MORE offensive than the lie itself?

Elliot Abrams, you sir are a damned liar!


2 posted on 01/27/2012 9:40:47 AM PST by Grunthor (I don't vote for Democrats, this includes Mitt Romney.)
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To: sheikdetailfeather; Jim Robinson

BTTT!


3 posted on 01/27/2012 9:41:20 AM PST by KansasGirl (Romney to Santorum: Obamneycare "nothing to get angry about")
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To: Grunthor
Elliot Abrams, you sir are a damned liar!

This bears repeating.


4 posted on 01/27/2012 9:43:10 AM PST by Cinnamontea
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To: sheikdetailfeather

Rush is saying he “thinks” Abrams was spoon-fed. He doesn’t know. I think the little creep out and out lied. I think they have all openly lied and now they’ve been exposed. Our “betters” are certainly a stupid, immoral bunch.


5 posted on 01/27/2012 9:43:34 AM PST by miss marmelstein
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To: KansasGirl

The American Spectator site is DELUGED RIGHT NOW AFTER LIMBAUGH CAME ON THE AIR MENTIONING IT. It took me several mins. to get this article to come online. WHOOHOO!!!!!! GO NEWT!


6 posted on 01/27/2012 9:43:48 AM PST by sheikdetailfeather (It's a Newtiful Day today!)
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To: Admin Moderator

Can we put this in breaking news? We need to refute these lies!


7 posted on 01/27/2012 9:45:43 AM PST by KansasGirl (Romney to Santorum: Obamneycare "nothing to get angry about")
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To: sheikdetailfeather

Go here....Google cache.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://spectator.org/blog/2012/01/27/elliott-abrams-caught-misleadi


8 posted on 01/27/2012 9:47:32 AM PST by COUNTrecount (Barry...above his poi grade.)
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To: sheikdetailfeather
He is even being accused of trolling for a job in a Romney administration.

Considering the number of lies circulating about Newt from the so-called Republican establishment, you would think they were trolling for jobs in a second Obama administration.

Image and video hosting by TinyPic

9 posted on 01/27/2012 9:50:02 AM PST by newheart (What this country needs is a good dose of bran. Attack Muffins Unite!)
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To: sheikdetailfeather
Abrams has a recent article "striking back" at those who dare to criticize the Arab spring:

But we are where we are, so the next question is whether the Arab Spring will actually fulfill its promise of greater democratic rights or whether it will simply usher in an era of extremist Islamist regimes or new forms of authoritarianism. The pessimists might yet be proved right -- any comparison of the Arab lands to Eastern Europe suggests that many positive elements are missing, not least the magnet and model of the European Union.

The article's dated January 23, 2012.


10 posted on 01/27/2012 9:50:57 AM PST by maryz
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To: sheikdetailfeather

Is this the sort of thing that Mittens’ Mormon faith permits him to do? I thought that Mormonism is all peace and love whereas the experience I am getting is in-the-gutter vitriol and lies. Is this why initially, it was ‘Anyone But Mitt’. Inquiring Minds want to know why the sudden pivot to ‘We Love Mitt - anyone But Newt’. It was too sudden and too complete not to be an orchestrated effort. I smell a conspiracy.


11 posted on 01/27/2012 9:55:36 AM PST by I am Richard Brandon
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To: sheikdetailfeather; Sidebar Moderator

Why is this story not showing up in my sidebar at all? This is important!


12 posted on 01/27/2012 9:56:13 AM PST by KansasGirl (Romney to Santorum: Obamneycare "nothing to get angry about")
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To: sheikdetailfeather

Bleepin’ Rush. Yesterday he kept repeating, “,this man is above repraxh, blah blah, blah.” I started counting my spoons. It was so obvious that he was setting something up. Now he’s trying to walk it back. Too late Rush. Next time question the people feeding you this crap.


13 posted on 01/27/2012 9:56:34 AM PST by St_Thomas_Aquinas
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To: maryz

That quote is the best part but it gets much worse.
Look, Gaza was a failure. Egypt is a failure. Abrams is a failure.


14 posted on 01/27/2012 9:58:57 AM PST by ari-freedom (If SOPA/PIPA passes, we will lose our Free Republic.)
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To: sheikdetailfeather

I can’t believe this. How can someone who everyone says is honest lie like this. It’s disgusting. If Willard is the nominee, I’m done with the GOP until they get back to Reagan’s roots.


