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Osprey crashes in Morocco, two dead
Jacksonville Daily News ^ | 4/11/12

Posted on 04/11/2012 5:06:48 PM PDT by sonofagun

RABAT, Morocco (AP) — Two U.S. Marines were killed and two severely injured in the crash of a hybrid aircraft in Morocco on Wednesday, officials said.

The Marines were taking part in joint U.S.-Moroccan military excercises located in the south of the country based in Agadir, said U.S. Embassy spokesman Rodney Ford in Rabat, who gave the toll.

Capt. Kevin Schultz, a Marine spokesman at the Pentagon in Washington, confirmed that the aircraft involved was an MV-22 Osprey, which takes off and lands like a helicopter and flies like an airplane. The aircraft was participating in a U.S.-Moroccan military exercise known as "African Lion."

(Excerpt) Read more at jdnews.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aerospace; crash; marineaviation; marines; meu; mv22; navair; osprey; planecrash
I have a son that flys an Osprey from the Iwo Jima. I believe he had duty aboard ship today so wasn't flying.

Wives haven't heard anything yet.

Keep these young men in you prayers as these are dangerous missions even when not flying into combat.

1 posted on 04/11/2012 5:07:02 PM PDT by sonofagun
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To: sonofagun

Prayers for you and the Marines.


2 posted on 04/11/2012 5:10:54 PM PDT by OwenKellogg (Charter Member of the Nut-job Conspiracy Theory Ping List)
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To: sonofagun

I didn’t know we have troops in Morocco


3 posted on 04/11/2012 5:18:30 PM PDT by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: sonofagun

prayers offered


4 posted on 04/11/2012 5:25:47 PM PDT by FourPeas ("Maladjusted and wigging out is no way to go through life, son." -hg)
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To: sonofagun
i think this is the third operational loss, Prayers up...
5 posted on 04/11/2012 5:27:31 PM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: sonofagun
I read a few days ago about a push to replace COD aircraft with the Ospreys.
I've been watching their development for years (decades?) and I just don't have a good feeling about them. A lot of people have been killed in these things - whether to training or maintenance or just inherent dangers/stabilization in hover to flight transition and back.

I don't know. I can't quantify it - can't back it up with facts, just as an aviation nut, ex-Navy aircrew and pilot myself, I'd hate to have a son flying them.
I'd never sleep.

Prayers up!

6 posted on 04/11/2012 5:27:31 PM PDT by grobdriver
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To: sonofagun

Your son is in my prayers this evening. I hope to God he’s safe and sound and that the men who died are in God’s hands. Their mission is complete here and they’ve served us well. God Bless them and God Bless their families.


7 posted on 04/11/2012 5:27:55 PM PDT by Dick Vomer (democrats are like flies, whatever they don't eat they sh#t on.)
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To: GeronL
I didn’t know we have troops in Morocco

From the fine article: "The aircraft was participating in a U.S.-Moroccan military exercise known as "African Lion." "

Bet you didn't know we recently sold Morocco F-16s, either.

8 posted on 04/11/2012 5:28:48 PM PDT by Yo-Yo (Is the /sarc tag really necessary?)
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To: GeronL
I didn’t know we have troops in Morocco

We have troops in over 150 different countries. Guarding embassies, maintaining airfields and ports, helping move supplies, training governments on how to fight insurgents, Afghanistan, intelligence gathering, the list goes on.
9 posted on 04/11/2012 5:33:27 PM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: GeronL
I didn’t know we have troops in Morocco

The Marines are attached to the 24th Marine Expeditionary Unit and is at sea. Morocco is apparently a friendly power that we train with on occasion.

10 posted on 04/11/2012 5:35:02 PM PDT by sonofagun (Some think my cynicism grows with age. I like to think of it as wisdom!)
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To: GeronL
DOD put out a list of countries and our troop deployments last fall:

http://siadapp.dmdc.osd.mil/personnel/MILITARY/history/hst1109.pdf
11 posted on 04/11/2012 5:35:36 PM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: grobdriver
I don't know. I can't quantify it - can't back it up with facts, just as an aviation nut, ex-Navy aircrew and pilot myself, I'd hate to have a son flying them. I'd never sleep.

There've been a lot of lessons learned flying this machine. My son loves it and I have every confidence that the plane will take care of the troops as long as the pilot takes care to follow his training as is true with any type aircraft.

The last operational loss, I believe, was an Air Force Model that the pilot flew into the ground. Even at that, most of the occupants survived.

