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H-1B Visas Take American Jobs
Townhall.com ^ | March 20, 2012 | Phyllis Schlafly

Posted on 03/20/2012 5:21:58 AM PDT by Kaslin

When President Obama was participating in a live video chat, Jennifer Wedel asked him, "Why does the government continue to issue and extend H-1B visas when there are tons of Americans just like my husband with no job?" Her husband is a semiconductor engineer who was laid off three years ago and is still unable to find an engineering job.

We all would like the answer to that question.

The U.S. Census Bureau reports that, counting only U.S.-born individuals, there are 101,000 with an engineering degree who are unemployed, another 244,000 who are not working or not looking for work and therefore not counted in unemployment statistics, and an additional 1.47 million who have an engineering degree but are not working as an engineer.

Obama's answer to Wedel sounded like he had been well briefed by the big corporation lobbyists. He even expressed bewilderment that any U.S. high-tech engineer could be out of work because industry executives tell him there is an unfilled "huge demand" for engineers.

Obama said, "H-1Bs should be reserved only for those companies who say they cannot find somebody in that particular field." Yes, indeed, they should. But in fact, they are not.

Created in 1990, the H-1B program was designed for employers to import foreign H-1B workers to fill various high-tech jobs only when Americans could not be found, and the law was supposed to make it illegal for an employer to replace an American with an H-1B worker. However, the big corporation lobbyists succeeded in fuzzying up the law so there is now no effective rule to prevent employers from firing American jobholders and replacing them with H-1B aliens.

Big companies prefer H-1B workers because they can pay them significantly less than Americans, never have to give them a raise or promotion, and have the unilateral power to deport them. H-1B workers don't dare to complain about working conditions or unpaid long hours, and they can't quit to take a better job.

Most H-1B workers are imported for entry-level jobs and trained by experienced U.S. workers who are then laid off. This process has introduced a new expression and acronym into the English language -- DYOG: Dig Your Own Grave.

One senator understands this problem: Sen. Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa. In a letter to the president last month, he pointed out how Obama's response to Jennifer Wedel shows he is only regurgitating the corporation lobbyists' sales talk with their phony mantra that "there are better and brighter people abroad."

Grassley said "thousands of qualified Americans remain out of work while companies are incentivized to import foreign workers." Grassley criticized the Obama administration for proposing new rules to "attract and retain highly skilled immigrants" to replace Americans, to expand eligibility for foreign students to remain in the U.S., to eliminate protections for U.S. workers, to allow employers to pay lower wages to alien workers and to give work authorizations to spouses of H-1B workers, thereby increasing competition for Americans looking for all kinds of jobs.

Obama has made expanding H-1Bs a feature of his re-election campaign, trying to broaden the program that already allows the importation of 65,000 H-1B visa aliens annually. Some people are even pushing the ridiculous notion of stapling a green card to college diplomas, so that foreigners would automatically be allowed to stay and work in our country.

Will that include the 57,000 Chinese undergraduates now in U.S. universities, most of whom were admitted on the basis of fake transcripts and recommendation letters, and are awarded college degrees for which they did not qualify? That's another racket that should be cleaned up.

Dickinson State University in North Dakota awarded degrees to 584 foreign students who did not earn them. On the day of an all-campus student meeting concerning this matter, Education Dean Douglas LaPlante was found dead from an apparently self-inflicted gunshot.

Media coverage of Obama's colloquy with Wedel focused on inviting her to send her husband's resume, but the real news should have been jobs. Is Obama ignorant of the unemployment reality facing U.S. engineers or is he disingenuously reciting the self-serving lies of his high-tech donors?

A good example of how the H-1B visa system works was described in a lawsuit filed against Molina Healthcare Inc., which handles Medicaid and Medicare paperwork for the government, and Cognizant Technology Solutions Corp., which recruits H-1B workers in India. On Jan. 14, 2010, one day after the Department of Labor approved Molina's application for 40 H-1B workers, Molina fired approximately 40 competent U.S. programmers, managers and analysts and hired 40 H-1B replacements imported by Cognizant from India.

That is how H-1B visas work in the real world to take jobs away from Americans.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial
KEYWORDS: h1b

1 posted on 03/20/2012 5:22:01 AM PDT by Kaslin
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To: Kaslin

If I spent all this time doing engineering and I can’t get a job because of some foreigner, I will be pissed.


