Posted on 03/09/2012 6:20:57 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
Reporting from Mobile, Ala.— Rick Santorum renewed his criticism of John F. Kennedy on Thursday night for saying during his 1960 campaign for the presidency that he believed “in an America where the separation of church and state is absolute.”
“That’s not America,” the Republican presidential hopeful told a crowd at an Alabama dinner banquet. “That’s France. That’s a naked public square where people of faith are out of bounds.”
[SNIP]
......Santorum said he would continue to speak out on the importance of religion in public life.
“Please pray for me that I do so more articulately in the future,” he said.
(Excerpt) Read more at latimes.com ...
Presidential candidate John F. Kennedy’s major address to a group of Protestant ministers on the religious issue. Many Protestants questioned the ability of a Roman Catholic President to make important national decisions independently of the influence of his church. Senator Kennedy answers those questions before an audience of Protestant clergy, many of whom may believe that he can not.
Location: Rice Hotel, Houston, Texas
Date: September 12, 1960
Running time: 11:14 minutes. [also link to transcript]
I don't know what else you'd call it except pandering.
Full disclosure: I am Catholic.
At this point, we need a candidate who is clearly focused on stating the the most important problems facing our country, and explaining how he would go about solving them, not just whining about the other guys, or going off on sidebar topics.
Newt is the only guy constantly clearly stating the problems and how he would go about solving them.
I hope my fellow Alabamians do the right thing next Tuesday and vote for Newt.
I can’t decide if he is a ringer, that clueless, or wants to fall gloriously upon a political sword and feel very noble in the aftermath. Meh. I’ll vote for him if he is the nominee, but I am not going to help put him in that position.
I don't want religion in government any more than I want government in religion. Doesn’t he see that our argument over the government forcing the Catholic church to provide birth control is the argument FOR religious freedom?
Oh s**t Rick; give it a friggin’ rest. What is that gonna do to get gas prices down, Employment up and keep the U.S. and Israel from being attacked by Iran? Damn dude; we’re electing a President, not a Priest. Two Conservatives left: Rick and Newt. One with no moral failures but no common sense and one with past indiscretions but a helluva lot of common sense.
HANG IN THERE NEWT!!!
He has few realistic options at this point OTHER THAN going out in a blaze of mediocrity - griping like an old crank about the evils of contraception and how JFK makes him want to puke.
Rick Santorum: The Pat Robertson of the 21st Century.
(And we all know that Pat got real to occupying the White House. /sarc.)
Obviously not. Church and State need to stay separate, as much for the protection of religion as the protection of the state.
One of the things I will talk about that no president has talked about before is I think the dangers of contraception in this country, the whole sexual libertine idea. Many in the Christian faith have said, 'Well, that’s okay. Contraception’s okay'. It’s not okay..."
It is difficult to understand how anyone could take Santorum seriously as a general election candidate.
I wish Ricky would hurry up and fall on the sword so Newt can win the South and move on agains’t Mitt and Obama.
Jim Young / Reuters - Republican presidential candidate Rick Santorum addresses supporters at his "Super Tuesday" primary election night rally in Steubenville, Ohio, March 6, 2012.
RE: Time Cover story: The Under-Told Story of How Santorum Became a Crusader for the Religious Right
It seems to me Saint Santorum is seeking the wrong position. He should move to Rome, and go for Pope.
I don’t recall a more sanctimonious pile ever running for POTUS. Next thing ya know, he’ll be speaking in tongues.
I agree...Santorum is not going to win with this kind of strategy. I mean, he knows or ought to know exactly what Kennedy meant. Moreover, his remark about France is odd since given the many connections between church and state over there (e.g., government authority over religious schools).
What he is essentially calling out is the “wall of separation” which does not exist in the Constitution. The only “wall” there is one that keeps government out of religion. He’s saying a person should be able to bring their values into office. Rick isn’t talking about making this a Catholic theocracy, but about the traditional, Judeo-Christian values that built this country. Secular values are essentially a religion unto itself. It’s sad that conservatives are attacking a man for standing up for traditional morality, a morality that helped makes this country great and is the antithesis to the socialism we are heading towards. If it’s not our morality, it’s theirs, and lately, conservatives seem to have bought the separation of church and state meme designed to eradicate traditional morality, replacing it with secular humanism, hook, line, and sinker. Maybe it’s in order to prop up their candidate of choice, which is very sad. We do need to fix the economy and be strong on national defense, things Rick talks about and stands for, not that you would know if only following media soundbites and hit pieces posted on FR.
