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Taxes Prompt More Americans to Renounce Citizenship
Reuters/CNBC ^ | 4/16/12

Posted on 04/16/2012 6:43:58 PM PDT by markomalley

A year ago, in Action Comics, Superman declared plans to renounce his U.S. citizenship.

"'Truth, justice, and the American way' — it's not enough anymore," the comic book superhero said, after both the Iranian and American governments criticized him for joining a peaceful anti-government protest in Tehran.

Last year, almost 1,800 people followed Superman's lead, renouncing their U.S. citizenship or handing in their Green Cards. That's a record number since the Internal Revenue Service began publishing a list of those who renounced in 1998. It's also almost eight times more than the number of citizens who renounced in 2008, and more than the total for 2007, 2008 and 2009 combined.

But not everyone's motivations are as lofty as Superman's. Many say they parted ways with America for tax reasons.

The United States is one of the only countries to tax its citizens on income earned while they're living abroad. And just as Americans stateside must file tax returns each April — this year, the deadline is Tuesday — an estimated 6.3 million U.S. citizens living abroad brace for what they describe as an even tougher process of reporting their income and foreign accounts to the IRS. For them, the deadline is June.

(Excerpt) Read more at cnbc.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Extended News; Front Page News; Government
KEYWORDS: 2012election; agitprop; antiamericanism; election2012; expats; kenyanbornmuzzie; loveitorleaveit; mittromney; obaamcitizenofworld; obama; obamarenouncedin2008; obamarenouncedusa; rapingmychildhood; renouncecitizenship; superman
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1 posted on 04/16/2012 6:44:04 PM PDT by markomalley
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To: markomalley

I’ve been thinking of becoming an illegal alien myself. We Americans get no respect anymore. As an illegal, I’d have it made in this country. No taxes and lots of handouts.


2 posted on 04/16/2012 6:47:15 PM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (It's time for the 47% to start paying their "fair share" of income taxes. Hypocrites!)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

No hablo Ingles, Senor.


3 posted on 04/16/2012 6:49:43 PM PDT by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: markomalley
The US is the only civilized country on earth that taxes its citizens on worldwide income when they're living outside the country.And our Tax Cheat-In-Chief,Geitner,fully supports that.
4 posted on 04/16/2012 6:50:11 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Unlike Mrs Obama,I've Been Proud Of This Country My *Entire* Life!)
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To: markomalley
If they renounce their citizenship just to avoid taxes, they weren't very good citizens to begin with.

I may end up moving out of the country when I retire but I will NOT renounce my citizenship.

5 posted on 04/16/2012 6:59:21 PM PDT by Just another Joe (Warning: FReeping can be addictive and helpful to your mental health)
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To: markomalley

Fact: The top-earning 1% of US taxpayers are Leaving the USA at the highest rate in history. (Source: INS/Census Bureau & Zogby International estimates)

http://actionamerica.org/taxecon/ticktick.shtml


6 posted on 04/16/2012 7:00:45 PM PDT by Bigun ("The most fearsome words in the English language are I'm from the government and I'm here to help!")
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To: markomalley

If the antichrist wins in November, I could see that number jumping ten fold.


7 posted on 04/16/2012 7:02:38 PM PDT by STJPII
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To: markomalley

Citizenship is overrated.


8 posted on 04/16/2012 7:04:15 PM PDT by headstamp 2 (Liberalism: Carrying adolescent values and behavior into adult life.)
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To: headstamp 2

National IQ probably went down as well.


9 posted on 04/16/2012 7:22:56 PM PDT by Surrounded_too
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To: markomalley
Like many who love the sea and sailing, good friend of mine has talked of sailing around the world for a long time. He is politically astute and did a lot of research into Obama and his colleagues from Chicago. As the health care debate raged on, he and his wife began doing some work on their boat and selling their stuff. They left for a life at sea about 14 months ago. They've spent most of the last year in the Pacific and are now just north of the canal heading for the Virgin Islands and then ...wherever.

We talked last week and I asked him what they miss about 'home' now that they've been gone over a year. He said, "Absolutely NOTHING!"

10 posted on 04/16/2012 7:28:22 PM PDT by Baynative (Please check this out - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFIcZkEzc8I)
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To: STJPII
If the antichrist wins in November...

Which one?

11 posted on 04/16/2012 7:29:03 PM PDT by lightman (Adjutorium nostrum (+) in nomine Domini--nevertheless, Vote Santorum!)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

You could still vote too.


12 posted on 04/16/2012 7:35:00 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man (I'd like to tell you, but then I'd have to kill you.)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

“Last year, almost 1,800 people followed Superman’s lead, renouncing their U.S. citizenship or handing in their Green Cards. That’s a record number”

How does that number hold up percentage wise? Dunno, however, was Alec Baldwin on of them? Just hoping.


