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Good Grief… Now Team Obama Wants to Blow Up 3 Dams In the Name of Junk Science
Gateway Pundit ^ | Feb 29,2012 | Jim Hoft

Posted on 02/29/2012 7:09:27 PM PST by Baynative

Just when you thought things couldn’t get any weirder… The Obama Administration now wants to demolish three dams in northern California to supposedly save the salmon… But the whole reason to support the move was based on shoddy and inconclusive scientific data.

(Excerpt) Read more at thegatewaypundit.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; US: California; US: Oregon; US: Washington
KEYWORDS: agenda21; california; dams; environazis; junkscience; klamath; landgrab; obama; oregon; propertyrights; unagenda21
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Against intense local opposition, the Obama administration wants to demolish three dams on the Klamath River in Siskiyou County, California. Low-cost clean hydroelectricity as well as water for irrigation would be lost if the dams were removed. Removal of the dams would also cause chaos for ranchers, homeowners, and small business who live and work in the downstream of the dams.
1 posted on 02/29/2012 7:09:31 PM PST by Baynative
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To: Baynative
It's not about the science.
It's not about the salmon.
2 posted on 02/29/2012 7:10:59 PM PST by ClearCase_guy ("And the public gets what the public wants" -- The Jam)
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To: TEXOKIE; ELVISNIXON.com; SunkenCiv; E. Pluribus Unum; CharlyFord; cripplecreek; OneLoyalAmerican; ..
"Removal of the dams would also cause chaos for ranchers, homeowners, and small business who live and work in the downstream of the dams. Despite this, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar has been trying to force dam removal for the supposed benefit of some salmon and steelhead spawning habitat.
Now, Prof. Paul R. Houser of George Mason University alleges that the administration’s plan is all based on junk science. In his role as science advisor to the Bureau of Reclamation, he was closely involved in the project. He has filed a formal complaint (PDF) alleging “intentional falsification” and “intentional . . . compromise of scientific and scholarly integrity.” "


3 posted on 02/29/2012 7:12:21 PM PST by Baynative (Please check this out - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFIcZkEzc8I)
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To: Baynative

Must be a conservative area.


4 posted on 02/29/2012 7:12:46 PM PST by KansasGirl
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To: Baynative

Those dams were releasing too much carbon dioxide into the atmosphere.


5 posted on 02/29/2012 7:13:40 PM PST by Vince Ferrer
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To: ClearCase_guy

What is it about? Why are they trying to destroy the food production in this extremely important area? I guess the next thing will be to make tapping the Ogallala Aquifer off-limits to kill the grain-producing states and starve not just us, but the entire world. Damn these people to hell.


6 posted on 02/29/2012 7:16:24 PM PST by ponygirl
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To: Baynative

Part of agenda 21

—Hydro power dam destruction: collapse of energy infrastructure to return to a primitive existence


7 posted on 02/29/2012 7:17:13 PM PST by opentalk
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To: Baynative; tubebender; Grampa Dave; Carry_Okie; Amerigomag; ElkGroveDan; ScottinSacto; ...

There’s a beautiful video of Congressman Tom McClintock giving an enlightening speech on this very subject on YouTube!!! Check it out...


8 posted on 02/29/2012 7:20:26 PM PST by SierraWasp (I'm done being disappointed by "He/She is the only one who can win" and being embarrassed later!!!)
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To: AuntB

One pingy dingy, two pingy dingy... Three pingy dingy!!!


9 posted on 02/29/2012 7:22:38 PM PST by SierraWasp (I'm done being disappointed by "He/She is the only one who can win" and being embarrassed later!!!)
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To: Baynative

If they approve this plan, all those folks who will be affected need to do a little civil disobedience. It would be pretty hard to blow up a dam with, say, a thousand protesters “occupying” it.


10 posted on 02/29/2012 7:23:53 PM PST by Boogieman
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To: Jeff Head

Jeff! You’re the man that knows all this history!!!