2 posted on 03/20/2012 5:30:56 AM PDT by EEGator
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To: Kaslin

Liberal school curricula undermine our student’s ability to compete for these positions.
Get the liberal social agenda’s out of school and get back to basics on the courses offered and promoted.


3 posted on 03/20/2012 5:32:40 AM PDT by G Larry (We are NOT obliged to carry the snake in our pocket and then dismiss the bites as natural behavior.)
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To: Kaslin

Well-sourced and well-written article by Mrs. Schlafly, exposing yet another way that America is intentionally killing itself, exchanging short-term profit for long-term ruin.


4 posted on 03/20/2012 5:34:49 AM PDT by Always A Marine
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To: G Larry
Liberal school curricula undermine our student’s ability to compete for these positions.
Get the liberal social agenda’s out of school and get back to basics on the courses offered and promoted.


Red Herring Alert!

There are hundreds of thousands of experienced, proven, American engineering professionals, and IT professionals who are unable to get work because of imported 'guest workers' who frequently pay no or partial taxes, working at salaries upon which that Americans can't both pay full American taxes and eat!

In addition these 'guest workers' on shore enable off shoring to countries where one can live well on a salary of $5K - $ 10K. Try that in the US!
5 posted on 03/20/2012 5:46:06 AM PDT by khelus
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To: Kaslin

Just another example of how this president views himself—not as an American citizen but as a citizen of the ‘world.’ His every action is to bring Americans down.


6 posted on 03/20/2012 5:46:29 AM PDT by erkyl (We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office --Aesop (~550 BC))
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To: Kaslin

they took our juuuuuuhb!


7 posted on 03/20/2012 5:47:03 AM PDT by babble-on
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To: Kaslin

they took our juuuuuuhb!


8 posted on 03/20/2012 5:47:23 AM PDT by babble-on
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To: Kaslin

Thanks for the post.


9 posted on 03/20/2012 5:47:41 AM PDT by khelus
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To: Kaslin

More muslims


10 posted on 03/20/2012 5:49:28 AM PDT by onedoug
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To: Kaslin

I am looking forward to the day when most media jobs along with law firm positions are outsourced or H1-B’ed.


11 posted on 03/20/2012 5:52:33 AM PDT by Le Chien Rouge
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To: EEGator
I worked in Japan for 14 years. Their equivalent of the H-1B's was simple: Import all the foreign workers you want. But if they are as great as you say they are, you will be required to prove it by paying them at least a 10% premium over the going wage for the industry. And, by the way, they are free to move to another company willing to pay them more.

The result was a lot fewer and better paid foreign workers. I got frequent calls from other companies and changed once. When I was no longer worth the premium wage, then it was time for me and my family to come back to the United States.

12 posted on 03/20/2012 5:53:07 AM PDT by Vigilanteman (Obama: Fake black man. Fake Messiah. Fake American. How many fakes can you fit in one Zer0?)
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To: Vigilanteman

Was Japan expensive? Did you like it there?


13 posted on 03/20/2012 5:58:58 AM PDT by EEGator
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To: Kaslin

There are some, even on this forum, that defend the H1B program, but I can tell you that it definitely takes American IT jobs, - took mine! When you go to interview you must interview with an Indian guy and if you’re not another H1B, you’re wasting your time and being humiliated in the process.


14 posted on 03/20/2012 5:58:58 AM PDT by The Sons of Liberty (Psalm 109:8 Let his days be few and let another take his office. - Mene, Mene, Tekel, Upharsin)
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To: babble-on

15 posted on 03/20/2012 6:00:35 AM PDT by EEGator
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To: Kaslin

Thanks. Good article to post for the “while I’m against illegal immigrtion, I’m all for legal immigration” crowd.


16 posted on 03/20/2012 6:04:28 AM PDT by SharpRightTurn ( White, black, and red all over--America's affirmative action, metrosexual president.)
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To: Kaslin

Because years ago, the first Bush administration made a deal with India to export as many jobs as India wanted if they would be our military ally in Central Asia. That was later expanded under Slick to include China, which is kind of odd because China was the threat we were trying to neutralize in allying with India in the first place.


17 posted on 03/20/2012 6:07:00 AM PDT by IronJack (=)
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To: Kaslin

I have seen first hand the games played by organizations who use a revolving door of Indian engineers (hardware and software) to keep the wage scale depressed for American engineers.