13 posted on 04/16/2012 7:41:49 PM PDT by Puckster
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To: markomalley

Where is the best place to go? Belize, Costa Rica, Ecuador, Panama, Philippines, Thailand, Singapore?

No place in the EU, not Brazil, mostly and probably not Eastern Europe.

I remember seeing some kind of freedom index that included taxes. We have discussed leaving the U.S. before. Citizenship here is meaning less and less to me. Family is the only thing that keeps me here now.

Before anyone ridicules about giving up... giving up what? I don’t see a win in this mess ever for anyone.


14 posted on 04/16/2012 7:43:07 PM PDT by Sequoyah101
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To: Just another Joe
If they renounce their citizenship just to avoid taxes, they weren't very good citizens to begin with.

I think some crusty old white men did that back in the 1770's....they weren't very good citizens either.

15 posted on 04/16/2012 7:44:23 PM PDT by Repeat Offender (While the wicked stand confounded, call me with Thy Saints surrounded)
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To: Sequoyah101

Good old Heritage Foundation. They study the heck out of things but never produce any solutions.

Freedom index and comparison to other countries:

http://www.heritage.org/index/visualize


16 posted on 04/16/2012 7:46:00 PM PDT by Sequoyah101
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To: FlingWingFlyer
I am becoming a conscientious objector to taxes. I believe they are cruel and inhumane when collected by a government that can print half of the money it spends each year thereby inflating the value of all our money away and not having to tax anyone.

Grow a pair, President Obama, end taxes now and spend only freshly printed money from the Federal Reserve computers.

Probably give us a few more good years before the collapse.

17 posted on 04/16/2012 7:49:00 PM PDT by urbanpovertylawcenter (where the law and poverty collide in an urban setting and sparks fly)
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To: STJPII

My Gf is Canadian and a green card holder. She won’t file for citizenship until Klownie the Kenyan and Chewbacca are out.


18 posted on 04/16/2012 7:50:04 PM PDT by max americana
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To: markomalley

Those reasons are much loftier than the formerly super man


19 posted on 04/16/2012 7:50:38 PM PDT by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: Sequoyah101

southern laos. central vietnam. small coffee ranch.
if one has to die among strangers i’d choose these.


20 posted on 04/16/2012 7:50:56 PM PDT by RitchieAprile
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To: FlingWingFlyer

They don’t deport non-citizens anyway and they’ve have no place to deport you to.


21 posted on 04/16/2012 7:54:12 PM PDT by a fool in paradise (Barack Obama continued to sponsor Jeremiah Wright after he said "G.D. AMERIKKA!"Where's the outrage?)
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To: Sequoyah101

> http://www.heritage.org/index/visualize

The U.S. is tenth and trending downwards.

Chile is seventh and trending upwards.

Australia is THIRD and trending upwards.

Maybe it’s Australia, then, and they speak English.


22 posted on 04/16/2012 7:58:32 PM PDT by Westbrook (Children do not divide your love, they multiply it.)
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To: Westbrook

Takes time and you are a U.S. Citizen in Australia on a Visa until you meet citizenship requirements. Wonder if this means you pay taxes in both places?

Looks like the U.S. has been on a slide for sometime. Tenth and going down. Look at the corruption index. Nigeria hasn’t got a thing on the U.S. The U.S. is just more genteel about it. What a shame it has come toward the end. Highest corporate taxes in the world, tax everything no matter where it is earned etc.

Almost all countries are going to make the process painful but if you have lots of money maybe it can be done.


23 posted on 04/16/2012 8:11:13 PM PDT by Sequoyah101
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To: RitchieAprile

I had thought about Vietnam. Wonder if they’d let you in?

I guess all you really need to do is get a permanent visa, move your money to someplace that doesn’t care and check out of the U.S. and just never come back.


24 posted on 04/16/2012 8:14:04 PM PDT by Sequoyah101
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To: Sequoyah101

U.S. citizen ex-pats in France pay U.S. taxes, plus 50 percent to France.


25 posted on 04/16/2012 8:23:22 PM PDT by firebrand
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To: markomalley

Questions:
If you renounce your US citizenship, are you permitted to re-enter the US?
Has anyone attempted to renounce their US citizenship while living in the US?
What are the easiest countries to obtain resident alien status? Citizen? I thought that the Caribean island nation of Dominica was pretty easy to get a passport if you had 60k.
Which foreign nations have gun rights comparable to the US? This is a pretty good indicator of individual rights.


26 posted on 04/16/2012 8:23:28 PM PDT by grumpygresh (Democrats delenda est; zero sera dans l'enfer bientot.)
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To: firebrand

France, was never on my list and won’t be... at least on my good list.

