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Marines Push Quietly, But Hard, For Navy to Replace C-2s With V-22s
AOL Defense ^ | 3/7/2012 | Richard Whittle

Posted on 04/07/2012 1:48:58 AM PDT by U-238

Landing a V-22 Osprey helicopter-style on the sprawling flight deck of the nuclear aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush was a snap, says Marine Corps test pilot Capt. Dan McKinney.

With Lt. Col. David Weinstein, McKinney did it a dozen times on March 20 – six landings in daylight, six at night. After their first two touchdowns, sailors perched in the carrier's superstructure to watch the helicopter-airplane hybrid Osprey's first-ever carrier qualification landings, conducted off the coast of North Carolina, started giving the pilots "a lot of thumbs-up."

Marine leaders hope the Osprey's "carrier quals," scheduled to continue in May and June, will help the Osprey get a thumbs-up as well from the admirals who run the Navy when they pick a replacement aircraft for their aging C-2A Greyhounds, the twin-engine turboprops that haul cargo, mail and passengers between carriers and the shore -- a mission called COD for "carrier on-board delivery." The first prototypes flew in 1964.

(Excerpt) Read more at defense.aol.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: aerospace; aircraftcarrier; c2; cvn77; mv22; navair; usmc; usnavy; v22

1 posted on 04/07/2012 1:49:03 AM PDT by U-238
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To: magslinger

ping


2 posted on 04/07/2012 2:17:22 AM PDT by FreedomPoster (Islam delenda est)
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120320-N-YM590-456 ATLANTIC OCEAN (March 20, 2012) An MV-22 Osprey flies by the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush (CVN 77) as the ship steams through the Atlantic Ocean. George H.W. Bush is in the Atlantic Ocean conducting carrier qualifications. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 2nd Class Brian M. Brooks/Released)

120320-N-YM590-481 ATLANTIC OCEAN (March 20, 2012) An MV-22 Osprey lands on the flight deck of the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush (CVN 77) during test operations. George H.W. Bush is in the Atlantic Ocean conducting carrier qualifications. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 2nd Class Brian M. Brooks/Released)

120320-N-YM590-531 ATLANTIC OCEAN (March 20, 2012) An MV-22 Osprey lands on the flight deck of the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush (CVN 77) during test operations. George H.W. Bush is in the Atlantic Ocean conducting carrier qualifications. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 2nd Class Brian M. Brooks/Released)

120320-N-NW381-059 ATLANTIC OCEAN (March 20, 2012) An MV-22 Osprey lands on the flight deck of the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush (CVN 77) during test operations. George H.W. Bush is in the Atlantic Ocean conducting carrier qualifications. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 3rd Class Maria Rachel D. Melchor/Released)

120320-N-XE109-364 ATLANTIC OCEAN (Feb. 5, 2012) Aviation Boatswain's Mate (Handling) 3rd Class Christopher W. Landrum signals an MV-22 Osprey to land on the flight deck of the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush (CVN 77) during test operations. George H.W. Bush is in the Atlantic Ocean conducting carrier qualifications. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist Seaman Brian Read Castillo/Released)

120320-N-XE109-463 ATLANTIC OCEAN (Feb. 5, 2012) Aviation Boatswain's Mate (Handling) 3rd Class Michael S. Alves signals an MV-22 Osprey to land on the flight deck of the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush (CVN 77) during test operations. George H.W. Bush is in the Atlantic Ocean conducting carrier qualifications. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist Seaman Brian Read Castillo/Released)

120320-N-YM590-835 ATLANTIC OCEAN (March 20, 2012) An MV-22 Osprey maneuvers on the flight deck of the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush (CVN 77) during test operations. George H.W. Bush is in the Atlantic Ocean conducting carrier qualifications. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 2nd Class Brian M. Brooks/Released)

120320-N-XE109-746 ATLANTIC OCEAN (March 20, 2012) Aviation Boatswain's Mate (Handling) 3rd Class Christopher W. Landrum directs the movement of an MV-22 Osprey on the flight deck of the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush (CVN 77) during test operations. George H.W. Bush is in the Atlantic Ocean conducting carrier qualifications. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist Seaman Brian Read Castillo/Released)

120320-N-YM590-700 ATLANTIC OCEAN (March 20, 2012) An MV-22 Osprey takes off from the flight deck of the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush (CVN 77) during test operations. George H.W. Bush is in the Atlantic Ocean conducting carrier qualifications. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 2nd Class Brian M. Brooks/Released)