11 posted on 02/29/2012 7:24:11 PM PST by SierraWasp (I'm done being disappointed by "He/She is the only one who can win" and being embarrassed later!!!)
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To: AdmSmith; AnonymousConservative; Berosus; bigheadfred; Bockscar; ColdOne; Convert from ECUSA; ...

Thanks Baynative.
Prof. Paul R. Houser of George Mason University alleges that the administration's plan is all based on junk science. In his role as science advisor to the Bureau of Reclamation, he was closely involved in the project. He has filed a formal complaint (PDF) alleging "intentional falsification" and "intentional . . . compromise of scientific and scholarly integrity."

12 posted on 02/29/2012 7:24:36 PM PST by SunkenCiv (FReep this FReepathon!)
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To: Baynative
During WWII, the Abwehr infiltrated two teams into the US with the intent of harassing and sabotaging American infrastructure. Had they been able to successfully infiltrate 1,000 teams, I dare say they could not have created half as much destruction, havoc and chaos as the Obama administration.
13 posted on 02/29/2012 7:34:17 PM PST by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Baynative

What about Hoover Dam? I hear that keeps Mexicans from swimming upstream and spawning too.


14 posted on 02/29/2012 7:35:11 PM PST by Dogbert41 ("...or by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the Great King. " -Jesus)
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To: Baynative
this comment has absolutely nothing to do with the validity of any obama administration plan.

i note the dams. as someone who spent many formative years in oregon and washington, watching the salmon ladders (on dams), and driving to hoover dam, and grand coulee dam, and tonight googling the 150+ dams and reservoirs on the incomplete list of dams and reservoirs in california . . . does any water west of the continental divide actually flow to, and in the amount, dictated by natural geography?

i know it's not just west of the divide. the southeastern u.s. wouldn't be the same without the tva.

but nothing riparian west of the divide appears to be natural.

15 posted on 02/29/2012 7:42:57 PM PST by Scoutmaster (You knew the job was dangerous when you took it)
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To: Baynative

This is well traveled territory... Free Republic and Klamath Falls.


16 posted on 02/29/2012 7:44:03 PM PST by Tex-Con-Man (T. Coddington Van Voorhees VII 2012 - "Together, I Shall Ride You To Victory")
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To: KansasGirl
"Must be a conservative area."

Of course. It's farm and ranch land.

17 posted on 02/29/2012 7:44:40 PM PST by Baynative (Please check this out - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFIcZkEzc8I)
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To: Baynative
Wayback to memory lane
18 posted on 02/29/2012 7:49:18 PM PST by Carry_Okie (The RNC would prefer Obama to a conservative nominee.)
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To: Boogieman
It would be pretty hard to blow up a dam with, say, a thousand protesters “occupying” it.

if you let me select the 1,000 protesters, i may at some point become ambivalent about the whole 'blowing up' thing

19 posted on 02/29/2012 7:50:09 PM PST by Scoutmaster (You knew the job was dangerous when you took it)
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To: ClearCase_guy
It's not about the science.
It's not about the salmon.

It's about Real Estate.

And some of 'bam's cronies are about to make a lot of money.

20 posted on 02/29/2012 7:50:17 PM PST by tsomer
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To: Baynative

The progressives would love to blow up Hetch Hetchy too.


21 posted on 02/29/2012 7:51:42 PM PST by GSWarrior
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To: Tex-Con-Man

I expect Jeff Head to weigh in soon and give us inside knowledge on local conditions.


22 posted on 02/29/2012 7:53:25 PM PST by Baynative (Please check this out - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFIcZkEzc8I)
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To: Vince Ferrer

Those dams were releasing too much carbon dioxide into the atmosphere.

I suggest that you retract the above statement .... the idiot lackeys of the Food Stamp President’s administration might actually try to sell the idea to the less intelligent serving in government, recently public education high school and college graduates, and MSM news readers!