I guess that keeps U.S. Citizens out of France.

What about the Muzzies?


27 posted on 04/16/2012 8:27:23 PM PDT by Sequoyah101
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To: markomalley
The late Sir John Templeton comes to mind.

Born in Tennessee in 1912, he renounced in 1964, avoiding $100m in taxes.

28 posted on 04/16/2012 8:32:34 PM PDT by cynwoody
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To: Sequoyah101

It was just an example. Taxes in some European countries are higher, Sweden for instance.

So I guess you have to look at the tax rate you would have to pay in each country you are interested in, and calculate that it would be added to your U.S. rate.

This was not a comment about France. I just happen to know a couple who live there and the guy makes a lot of money so he doesn’t care. He loves Paris. But I wonder how high U.S. tax rates would have to go for him to give up his citizenship.


29 posted on 04/16/2012 8:37:24 PM PDT by firebrand
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To: markomalley; ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; stephenjohnbanker; DoughtyOne; calcowgirl; Gilbo_3; ...
RE:”Last year, almost 1,800 people followed Superman's lead, renouncing their U.S. citizenship or handing in their Green Cards. That's a record number since the Internal Revenue Service began publishing a list of those who renounced in 1998. It's also almost eight times more than the number of citizens who renounced in 2008, and more than the total for 2007, 2008 and 2009 combined.

We don't need them. For every rich guy who renounces their U.S. citizenship there are hundreds of illegals coming here to the US for the *benefits* of being American.

And it's poor people like them who create jobs by spending their welfare checks, not those greedy rich guys who refuse to pay their 'fair' share.

30 posted on 04/16/2012 8:42:42 PM PDT by sickoflibs (Obama : "I will just make insurance companies give you health care for 'free, What Mandates??' ")
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To: grumpygresh

“If you renounce your US citizenship, are you permitted to re-enter the US?”

4 months a year without being considered a tax resident.

“Has anyone attempted to renounce their US citizenship while living in the US?”

Cant.


31 posted on 04/16/2012 8:46:25 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ("Of two evils, choose neither." -- Charles Spurgeon)
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To: markomalley

The problem is that the US not only will tax your earnings in the US, but will tax what you own overseas.

So we retired to my husband’s home and only taxes on our retirement income. But theoretically, Because the family business (run by the extended family) has my husband’s name on it as joint owner, we should be double paying taxes on it too: Taxes to the Philippine government, and taxes to the USA on what the business earns here.

My husband ignores the law, because he’s in his 80’s and figures they won’t go after him for a joint owned business here that really doesn’t make a lot of profit.

But if we were really rich, it would be good business sense for him to just drop the US citizenship instead of being a dual citizen.

And being a dual citizen might be a good way to get around other problems if the US continues to go to the dogs: IF Mr. Zimmermann’s mom had registered him in the Peruvian embassy as a kid, he could have been eligible as a dual citizen, and could flee to Peru for political asylum.


32 posted on 04/16/2012 9:09:05 PM PDT by LadyDoc
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To: markomalley

Maybe one day Obama will renounce his U.S. citizen...oops, never mind.


33 posted on 04/16/2012 9:23:25 PM PDT by twister881
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To: firebrand

Don’t take it too seriously. The comment was about France, not an affront to your notice of the double taxation.

As stated in one of my previous posts, I suppose you could just move your money to the Caymans and disappear to someplace where your visa was secure.


34 posted on 04/16/2012 9:50:39 PM PDT by Sequoyah101
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To: Repeat Offender

Wrong. They were the best citizens of the states in which they were born.


35 posted on 04/16/2012 10:23:10 PM PDT by ngat
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To: markomalley

I have a legal immigrant friend who is quite dismayed at how unfree the US has become. The conversation started when he read that there was a new law outlawing public breastfeeding. He asked, why do we need a new law? If people are uncomfortable, cant they just respectfully ask her to cover up or offer a jacket or look away. In his native country the overall government is considered more socialist than ours, but individual day to day life is much more free. Not sure if the US is beyond repair, but it appears more so every day.. personally I am weighing all the options. I speak 5 languages, (well, 3 profiently, 2 enough to build on) so moving would not be a problem.


36 posted on 04/16/2012 11:01:43 PM PDT by douginthearmy (Obamagebra: 1 job + 1 hope + 1 change = 0 jobs + 0 hope)
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Comment #37 Removed by Moderator

To: sickoflibs; stephenjohnbanker; fieldmarshaldj

I’m declaring myself a micronation. You may address me as your Majesty.

Now I can go on welfare and call it foreign aid.