I like Newt's delegate strategy- it's working well, but we need voters to wake up and get behind Newt.
All I know is I hear more homilies from Father Santorum on the stump than I do from my priests at Mass!
>> I don’t know what else you’d call it except pandering.
Full disclosure: I am Catholic. <<
I find it more than a bit interesting — even amazing — that some recent exit polls show Rick has usually been losing the Catholic vote. The only folks he seems consistently to win are the “formerly anti-Popish” Evangelicals. Go figure!
Most of the above commenters apparently do not understand the American concept of Christian Faith. A true Christian CANNOT separate his/her faith/belief structure from everyday activities even as a politician!
Either we have some dismal ignorance here about Christianity or some hyper partisans against Santorum
BTW most voters are not that ignorant about American religious belief —except the MSM and libtards!
This guy’s strategy is stupid.
I think he is doing perfectly. 7 states find him the perfect candidate. 13 states find him the runner up as the perfect candidate. Not bad out of 23 states. He has the most gold and silvers. Most states agree with him.
I am Catholic, Santorum’s issue (Well one of them anyway) is that he is just completely incapable of articulating his social conservative stands in a way that doesn’t make him look and sound like a radical or a kook as often as not.
Santorum got beaten to death in 06, and lost by 17 points because he has and continues to this very day, provide sound bite after sound bite of him saying things that just utterly unacceptable to the majority of folks.
He doesn’t have the intellect or the oratory skills to defend his social conservative stands in a reasonable way. Yes if you listen to the breadth of a comment he makes its usually not to bad, but inside that breadth is a sentence or two that can be taken as a sound bite and makes him look completely outside the mainstream.
Santorum won’t change his stripes folks, and he’s not going to get any better at articulating his stands... he’s a disaster waiting to happen,.
If we want the economy fixed, regulations rolled back and energy independence, we better vote for Newt Gingrich.
That, and/or waving around rattlers and copperheads during his sermons?
But maybe snake-handling has no appeal outside of Tennessee -- which Rick has already won!
The man is anything but pure. Have the courage and read. I wrote this and I footnoted it to death so there could be none of the usual claims of error, I did it out of respect for the intellect of santorum's supporters, and to approach them in a thoughtful way instead of shouting. some of them have found it eye-opening, and had their minds changed, or atleast started vetting Rick themselves. I hope you will join them.
Stupid.
I think Freepers understand the American concept of Christian Faith here.
But Santorum has been over that topic multiple times. We all know where Santorum stands on the issue. Asked and answered.
I don't know what else to think when that becomes a main topic in his stump speech. You have a very small window to get your message out to prospective voters, and THAT’s the most import thing you want to leave people with?
Newt's going around Alabama talking about the price of gas, going to gas stations, meeting with people and outlining his ways to solve the problem.
Again, I'm very happy that Santorum is so passionate about his faith. But as a voter, I know what message resonates more with me.
Throw in a little bit of reality that Santorum lost his a$$ with the public on this issue, so he tries to revisit it, thinking he will change the outcome.
This idiot just needs to go away.......He has caused too much damage already and we are all stuck with results.
This is not the president's job. To be a good role model, sure? To return "morals and principles" back to America? Nope. We are electing a president, not a priest.
Santorum will not be the next President, and if we nominate him we will lose in a massive landslide (which would take our House majority down as well). Perhaps some socons have a martyr complex? Prove to themselves that the country is going to hell because Santorum can't be elected? Or just want to make a statement by voting for a guy who could never win a general election? Either way, Santorum is an after-thought candidate who only made it this far because he was the only non-Romney no one paid any attention to till the rest were gone.
Any candidate, in this case Rick Santorum, who thinks it is would be part of his job as President to lecture the American people on why contraception is "not okay" is a terrible candidate who would be decisively defeated as a nominee. And yes, Santorum did say that:
One of the things I will talk about that no president has talked about before is I think the dangers of contraception in this country, the whole sexual libertine idea. Many in the Christian faith have said, 'Well, that’s okay. Contraception’s okay'. It’s not okay..."