120320-N-IM823-006 ATLANTIC OCEAN (March 20, 2012) Aviation Boatswain's Mate (Handling) 3rd Class Christopher W. Landrum directs the landing of an MV-22 Osprey on the flight deck of the aircraft carrier USS George H.W. Bush (CVN 77) during test operations. George H.W. Bush is in the Atlantic Ocean conducting carrier qualifications. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 1st Class Joseph R. Vincent/Released)

3 posted on 04/07/2012 3:01:13 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: U-238

Title and text seems a bit misleading as V-22 formal carrier landings were done during aircraft testing phase at least as early as 1999, if not before. This documentation was actually the sea trials of the carrier, not the Osprey.

The pictures are beautiful, though.


4 posted on 04/07/2012 3:16:31 AM PDT by TexasRedeye
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To: U-238

Do these people just make up stuff because they don’t know history?

I’m retired from Bell Helicopter. We developed two proof-of-concept aircraft designated the XV-15 beginning decades ago and one is in the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum. They led to the much larger V-22 configurations for Navy, Air Force and Marines. ....Carrier qualifications for the V-22 were initially perfomed successfully MANY years ago, not just this March. ....These qualifications were probably for the pilots, not the aircraft.

I served in Catapults on a carrier in the Navy and before we deployed for a multi-month cruise to the Med, we’d conduct day and night ops to qualify the various squadron pilots that were to be deployed with the ship.


5 posted on 04/07/2012 3:19:50 AM PDT by octex
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To: TexasRedeye

V-22 formal carrier landings were done during aircraft testing phase at least as early as 1999, if not before. This documentation was actually the sea trials of the carrier, not the Osprey.
******************
Agree with you. Also teaching flight deck workers and qualifying pilots.


6 posted on 04/07/2012 3:25:16 AM PDT by octex
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To: TexasRedeye
V-22 formal carrier landings were done during aircraft testing phase at least as early as 1999, if not before.

What boat?

7 posted on 04/07/2012 3:50:31 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: octex
I’m retired from Bell Helicopter.

Me, too! I worked on the XV-15 in the '70s and right up through the XV-22 development until the early 1990's then spent the next 10 or so years on the Model CF-412 production and delivery program.

8 posted on 04/07/2012 3:52:40 AM PDT by TexasRedeye
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To: A.A. Cunningham
What boat?

Don't know which ship but official sea trials were first conducted in 2002. BTW - the aircraft broke during these trials!

9 posted on 04/07/2012 4:13:27 AM PDT by TexasRedeye
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To: TexasRedeye
Title and text seems a bit misleading as V-22 formal carrier landings were done during aircraft testing phase at least as early as 1999, if not before. This documentation was actually the sea trials of the carrier, not the Osprey.

Yes, I remember seeing pictures of at least one early V-22 on a CV/CVN. Can't remember which tho.

CarQuals are different than the carrier evaluation trials that are conducted during an aircraft's development phase.

I'd like to know whether these were straight vertical landings and take-offs, or whether they mixed in the rolling (STOL) ones people think will be necessary to give the V-22 the range and load-carrying to compete with the C-2 as a COD platform.
10 posted on 04/07/2012 4:25:34 AM PDT by tanknetter
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To: U-238

The C-2A was ancient back in 87-93 when I flew it. I always wondered why it wasn’t replaced with the V-22 ages ago.


11 posted on 04/07/2012 4:29:59 AM PDT by ALPAPilot
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To: magslinger

List ping please..GREAT pics!!!


12 posted on 04/07/2012 4:41:48 AM PDT by ken5050
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To: ALPAPilot
I always wondered why it (COD) wasn’t replaced with the V-22 ages ago.

Tanknetter hit it with range/load capability. The Navy has always been reluctant to adopt the Osprey primarily due to the costs and "availability rate" of the V-22 anyway. Also, on-board maintenance presents a multitude of problems.

13 posted on 04/07/2012 4:44:33 AM PDT by TexasRedeye
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To: TexasRedeye

If you are a carrier aviator, it’s “the boat” not “ship”


14 posted on 04/07/2012 4:50:02 AM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: SampleMan
If you are a carrier aviator, it’s “the boat” not “ship”

OK! To a simple land lubber (Army aviation) like me, ships "carry" boats or "boats" are submarines. The Osprey had "ship board" trials, though, or at least that is what the Navy called them when I was working on them.

