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Washington sues Florida city over firefighter tests
Yahoo news ^ | 23 Apr 2012

Posted on 04/23/2012 5:09:40 PM PDT by mandaladon

MIAMI (Reuters) - The Justice Department sued the city of Jacksonville, Florida, on Monday, claiming its use of written tests to determine promotions in the city's fire department discriminates against African-Americans.

The lawsuit followed a more than two-year investigation examining Jacksonville's record of promoting African-Americans for the ranks of lieutenant, captain, district chief and engineer dating back to 2004.

It came after a separate lawsuit filed last year by two dozen Jacksonville firefighters challenging the city's promotional process. In the lawsuit, the firefighters alleged union officials unfairly shared exam questions with white workers but not with black workers ahead of the test.

"This complaint should send a clear message to all public employers that employment practices that have the effect of excluding qualified candidates on account of race will not be tolerated," Thomas Perez, a U.S. assistant attorney general for civil rights, said in a statement.

A spokesman for the Jacksonville mayor's office declined to comment.

The complaint by the Justice Department alleges the exams are "not job related for the positions in question."

The complaint said use of the tests "has resulted in a disparate impact upon black candidates" because African-Americans pass the examinations at significantly lower rates than white candidates.

The Justice Department said black employees who do pass the tests rarely are promoted since their scores are generally lower than white workers.

"At best, these tests measure only a slice of what is necessary to be a supervisor, but they stand in the way of qualified African-Americans advancing in the fire department," the statement said.

The lawsuit also named the local firefighter's union, the Jacksonville Association of Firefighters Local 122, as a defendant since it negotiates the terms of promotion tests with the city.

(Excerpt) Read more at news.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Extended News; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: dojustus; firefighters; flafirefighters; florida; naacp
Obama vs. America
1 posted on 04/23/2012 5:09:46 PM PDT by mandaladon
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To: mandaladon

Readin’s fo’ rich folks.


2 posted on 04/23/2012 5:10:47 PM PDT by Repeat Offender (While the wicked stand confounded, call me with Thy Saints surrounded)
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To: mandaladon
From what I've heard about the tests they only involve knowledge critical to fighting and investigating fires. I was told that some applicants just didn't want to study hard enough to make a decent score.

I don't find that hard to believe at all.

3 posted on 04/23/2012 5:15:50 PM PDT by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: mandaladon
Discriminated against Holder's people...i.e. it was fair and not skewed to protect the "aggrieved!"

We must coddle his aggrieved at the detriment of those at risk.

4 posted on 04/23/2012 5:19:18 PM PDT by RoosterRedux
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To: mandaladon

“The complaint said use of the tests “has resulted in a disparate impact upon black candidates” because African-Americans pass the examinations at significantly lower rates than white candidates.”

wow....just wow.


5 posted on 04/23/2012 5:20:59 PM PDT by icwhatudo (Tax codes and spending don't get 14 year olds pregnant and on welfare. Morality Matters.)
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To: mandaladon

This makes it seem as though blacks are not intelligent enough to pass tests. Is this what those firefighters want?


6 posted on 04/23/2012 5:21:24 PM PDT by Clara Lou
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To: mandaladon

Had an uncle in the Seattle Fire Department years ago who consistenly scored in the top five on all promotional tests (which were ALL about management, strategies and firefighting skills).

But, time after time, he was passed over for a less qualified minority/female applicant, who had usually scored somewhere in the 60th percentile. Sure made me feel safer knowing that people who could barely pass the exams were in charge if I ever had an emergency - NOT

Isn’t this kind of case what got the “wise Latina” in so much trouble? And didn’t the Supremes knock down her ruling 9-0?

Discrimination is discrimination folks - doesn’t matter which way it goes!


7 posted on 04/23/2012 5:22:57 PM PDT by VikingMom (I may not know what the future holds but I know who holds the future!)
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To: mandaladon

I am 100% sure that Benjamin Crump would also not pass these tests...unless the questions were in Ebonics!


8 posted on 04/23/2012 5:25:26 PM PDT by Seeking the truth
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To: VikingMom
Thats how Moochie got into Harvard Law with a C Average.