The bean counters never want to pay for the highly diverse skill set and training (WAY more than any MBA)required to be a good engineer capable of developing systems for anything from skate boards to rockets so to keep the wage scale in line they use these H1Bs.

Never let your children become an engineer. To be really good you must not only have a great foundation in lets say electronics and software but you MUST continually keep abreast of the ever changing technology which comes much faster than the latest MBA scam for improving the bottom line by avoiding taxes, suppressing wages, tracking the age of the staff (see note 1 at end), stealing rebates from your customers (see note 2 at end) etc.

And, unless you work for an Engineering Firm, you will always be a spare tire. By that I mean, the mahogany row crowd will only call on you when they need something otherwise stay hidden in the trunk less you be seen by one of the MBA types at the golf outing.

One thing I found as Corporate Director Of Engineering for a $50B/year company was you tend to believe these H1B people understand English as they sort of speak it, but believe me there is a huge disconnect.

NOTE: I caught the HR department tracking the age of every member of the office staff so as to make sure they never reached retirement. In 16 years, in an office of 200+ only one person retired the rest were pushed out.

NOTE: One division (of 50+) was caught twice stealing major portions of customer rebates for consumables which were agreed upon in the contract. They were the division’s largest customer. They left. The mahogany row crowd had already been promoted because of the huge contribution to the bottom line, (with stolen money). The spare tire remained in the trunk.


18 posted on 03/20/2012 6:11:37 AM PDT by Wurlitzer (Welcome to the new USSA (United Socialist States of Amerika))
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To: Vigilanteman

We hear how Americans are just not smart enough... Just look at our scores compared to the world. We bought the lie, educators get more cash and companies do not have to pay those high employer taxes. What a bargain for us illiterate Americans.


19 posted on 03/20/2012 6:21:08 AM PDT by momincombatboots (Back to West by G-d Virginia.)
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To: erkyl
Just another example of how this president views himself—not as an American citizen but as a citizen of the ‘world.’ His every action is to bring Americans down.

Both parties have been equally complicit in flooding the country with 'guest workers' to replace those pesky well-paid middle class Americans. The H-1B began in 1990 under Bush I.
20 posted on 03/20/2012 6:29:40 AM PDT by khelus
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To: Le Chien Rouge
I am looking forward to the day when most media jobs along with law firm positions are outsourced or H1-B’ed.

I like the way you think. How about we add congress?
21 posted on 03/20/2012 6:35:33 AM PDT by khelus
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To: Wurlitzer
. . . Never let your children become an engineer. To be really good you must not only have a great foundation in lets say electronics and software but you MUST continually keep abreast of the ever changing technology which comes much faster than the latest MBA scam for improving the bottom line by avoiding taxes, suppressing wages, tracking the age of the staff (see note 1 at end), stealing rebates from your customers (see note 2 at end) etc. . .

I'm a soft ware engineer, and do not know anyone in the field who would allow their child to enter the field.

Thank for posting some of the shenanigans corporate bean counters use to avoid hiring americans in engineering and IT.

Ain't globalism global communism grand?
22 posted on 03/20/2012 6:50:49 AM PDT by khelus
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To: EEGator
Yes, Japan was expensive particularly on certain things such as most food. On other things such as eyeglasses and dental work, it was a bargain. Particularly when you compared value for the money and quality.

We loved it there. I'd go back in a heartbeat for the right opportunity.

23 posted on 03/20/2012 6:51:15 AM PDT by Vigilanteman (Obama: Fake black man. Fake Messiah. Fake American. How many fakes can you fit in one Zer0?)
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To: Kaslin

Follow the money. At my corp, we have crap loads of Chinese and Indians.

The more the company lays off, the more foreigners they bring.

This has been going on for the last decade, particularly within the last 5 years.


24 posted on 03/20/2012 6:57:44 AM PDT by servantboy777
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To: Kaslin

I have an H1-B and I can tell you right now - NO American can do what I do. H1-Bs need to be granted off of salary as opposed to a lottery. A person’s value to the economy can be objectively judged by that. That would eliminate the “low tech” people getting 20k/yr on an H1-B.