15 posted on 01/27/2012 10:11:51 AM PST by libertarian neocon
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To: sheikdetailfeather

This whole episode has literally made me sick at my stomach. It is like a bad conspiracy movie about rigging elections, doing anything to get elected. AND IT IS COMING FROM OUR SIDE!!! THIS JUST EXPOSES THEM ALL TO WHAT THEY REALLY ARE AND I WILL NEVER PULL THE LEVER FOR MITT ROMNEY!

(and yes, I am yelling:))


16 posted on 01/27/2012 10:18:05 AM PST by georgiagirl_pam (Step One: SECURE YOUR DOOR! (it will give you time to get your gun!) mysafedoor.com)
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To: miss marmelstein

Elliot Abrams? The impeccable one? The one who almost went to jail? Oh my, how the mighty are fallen! I wonder who put the bee in Rush’s bonnet.


17 posted on 01/27/2012 10:18:31 AM PST by Lady Lucky (A tea party in name only is worse than no tea party at all.)
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To: sheikdetailfeather
"Specifically, Abrams implies...Not only not so, it was quite to the contrary. Of President Reagan, Gingrich says:

• "Let me be clear: I have the greatest respect for President Reagan. I think he personally understands the threat of communism." Gingrich then goes on -- at Newtonian length -- praising Reagan for Reagan's understanding of Lenin, Reagan's understanding of the real "purposes of a Soviet dictatorship" and much more. He lists and applauds Reagan repeatedly for the President's appreciation of "the threat in a more powerful Soviet empire" and the threats posed by Communist Cuba and Nicaragua. He ranks Reagan with the great cold war presidents in protecting freedom."



The Establishment have to resort to lies to win FL.

18 posted on 01/27/2012 10:21:00 AM PST by Red Steel
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To: georgiagirl_pam

I agree with you. It is just fine to shout. We cannot afford to be complacent right now and passion is a good thing. Those who are lieing to us will lose their power and reputations soon enough!


19 posted on 01/27/2012 10:25:19 AM PST by sheikdetailfeather (It's a Newtiful Day today!)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas
Bleepin’ Rush. Yesterday he kept repeating, “,this man is above repraxh, blah blah, blah.” I started counting my spoons. It was so obvious that he was setting something up. Now he’s trying to walk it back. Too late Rush. Next time question the people feeding you this crap.

Could not agree more


20 posted on 01/27/2012 10:27:30 AM PST by uncbob
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To: Lady Lucky

The American Spectator did! Good work, AS and Gingrich aides!


21 posted on 01/27/2012 10:28:39 AM PST by miss marmelstein
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To: georgiagirl_pam

I, too, am sick about this. You don’t even have to be a fan of Newt to be repulsed by this disgusting Romney trick. He’s Clintonian.


22 posted on 01/27/2012 10:31:00 AM PST by miss marmelstein
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas

I actually thought Rush sounded stunned yesterday and was hinting that the speech must have been creatively edited, but he didn’t have the evidence so wouldn’t come right out and say it.


23 posted on 01/27/2012 10:32:45 AM PST by KansasGirl (Romney to Santorum: Obamneycare "nothing to get angry about".)
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Comment #24 Removed by Moderator

To: I am Richard Brandon

Sometimes I feel like the oldest person on FR! I guess no one but me goes back far enough to remember poor crazy Howard Hughes’ “Mormon Mafia.” Hughes thought Mormons were more honest than other people and only hired them. Eventually, as his mental illnesses began to overcome him, he became a prisoner of his Mormon employees who would not get him access to much medical care. Sad story; maybe a Romney family member was employed!


25 posted on 01/27/2012 10:36:00 AM PST by miss marmelstein
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To: miss marmelstein

Praise to Jeff Lord!


26 posted on 01/27/2012 10:36:11 AM PST by Lady Lucky (A tea party in name only is worse than no tea party at all.)
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To: Red Steel

Romney can’t run on his liberal record and win the GOP primary so all he can do is smear and lie about Newt.


27 posted on 01/27/2012 10:38:03 AM PST by KansasGirl (Romney to Santorum: Obamneycare "nothing to get angry about".)
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To: miss marmelstein
Missy - Oldest = Wisest and most knowledgeable!
28 posted on 01/27/2012 10:44:09 AM PST by I am Richard Brandon
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To: I am Richard Brandon

Certainly one of the oldest, it seems. Sigh...


29 posted on 01/27/2012 10:52:59 AM PST by miss marmelstein
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To: Grunthor

Your right! Romney and Abrams are LIARS!!!!!!!!!!