Santorum will roll back those things too. They are both the same as far as being a patriotic Americans. It just that Santorum has the morals and principles a little more than Newt. But either one can be President as far as I am concerned. Problem with Newt is getting some support outside of SC and GA. If he can do that, he would be in a better position. Maybe try for Indiana or NM. I still think he is making a mistake by not trying in Kansas. I mean if he won there he could say that he won in the mid-West and the South instead of just the South.
Santorum will not be the next President, and if we nominate him we will lose in a massive landslide
That is such BS. If it was popular vote....MAYBE but since it is electoral college who chose then Santorum is the one that we want. He won Iowa, Wisconsin, Colorado, almost Ohio, will win Pennsylvania. He is winning all the important states. I know you want Newt but SC and GA we will win no matter who the candidate is. Newt can’t win in states that went blue in 2008 but are normally red. If we only have a candidate that wins the South, how can we expect to win the election? There are not enough states in the South for Newt to win in the general.
That is utter Bull splatter! Santorum has said NOTHING about these issues that he has not copied almost word for word from Newt Gingrich and even Romney. And in relation to the issues that actually matters to the public, Santorum has “TALKED” about it, less than 10% of the time.
He still has no plan of his own, nor does he have a clue how to even start.
This IS the reason why Santorum will never take hold, or win the election. The sooner you come to grips with reality, the sooner you can start learning again.
Okay here is my question. We all hear this stuff coming out of Santorum’s mouth, but we still see “Conservatives” voting for this guy in big numbers,especially Evangelicals (though interesting enough not Catholics). Why? Are these people that easily swayed by his pompous virtuosity? He is a disaster waiting to happen come November. He is a walking, talking Dem political add. They could fire all their high priced consultants because they would need them, it would be that easy. As a SoCon commentator on the cultural decay in America he would be outstanding, but gawd not president. I think Rick must have had a real vocation to become a priest and didn’t follow his heart.
It seems to me that post would fit better at DU. Attacking a man for standing up for Judeo-Christian morality on a conservative site? Wow.
ROFLMAO! Now there is a classic oxymoron for you! LOL!
naps, what do you think of my post #24? What does it say about Santorum? I’d really like your opinion. thanks.
His F-I-L must have been very proud of his daughter living with the #1 abortionist in PA for 6 years. A man 20+ years her senior.
While I could happily vote for Gingrich, as well as for Santorum or Paul, I see that this thread is attracting some who are allowing the left to live rent rent-free in certain corners of their minds.
1. “Separation of church and state” is not part of the Constitution, and the meaning given this phrase today would have been abhorent to the Foundering Generation that ratified it and the generations of Americans that immediately succeeded them.
2. The phrase “separation of church and state” is actually Klan-speak for a KKK doctrine advocating suppressing Catholicism. (I, by the way, am not a Catholic)
3. The phrase “separation of church and state” was inserted into the Everson case in 1947 and was used thereafter to unconstitutionally suppress Christianity in this country. The SCOTUS judge who inserted the phrase in his opinion was Hugo Black, A KLANSMAN and a notorious anti-Catholic bigot.
4. As a purely nominal Catholic, it isn’t surprising that JFK was willing to embrace this doctrine at a time when, unlike today, people still knew what it meant. Nevertheless, it was wrong and harmful.
5. The left wins because it is epistemologically self-conscious, unlike the average conservative. As a result, the left asserts its metaphysical views, directly and indirectly, very forcefully. We, on the other hand, because we have been conditioned by the left’s media to flinch when someone on our side does the same thing, turn on conservatives who raise the issues that must be raised to ultimately overturn the left’s cultural hegemony. We also hand our children over to be indoctrinated by the left’s government schools and allow them to consume hours and hours of leftist media. We, too, consume large amounts of leftist media and make huge income transfers to the left through cable subscriptions and other purchases we make.
6. Santorum isn’t wrong to raise this issue. We are wrong for criticizing him for it. Perhaps the criticism reflects that many here think,like most of the WSJ editorial page writers, we can have a free economy and lots of stuff without worrying about all that “uptight, icky” moral stuff. This is not merely wrong, it is foolish.
7. Politics won’t save us. The leftist policies we complain about are a product of our failure to defend the Christian culture that the Constitution rested on. Leftist politicians are culture warriors, but we, in contrast, turn on our candidates who raise cultural issues in a serious way. Any political victory that is not also clearly a cultural victory is hollow. Both Bush presidencies illustrate that. Candidates who don’t even make a Bush-like pretense of raising cultural issues lose - but maybe we like our Doles and McCains.