25 posted on 03/20/2012 7:02:11 AM PDT by impimp
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To: SharpRightTurn

At current immigration levels (approx. 1 million yr) we will overwhelm our infrastructure.

Check out the following lecture. It will blow the legal immigration crowd outta the water.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPjzfGChGlE


26 posted on 03/20/2012 7:04:17 AM PDT by servantboy777
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To: Kaslin

The two simple reforms that would fix the system:

1. We let in the top 68,000 based on the highest salaries, not the first to apply.

2. After 3 months in the US, each H1B is free to take a job with another employer at a higher salary.


27 posted on 03/20/2012 7:07:26 AM PDT by proxy_user
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To: Kaslin
H1-Bs reduce both the number of job offerings and wages. They do something else, too. They stack our engineer pool with poor-quality employees. I've been in IT for almost 20 years, including management and hiring, and I could write several books full of anecdotes about H1-B workers. There are several very common issues associated with H1-B workers:

1. Fraudulent credentials masking a lack of education and skills. Most H1-B workers have stellar credentials, usually including multiple technical degrees and certifications. These are often made up out of whole cloth. Always do the footwork to contact the university or certification organization. In several (10+ and counting) cases, I discovered that the issuing authority did not exist.

2. Absenteeism. "But they work so hard and pull such long hours!" you say. But do you factor in the annual 3-6 week leave of absence, usually applied for on short or no notice, without regard for project schedules?

3. Cultural fallout. If you want to see some serious fireworks, hire a Dalit lead engineer and put a Brahman developer under him. Oh, that's right...they won't tell you what caste they are when you hire them. Lucky you. You won't find out that there is an issue until a deadline is missed or someone resigns at a key moment. I'm watching a software team unravel right now because it is composed of two cultural groups that can't even be seen together in public in their home country. Needless to say they don't work well together. The simple social graces that we are accustomed to as Westerners (such as not spitting or shouting) should not be taken for granted.

One cultural anecdote: we once hired an honest-to-God Princess to be a software tester. She didn't TELL us that she was a damned Princess, of course. We found out when she only appeared for work occasionally, insisted on vanishing early on the days that she did deign to appear, and-this is the kicker-tried to outsource her tasks to her personal assistants. She fought tooth-and-nail to keep the job, too. Apparently it was either a rite-of-passage or some sort of religious labor for her. I'm told she still applies for every single job posting.

28 posted on 03/20/2012 7:15:16 AM PDT by jboot
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To: khelus
Both parties have been equally complicit in flooding the country with 'guest workers' to replace those pesky well-paid middle class Americans. The H-1B began in 1990 under Bush I.

Technically correct, but the program actually goes back much further than that including the the H-1 visa program in 1952 and the L-1 and L-2 visa program in 1970. Check out this link for the history of the H-1B visa program.

29 posted on 03/20/2012 7:16:37 AM PDT by kabar
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To: servantboy777
Count me in.

Worked in a software shop for a Major U.S. corporation. Of about 100 software engineers, less than 50% were American. The rest were all H1B.

The reason American engineers cannot compete with many H1B workers is not because of the Liberal “Americans are greedy” meme, it is because people of foreign birth have a different view of money and success. A person in India or China may think 30,000 is an unbelievable amount of money. And it is in their culture.

So, an employer can offer an extremely well qualified candidate 45,000 a year AND, they get to come to America. The guy's eyes will pop out of his head and he will jump on it. The H1B is working for more than just salary. He is working for his visa as well. This tends to keep him highly motivated. H1Bs have had a huge negative impact on the American technical jobs market in keeping jobs scarce and salaries low.

By the way, this erosion and destruction of American technical dominance was fully supported by all administrations Republican and Democrat over the last 40 years, the same way they supported the destruction of any form of American manufacturing. All it takes is for one employer to give a few congressmen a briefcase full of money and 'voila', suddenly you can outsource anything you want and import as many foreign workers as you want and, wink, wink, sure we'll keep that border open. Don't worry about it. (wink)

Anything Americans invent or build, politicians tear it down and distribute it globally in the name of 'fairness' or something. It is the stupidest thing on Earth, but what can you do? I really do believe that many politicians would sell their own mother into slavery for a few bucks. But never mind.

If you are going into the tech field today, it would serve you well to speak Urdu and some Chinese. That is where all the action is now. A software guy named Ted or Bill or Paul is a rare breed these days. Oh, and get used to pronouncing names with 56 characters in them. It is pretty common out there.