30 posted on 01/27/2012 10:59:17 AM PST by tallyhoe
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To: KansasGirl
I actually thought Rush sounded stunned yesterday and was hinting that the speech must have been creatively edited, but he didn’t have the evidence so wouldn’t come right out and say it.

Then he should have checked it out before passing along unverified comments that turned out to be lies. No better than filthy gossipmongering, and to an audience as huge as his, it's disgraceful.

Now if he'll just as promptly check and retract the dozen other steaming road apples he shared with everyone...

31 posted on 01/27/2012 11:00:44 AM PST by Lady Lucky (A tea party in name only is worse than no tea party at all.)
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To: sheikdetailfeather
Mitt can buy all of the rinos like Abrams. Look at Coulter/Drudge, as a probable examples of whores cashing in on the Mitt Gravy Train.

The economic disaster has apparently left a lot of formerly wealthy Rinos very susceptible to Romney's 30 pieces of silver. So they are cashing in for their 30 pieces of silver and selling out to trash Newt!:


32 posted on 01/27/2012 11:22:21 AM PST by Grampa Dave (ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION IS DESTROYING AMERICA-LOOK AT WHAT IT DID TO THE WHITE HOUSE!)
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To: sheikdetailfeather
Who could be behind this smear campaign?


33 posted on 01/27/2012 11:24:13 AM PST by dead (I've got my eye out for Mullah Omar.)
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To: sheikdetailfeather
As usual, there is always more to a story than what people with a point of view want to tell you. I'm surprised people here are shocked that those with a political agenda choose to quote only things that push that agenda, and ignore that which does not.

And it's fun to call it "lying" when someone making a point doesn't include the argument against their point.

Here, from the referenced American Spectator story, is the relevant quote:

"The fact is that George Will, Charles Krauthammer, Irving Kristol, and Jeane Kirkpatrick are right in pointing out the enormous gap between President Reagan's strong rhetoric, which is adequate, and his administration's weak policies, which are inadequate and will ultimately fail."
The "misleading" aspect was that Abrams didn't tell us that other people were equally wrong as Gingrich was, and that Gingrich was agreeing with those people.

Nowadays, if you tried to defend a conservative saying that Reagan's policies would fail by noting they were just agreeing with George Will, you probably wouldn't get far on a conservative forum.

Of course, some of us never put much stock in this attack, at least as it was SUPPOSED to be. It seems I always see some other aspect of things than I'm supposed to. To me, the issue wasn't "Gingrich attacks Reagan". Everybody deserves to be questioned, and I think it was sleazy of Romney, of all people, to suggest that Gingrich disagreement with Reagan on this matter suggested Gingrich wasn't a Reagan supporter.

But what I would have expected Gingrich to do in response was to come out, note that he did think Reagan wasn't being forceful enough, and to admit that in the end, Gingrich was wrong about that assessment. For extra credit, Gingrich could have said he learned from that, and it would make him a better President, seeing that when you have a weapon like the United States, you can be less forceful and acheive results.

But attacking Abrams for this is silly. The quotes while not the full story were true. It's in the "refutation" -- Gingrich DID say that he agreed that Reagan wasn't being forceful enough.

Rather than attacking Abrams for pointing that out, why not instead acknowledge the error and use it to advantage?

There's also a part of the spectator story about Gingrich taking ABC on over his ex-wife. I'd love to say something about that, but I can't, because I love being here at FR and already feel like I'm treading on thin ice simply pointing out the flaw in the argument above, without raising any other issues.

34 posted on 01/27/2012 11:27:13 AM PST by CharlesWayneCT
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To: Grunthor
Why don’t people ever say “lying” anymore? Is Calling someone a liar MORE offensive than the lie itself? Elliot Abrams, you sir are a damned liar!

You are correct Elliot Abrams is a LIAR, just like Mitt 'providential' Romney is a liar. I am sick of these hypocrites that cover up for liars saying words like 'spoon-fed'. GIVE me a break. Some of our 'rich' conservatives, fatted off their yakking have become LAZY.

35 posted on 01/27/2012 11:29:22 AM PST by Just mythoughts (Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.)
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To: CharlesWayneCT
The "misleading" aspect was that Abrams didn't tell us that other people were equally wrong as Gingrich was, and that Gingrich was agreeing with those people.

It's also misleading in that it doesn't make it clear that he shared the same goal as Reagan, he just wanted Reagan to step even harder on the gas pedal to get there.

It was a difference in degree not substance.