15 posted on 04/07/2012 4:57:15 AM PDT by TexasRedeye
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To: TexasRedeye
Redeye nails it. Cost is the driver here, not capability. Just like everywhere else in DoD. And yes, this is dynamic interface testing for the new USS BUSH. Thousands of MV/CV-22 ops have been operationally performed over the last decade or so on the amphibs. TC
16 posted on 04/07/2012 5:05:53 AM PDT by Pentagon Leatherneck
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To: TexasRedeye
Tanknetter hit it with range/load capability.

Do you know the range/load capability of the V-22? The C-2A could carry about 10,000 lbs. of cargo or 26 passengers for about 1000 miles doing about 280 Knots.

I thought the V-22 folded up pretty small, but I just don't know that much about it.

17 posted on 04/07/2012 5:07:18 AM PDT by ALPAPilot
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To: U-238

Beautiful pics. Just don’t try bringing that plane into a hot LZ. :-)


18 posted on 04/07/2012 5:37:13 AM PDT by Rannug ("God has given it to me, let him who touches it beware.")
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To: ALPAPilot

Published load/range/speed is very similar to the C-2 in the modern V-22. Operational problems aboard a carrier, though, are quite different, complex and, in these days, costly. No doubt, these issues will be overcome (politically).

As to the “hot” LZ, the limited field of fire available to a door gunner makes a “stinger” in the tail virtually the only defense until forward firing armament is developed for it. Since the Marines are the Marines, look for a turret under the chin, weapon pods under the wings or something similar in the future.


19 posted on 04/07/2012 5:53:41 AM PDT by TexasRedeye
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To: TexasRedeye

Official Sea Trials on a CV/CVN, aka boat, have not been executed for the V-22 prior to now. Sea Trials involves a syllabus of KPPs; Key Performance Parameters. The first boat to conduct Sea Trials for the Osprey was the Wasp in December of 1990. The second boat to conduct Sea Trials for the Osprey was the Saipan in January of 1999. Wasp is a LHD. Saipan is a LHA. Just landing on the deck of a CV/CVN doesn’t constitute executing Sea Trials.


20 posted on 04/07/2012 8:02:44 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: Rannug
Just don’t try bringing that plane into a hot LZ.

Don't tell that to the Osprey aircrews who already have.

21 posted on 04/07/2012 8:05:28 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: TexasRedeye

Another issue for the V-22 is the heat from the exhaust when the propellers are rotated upwards. Apparently, this has caused difficulties when landing or taking off, causing near melting conditions on the deck superstructure.

You don’t hear about this problem these days. Maybe they have found a way to deal with it.


22 posted on 04/07/2012 8:23:55 AM PDT by Fractal Trader
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To: A.A. Cunningham

When they put jets on this thing, it’s gonna be a game changer.


23 posted on 04/07/2012 8:33:37 AM PDT by blueunicorn6 ("A crack shot and a good dancer")
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To: A.A. Cunningham
Just landing on the deck of a CV/CVN doesn’t constitute executing Sea Trials.

OK. What we did in the '90s were called "Proof of concept". We just trying to sell the darn thing!

24 posted on 04/07/2012 9:26:34 AM PDT by TexasRedeye
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To: Fractal Trader
Apparently, this has caused difficulties when landing or taking off, causing near melting conditions on the deck superstructure.

Sounds like you're channeling Carlton Meyer and his cabal of buffoons at that hack blog he runs.

The deck heating issue was solved long ago

25 posted on 04/07/2012 9:29:36 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: U-238

V-22 Unit Cost ~ $70 Million
C-2A Unit cost ~ $39 million


26 posted on 04/07/2012 12:59:12 PM PDT by Josh Painter ("We will not save our country by becoming like the left." - Sarah Palin)
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To: SampleMan

I always thought a ship was a ship and a boat was a sub.

Oh well.


27 posted on 04/09/2012 3:08:15 PM PDT by hattend (Jesus wants me to make churches pay for abortions. - Barack Obama)
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To: hattend

“The Boat” is a term of endearment for a CV by Naval Aviators.


28 posted on 04/09/2012 3:42:42 PM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: hattend

“The Boat” is a term of endearment for a CV by Naval Aviators.


29 posted on 04/09/2012 3:42:59 PM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: A.A. Cunningham
I would have thought that the .51’s and rpg’s would have made mince meat out of it. Really glad it can survive that environment.
30 posted on 04/10/2012 5:05:24 AM PDT by Rannug ("God has given it to me, let him who touches it beware.")
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