30 posted on 03/20/2012 7:35:20 AM PDT by 240B (he is doing everything he said he wouldn't and not doing what he said he would)
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To: khelus

Reuters and Yahoo writers are sitting in Bangalore.
Check any breaking news, and then check footnote.


31 posted on 03/20/2012 7:46:39 AM PDT by jennychase
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To: kabar; All
... Technically correct, but the program actually goes back much further than that including the H-1 visa program in 1952 and the L-1 and L-2 visa program in 1970. Check out this link for the history of the H-1B visa program.

This is an excellent link. Rob Sanchez has done very thorough research on 'guest workers'. In fact this is an excellent site.

As in many other areas there has been a major degeneration in the way NIV [non-immigrantion visas] are handled in the US.

There is a huge difference between the H-1 and H-1B:
the H-1B is embedded in 'Free Trade Agreements', administered by the inelected bureaucracy at the WTO, overrides US immigration law, gives no consideration to the current job market, and applications have been proven to be rubber stamped.

I know people in IT who came in under the old H-1 visa. In order to qualify they had to prove their educational and work history, under go health and security screening like one once did to get a green card. The number of H-1's were limited by the job market; they had to wait for an opening in the US. "Foreign workers were required to go back to their home countries if they lost their job, or if the visa expired. The H-1 program was mandated to be TEMPORARY."

The L-1 visa was originally used on to bring executives and their families for intra company transfers. In practice the L-1 visa has also morphed into a way to bring in foreign workers and suppress the job market and salaries for Americans. IIRC, the numbers of L-1 visas now surpass the numbers of H-1B's.

Rob has an excellent article detailing the alphabet soup of guest workers here: The Most Generous Nation in the World... at Giving Jobs Away

Here's a chart of the number of persons given authorization to work in the US in 2008:


32 posted on 03/20/2012 7:59:52 AM PDT by khelus
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To: 240B
... By the way, this erosion and destruction of American technical dominance was fully supported by all administrations Republican and Democrat over the last 40 years, the same way they supported the destruction of any form of American manufacturing. All it takes is for one employer to give a few congressmen a briefcase full of money and 'voila', suddenly you can outsource anything you want and import as many foreign workers as you want and, wink, wink, sure we'll keep that border open. Don't worry about it. (wink)
Anything Americans invent or build, politicians tear it down and distribute it globally in the name of 'fairness' or something. ...


Great post! This is why globalism = global communism, gotta spread the wealth of the American middle class! When politicians pander on about harmonization of living standards, they don't tell you that they mean bring ours down to that of the third world.
33 posted on 03/20/2012 8:15:25 AM PDT by khelus
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To: 240B
I also had a conversation with an Indian (nice enough fella), and he indicated in the conversation that he has amassed thousands of dollars in credit card debt for education, living expenses and so forth.

He said and I paraphrase,”If the federal government screws with him and his visa, he'll just say screw it and go home, leaving the C/Crd company to eat the debt.”

I thought to myself.....oh great, leave us with the tab.

34 posted on 03/20/2012 8:18:09 AM PDT by servantboy777
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To: khelus
Right. The chart from CIS provides the basis for Roy Beck's assertion that we are bringing in 125,000 LEGAL FOREIGN WORKERS A MONTH right now while 22 million Americans are looking for fulltime employment. It makes no sense at all. And we are bringing in the wrong kind of immigrants, i.e., they are poor, uneducated, and unskilled. We don't need more high school dropouts. 57% of all immigrant headed households with children are on at least one major welfare program.


35 posted on 03/20/2012 8:52:20 AM PDT by kabar
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To: servantboy777
People from many nations do that all the time. Back in the 90s, when the blizzard of free approved credit cards were flooding America, I knew people from overseas who would apply for every single one of them knowing they were going to leave the country in a few months.

Each time they were approved, they would immediately max-out the card, send the stuff home to where ever they were from, and apply for a new credit limit. In some cases they were able to amass hundreds of thousands of dollars this way with no intention whatsoever of even attempting to pay it back. They called it ‘free money from America’ and it was.

In some cases, they could return home, bribe the right guy for a new name and a new passport, apply for a new visa with the new name, come back to the U.S. and do it all over again.