A white or Asian can't get into any law School with a C average

9 posted on 04/23/2012 5:27:31 PM PDT by scooby321 (h tones)
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To: mandaladon

LOL!
As always, I wonder how many of the white firefighters voted for the communist piece of sh** Ubama?
And how many will vote for him again?


10 posted on 04/23/2012 5:30:42 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: mandaladon

You know, I might also have a case. I have been discriminated against and excluded from playing in the major leagues because I can’t hit or field as well as those who those who were given contracts.


11 posted on 04/23/2012 5:32:17 PM PDT by pieceofthepuzzle
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To: mandaladon

Hmmmmm....

Does it discriminate Chinese Americans, Mexican Americans, Croatian Americans, Pakistani Americans, Arab Americans, Persian Americans?????


12 posted on 04/23/2012 5:32:22 PM PDT by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: mandaladon
Known as the 'father of modern American radicalism,' Saul D. Alinsky (1909-1972) developed strategies and tactics that take the enormous, unfocused emotional energy of grassroots groups and transform it into effective anti-government and anti-corporate activism. ... Some of these rules are ruthless, but they work. … Alinsky's Rules for Radicals:

Alinsky's second chapter, called Of Means and Ends, craftily poses many difficult moral dilemmas, and his 'tenth rule of the ethics of means and ends' is: 'you do what you can with what you have and clothe it with moral arguments.' He doesn't ignore traditional moral standards or dismiss them as unnecessary. He is much more devious; he teaches his followers that 'Moral rationalization is indispensable at all times of action whether to justify the selection or the use of ends or means.'...

"'The organizer's first job is to create the issues or problems,' and 'organizations must be based on many issues.' The organizer 'must first rub raw the resentments of the people of the community; fan the latent hostilities of many of the people to the point of overt expression. He must search out controversy and issues, rather than avoid them, for unless there is controversy people are not concerned enough to act. . . . An organizer must stir up dissatisfaction and discontent.'"

.

13 posted on 04/23/2012 5:34:33 PM PDT by Elle Bee
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To: icwhatudo

“disparate impact” is the new Jim Crow claim for the Jesse Jagmo’s of the world.

anything test that isn’t passed 33-1/3 by whites,33-1/3 by blacks and 33-1/3 by hispanics... is RACIST!


14 posted on 04/23/2012 5:37:37 PM PDT by TurboZamboni (Looting the future to bribe the present)
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To: Vendome

Q. What is a stand-pipe?

A. Don’t know - never heard of it. (So, the question is obviously racist and SHALL NOT be on the firefighter’s test).

Q. For what is a fire hydrant used?

A. For us kids in the hood to open and run through on a
VERY HOT day. (Not a racist question - responder gets
10 points for this answer)

Q. How high is a 50 foot ladder?

A. Pretty damn high (responder gets 10 points - not racist)


15 posted on 04/23/2012 5:38:18 PM PDT by Mr. Wright
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To: mandaladon

absolutely what typifies what we are against: a govt who opposes success.


16 posted on 04/23/2012 5:42:44 PM PDT by bestintxas (Somewhere in Kenya, a Village is missing its Idiot, thankfully.)
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To: mandaladon
feh... this is why there are pictures on the cash registers in fast food joints
17 posted on 04/23/2012 5:45:44 PM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: mandaladon

Yeah, let’s lower the bar and pump most of the water out of the bay, and lower all of the boats/ships, to make it “equal & fair”. More racist bullcrap to achieve “equal outcome” based on melanin.

Puke. Spit.

The US Dept of INJustice is a corrupt, criminal enterprise.


18 posted on 04/23/2012 5:47:56 PM PDT by carriage_hill (I'd vote for a "orange juice can", before 0bummer&HisRegimeFromHell, gets another 4yrs. Can-> later.)
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To: mandaladon

How is a written test discriminatory? Reading would seem to be a fundamental job skill. These guys are supposed to study training material, operators manuals for the gear they have, maybe read accounts of tactics in fighting fires, operations plans for coordinating with other companies for large fires, working with other agencies in the event of a natural or man-made disaster. I’m sorry, not everything in this life can be dumbed-down to a two minute MTV video. You have got to stay current in whatever field you are in. Chances are that means you’ve got to read.