23 posted on 02/29/2012 7:55:41 PM PST by RetiredTexasVet (There's a pill for just about everything ... except stupid!)
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To: ponygirl

The 0bama regime wants to do the same thing to Northern California that they did early on to Central Valley, CA.. KILL THE FARMING. They cut the water supply to the CV for a tiny fish (yeah right).. Remember, THERE IS ALWAYS AN EXCUSE TO IMPOSE THE “CHANGE”.

Make no mistake, THIS IS AGENDA 21.


24 posted on 02/29/2012 8:02:41 PM PST by FedsRStealingOurCountryFromUs
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To: Boogieman

“If they approve this plan, all those folks who will be affected need to do a little civil disobedience. It would be pretty hard to blow up a dam with, say, a thousand protesters “occupying” it.”

Really? Don’t think so...I think that it would collapse more quickly, if anything...


25 posted on 02/29/2012 8:09:29 PM PST by The Antiyuppie ("When small men cast long shadows, then it is very late in the day.")
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To: opentalk

Its all part of making that area off-limits. Take away the power, jobs and people will migrate. Appears to everyone they’re making their own choice to do so.


26 posted on 02/29/2012 8:10:47 PM PST by Secret Agent Man (I'd like to tell you, but then I'd have to kill you.)
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To: Scoutmaster

I read an interesting book which pretty much showed that none of the New England landscape was ever “natural,” not even when the Pilgrims landed. The Indians farmed, cut trees, burned sections to plant crops, and so on.

And in the early years of white settlement, almost all of the streams and rivers were manipulated. The rivers were needed for travel and commerce. The streams were used for water supplies and for water mills, which were the main source of power for such things as grinding corn and wheat or sawing lumber. Streams were redirected all over the place, swamps were drained, dams were built, ponds were created.

There is no such thing as pure nature, anywhere. And if humans don’t do it, animals will—beavers, deer, buffalo, you name it.


27 posted on 02/29/2012 8:11:14 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Baynative

First they turned off the irrigation, now want to blow up dams. What is it Democrats have against Klamath?


28 posted on 02/29/2012 8:13:59 PM PST by tbw2
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To: Baynative

Don’t forget the ultimate goal of the Sierra Club is to return everything west of the Rockies back to nature and eliminate all humans west of the Rockies!


29 posted on 02/29/2012 8:19:57 PM PST by dalereed
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To: tbw2
"What is it Democrats have against Klamath?"

The Klamath Valley is made up of farmers and ranchers. It is rural western America - the antithesis of everything Chicago

I remember an often repeated quote from Jack Nicholson in Easy Rider that went something like; "They don't hate you. They hate what you represent - Freedom"

30 posted on 02/29/2012 8:21:57 PM PST by Baynative (Please check this out - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFIcZkEzc8I)
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To: Baynative

sfl


31 posted on 02/29/2012 8:22:59 PM PST by phockthis (http://www.supremelaw.org/fedzone11/index.htm ...)
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To: The Antiyuppie

Well, what I meant was, it would be much harder for them to issue the order to blow it up, and have it be obeyed. Even if they did, it would be a PR nightmare for them, either by having to violently remove the protestors, or moreso if their actions resulted in deaths.

We need to start resisting these overreaches, since we can’t rely on our representatives or the courts doing their jobs anymore, so it falls to the citizens. Before we break out the more violent means of resistance, I think we are bound to attempt the more peaceful means which have proved extremely successful in recent history.


32 posted on 02/29/2012 8:23:16 PM PST by Boogieman
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To: Boogieman
The Agenda 21 'biodiversity' Death Map: Also see: "BioDiversity Map"


33 posted on 02/29/2012 8:40:57 PM PST by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto.)
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To: Baynative

The Klamath Bucket Brigade: http://www.klamathbucketbrigade.org/


34 posted on 02/29/2012 8:44:55 PM PST by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto.)
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To: Cicero
There is no such thing as pure nature, anywhere. And if humans don’t do it, animals will—beavers, deer, buffalo, you name it.

thanks for your input. i've driven over hoover dam. i've backpacked by beaver lodges. beaver don't coordinate with other beaver to set up a state-wide or national water flow/retention plan. so i understand, but think there is a difference of scale that makes my question/observation relevant.