36 posted on 01/27/2012 11:31:40 AM PST by dead (I've got my eye out for Mullah Omar.)
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To: KansasGirl; Sidebar Moderator

Sidebar Moderator was lost at sea for many months, in fact we thought that we lost him or her for good, so, please, go easy on him or her.... ;-)


37 posted on 01/27/2012 11:41:15 AM PST by b4its2late (Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I am not sure about the former.)
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To: dead

Although when I read the Abram’s piece, that is exactly the message I got from it. I didn’t think Gingrich opposed Reagan, was able to see the quotes and understand. Maybe Abrams SAID we should think otherwise, I don’t remember — but I focused on the quotes Abrams gave, and thought Gingrich wanted communism ended, and didn’t think Reagan was doing enough in that regard.

Maybe it’s because I didn’t buy that Gingrich opposed Reagan (I’ve never bought that Gingrich was somehow instrumental in Reagan’s success, although he certainly was one of many who helped). I also knew that Reagan wanted to end communism, and couldn’t ever imagine Gingrich would think differently, so I knew that wasn’t what Gingrich was saying.

And it doesn’t bother me a bit that Gingrich, being young and somewhat uninformed, could think that Reagan wasn’t doing enough.

When we discussed this, I ended up in an argument with some Gingrich supporter who suggested that Gingrich was right, Reagan wasn’t doing enough, and was probably suffering from Alzeihmers and allowing George Bush to run the country.

Anyway, I thought the big thing about this was it emphasized that while Gingrich had disagreements with Reagan, Romney actively opposed Reagan at the time. And I certainly don’t think getting something wrong in 1986 disqualifies you from being President.


38 posted on 01/27/2012 11:41:37 AM PST by CharlesWayneCT
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To: sheikdetailfeather

It seems this Romney campaign has no problem with lying, kinda similar to what Joe Wilson shouted out in the crowded House Chamber when the chosen one was speaking....


39 posted on 01/27/2012 11:43:26 AM PST by b4its2late (Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I am not sure about the former.)
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To: CharlesWayneCT
When we discussed this, I ended up in an argument with some Gingrich supporter who suggested that Gingrich was right, Reagan wasn’t doing enough, and was probably suffering from Alzeihmers and allowing George Bush to run the country.

Oh, you were arguing with a bonehead! I've done that!

Newt's OK and was almost always on board with Reagan in those years. It's a ridiculous line of attack for the Mittens crew. Romney's an oily one.

40 posted on 01/27/2012 11:45:39 AM PST by dead (I've got my eye out for Mullah Omar.)
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To: CharlesWayneCT
Geeze.... There was a whole speech it is rather crude and infantile to do the Abrams thing and select out of it for purpose of DECEPTION to bear false witness.....

IF Abrams really has the credibility of a slug he would NOT rip out a short paragraph without NOTATION there was much more said and TWIST it to sound how LIARS want it to sound.

41 posted on 01/27/2012 11:51:31 AM PST by Just mythoughts (Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.)
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To: b4its2late

Yes, it was a harrowing experience. I’ll tell ya, I would quit if it wasn’t for the free yacht and the big bucks Jim pays me ;-)


42 posted on 01/27/2012 11:53:42 AM PST by Sidebar Moderator
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To: dead
Newt's OK and was almost always on board with Reagan in those years. It's a ridiculous line of attack for the Mittens crew. Romney's an oily one.

If anyone was against Reagan and his policies especially economic it was that liar Romney

That is what Rush should be harping on but I think it is too late the damage is done

Truth Detector my butt
43 posted on 01/27/2012 12:22:20 PM PST by uncbob
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To: sheikdetailfeather

I noticed that the “impartial reporter” Drudge does not show this article “Elliott Abrams Caught Misleading on Newt” on his website.


44 posted on 01/27/2012 12:46:34 PM PST by Red Steel
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To: Red Steel

Drudge has it up on his site now (I don’t want to take credit but I emailed him the article about 2 hours ago)


45 posted on 01/27/2012 2:58:44 PM PST by CaptainK (...please make it stop. Shake a can of pennies at it.)
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To: miss marmelstein

We need to have a Septuagenarian Rally. Only problem is, I’m not eligible until next Friday!


46 posted on 01/27/2012 4:38:54 PM PST by GopherIt
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To: Just mythoughts

As it tuirns out, there was a lot more “Reagan criticism” in the full speech, which has now been posted on the web so we can all make our own decision. It appears neither Abrams nor Lord were really “truthful” about the speech; the truth, as I said before, is somewhere in between, and each side selectively quoted to prove the point THEY wanted to make, not to give us the “full story”.


47 posted on 01/27/2012 6:55:44 PM PST by CharlesWayneCT
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