8. The political discussion of candidates on FR this primary season has been the most childish I’ve ever seen. With the exception of Mittens, Huntsman, and Pawlenty, our candidates have been good to very good. But, instead of discussing relative strengths and weaknesses in a reasonable way, we have been stupidly tearing decent candidates apart.
9. Conservatives don’t deserve to be taken seriously, and won’t be, until we entirely delegitimize and shut down government schools and destroy the MSM by getting rid of our televisions and refusing to buy from sponsors of leftist (both cultural and political) programming.
The longer I read FR, the more convinced I am that Pogo was right.
I can condense what you said, into a few words; “Santorum supporters are brainless!” (THERE!, I said it!)
I’ve seen it because you have posted it in multiple Santorum threads. That’s not going to make me drop my support for him and turn to Gingrich. Santorum didn’t defend this and amended the law. No one is perfect, and Gingrich has skeletons in his closet too.
Rick? Is that you?
Uh, he didn’t defend it because it was indefensible. and he amended the law because he got caught. Only problem with your logic is Sanctimonium presents himself as the “God called me to do this” candidate, and his supporters call him the principled moral conservative. Newt admits he’s a sinner. His supporters know he is a sinner. that’s the problem with Santorum, he is not who he says he is... and this is just a the tip of the iceberg of evidence. You santorum supporters have to start facing the reality of who he is before it’s too late and you damage this country irreparablly. Stop compromising and rationalizing.
Yes, Rick Perry, that is...;-)
At this point I am just an ABM (Anyone But Mittens)guy.
2 reasons Conservatives vote for Senator Santorum:
1. Dr. James Dobson’s endorsement
2. Hours of support from Rush and Mark Levin
Santorum has been very blessed to receive the support of these men.
Just a few of Newt’s written accomplishments, (santorum’s 2 books are at the very end, one he wrote for his campaign, the other a bio about himself):
GINGRICH WRITINGS:
Nonfiction
Gingrich has authored or co-authored 18 non-fiction books since 1982.
* The Government’s Role in Solving Societal Problems, Associated Faculty Press, Incorporated. January 1982 ISBN 978-0-86733-026-7
* Window of Opportunity. Tom Doherty Associates, December 1985. ISBN 978-0-312-93923-6
* Contract with America (co-editor). Times Books, December 1994. ISBN 978-0-8129-2586-9
* Restoring the Dream. Times Books, May 1995. ISBN 978-0-8129-2666-8
* Quotations from Speaker Newt. Workman Publishing Company, Inc., July 1995. ISBN 978-0-7611-0092-8
* To Renew America. Farrar Straus & Giroux, July 1996. ISBN 978-0-06-109539-9
* Lessons Learned The Hard Way. HarperCollins Publishers, May 1998 ISBN 978-0-06-019106-1
* Presidential Determination Regarding Certification of the Thirty-Two Major Illicit Narcotics Producing and Transit Countries. DIANE Publishing Company, September 1999. ISBN 978-0-7881-3186-8
* Saving Lives and Saving Money. Alexis de Tocqueville Institution, April 2003. ISBN 978-0-9705485-4-2
* Winning the Future. Regnery Publishing, January 2005. ISBN 978-0-89526-042-0
* Rediscovering God in America: Reflections on the Role of Faith in Our Nation’s History and Future, Integrity Publishers, October 2006. ISBN 978-1-59145-482-3
* The Art of Transformation, with Nancy Desmond. CHT Press, November 29, 2006, ISBN 978-1-933966-00-7
* A Contract with the Earth, with Terry L. Maple. Johns Hopkins University Press, October 1, 2007. ISBN 978-0-8018-8780-2
* Real Change: From the World That Fails to the World That Works, Regnery Publishing, January 2008. ISBN 978-1-59698-053-2
* Drill Here, Drill Now, Pay Less: A Handbook for Slashing Gas Prices and Solving Our Energy Crisis, with Vince Haley. Regnery Publishing, September 2008 ISBN 978-1-59698-576-6
* 5 Principles for a Successful Life: From Our Family to Yours, with Jackie Gingrich Cushman, Crown Publishing Group, May 2009 ISBN 978-0-307-46232-9
* To Save America: Stopping Obama’s Secular-Socialist Machine, with Joe DeSantis. Regnery Publishing, May 2010 ISBN 978-1-59698-596-4
* A Nation Like No Other: Why American Exceptionalism Matters, Regnery Publishing, June 2011 ISBN 978-1-59698-271-0
Fiction
Gingrich co-wrote the following alternate history novels and series of novels with William R. Forstchen.