35 posted on 02/29/2012 8:56:07 PM PST by Scoutmaster (You knew the job was dangerous when you took it)
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To: Baynative

GREAT!!!! once we get rid of those stupid dams, we’ll have plenty of space to install the new windmills.EUREKA, we’ve solved our energy problems and saved a fish at the same time.....in my next 5 years as president, we may devlop algae farms to replenish our oil supply....please, no applause...


36 posted on 02/29/2012 9:09:05 PM PST by terycarl (lurking, but well informed)
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To: combat_boots

Time for the Klamath Bucket Brigade to ride to court with a Data Quality Act suit.


37 posted on 02/29/2012 9:31:47 PM PST by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is necessary to examine principles."...the public interest)
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To: Baynative
Loss of fresh water for communities and farming. Loss of hydro power (renewable generation that actually works) and flood control downstream. How stupid can you be? Redundant question when Obama and his minions are involved. Their intent is to damage the country.
38 posted on 02/29/2012 9:42:50 PM PST by Myrddin
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To: Baynative

We blow the dams, fish population goes crazy, and the Chinese scoop em up at the ocean.


39 posted on 02/29/2012 10:24:45 PM PST by SgtHooper (The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list.)
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To: Boogieman

I’m sorry, I forgot the </s>.


40 posted on 02/29/2012 10:37:51 PM PST by The Antiyuppie ("When small men cast long shadows, then it is very late in the day.")
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To: Baynative

This is not Jeff Head’s territory. It is mine. This is southwest of the Klamath Falls area. The area below the dams is not heavily farmed. This is the mid-Klamath. In fact, some of the very Klamath Project farmers who were affected by the water turn off at the head gates are now in favor of dam removal. They were quite willing to stab my people in the back to trade for gains in their water and electricity price needs.

The people of the mid Klamath include the retirees and communities who live around the reservoirs behind the dams. They include resort owners and river folk who will be flooded out by uncontrolable flooding. They include fishing guides, miners, loggers and some small family farms that have been handed down since the 1850s.

Dam removal will damage infrastructure (roads, bridges,) kill fish and possibly all living things in the river for several years. (And it will walk away from any liability, leaving locals holding the bag.) It will mess up the City of Yreka’s water supply. It will leave raw stinking mudflats for the people around the reservoirs that will be a seedbed for noxious weeds. It will destroy one of the finest white water rafting areas in the US. It will remove the settling effects of the reservoirs on nutrients and organics (algae) and create a hot nutrient rich soup that will be plugged with algae. It will remove the power of the reservoirs to act as settling ponds for the putrid water that comes in from Oregon. It will reduce water flows in the summer to a much lower level. It will turn a county that is a net exporter of energy into one that is a net consumer of energy produced elsewhere.

It will also drag two agriclutural areas - the Scott and Shasta Valleys into the mess. (These are areas with small family heritage farms.) Plans are to use restrictions on their water and land use to mitigate the impact of the upper Klamath on salmon.

To top it off, the whole thing is based on manipulated science to intentionaly support dam removal: Fired federal adviser files whistle-blower complaint over Klamath dam removal http://www.redding.com/news/2012/feb/28/klamath-river-dams-fired-federal-adviser-files/ Here are his allegations: http://users.sisqtel.net/armstrng/allegation.pdf and his bio http://prhouser.com/houser.html

The Board of Sups hired a consultant and found several irregularities in the science http://www.co.siskiyou.ca.us/BOS/DOCS/KBRA/Comments_of_SiskiyouCountyandCities_to_KlamathFacilitiesRemoval_EIR_EIS%2011_21_11.pdf

There are also scientists at ESIPRI who are reviewing the integrity of the science: http://www.esipri.org/


41 posted on 02/29/2012 10:38:21 PM PST by marsh2
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To: Baynative; SierraWasp; Grampa Dave; marsh2

The “studies” gives scant attention to the thousands of Cu yards of sediment piled up behind the three dams and the destruction it will cause down stream and the rate payers are being forced to pay for this farce...


