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Case of Tigard man, grounded by no-fly list, offers glimpse into secretive security screening
Oregonlive.com ^ | 04/12/2012 | By Helen Jung,

Posted on 04/14/2012 9:05:19 AM PDT by redreno

At 4:45 p.m. on March 1, Jamal Tarhuni boarded an Amtrak train in Portland and settled in for a 36-hour ride to Minneapolis.

There, he spoke at the annual Nobel Peace Prize forum about his experiences in Libya as a relief organization volunteer. He then drove for 17 hours over two days with a friend to Washington, D.C., to attend a reception for the Libyan prime minister and meet with U.S. Sen. Ron Wyden's staff.

Afterward, Tarhuni retraced his steps -- by car to Minneapolis and train to Portland -- ultimately spending more than 100 hours traveling a route that could be covered by plane in 12.

This is Tarhuni's new life in the slow lane, courtesy of the federal government and its no-fly list. The roster names some 20,000 people, including about 500 U.S. citizens like Tarhuni, who are barred from flying because they are believed to be an air-terrorism threat.

(Excerpt) Read more at oregonlive.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; US: Oregon
KEYWORDS: govtabuse; islam; muslim; noflylist; tyranny

1 posted on 04/14/2012 9:05:29 AM PDT by redreno
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To: redreno

The vast majority of these 20k folks...didn’t get on the no-fly list by accident. So I don’t have any heartburn about them discovering the wonderful roads and highways of America. We have lots of people who never travel by aircraft....by their own desires.


2 posted on 04/14/2012 9:10:27 AM PDT by pepsionice
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To: redreno

It’s worth a reminder that some on the left and on the right attack people who don’t want to automatically restrict firearm sales to people on the No Fly List. This article is a good example of why the gun restriction would be bogus — because the No Fly List is, at best, imperfect.


3 posted on 04/14/2012 9:12:24 AM PDT by jiggyboy (Ten percent of poll respondents are either lying or insane)
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To: redreno

I say put him on the no trains list, the no bus list and the no cars list, too. He can either walk or ride his camel.


4 posted on 04/14/2012 9:14:14 AM PDT by San Jacinto
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To: pepsionice

“So I don’t have any heartburn about them discovering the wonderful roads and highways of America.”

Nor will I when YOUR name is surreptitiously added with no chance of appeal onto the list. If you think pro lifers, 2nd amendment supporters or small government advocates won’t be added at some point you’re living in a dream world.


5 posted on 04/14/2012 9:17:09 AM PDT by KantianBurke (Where was the Tea Party when Dubya was spending like a drunken sailor?)
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To: pepsionice

Apparently you have never seen the stories of 7-year-olds that happen to be on that pristine list of bureaucratic perfection.


6 posted on 04/14/2012 9:18:43 AM PDT by jiggyboy (Ten percent of poll respondents are either lying or insane)
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To: redreno

Jamal,,,, worked for the Libyan branch of the Muslim brotherhood uprising? I’d be happy if he was kept off the train too. F him,,, Muslim sympathizer.


7 posted on 04/14/2012 9:32:44 AM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for officeoffI)
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To: redreno

It’s more like hundreds of thousands of people, most of whom have Anglo sounding first and last names.

Anyone named David Nelson was on this list. It was a hassle for the (now) late David Nelson, son of Ozzie and Harriet Nelson, every time he boarded a plane in Orange County, California.....and anywhere else in the U.S.

Alexandra Hay, Robert Johnson, and similar names shared by vast number of people were on either the restricted or “no-fly” list. Some of these people appeared on “60 minutes” a few years ago and aired their complaints. Not one of them was a Muslim.

The security threads at the frequent flyer web site, Flyertalk, has had many stories of the trials and tribulations of passengers who were caught in this bizarro world dragnet. Apparently, there is one person somewhere who has one of these common names and an outstanding arrest warrant or two.


