Can Cops Arrest George Zimmerman for Murder in Trayvon Martin Case?

Opposingviews ^ | 24 March, 2012 | Eugene Volokh

[cuban leaf]

—We know that a 911 dispatcher told Zimmerman not to follow Martin.—

Actually, no. The dispatcher told Z that they didn’t need him to follow Tray. Huge difference. Most men still would have followed.

[precisionshootist]

"My understanding is that law enforcement must sign an affidavit stating that believe there is probable cause to make the charge of murder and if the outcome is justifiable homicide then law enforcement becomes liable to the defendant. This is another aspect of the 2005 stand your ground law designed to ensure that police don’t automatically arrest people for defending themselves."

Exactly correct!!

Stand your ground, Castle Laws, etc. exist to protect people from THE POLICE, AND PROSECUTORS who have a record of arresting the victim in cases like these.

I find it disturbing that we even need these laws but many states and communities have found them necessary to protect innocent people from unjustified arrest and prosecution. To put it bluntly we as a society are trying to balance out big government police state powers that have spun out of control.

[Old Teufel Hunden]

"Most men still would have followed."

I disagree. I would not have followed. I would not need the 911 operator to tell me not to follow. It's not worth it. You call the cops and let them handle it. When you get into a confrontation, you risk both of your lives. You don't know what kind of weapons he has on him. It doesn't matter who's stronger or knows karate or whatever. In a fight, anything can happen.

[Tatze]

Not to mention that a 911 operator has no legal authority to order anyone to do anything. Zimmerman was under no legal obligation to follow the operator’s suggestion.

[Java4Jay]

I heard it happened around 7pm

[Cboldt]

-- Once again, in the police report, the kid is talking on the phone to his girl friend, he tells her someone is following him, she says she heard zimmerman and the phone went dead --

I don't see that in the 4 pages of police report that I have (Twin-Lakes-Shooting-Initial-Report.pdf). I did see a report (clickable link to www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2863797/posts?page=149#149; not an official report, and I don't know the origin of it - might be a fabrication, for all I know) where the GF states facts that justify Zimmerman's actions and make Trayvon the aggressor.

[TexasFreeper2009]

It doesn’t matter if Zimmerman kept following Martin after the dispatcher told him not to (he is a free citizen and can walk down the street if he so chooses)

It doesn’t matter if Zimmerman asked Martin what he was doing(he is a free citizen and can talk to whomever he so chooses, it’s called free speech)

It doesn’t even matter if Zimmerman started the fight.

All that matters is if at some point during the fight Zimmerman felt that his life was in danger, at that point had the right to use deadly force to save his life (it’s called self defense)

[TexasFreeper2009]

yep battery, the same as you would get for a bar fight. A ticket basically and a small fine.

[Old Teufel Hunden]

You are right, the 911 operator has no authority over Zimmerman. But that was wise advice and indeed turned out to be would you not agree? All he saw was Martin acting suspiciously, not even committing a crime. It’s worth calling the cops on, but not worth getting in a confrontation over. I’ll bet he agrees with me about right now.

[org.whodat]

Some people here are posting bs for some hidden purpose, the time, the adding sixty pounds to the kids weight, saying the kid was on top of zimmerman, but no one knows it that was more than a second. And then all the BS pictures of the kid, which no one knows are real or photoshoped crap. Then some clown said the kid had gold teeth and tats. All of which can be added and taken away with the computer. Then they start the crap about the kid may have done this or that. None of which would make it into a court, since what happened to the kid up until he had his run in with zimmerman has anything to do with the case.

[org.whodat]

The flordia stand your ground law does not apply here so what law of defense is he using.

[org.whodat]

The Florida stand your ground law does not apply here so what law of defense is he using.

[CAluvdubya]

I find it hard to believe that a 140 pound kid beat the crap out of zimmerman, who was 80 lbs heaver for five minutes.

Maybe it took part of that time trying to sneak up on Zimmerman? I would have run back to where I was staying since I'd lost the guy.

Zimmerman had already stated on the phone to the police that he had lost the kid and was heading back to his truck. That is on record from the taped call.

[Old Teufel Hunden]

All that you say may in fact be true. The investigation will sort this out. I think that if he did in fact follow him, he is liable for something. I’m no lawyer so I don’t know for sure. All of that is irrelevant though. What is relevant is someone died needlessly and tragically. It may turn out to be just a terrible tragedy where no one is at fault, but someone is still dead. Is that worth possibly following him and putting in motion these tragic events? I don’t think so.

[pops88]

Are you on overtime pay now, or did you just pass the posting account to someone else?

[org.whodat]

So he admitted he was unlawfully chasing the kid.

[org.whodat]

Knock of the personal crap.

[TexasFreeper2009]

Even if Zimmerman attacked Martin totally unprovoked (extremely unlikely) then Zimmerman would only be guilty of battery, a minor crime that usually results in a ticket and a small fine.

In regards to a murder charge, all that matters is if at some point during the fight Zimmerman felt that his life was in danger, at that point had the right to use deadly force to save his life (it’s called self defense)

[Oztrich Boy]

I did not realize it was 3AM when this took place

It wasn't. Sanford PD didpatcher logs the xaal from Zimmerman at 12 seconds past 7:11PM. logs off at 15 seconds past 7:15PM

Martin was on his phone to his girl from 7:12 to 7:16, phone call ends just after Zimmerman and Martin meet.

Police arrive in area at 7:17PM. Find Zimmerman and Martin's dead body sometime between then and c.7:20. EMT;s pronounce Martin dead at 7:30PM

Some of us are having a hard time fitting Martin stalking and attacking Zimmerman, a major fight, and the shooting in the space of 1-3 minutes.

[CAluvdubya]

No law against following someone on the street. I just heard the play back of the police call. The word used is following NOT chasing.

Now who's the one changing facts, eh?

BTW, it's also on record, by an eye witness, that Martin had Zimmerman on the ground and was beating him with his fists.

The police have already investigated this case and found no reason to charge Zimmerman. The evidence and witness backed up his story.

Nobody ever said this wasn't a tragic event all the way around.