42 posted on 02/29/2012 10:42:34 PM PST by tubebender (I always wanted to be somebody, but now I realize I should have been more specific.)
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To: marsh2

I should have known you would be hear...


43 posted on 02/29/2012 10:46:58 PM PST by tubebender (I always wanted to be somebody, but now I realize I should have been more specific.)
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To: SunkenCiv; carolinablonde; marvlus; ApplegateRanch; Berlin_Freeper; Genesis defender; golux; ...
Thanx for the ping SunkenCiv !

 


Beam me to Planet Gore !

44 posted on 03/01/2012 2:41:25 AM PST by steelyourfaith (Expel the Occupy White House squatters !!!)
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To: marsh2; Baynative; SierraWasp; Jeff Head

Thanks for weighing in Marsh. You are the person who understands this more than anyone. I can see one of these dams from my front window.


45 posted on 03/01/2012 6:49:40 AM PST by AuntB (Illegal immigration is simply more "share the wealth" socialism and a CRIME not a race!)
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To: marsh2; Baynative; SierraWasp; AuntB; All

Exactly, Marsh2.

Sadly, as with all groups, and we saw it in spades in 2001, there are farmers too who will try and “go along to get along.”

Now that the 2001 crisis is long past (although never truly resolved, either adequately or constitutionally), some are once again complacent.

This order, this effort just punctuates the willingness the individuals who want to destroy the agricultural and natrual resource capability of America are still fighting hard and stoill committing their tracesties, lies, illegal takings, unconstituional acts, and power mongering and marxist efforts to destroy America.

They must be fought on all fronts and the people have to come together to do so.

As with the Clinton years, under an Obama, and particularly an Eric Holder leadership, doing so will be very dangerous. We may hope that a change occurs in November like it did on November of 2000.

Although Bush was slow to act and help those who supported him, we eventually made enough impact to get him to act and the new DOI and BOR leaders ultimately came to the aid of the farmers. If Obama stays in power, I fear as we conservative, loyal to the constitution Americans protest and try to civilly protect our rights, that Salazaar and Holder would push it to violence to try and brutally and forcefully put down any such protest.

We went to Klamath without guns, in fact I wrote and distributed an email to amny, many people as I left sayoing specifically that I was leaving mine at home. But we also contacted all the militia leaders and others to be on guard and prepared in case it turned bad...because if it had, there would have been a different kind of fight ensue. I thank God and my Savior it did not lead to that in that case...but it is always possible when dealing with power hungry and power mad fanatics who want to step on the individual, unalienable rights of those standing up to defend them.

So...organnize, protest, and stand up...vote in November like our liberty and life depends on it (because IMHO, they do), and be careful and wise in this.

God grant that we can stand and thwart another effort to further erode, negatively impact, and destroy our prosperity and way of life.

AMERICA AT THE CROSSROADS OF HISTORY
http://www.jeffhead.com/crossroads.htm


46 posted on 03/01/2012 8:17:52 AM PST by Jeff Head (Liberty is not free. Never has been, never will be. (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: marsh2; TEXOKIE; ELVISNIXON.com; SunkenCiv; E. Pluribus Unum; CharlyFord; cripplecreek; ...
Thank you for the detailed explanation.

The Damage Done to the Environment by Barack Obama and his fanatical Czars is unknown to most people and almost always based on false science and contrived dangers to some endangered or sacred fish or insect.

It was junk science and the "by any means" Agenda 21 movement that became the catalyst for the creation of ESIPRI as we fought against burdensome and unconstitutional shoreline and riparian restrictions here in Western Washington State. The allied forces of the Olympic Stewardship Foundation and the Citizens Alliance for Property Rights (CAPR)were fighting a good fight, but losing ground to false science and the fanatical environmentalism supported by our tax dollars thorough the EPA and individual departments of ecology. This assault on our environment, our constitutional rights and our common sense will continue to succeed unless we educate more people and get them involved.