8 posted on 04/14/2012 9:33:16 AM PDT by july4thfreedomfoundation (The TEA Party is my cup of tea.)
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To: redreno

If TSA screening is so great, why would they need to restrict anyone from flying? Isn’t the screening supposed to keep us all safe?

Just wonderin’


9 posted on 04/14/2012 9:35:01 AM PDT by BigBobber
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To: BigBobber

No there you go again - thinking the problem through. Obviously you don’t work for the government. ;-/


10 posted on 04/14/2012 9:38:02 AM PDT by ThunderSleeps (Stop obama now! Stop the hussein - insane agenda!)
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To: jiggyboy

Don’t name your 7 year old Ishtar, or Some other Moslem name,,, that might help. We of course need a way to get innocent kids off the list. But those are all cases of sharing a name with a true threat,,, that should be resolvable.
But guys like Jamal, the Portland Moslem Libyan upriser needs to walk,,, the turd is a traitor.


11 posted on 04/14/2012 9:38:43 AM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for officeoffI)
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To: jiggyboy
My niece is on a U.S. Customs "watch list" which means that every time she re-enters the country from either Canada or an out of country vacation such as Mexico, she and all her luggage are taken into a separate room and thoroughly examined. She's a convicted smuggler......

About 14 years ago she vacationed in Cuba via Canada and on her return, she was stopped at the Windsor tunnel where they did a vehicle search and busted for trying to bring back a small box of cigars for her then boyfriend......LOL! It was a very costly experience for her.

12 posted on 04/14/2012 9:38:59 AM PDT by Hot Tabasco (Would I like to be young again? No, I worked too hard to get here, I don't want to do it again)
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To: DesertRhino
Don’t name your 7 year old Ishtar, or Some other Moslem name,,, that might help.

I see you haven't read any of those stories either. Google for "no fly list" plus "child" so you don't make another completely uninformed post.

13 posted on 04/14/2012 9:45:50 AM PDT by jiggyboy (Ten percent of poll respondents are either lying or insane)
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To: redreno

Knowing Janet Napolitano’s history, I’d say the best way to stay off her no-fly list is to be an actual terror threat.


14 posted on 04/14/2012 9:52:41 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (For every black person murdered by a white, thirty-nine white people are murdered by blacks.)
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To: San Jacinto

That would be unconstitutional, not to mention un-American. This guy (along with several hundred others on the no-fly list) is a US citizen. The government cannot deprive him of liberty without due process of law, which require, at a minimum, notice and an opportunity to be heard. If the govt can do this to him, they can do it to you as well.


15 posted on 04/14/2012 10:06:04 AM PDT by Conscience of a Conservative
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To: pepsionice

“The vast majority of these 20k folks...didn’t get on the no-fly list by accident.”

Similar to the McCarthy bunch...who actually were Communists intent on overthrowing the government to create something in the image of Stalin.


16 posted on 04/14/2012 10:12:41 AM PDT by BobL
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To: pepsionice
The vast majority of these 20k folks...didn’t get on the no-fly list by accident.

Well, the intended sob story suggests otherwise. I just anticipate the mindless "if it saves one innocent person for negative special treatment..." doofuses to come out of the woodwork.

17 posted on 04/14/2012 10:15:17 AM PDT by Publius6961 ("It's easy to make promises you can't keep" - B.H.Obama Feb 23, 2012)
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To: DesertRhino

Any evidence that this guy is a traitor? He may well be, but I see no evidence, and the problem with the no-fly list is that the govt does not need to show any evidence before placing someone on it. Under the Constitution, even traitors get due process (in fact, treason is the only crime for which the Constitution lays out specific evidenced that must be offered).


18 posted on 04/14/2012 10:16:43 AM PDT by Conscience of a Conservative
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To: Publius6961

it’s not a question of “if it saves one innocent person...,” its a question of whether our government, a government of specific and limited power, shoukd have the authority to deprive a citizen of liberty without due process of law.