12 posted on 04/11/2012 5:39:41 PM PDT by sonofagun (Some think my cynicism grows with age. I like to think of it as wisdom!)
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To: sonofagun

I hate to hear of things like this. May God have mercy on their souls and may they rest in peace.
Prayers for the dead and their families going up.

I think it’s awesome that you have a son flying those, you must be proud despite the danger, not that the Osprey is dangerous but these guys are always prepared and training for war.


13 posted on 04/11/2012 5:40:02 PM PDT by Lx (Do you like it, do you like it. Scott? I call it Mr. and Mrs. Tennerman chili.)
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To: GeronL

We have law enforcement and/or military in 143 countries.


14 posted on 04/11/2012 5:41:12 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: grobdriver

The Osprey is a dangerous aircraft. It was in development for over 20 years because it was so dangerous. When it couldn’t meet the operational requirements, they simply lowered the requirements.


15 posted on 04/11/2012 5:44:33 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Never believe anything in politics until it has been officially denied.)
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To: GeronL

We probably have troops in about 80 % of the world’s nations. And for the life of me I cannot fathom why.


16 posted on 04/11/2012 5:49:32 PM PDT by emax
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To: emax
We probably have troops in about 80 % of the world’s nations. And for the life of me I cannot fathom why.

"War on Terror" (i.e. the never-ending war), embassy guard duty, training, maintaining airfields, supply depots, and naval ports for our troops overseas, there are many reasons why we have troops scattered around the world.

Are they all necessary? A lot are necessary - I would rather not see our Marines pulled out of embassy guard duty, and a lot of the airfields and ports are needed to support our missions overseas, and we do a lot of intelligence gathering on the ground that a satellite simply can't do.

Now when it comes to military aid to other nations, that's a whole different topic.
17 posted on 04/11/2012 5:54:56 PM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: Lx
I think it’s awesome that you have a son flying those, you must be proud despite the danger, not that the Osprey is dangerous but these guys are always prepared and training for war.

I sure am. It was a long haul and makes for a bit of a story.

18 posted on 04/11/2012 6:00:10 PM PDT by sonofagun (Some think my cynicism grows with age. I like to think of it as wisdom!)
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To: sonofagun

Prayer from a CRO dad. I know what this is all about.


19 posted on 04/11/2012 6:12:34 PM PDT by lookout88 (.combat officer's dad)
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To: GeronL
I didn’t know we have troops in Morocco ...

On joint military exercises Marines can show up in some very unexpected locals. Mostly locals next to major bodies of water.

20 posted on 04/11/2012 6:25:56 PM PDT by BluH2o
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To: Blood of Tyrants
There was a question of how long that fancy double diaphragm drive that synchronizes the left/right rotors would last. My former boss was going to bid the stress analysis job. I'm not sure it was ever done as the parties interested in doing the analysis couldn't figure out how to couple the vibration signature into a sensor to monitor it. When (not if) that diaphragm fails from work hardening, the bird falls out of the sky.
21 posted on 04/11/2012 6:41:22 PM PDT by Myrddin
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To: sonofagun

I volunteer for the USO and worked on the Iwo Jima last May during Fleet Week in NYC. It was docked on the Hudson River. I always visit the guys on the flight deck and make it a point to visit the Osprey!


22 posted on 04/11/2012 7:25:07 PM PDT by toldyou (Even if the voices aren't real they have some pretty good ideas.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

And yet it STILL has killed less Marines per flight hour than the aircraft it replaces, the CH-46.


23 posted on 04/12/2012 1:05:34 AM PDT by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: Myrddin
"...When (not if) that diaphragm fails from work hardening, the bird falls out of the sky...."

Rumsfeld tried to stop the Osprey: personally, I'm pained by the many crashes and loss of scores of US Marines.

Comparing the Osprey to a helicopter doesn't account for the very few years the Osprey has been in service.

24 posted on 04/12/2012 1:22:05 AM PDT by Does so (They don't think — they plot!)
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To: Does so
I think is was Cheney who tried to stop the Osprey.
25 posted on 04/12/2012 1:30:19 AM PDT by Kickass Conservative (A day without Obama is like a day without a Tsunami.)
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To: Spktyr

Does that include combat losses where they were shot out of the sky?


26 posted on 04/12/2012 4:39:59 AM PDT by USAF80
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To: sonofagun
My wife and I received an email from my son this morning. Although he was not involved in the crash, he lost two dear friends and comrades.

Thank you every one for your prayers.

27 posted on 04/12/2012 6:06:26 AM PDT by sonofagun (Some think my cynicism grows with age. I like to think of it as wisdom!)
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To: grobdriver
"I've been watching their development for years (decades?) and I just don't have a good feeling about them."