19 posted on 04/23/2012 5:49:01 PM PDT by ThunderSleeps (Stop obama now! Stop the hussein - insane agenda!)
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To: Seeking the truth

I don’t know how Crump made it through law school. I bet the man can’t write a coherent paragraph!


20 posted on 04/23/2012 5:50:01 PM PDT by ilovesarah2012
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To: mandaladon

There is a reason that at every turn the race baiters have attacked written tests as racist and have systematically purged all forms of testing (especially IQ testing) from companies and government as a means of hiring and promotions. It’s because blacks are about 1 standard deviation lower than whites in intelligence and the only way you can achieve equality of out come is to ignore merit based hiring and promotions.

You can cry racist all day long about the above statement but when you get to areas of endeavor that are purely merit based the results speak for themselves. Look at the racial distribution of chess masters, or quantum physicists or any other area where raw brain power is the only entrance requirement and you’ll see what I mean. That’s also not to say that whites are at the top of the heap, Jews are about 1.5 standard deviations above whites in intelligence and Chinese/Indians are about 1/2 a standard deviation above whites. You’ll also notice that women will have a different distribution than men (although the mean may be the same) with men having a wider distribution than women which means that much more men will be at both the very top end and bottom end than women, which is again the case for these top end endeavors.

So unless you show me proof (like a video of some union thug slipping whitey the test answers) this is just the race hustling pimps at it again to the detriment of our safety in this case as if they have their way you will end up with unqualified guys/gals in positions that could get people killed. But that’s nothing new as they’ve been shoving women into the fire department based on nothing other than they are women, even though physically they are not qualified to do the job. I would rather see blacks hired as firemen than women even though they may not be qualified to move up the ranks as physically they can do the job whereas women cannot.


21 posted on 04/23/2012 5:58:50 PM PDT by trapped_in_LA
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To: mandaladon
In the lawsuit, the firefighters alleged union officials unfairly shared exam questions with white workers but not with black workers ahead of the test.

Wait. Wait just a frickin second. The basis of the lawsuit is you failed to help me cheat as you did with the others? Is that the argument here?? You not just failed to let me cheat, you failed to help me cheat?

Good Lord, help us!

22 posted on 04/23/2012 6:22:45 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (Obama considers the Third World morally superior to the United States.)
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To: mandaladon
It is interesting that the story makes the assertion that the test questions are being released to white candidates and not black. That would be unfair and a just reason for filing a complaint.

It is also interesting that the Justice Department's problem with the process is that the written test is discriminatory simply based on it being a written test.

23 posted on 04/23/2012 7:43:56 PM PDT by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: trapped_in_LA
...Jews are about 1.5 standard deviations above whites in intelligence...

Shouldn't that be "other whites"? Most Jews are whites, and I think the Jews who have won special distinction for their intellectual achievements (Nobel Prizes, etc.) have mostly if not entirely descended from European Jews.

24 posted on 04/23/2012 8:16:01 PM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: Verginius Rufus

“Shouldn’t that be “other whites”?”

Nope, they are a separate race. Most likely reason for the high IQ is that you are looking at natural selection over a 2000 year period of persecution by whatever host nation they were living in. Only the very smart survived or so it seems.

I get a kick out of these white supremacist that think they are the “master race”, when you really look at it that title really should go to the Chinese and Indians as both of those races have whites beat in both IQ and population. And really in the end, it’s all about who makes the next generation and as far as I can see that is not the white race.


25 posted on 04/23/2012 8:47:07 PM PDT by trapped_in_LA
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To: trapped_in_LA
Nobody seems to know what "race" means or how many races there are. The government has artificially created some categories that have no scientific basis and little connection to the real world (everyone from Spanish-speaking countries in the Western hemisphere is "Hispanic" and "Asian and Pacific Islander" are lumped together...but Armenians, Arabs, Turks, and Georgians don't count as "Asian" even though they live in or their ancestors lived in Asia).

100 years ago the term "race" had a different meaning--on the ships' manifests at Ellis Island it is the equivalent of "ethnic group."

26 posted on 04/23/2012 9:28:02 PM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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