19 posted on 04/14/2012 10:21:09 AM PDT by Conscience of a Conservative
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To: jiggyboy
Apparently you have never seen the stories of 7-year-olds that happen to be on that pristine list of bureaucratic perfection.

I seriously doubt that 7-year-olds remain on that list any significant length of time.

As for the "no appeal" statement, that is BS.

I would remind those having their knickers in a bunch that individuals who don't agree with them know perfectly well that they are just as subject to bureaucratic error as anyone else -- and accept the possibility without a problem.

20 posted on 04/14/2012 10:23:45 AM PDT by Publius6961 ("It's easy to make promises you can't keep" - B.H.Obama Feb 23, 2012)
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To: redreno

Why do these muslim loser bastards always end up in Minneapolis? WTF?
Take the slow train through Nebraska next time, you goat raper!


21 posted on 04/14/2012 10:26:00 AM PDT by Fireone (The time for Newt/Palin is NOW! (did I mention FUBO?))
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To: KantianBurke
If you think pro lifers, 2nd amendment supporters or small government advocates won’t be added at some point you’re living in a dream world.

When that happens, being unable to get on a plane will be the least of our problems. Or the government's.

22 posted on 04/14/2012 10:31:06 AM PDT by Publius6961 ("It's easy to make promises you can't keep" - B.H.Obama Feb 23, 2012)
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To: Conscience of a Conservative
its a question of whether our government, a government of specific and limited power, shoukd have the authority to deprive a citizen of liberty without due process of law.

If stressing over unconstitutional government abuse is your thing, you may want to consider a bigger and universal abuse affecting everybody not just mainly phony citizens who help plan and execute terrorist plots.

Try the IRS. They can preemptively seize everything you own and make your family homeless on the assumption that you might owe taxes, without proof.

23 posted on 04/14/2012 10:41:28 AM PDT by Publius6961 ("It's easy to make promises you can't keep" - B.H.Obama Feb 23, 2012)
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To: redreno

I always ask, is bill ayers on the no-fly list?


24 posted on 04/14/2012 10:43:53 AM PDT by isom35
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To: Publius6961

Yes, the IRS seizure powers (and, really, most LE seizure powers) are unconstitutional, and appalling abuses of power. That doesn’t make the no-fly list any more constitutional. And yes, the folks on the no-fly list may well be ‘fake citizens’ who plan attacks. That doesn’t mean the govt should be able to restrict their liberty without due process. Our entire system of government, the whole Constitution, is based on the notion that people (and in particular, people who seek power via positions in government) are imperfect. That’s why there are checks and balances in place, to make sure exercises of govt power (in particular, where such exercises restrict the rights of citizens) are not arbitrarily undertaken. The no-fly list (and IRS and other seizure powers) fly in the face of this principle.


25 posted on 04/14/2012 11:02:07 AM PDT by Conscience of a Conservative
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To: redreno
If helping the Muslim Brotherhood gets you on the “no fly” list, then Obama should be on it. The scariest thing about the list is that liberals are already exempting the worst risks and yes, will sooner or later put conservative activists on it instead.
26 posted on 04/14/2012 11:05:24 AM PDT by Missouri gal
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To: pepsionice
The vast majority of these 20k folks...didn’t get on the no-fly list by accident.

From the article:

The FBI will not comment on its reasons for blocking Tarhuni -- even to him. And Tarhuni is at a loss for how to defend himself against accusations that no one will divulge.

This is the real outrage; the 5th Amendment says: "nor [shall a person] be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law" -- the lists, as is, are precisely the sort of liberty that the 5th was supposed to protect, for how can a man answer charges against him if they are kept forever secret? Further, how can there be a 'due process' if there is no way to be removed from the list? (Or, if we're using the presence of the man's name on the list the 5th also says "No person shall be held to answer for a[n] infamous crime unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury" with some exceptions, none of which are applicable here.)

27 posted on 04/16/2012 5:58:20 PM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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