* 1945 Baen Books, August 1995 ISBN 978-0-671-87739-2
Civil War Series
* Gettysburg: A Novel of the Civil War Thomas Dunne Books, June 2003 ISBN 978-0-312-30935-0
* Grant Comes East Thomas Dunne Books, June 2004 ISBN 978-0-312-30937-4
* Never Call Retreat: Lee and Grant: The Final Victory Thomas Dunne Books, June 2005 ISBN 978-0-312-34298-2
* The Battle of the Crater: A Novel Thomas Dunne Books, November 2011 ISBN 978-0-312-60710-4
Pacific War Series
* Pearl Harbor: A Novel of December 8th Thomas Dunne Books, May 2007 ISBN 978-0-312-36350-5
* Days of Infamy Thomas Dunne Books, April 2008 ISBN 978-0-312-36351-2
Revolutionary War Series
* To Try Men’s Souls: A Novel of George Washington and the Fight for American Freedom, October 2009, ISBN 978-0-312-59106-9
* Valley Forge: George Washington and the Crucible of Victory, November 2010, ISBN 978-0-312-59107-6
Films
* Nine Days that Changed the World, Gingrich Productions, April 2010[186]
**********
Santorum Writings:
# Rick Santorum (2005). It Takes a Family: Conservatism and the Common Good. Intercollegiate Studies Institute. ISBN 1-932236-29-5.
# Rick Santorum (2005). Rick Santorum. Monument Press. ISBN 0-9769668-0-8.
*********
* Rediscovering God in America: Reflections on the Role of Faith in Our Nation’s History and Future, by Newt Gingrich. Integrity Publishers, October 2006. ISBN 978-1-59145-482-3
Rick Santorum doesn’t have a corner on the market in believing there is a place for faith in the public square. I am pretty sure what santorum knows wouldn’t make a half-chapter in Newt’s book. WAKE UP SANTORUM SUPPORTERS! WAKE UP!!
Santorum: “I’m such a conservative”
Romney: “I’m a severe conservative”
Newt: “Here’s what we’re gonna do”
Very well said!
“We are electing a president, not a priest.”
Many countries are filled with people of faith but they are “developing nations” because they don’t have what we do, a rule of law based on English common law. We are vetting candidates to be our presidential nominee and we want to focus on States Rights and local government; address a Federal government that has taken away our liberties; strengthen our national defense and repair our relationships with our allies, etc.
I believe it is time for Santorum to broaden his platform. He has made the electorate aware of his religious and moral underpinnings. By continuing to raise it, he is intentionally inviting the MSM to write about it. The electorate wants work, a strong economy, a safe country, and to live without fear of a government taking away our freedoms that are granted to all men in the Constitution.
Is he running for the office of the President or is he on a Crusade? Did he enter this primary to carry his message of faith and Life? Does he not see a path forward to the White House so has decided to parley his time on the stump into a sermon?
I will get back to you. In a meeting in 10, but will read it soon.
thanks. I wasn’t calling you out or anything, just really want to know what you think about it... I know you are pretty darn fair - on your good days :) Have a good one!
I heard the first Bishop Willard ad today in Mississippi. It was a series of attacks on Gingrich, which were classic Bishop Willard smears and deceptions. He did not waste ammunition on Santorum, or Obama. Fox handled the criticisms of Obama for him in the following new section.
Every political speech is a sermon, just as every law “imposes someone’s morality on someone else.” As for “people of faith”, there is only one faith that has led to self-consciously limited government and a free people - and it certainly wasn’t Mohammedanism, Hinduism, Shintoism, or Buddhism. Secularism, which is itself a “faith”, in its most malignant form leads to Pol Pot, Mao, and Stalin. In its more “benign” form it results in mass murder through abortion; economically it results in Greece, etc.
I simply hope that someone finds a way to derail Mittens.
Perry would have been the best canddidate. Too bad he didn’t take things as seriously as he should have at the beginning.
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