To all who are following this or other threads please understand how valuable a service the folks at ESIPRI are doing on your behalf. It is no small task to take the time to disprove what agenda driven activists will accept as "Best Available Science" if it supports their objectives. We have even seen undergraduate college papers and letters to the editor enter the public record and claim factual representation. We've seen people sympathetic with the ideals of Agenda 21 can gain credibility by taking an 8 hour course on recycling or beach watching, while PhD scientists run up against a brick wall in trying to present factual scientific data to self serving politicians. Thus the need for dedicated folks like those who participate in the ESIPRI process if unbiased and independent peer review.

I know it's election season and we have just gone through a quarterly fundraiser here at FR, but any donation you can make to them would be a great help.

Marsh, I hope you will keep us informed. I have a short Agenda 21 ping list, but nothing specific to dams and rivers. If there is one you know of, please ping them to this thread and add me to any lists you have as well. Thanks

BUT WAIT ...there's more---This just came in from a friend of mine at ESIPRI


Jim —
"This issue has changed dramatically this week.

Trademark America has been working with the Siskiyou County Board of Supervisors on a formal coordination process with the Department of Interior on the Klamath Dams removal issue. On Monday, Secretary of Interior Salazar announced that instead of making and publishing a decision by March 31, he will now await Congressional approval prior to making and announcing a decision.

Since the current House of Representatives will not provide that approval, the dams are safe for now . . . unless the House reverts to Democrat control and the Republicans fail to win the Senate."
Norm

47 posted on 03/01/2012 8:51:34 AM PST by Baynative (Please check this out - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFIcZkEzc8I)
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To: Baynative

Obama’s Great Lakes czar, Cameron Davis is the head of the Alliance for the great lakes. They see dam removal as one of their top priorities.


48 posted on 03/01/2012 9:12:39 AM PST by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: tubebender

“The “studies” gives scant attention to the thousands of Cu yards of sediment piled up behind the three dams and the destruction it will cause down stream and the rate payers are being forced to pay for this farce.”

You are exactly right. A recent dam removal on the Rogue in So. Oregon is causing all kinds of sludge mess and they have no idea what to do with it.

2,000,000 Ten Yard Dump Trucks of Hazardous Sediment will be released into the Klamath River
Nov 28, 2011
Klamath River & Dams
The sediment chart below is a brief on the 20 million (20,000,000!) cubic yards of sediment debris captured behind the four Klamath River dams that will be released with dam removal.
On October 20, 2011, at a Department of Interior (DOI) event, Oregon Senator Doug Whitsett stated for public record that the Federal Energy Commission estimated that 20,000,000 cubic yards has accumulated behind the four dams.
The draft Environmental Impact Statement does not appear to mitigate 20,000,000 cubic yards of sediment.
*That amount of sediment is equal to approximately 2,000,000 ten yard dump truck loads of silt, sediment and organic muck not to mention possible hazardous levels of Chromium-6 as found in the recent dam removal on the Rogue River in Southern Oregon!
Said chart indicates the possible damages in a profile graph regarding the potential depth of the sediment debris that will effect the anadromous fish and salmon egg redds spawning habitat on the Klamath River from River Mile 190 (RM) (about 6 feet in depth) at Iron Gate Dam, to the Pacific Ocean, RM 00 (at a depth of about 0.5 feet) if and when the proposed dams are breached.
http://pienpolitics.com/?p=6759


49 posted on 03/01/2012 9:22:48 AM PST by AuntB (Illegal immigration is simply more "share the wealth" socialism and a CRIME not a race!)
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To: AuntB
I hope no one misses this brief speech by Congressman Tom McClintock!!!

click here please.

50 posted on 03/01/2012 9:27:15 AM PST by SierraWasp (I'm done being disappointed by "He/She is the only one who can win" and being embarrassed later!!!)
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