38 posted on 04/17/2012 1:55:25 AM PDT by Impy (Don't call me red.)
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To: ngat
Wrong. They were the best citizens of the states in which they were born.

I don't think it was called the United States of England when the colonists declared their independance. Your history book must be different than mine.

My statement was correct. The Founders did reject British citizenship and were upset over taxes (among other things).

Further, revolting against the crown would mean they weren't good British citizens......your English comprehension book must be different too........FRegards

39 posted on 04/17/2012 4:09:36 AM PDT by Repeat Offender (While the wicked stand confounded, call me with Thy Saints surrounded)
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To: markomalley

Yes, taxes are outrageous and we have loads of problems. But we truly won life’s lottery by being born in this greatest nation on earth. Those renouncing that priceless gift are total jackasses.


40 posted on 04/17/2012 8:37:47 AM PDT by doug from upland (Just in case, it has been reserved: www.TheBitchIsBack2012.com)
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To: Repeat Offender

I wonder what happens if all the citizens of a state renounce their citizenship or if the state does it for them? I know that did not work out so well the first time but perhaps it is time to try it again!


41 posted on 04/17/2012 8:38:35 AM PDT by Mouton (Voting is an opiate of the electorate. Nothing changes no matter who wins..)
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To: Sequoyah101
Things come in cycles. We had tax rates over 90% some decades ago. Name another country that has a FR.

Singapore is a police state and countries that are usually high on the Heritage freedom index are usually listed simply on taxes and business incentives, and don't take in obvious inherent rights into the index.

Let me know when you can open carry or simply carry in Singapore or Hong Kong. LOL!

42 posted on 04/17/2012 8:40:45 AM PDT by Theoria (Rush Limbaugh: Ron Paul sounds like an Islamic terrorist)
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To: Gay State Conservative

I’d like to know the stats going back a number of years? Not just this year.


43 posted on 04/17/2012 8:49:51 AM PDT by George from New England
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To: ciaocotc
I like you.

By 'popped', of course, I know you mean things like 'convinced to a new viewpoint', or 'fired from position of power'.

Please do not correct me btw.

44 posted on 04/17/2012 8:52:03 AM PDT by Lazamataz (Shut up and drill.)
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To: markomalley
The United States is one of the only countries to tax its citizens on income earned while they're living abroad

False on two levels.

1. Most countries tax their citizens on world wide income.

2. The US allows an exclusion of up to 92,900 for income earned abroad.

The exodus has more to do with our rates on income earned here than overseas.

45 posted on 04/17/2012 8:56:37 AM PDT by Raycpa
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To: urbanpovertylawcenter

I agree. I think taxes are only used for keeping us schlubs in line. The real dough is in inflating the money supply. Takes it right out of our pockets, with us having no say in it whatsoever, and it’s not even done by the government, its done by a private bank that doesn’t have to open its books.


46 posted on 04/17/2012 8:58:09 AM PDT by ichabod1 (Cheney/Rumsfeld 2012)
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To: ciaocotc

Ciaocotc wrote
“A relatively small but professional group that targeted and popped a few hundred of the most egregious leftist media, education, money, union, judicial, and political voices would stop this in its tracks. They would either go to ground or be forced to over play their hand early. Not pretty - but a win win.”

So your solution would be to have another 1917 style “change”

Not so sure that would turn out the way it was intended.


47 posted on 04/17/2012 9:00:51 AM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: George from New England
I’d like to know the stats going back a number of years? Not just this year.

Yah,I suppose.But the difficult thing is that in order for the State Department to "accept" your renunciation you first have to prove that you have citizenship in another country.Some US citizens have a second citizenship (mostly Mexicans,I believe) so I doubt that the numbers are large today...or that they've ever been large.I could be wrong,however.

48 posted on 04/17/2012 9:00:56 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Unlike Mrs Obama,I've Been Proud Of This Country My *Entire* Life!)
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To: twister881

Actually, I wouldn’t be that surprised if that man DID renounce one day. I had a vision of, if we’re able to get him out of there, him turning around and writing a book saying “HA HA YOU AMELLICAN LOSERS I NEVER WAS A USSSS CITI-SSS-EN I DID IT ALL TO BRING YOU DOWNNNN! I AM ALSO MU-SSS-LIM, PRAISE ALLAH!”


49 posted on 04/17/2012 9:11:32 AM PDT by ichabod1 (Cheney/Rumsfeld 2012)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

We considered NZ a few years back.

These days, we choose to stay and fight the good fight.

My ancestors fought with “Mad” Anthony Wayne, and I’ll be damned if I’ll just give up.


50 posted on 04/17/2012 9:17:03 AM PDT by LadyBuck (In the immortal words of Jean Paul Sartre, 'Au revoir, gopher')
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