They were obviously wrong in a moral sense for doing this, but the credit companies have to bear some of the blame for their idiotic idea of giving anyone who fills out an application, credit. That was a crazy time in America.

36 posted on 03/20/2012 9:00:54 AM PDT by 240B (he is doing everything he said he wouldn't and not doing what he said he would)
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To: Kaslin

This is an accurate representation of the H1B sham. Companies only have to ‘say’ that qualified Americans ‘can’t be found.’ In no way is this verified or attested to legally.


37 posted on 03/20/2012 9:07:41 AM PDT by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto.)
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To: kabar
Thanks for posting the Pew data.

We are frequently told that Texas bears a moral burden w/r/t the high dropout rate among "minority" students.

A revision appears in the form of background study work which has shown that high dropout rates are tied closely to parental involvement and parental attitudes toward the value of education.

You supplied the missing piece. The feckless parents are feckless because they are your illegal aliens who never graduated from high school themselves and have passed that attitude to their kids.

Nice of the earlier social workers, though, to omit the fact of parental fecklessness and its organic, tight tie to illegal status, while maintaining the liberal fiction that this situation creates a moral call on, and burden of cracker guilt for, Texas voters and politicians.

38 posted on 03/20/2012 10:15:29 AM PDT by lentulusgracchus
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To: 240B

Urdu or Chinese? What do the Pakistanis have to do with anything? India is ahead of Pakistan and in both countries, educated people should speak English. If you try to deal with India using a native language, you better pick teh right one. Bengalis don’t like being addressed in Hindi.


39 posted on 03/20/2012 3:16:23 PM PDT by rmlew ("Mosques are our barracks, minarets our bayonets, domes our helmets, the believers our soldiers.")
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To: impimp
I have an H1-B and I can tell you right now - NO American can do what I do.

Hilarious. Not only are you talented and indispensable, but you are quite the comedian.
40 posted on 03/20/2012 4:59:26 PM PDT by dmartin (Not the 'Change' you were 'Hoping' for?)
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To: impimp
NO American can do what I do

Let me guess - you're the last living speaker of Volapük.

41 posted on 03/20/2012 5:06:19 PM PDT by Revolting cat! (Let us prey!)
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To: Kaslin

bttt


42 posted on 03/20/2012 5:42:37 PM PDT by Pelham (Marco Rubio, la raza trojan horse.)
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To: Kaslin

“Some people are even pushing the ridiculous notion of stapling a green card to college diplomas, so that foreigners would automatically be allowed to stay and work in our country.”

This is de facto policy already for foreign STEM Ph.D's (Science, Technology, Engineering, Math).

They essentially receive a six year work visa with their graduate degree.

A truly determined Ph.D can almost always turn this six year window into a Green Card, a sham marriage, or USA citizenship.

Reports that foreign STEM Ph.D's are sent home are 99% bunk.

About 80% of Western European, Japanese, and oil rich Middle Eastern Ph.D's return voluntarily to their home nation, where their pay, status, opportunity, and standard of living is similar to the USA.

Close to 80% of Chinese, Russian, Indian, and Eastern European Ph.D's stay permanently in the USA.

If you ever wonder why so few native born Americans get a STEM Ph.D, competing for jobs against desperate scholars from third world countries is a very good reason.

Foreign STEM students with just a Bachelor's degree also have abundant opportunities.

The most determined ones can easily get a one or two year internship in the USA.

They get a fraction of the pay a new American graduate would receive, they never argue with the boss, and they never threaten to change jobs.

Guess who gets hired first?

43 posted on 03/21/2012 1:30:11 AM PDT by zeestephen
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To: Le Chien Rouge
We have the same fantasy, L.C.R.

I envision myself as the GOP presidential candidate speaking at Harvard Law School and Columbia Journalism School where I announce my first Executive Order will be unlimited immigration for foreign lawyers and journalists.

Ahhh.....

I can hear the thunderous applause already.

44 posted on 03/21/2012 1:38:06 AM PDT by zeestephen
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To: impimp

“H1-Bs need to be granted [based on] salary.....”

Exactly!

If we make a blanket rule that all Green Cards, all Work Visas, and all New Citizens must have a job paying at least $125,000, the “legal” immigration issue would solve itself.

45 posted on 03/21/2012 1:52:03 AM PDT by zeestephen
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