First started hearing about them while in the Corps in the late 80's. I want to say around 1987 or so. It's been a long time to get this thing operational and numerous times people have tried to kill it. Overall, I think this Osprey is a good thing for the Corps. The capabilities it gives the Marine Corps is tremendous. It's had it's mishaps along the way, but if you go back into the history of every helicopter program, there have been problems, crashes and deaths.

We can't judge this crash without any facts and assume that it was a malfunction of the Osprey. It could be pilot error, weather, mechanical failures due to improper maintenance procedures. A million things. Let's not assume that the helicopter is flawed. Remember, in the early 80's there were people trying to kill the M-1 Abrams program. It is now the main battle tank of our military and without it, there would have been a lot more deaths in Gulf War I and Iraq. Good thing it wasn't killed and is now considered one of the best tanks in the world.
28 posted on 04/12/2012 8:39:32 AM PDT by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: grobdriver
I was at Bell Helicopter when this was my project during the development phase. Stayed there long enough to see the first production product. After seeing the ballistics test on the under carriage...you don't want to be in there. Lots of maintenance problems..lots of downtime...problems with the transitional modes. The test pilots were even scared to take it up. Trust me on this one...I have flown on the CODs many times. I will take them over the V-22 ANYTIME
29 posted on 04/12/2012 10:48:23 AM PDT by VF-51vnv
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To: USAF80

No, it’s accidents in peacetime or accidents in wartime where combat damage wasn’t the cause. The CH-46 has an unfortunate tendency to fall out of the sky all on its own.


30 posted on 04/12/2012 12:23:28 PM PDT by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: Does so

At this exact number of years into service, the CH-46 had also killed more people than the Osprey.


31 posted on 04/12/2012 12:25:27 PM PDT by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: sonofagun
The last operational loss, I believe, was an Air Force Model that the pilot flew into the ground.

As an aircraft engineer I believe most crashes could be considered flying into the ground, LOL!

I personally believe that the V-22 is a horribly foolish design that lifts itself from its extremities in a balance critical fashion when it could do the same job better if the rotor or coaxial rotors pivoted from above the aircraft's center of gravity along the aircraft's center line to in front of the craft. I personally believe the design was drawn up by an artist, and then forced upon the engineers. Unfortunately simple, stable, and effective were abandoned in favor of the "cool looking" Rube Goldberg designed contraption that is the V-22. Best of luck to your son. I hope he stays safe while protecting us.

If I had my way Marine 1 would be an Osprey and Obama, Biden, Reid, and Pelosi would all ride on it together.

32 posted on 04/13/2012 6:48:22 AM PDT by ME-262 (We need Term Limits for the federal house and senate. We need new Bums up there.)
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To: grobdriver

IIRC, the Osprey program was wrought with difficulties from the start. My assessment is that it was a political jobs tool for the Democrats.


33 posted on 04/13/2012 6:56:11 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: Blood of Tyrants

I believe so also. A digression...the B-2 has quaternary computer control of the aileron surfaces.....FOUR level backup! It cannot be flown without computer trim .....that should tell us something.....


34 posted on 04/13/2012 6:58:36 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: ME-262
I share your LOL, although I don't share your thoughts on this aircraft's design.

You may get your wish on Marine-1 being an Osprey. I know it's been up for consideration, although I'm not sure what the current status is.

This aircraft is used quite often to move VIP's from one point to another.

I'm not an engineer but I work with an engineering group. I know how engineers can differ, sometimes vehemently, in their design ideas.

The fact of the matter is that this is the first operational loss of an MV-22 by the Marine Corps.

The sensational losses occurred during testing phases of this aircraft.

35 posted on 04/13/2012 4:30:58 PM PDT by sonofagun (Some think my cynicism grows with age. I like to think of it as wisdom!)
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To: GeronL
Me neither. Apparently we have troops all over Africa, doing god knows what.
36 posted on 04/15/2012 4:58:06 PM PDT by hinckley buzzard
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To: hinckley buzzard

yet we can’t protect our own borders


37 posted on 04/15/2012 5:00:28 PM PDT by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: Chode

Cpl. Robby A. Reyes of Los Angeles and Cpl. Derek A. Kerns of Fort Dix, New Jersey.


38 posted on 04/17/2012 2:53:21 AM PDT by Doogle (((USAF.68-73..8th TFW Ubon Thailand..never store a threat you should have eliminated)))
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To: Doogle
damn, i thought it was another one... Prayers up!
39 posted on 04/17/2012 4:47:03 AM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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